Necro .... Something?

[Rhaethe]

Hey there folks :)

 

One of the last alts I have planned is a Mastermind.  I've decided on Necro, but I am at a loss on which Secondary will work best to keep the minions alive.  The reading I have done so far shows folks tend to choose /dark, but I don't think I want to go that route.  Kinetics. FF, and Sonic are appealing, as well as Poison ... which of these do you think would be most complimentary, or is there another secondary that suits "best"?

 

 

[Tacheyon]

I just started a Necro/Nature.  So far (only 14) having fun with it, and can see some good potential down the line.  Went with magically corrupted dirt my villain/hero was buried in, brought them back to life in a half undead state.

 

Now /Dark is a really good fit with them.  I was thinking /Kin but aside from the 1st skill melee ranged heal, Kinetics doesn't have much in mitigation.  You can try /Therm as that not only heals but covers their weakness to Fire damage.  Cold could do most of it (you would need to take Heal Other) and have more CC and debuffs.

 

Damn...now my creative mind just whipped up a couple more alts.  Back to the Character Creator!

[StrikerFox]

I recommend Storm. It won't be the best but of all the MM secondaries I have played, imo, it's the most fun. Give it a try. Play until level 18, buy a Sudden Acceleration KB-KD IO on /ah, slot it in Gale and put it on auto. The mitigation it provides may surprise you.

[PaxArcana]

Doctor Von Zed is a Necro/Cold MM.  So far it's been fun, but he's only in the mid-teens, so ... :)

[SmalltalkJava]

I recommend Storm. It won't be the best but of all the MM secondaries I have played, imo, it's the most fun. Give it a try. Play until level 18, buy a Sudden Acceleration KB-KD IO on /ah, slot it in Gale and put it on auto. The mitigation it provides may surprise you.

 

True. At low levels Gale with kB -> kd IO and several accuracy is pretty Uber.  Knocks down entire groups

[Xaeon]

I've had good fun with /Dark on my Necro MM. It's thematically fitting and it also gives you an extra pet at level 38. Not to mention it's got a bit of everything you'd want out of a support set as well as a good soft control in Fearsome Stare.

[Redlynne]

True. At low levels Gale with kB -> kd IO and several accuracy is pretty Uber.  Knocks down entire groups

 

You can blame me for making Gale fun to use routinely.

I mean, can you imagine that people used to think that Gale was a waste of a power pick that they'd never use?

I know, right?  Amateurs.

 

[kelly Rocket]

Strongly recommend either Dark or Time to pair with Necro. The reason being that Necro is not a good damage set and never will be, but the Lich is an excellent CC pet, so what you want to do is pair Necro with a secondary that gives you even more CC, so that you can stack it all to oblivion and beyond, and nothing gets to move or attack :D

 

Dark and Time are the secondaries that fit that particular criteria.

 

Traps, Storm, and Trick Arrow would be choices that could possibly work as well, but I don't feel they CC as well as Dark and Time.

[Dallayna]

So, first off, this is a seriously tough question because everyone has a favorite secondary power. Because of that, I'm going to go a little different and ask back: Well..... how do you like to play?

 

I mean, when the wrapper's off the case and the game's booted up into the computer or console, what are the games (other than this one obviously) that you just keep playing no matter what? I mean, if you're like me, you've got a whole stack of games that you just never got around to finishing and a whole other stack that you've probably played through so many times that you've practically got it memorized.

 

The reason why I ask is because sometimes (not always by any means when it comes to a game like City!) just sometimes, that might give you an idea when you're looking through that kind of daunting list of powers in the character creator.

 

Using myself as an example, in most games, I'm a blasting wizardy type and healer all the way. Why? Because, I just looooove sitting back and watching the action as much as I like playing. For that reason, a really good secondary for me is Force Fields, Empathy, or Pain Domination because two attacks and a couple of prestige powers suit me just fine whereas someone who's more of a tanky-type of player that just loves the furious press of buttons would probably like something a touch more active such as Trick Arrow, or Storm Summoning or Cold Domination because it gives them a couple more active attacks that they otherwise wouldn't get.

