Amazon Warrior idea

[Dragonfire]

Hi all,

 

I was thinking of doing an Amazon warrior hero, and was considering a tanker with super strength / invulnerability.  Is Invulnerability better off than regeneration?  I wanted to make sure I had fun with this build getting to 50 in this theme.

[Caulderone]

This would probably be better off in the Tanker subforum.

 

Look up Heraclea, as she has a build with a similar theme to it.

[Heraclea]

In-game, I can't recommend Super Strength in its current form, especially for a tanker, though Invulnerability is probably as good a way as any to cope with its flaws.  For that general feel I'd go with Street Justice (punches and kicks) or Titan Weapons (slow, hard hitting attacks). 

 

I never was in love with 'Rage' as a defining power for Heraclea for concept reasons;  she's a soldier, not a Hulk.  Before ED I ran a build that just didn't use it.   Heraclea was Inv/SS in the old game; in Homecoming she's Inv/Dark Melee - very good synergy there.   In the old game I had an Inv/DM tanker who became my go-to for master runs and the like. 

Edited September 8, 2019 by Heraclea

[Dragonfire]

How is street justice vs super strength power-wise?  IS one more powerful than the other attack-wise?

[Heraclea]

Street Justice doesn't have Foot Stomp, which is rather the point of Super Strength on a tanker, with reliable knockup in a solid PBAoE attack.  But it does have several PBAoEs and wide cones, and is generally as interesting or more so with regard to animations.  A lot of the damage in SJ comes from a rudimentary 'combo' system, where some attacks are builders and others finishers. There's a lot more finesse in Street Justice, which makes it a bit more attractive in my mind's eye for an Amazon concept.  I would say that both sets are rough equals in their Tanker form.  

 

 

[PaxArcana]

Query: why a Tanker?  Why not a Brute or Scrapper?  🙂

[Dragonfire]

I guess it's because I played before CoV and always considered the tanker the one who can absorb the most damage and is the most physically powerful, which is what I think of for an Amazon.  How does a brute or scrapper compare to a tanker as far as durability and attack power?

[AkuTenshiiZero]

Regen is not a good set for tanking.  As for Brute and Scrapper, I find Brutes to be capable tanks if built for it, and Scrappers not so much.  A Scrapper can hold a few enemies safely, but not the hordes a Tanker or Brute can.  The main difference between Tankers and Brutes is that a Tanker can just tank all day while their team does the damage, while a Brute can tank short-term and speeds up the process by being a capable DPSer themselves.

 

Basically, if you want to be tough and still dish out respectable damage, play a Brute.  If you don't care about your damage and just want to never die, play a Tanker.  If you want to be a raving psychopath flitting from target to target like a murder-hummingbird, play a Scrapper.

[Heraclea]

12 minutes ago, AkuTenshiiZero said:

Basically, if you want to be tough and still dish out respectable damage, play a Brute.  If you don't care about your damage and just want to never die, play a Tanker.  If you want to be a raving psychopath flitting from target to target like a murder-hummingbird, play a Scrapper.

I find the latter is more typical of Brutes than Scrappers: the Fury mechanic means that they always have to rush to the next spawn.  Which is why they tend to build like tankers; Brutes are much more compelled to min-max builds than Scrappers are.  With the scrapper you have a lot more build freedom to make concept characters, because no one expects you to tank, and you don't have to build for sustain or survival nearly as much. 

 

Pine's to the contrary, I don't think regen is available as a tanker primary.  In its current state it wouldn't work.  Regen on a brute is tempting in the lower levels, but doesn't give you the survivability for the late game.  Regen scrapper is still viable.  I rolled one on Homecoming for a specific purpose.  She is my lowbie task force merits farmer: great fun on a Citadel or even a Synapse, but struggles with late game content.  I didn't take fighting pool on the character; it seemed to be lipstick on a pig where Regen is involved.

[TheOtherTed]

Is it weird that the first powerset combo that my brain vomited up was an Archery / Martial Combat Blaster?

 

Anyway, if I were to create a classical era Amazon, I probably wouldn't go with a bare-handed fighting style.  As an example from a parallel myth, I've been running a Valkyrie as a War Mace / Shield Brute, and it's been lots of fun (although I have no idea if it's "optimal" in any way).

