Fly speed

[Arbegla]

I think the short and sweet answer to why fly has such a small (relative to SS/SJ) movement cap is due to mobility while fly is enabled. You get pseudo-KB protection while flying (flip in the air rather then on the floor) and you can out range mobs by flying above them. Neither of those things can you do with SS/SJ. 

[Captain Fabulous]

13 minutes ago, Ukase said:

So, this is a necro post, but on topic, sort of. 

We have movement caps. Caps to speed, caps to fly..and caps to teleport distance and caps to jump height and distance. 

I'm not going to ask why. 

I'm playing a PB, trying to like the set. Trying to learn what it's good at (nothing yet) and what it's bad at (no real strengths, but seems weak like other ATs in endurance and accuracy - but that's probably more about the content I'm running and how I build than the AT itself. 

I wanted to avoid Super Speed with this character. But, if I did, I'd have to take conceal because I'd rather get missions completed than clear maps. The XP will come. You guys can flail away all you like, I want the merits. But where I'm at right now is flying, slowly. 

So, here's my questions for your folks that are smarter than me, or at least think you are. 

Why does afterburner, and the PB equivalent Quantam turn off after a short time? (My detailed info and City of Data do not show what the duration is, I'm guessing 20-30 seconds) 
And why are people with flight okay with this? 

These powers are, well, inefficient as designed. Would it not be better to just increase the fly speed cap to 150, 200 mph? Why so slow? Super speed is a toggle. You turn it on, you can go as fast as you can go. There is no additional button to increase your speed. Why does Fly or Cosmic Flight have to endure this additional power execution? 
And did I ask why it's so slow? Seems like a no brainer to raise the caps so people have a reason to pursue increases in movement speeds. 

I'm sure this has been discussed, but when I typed in "Fly speed cap", my results found this on the third page, and I wasn't going to sift through every page to find something relevant. 
 

And did I ask why the caps are so low in the first place? It wouldn't hurt bystanders by ramping up the speed caps to something noticeable like 150 mph or so. 

Speed caps were increased not all that long ago. Fly is slower because it has increased functionality as a tradeoff. Afterburner is designed to be a short duration boost. Y'know, like the afterburner on a jet. Afterburner and Evasive Maneuvers (along with their PB counterparts) increase the flight speed cap. The Jump and Steam packs available for free from the START vendor also significantly boost flight speeds and can be stacked with Afterburner. 

PBs and WSs have always been a jack of all trades, master of none AT. But they're still fun to play. Stealth IOs, while not full invisibility, make it easy to cruise thru missions.

At one time the cap on Superspeed was set because it was the fastest speed the client could reliably handle. Still might be the case.

[Captain Fabulous]

7 minutes ago, lemming said:

On the why of speed caps at the level they are, there is some upper limit that the engine can deal with.  (something rendering I think?)  Will have to get someone with more knowledge to weigh in.

Yes. The client has a limit as to how fast a character can move. This is why powers like Shield Charge had to be teleports instead of moving you very fast, because the client would break.

[Luminara]

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

Why does afterburner, and the PB equivalent Quantam turn off after a short time?

 

Because if it would remove any need, or reason, to use enhancements if it stayed active in perpetuity.  Same reason Aim and Build Up have limited durations, to make one example.

 

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

My detailed info and City of Data do not show what the duration is, I'm guessing 20-30 seconds

 

 

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

And did I ask why the caps are so low in the first place?

 

Because it's the least restricted travel power in every other way.  Super Speed requires going around a lot of obstacles.  Super Jump is only "fast" until it reaches the apex of the leap, and is still blocked by obstacles.  Teleport requires constant manual input, both to keep moving and to avoid obstacles.  Fly - angle up, autorun, browse AH, angle down, enter mission.

[Ukase]

I appreciate everyone's answers. I knew they would make some kind of sense. But damn, I wish it were faster. But then, I wish I was faster, too. 

[Glacier Peak]

The faster you move, the harder it is to see the fine details of the city. And eventually there would be no reason to use anything but Mission Teleporter. I think the journey is the fun part.

[Jacke]

13 hours ago, Ukase said:

I wanted to avoid Super Speed with this character. But, if I did, I'd have to take conceal because I'd rather get missions completed than clear maps.

 

I want to avoid the Speed Pool all the time.

 

And I love love LOVE stealth.