 

Obviously, concept is going to make a slight bit of difference too because I might want to go for something like Pain Domination for a villain or Empathy for a Heroic type but, my first narrowing down of the powers is always going to be just like it is in the character creator: which play style am I going for? How active do I want to be? How close to the bad guys do I want to be during the fighting? How close do I want my minions to be? And then, I go for what's easier to make sense for my character concept.

 

The reason why I've taken to doing things this way instead of coming up with the character idea first to be honest is because after so many alts over so many years back in the day, I noticed that around level 20, I stopped caring what all I was thinking when I made the character and around level 30, I honestly have flat-out forgotten. By that point, it's just down to whether or not I'm having fun with this character's powers and how they work.

 

The fun ones get to 50 while the cool idea characters that don't quite work as well for me just wind up getting pushed further and further down my list of characters until they wind up on the last page where they get forgotten about.

 

So, my advice is to look through the various powers and think about whether or not they sound any fun to you even if they don't seem to work out the greatest to your idea. Because, frankly? You can always come up with a reason for any power, you can't however make a power that you find boring or annoying or just not fun into a character you want to play.

 

Anyway, I know that it's probably the most annoying of the advice that you'll get here, but that's my advice all the same.

 

TL;DR version?

Ignore numbers, opinions, popularity and even "theme" -- Go for what sounds the most fun to you.  Because, this is your character and you want to have fun!!!!

 

Now, have fun: Go. Kill Skulls.  8)

 

[Rhaethe]

@Dallayna

 

Well then, that is an excellent turnabout question :)

 

Honestly, my play-style is similar to what you describe yours as.  I prefer range, and I like doing support and damage in equal measure.  Out of all my characters in this game, the ones I play the most are:  Arachnos Soldier (Huntsman build), Storm/Sonic Defender, and Ice/Ice Blaster.  I tend to be fairly mellow and methodical, but not plodding ;)

 

I've played enough beast-pet type classes in other games that Beast in this one just does not appeal.  Bots and Demons do not appeal to me either.  That leaves me Necro, Ninja, Mercs, and Thugs.  I chose Necro for the MM because they seemed like the set that would best complement my play-style, as the minions appear to be mostly melee. 

 

However, I am not married to Necro as a primary, and am willing to think of another if it suits better. :)

[fireawayx]

I've enjoyed Necro/Nature -  there's a high amount of sustain and debuffs to assist in keeping your t1 zombies alive, and the additional CC it provides through Entangling Aura synergizes well with your Lich. It's definitely lower on damage though - seems only slightly above full passive sets like Empathy and FF.

 

/Storm, to that end, can really pick your damage up, both through Freezing Rain (one of the most jam-packed abilities in the game) and with Tornado and Lightning Storm. The CC and debuffs are considerable as well for helping survivability.

 

Kinetics is also famously potent, but if I'm honest I find it a little boring and repetitive to play in a scenario where it's the powerset you'll use primarily. It doesn't have much flash in terms of animation.

[Dallayna]

@Rhaethe

 

Then in that case I can say that I do remember having fun with zombies for the reasons you just said: they're more melee type of pets. And, you are right in that the way that the secondary power interacts with your pets does indeed make a difference but, like I said, it's just not a numbers kind of synergy when it comes to the "fun-ness factor."

 

I mean, I remember having a MM necro that I loved playing but, all of these years later, alas, I honestly could not tell you what it was. I can tell you the one that I hated: Dark Miasma. Now don't get me wrong, there are some great powers in there but, again, we come to the fact that when I'm not running an MM, I'm usually a Defender or Controller with heavy dose of heals of some variety so I like my pets to play the part of tank for me.

 

Needless to say that from that perspective, despite the fact that they seem to work so well together thematically that Twilight Grasp (Dark Miasma) + Zombies = complete and utter waste. I mean you have to be so close for that to go off that positioning so you don't draw aggro from the pets and are still close enough to the action so that you can heal them that I just gave up around level 20. For the flip side of the same reason: Transfusion (Kinetics) + Demon Summoning was kinda the same it was a fight to make my guys stay close enough to the baddies to get the benefit when it went off. lol.

 

Anyway, I guess my biggest question for myself at this point- having decided on the pet but aren't quite sure which of the secondaries to go for, I usually just ask myself which roll do I want to play to these guys? Am I feeling more Defender or Controller?

 

Because, Defender, I'm probably going to start looking at the secondaries with a more active or more appropriate heal (like avoiding something like Dark Miasma and looking more at Poison or Thermal could be a kinda cool to try out or even Kinetics- heck, maybe even Rad because you can just stand (hide) behind them. If I feeling more active, Controller type of mood, Nature's the Power Du Jour, Time Manipulation might be kind of fun to try out too or Trick Arrow, or how about Cold? 

 

Again though, it always, always, always comes down to "fun-ness factor" for me because, way I see it, powers come into and out of fashion as tiny tweaks and changes are always introduced by game developers over time so no Archtype/Class or power in any game is going to stay the most powerful anyway so, why bug out about a couple of points on a character sheet? As long as I'm not face planting every other fight, and I'm having fun, it's a good build. After all, no stat or team invite is worth filling what little gaming time I get in my life with boredom or- worse; aggravation. 

 

Only really firm piece of advice I can give on power choices when it comes to City is to just save your character build before you hit the Register button. One of the truly intelligent things that I always loved about this game was the ability to save your character's every detail while you're creating them because, with that Save File, if you do find yourself sitting at level 4 (or even 40!) absolutely hating whatever it was you picked and you don't want to roll an alt?

 

You can always just sell off everything, email all the influence to yourself and have the exact same character with a different power picked out in only a couple of clicks after you've hit confirm on that Delete.

 

Except with, you know, more resources to start with this time around. ;)

[tjknight]

I have a 28 Necro/Nature now and he's coming along nicely. The zombies really do seem benefit from all the uber heals (and they buff you too).

 

/Kin was a struggle for me to work with on a MM. But I'm thinking there's something more wrong with how I'm playing the set, then the combo itself.  I think a more 'tankermind' style would work better and perhaps keep the pets from running out of heal range.

 

Back in the old days, I teamed with a Necro/Dark regularly. By end game, that guy was a powehouse. And this was before incarnates. One thing to note, the heal from /Dark is excelent and has rather large radius. You're pets will stay healed up easily. Also, the extra pet is nice.

 

I fiddled around with /time but only at low levels. It blooms pretty early and I can see how /time with an MM primary would be good.

 

If it were put to a vote I'd rate these as my top three choices for Necro:

 

1. Dark

2. Time

3. Nature

 

 

 

[You]

/thermal? Any taker?

[tjknight]

On 7/21/2019 at 2:55 AM, You said:

/thermal? Any taker?

Got bored and rolled up a lvl 26 Necro/Thermal up on the test server. Mostly, because I've saw a random internet post claiming this combo is really good.  So at lvl 26 it aprox 23% resistance to Smashing, Lethal. About 45% resistance to Fire and Toxic. Along with strong resistance to negative (can't remember the percentage).  Ran a few quick Newspaper missons and have to say it was impressive. The lower tier pets didn't die as easily they normally do, and overall it felt quite tanky. 

Mind you, this was just a quick build I put together with standard IO's. So no special enhancements or set bonuses.  I imagine someone who really knew what they were doing could, put together something much better than I did. 