 

Back in the day, I got sick and tired of missions sending me into the higher Level end of a Zone and getting ganked by the Purple-conning mobs there.  Learned to run down the exact centre of streets trying to avoid aggro.  And Hovering across The Hollows because that Zone used to be brutal.

 

Back in the day, on my main, Assault Rifle/Devices Blaster, when I was L15, I was on the Old School Posi TF with others.  (Back then you never Levelled higher than the max of the TF, so I was L15 throughout.  The Team slowly lost members until there was just 3 of us who started the last mission.  And those other 2 soon dropped off.  Leaving me with a mission set to +0x3 (and back then I didn't know how to reset TF missions).   It was brutal, going through that map filled with Circle of Thorns.  I remember one hallway with two side bays, each with a full spawn.  I couldn't aggro just one, all of them came to beat on me.  Clearing that and the rest of the map,. I ran back from the Hospital in Steel Canyon to the door in Perez Park so many times.

 

But I persevered.  And I won!  (No AV on the Old Posi TF helped.)

 

My reward: A L15 Celerity Stealth Proc Recipe, my first.

 

I've put stealth on every Toon since.

 

I want to have at least Boss-level stealth, 55ft or more, on every Toon I have.

 

I have used a stealth Proc in Super Speed to get that stealth (but only in PvE) and it's a pain to control a Super-Speeding Toon on an indoor map.

 

I always take a L15 Celerity Stealth Proc in Prestige Power Surge (to make the stealth Sprint look different).  If there's no stealth Power in the Primary or Secondary Powersets and it's one of the few builds I can't fit in the Concealment Pool (because the build just has to have 4 other Pools) for the Stealth Power, I will use the Celerity Stealth Proc and the Base Buff Grant Invisibility (which is only 30ft), as together they fulfill my need.

Come to the Dark Side!  Hide in the shadows.  And sneak!

 

Learn how to run past those damn far-sighted mobs or the ones who just ignore stealth.  (I take Smoke Grenade on my AR/Dev Blaster at L47 to help deal with them.)

 

 

[Ukase]

6 hours ago, Jacke said:

Come to the Dark Side!  Hide in the shadows.

I usually avoid the concealment pool in favor of the celerity:stealth because often, the celerity with SS is enough. Both methods of stealth suppress when clicking on glowies, as well as entering combat. 

We're only allowed 4 power pools. And I just can't see not getting Combat Jumping. No idea how I'd play without it. 
I suppose I could go: 
Leaping
Speed
Concealment
Leadership 

Then I could avoid SS. But apparently for reasons discussed, fly is too slow, and afterburner turns off too soon, and takes too long to recharge to suit my preferences. So, SS it was and shall be. 
 

[Arbegla]

3 hours ago, Ukase said:

I usually avoid the concealment pool in favor of the celerity:stealth because often, the celerity with SS is enough. Both methods of stealth suppress when clicking on glowies, as well as entering combat. 

We're only allowed 4 power pools. And I just can't see not getting Combat Jumping. No idea how I'd play without it. 
I suppose I could go: 
Leaping
Speed
Concealment
Leadership 

Then I could avoid SS. But apparently for reasons discussed, fly is too slow, and afterburner turns off too soon, and takes too long to recharge to suit my preferences. So, SS it was and shall be. 
 

 

For what its worth, the new 'double jump' power you get with super jump allows you to basically leap over the whole city. Its pretty much the same as the jump-pack you get from the START vendor, but free. And Super Jump is almost as fast as SS, though not as useful to stealth with in missions, unless you're REALLY good at bunny hopping.

[catsi563]

23 hours ago, Arbegla said:

I think the short and sweet answer to why fly has such a small (relative to SS/SJ) movement cap is due to mobility while fly is enabled. You get pseudo-KB protection while flying (flip in the air rather then on the floor) and you can out range mobs by flying above them. Neither of those things can you do with SS/SJ. 

exactly 

 

flight has the best advantage of any of the movement powers for the sole reason that unlike the others once you go up you DO NOT ever need to go down unless YOU choose to. or run out of end

 

SS faster sure but no UP mechanic

 

SJ lots of up and a smidge faster no control really and youre at the mercy of gravity going down and landings hurt 

 

teleport fastest and good control no staying up power you WILL go down at some point

 

flight best control no height limit best end cost of the bunch best maneuverability

 

so yeah flights a bit slower but it makes up for it with several advantages