[ghotistix]

no one seems to have mentioned it yet, so i'm going to go ahead and throw out there a /radiation.  for those who aren't very familiar with /radiation, let's look at what it gives you:

 

a PBAoE heal - this kind of heal is especially useful for a MM in bodyguard mode for any damage you take personally that spreads to you pets.

two auto-hit AoE toggle debuffs - while a few other sets have one of these that makes the enemy less of a threat, these work together to make the enemies easier to kill also (which really helps the lower necro damage).

two additional AoE debuffs - in addition to the other elements of these debuffs, they both include fairly strong -regen, something else that can make tough enemies easier to kill.

a PBAoE toggle hold - now, while this is realistically only going to hold some of the minions some of the time, this allows you to focus attention on taking out the hardest hitting enemies first.

a PBAoE team buff - even though the +recharge doesn't affect pets, the rest of it can really help them with the +damage and +mez resistance.

also two abilities that only work on dead teammates and not on pets, so, who cares?  🙂

 

look at all those AoE powers.  /radiation seems to really shine in a play style consisting of being right in the middle of the action with all of your pets being right in there with you, something that necro/ seems to want since they have a lot of melee attacks.  is necro/rad the strongest MM combo out there?  i'd guess no, but it does seem to synergize well with itself and adds a lot to help keep you undead horde just a little bit more UN-dead.

any thoughts?

[kelly Rocket]

Necro/Rad is great because of Choking Cloud and EM Pulse stacking with the Liche and Ghost's crowd controls.

 

I just don't like playing /Rad because I hate anchor toggles.

[Rhaethe]

Update on my MM experiment.  :)

 

Note: I have never played an MM before, not even the days of Live.

 

I ended up creating a Ninja/Storm and created a character that was pretty close to looking like a Tsoo Sorceror.  I then placed that character in Praetoria to give  it a workout and see how things went.  I was able to go through things at a decent rate, but there was a lot more effort in keeping track of the Ninjas than I thought there might be.  There was no "Send in pet, heal from a distance, and progress at a laid back rate"  No no.  There was a lot of "Go kill, have a heal or two, oh wait where the f are you going come back here, oh hell where are you going now?  I am going to have to recall you every time aren't I? Wait stop dammit come back here."    I am not sure if the Ninja "hyperness" is specific to Ninja, all MM minions who melee, or all MM minions.

 

I put the MM aside for a bit that night and fiddled around with the character creator and got completely sidetracked creating a Dark/Dark Controller ... once I discovered that I could recolor the Dark powers this fluffy light pink color; a good number of recolors of Dark powers just look weird to me and don't recolor well, but the light pink delighted me.  I  proceeded to get completely distracted playing the alt.

 

I might create a Necro MM now to continue experimenting ... will maybe do a "sister" of the Dark/Dark controller and make the dark powers in Necro some shade of pastel lol.  As far as secondary, I have discovered that I really am a "from a distance" sort of player with the MM, so any secondary will need heals for the minions that can be done from a distance ... so that helps narrow things.  Probably Thermal, Poison, Empathy, or Pain.

[SmalltalkJava]

I think it has to do with the speed of the ninja henchies.   I know the wolves in beasts tend to run all over the place also,  especially if they are speedboosted.  They are like rabid dogs just zooming all over.

 

 

[SmalltalkJava]

On 7/21/2019 at 1:55 AM, You said:

/thermal? Any taker?

/thermal is pretty strong.  It has +Resist Shields and a Heal.   

[Redlynne]

Best counter I've found to Ninjas getting spastic all over the map is to keep them in Bodyguard Mode and soak the alpha myself (dividing out the damage to them) which then prompts them to aggro on whatever hit me.  Doing this from a distance "encourages" the Ninjas to stay put beside me and use their ranged attacks to start with (Shuriken machinegun spamming from the Genin) while whatever attacked me closes range.  If the $Target "had friends" they will be bumrushing towards MY position, rather than sending the Ninjas in over to THEIR position, which then helps keep them ... focused ... on the task at hand of delivering a beatdown in MY vicinity, rather than rushing off and trying to aggro the entire map for me.

[Rhaethe]

The MM Experiment continues ...

 

I found that the Necro minions are far easier for me to track on screen, and I feel less spastic when using them.  As far as Secondary, I'm still torn between Thermal and Kinetic, though I am sure I will figure that out soon.  

 

As far as Epic Pool powers available to Masterminds, I am really not digging on any of them, at least what I can see in Pines.  Anything there that I MUST HAVE OMG, or are Epic/Patron pools fairly skippable on MM?