 

I could also see pairing Battle Axe, Broadsword, or (as someone suggested) Titan Weapons with Invulnerability, Willpower, or even Super Reflexes, but, again, I can't make any claim for relative strengths.

 

Edit:  Specific AT - really your choice.  Personally I'd lean away from Tanker, and slightly on the Scrapper side of Scrapper or Brute.

 

 

Edited September 8, 2019 by TheOtherTed

[PaxArcana]

6 hours ago, Dragonfire said:

I guess it's because I played before CoV and always considered the tanker the one who can absorb the most damage and is the most physically powerful, which is what I think of for an Amazon.  How does a brute or scrapper compare to a tanker as far as durability and attack power?

Slightly less durability (but definitely not sqishy), and way more DPS.  Like, way way WAAAAY more.  (Especially Brutes, once their Fury bar is filled up and they keep on fighting ...)

 

5 hours ago, AkuTenshiiZero said:

Basically, if you want to be tough and still dish out respectable damage, play a Brute.  If you don't care about your damage and just want to never die, play a Tanker.  If you want to be a raving psychopath flitting from target to target like a murder-hummingbird, play a Scrapper.

+1 to this.  Except, I agree with Heraclea that you've got Scrappers and Brutes backwards.  I've recently begun playing a Dual Blade / Willpower Brute, and I hate hate HATE running out of enemies ... because it means my Fury is going to wane, and with it, my nigh-godlike (for his level) damage.

 

5 minutes ago, TheOtherTed said:

Anyway, if I were to create a classical era Amazon, I probably wouldn't go with a bare-handed fighting style.  As an example from a parallel myth, I've been running a Valkyrie as a War Mace / Shield Brute, and it's been lots of fun (although I have no idea if it's "optimal" in any way).

+1 to this, as well.  🙂

 

[Redlynne]

3 hours ago, TheOtherTed said:

Is it weird that the first powerset combo that my brain vomited up was an Archery / Martial Combat Blaster?

Not if you're a fan of Xena: Warrior Princess.

 

To a strong Amazon nation.

[boggo2300]

9 hours ago, AkuTenshiiZero said:

If you want to be a raving psychopath flitting from target to target like a murder-hummingbird, play a Scrapper.

Slicer Dicer my main Scrapper approves this message 🙂

[DR_Mechano]

20 hours ago, Heraclea said:

I find the latter is more typical of Brutes than Scrappers: the Fury mechanic means that they always have to rush to the next spawn.  Which is why they tend to build like tankers; Brutes are much more compelled to min-max builds than Scrappers are.  With the scrapper you have a lot more build freedom to make concept characters, because no one expects you to tank, and you don't have to build for sustain or survival nearly as much. 

 

Pine's to the contrary, I don't think regen is available as a tanker primary.  In its current state it wouldn't work.  Regen on a brute is tempting in the lower levels, but doesn't give you the survivability for the late game.  Regen scrapper is still viable.  I rolled one on Homecoming for a specific purpose.  She is my lowbie task force merits farmer: great fun on a Citadel or even a Synapse, but struggles with late game content.  I didn't take fighting pool on the character; it seemed to be lipstick on a pig where Regen is involved.

To be fair, Regen, on a tanker COULD be good but you'd have to seriously push it. Regen Brutes can get up to 200hp per second with a very large IO investment, Tankers could push that up to probably about 300-400hp per second with the same investment. To compare 300 hp per second is what Giant Monster regenerate health at. Of course Giant monsters also get decent resistances and a massive health pool to go along with their health regen. The investment to reach 400 hp per second would also mean that you couldn't build for much else and since regen is all healing with very few resistances it also means you can't do things like adding in defense and resistances without lowering the hp per second or use the major sets that help.

 

By contrast, Willpower can build for regen with a bit of resist and defense OR it can build to cap it's Smashing/Lethal resistance and melee defense. I've seen a willpower brute build that went all in on the regen but I'm not sure how viable that is compared to the 'standard' build. This also applies to other sets like Elec/Fire/Dark which can, with the right build, softcap 2 resistances (for Elec its energy and S/L etc.) Of course the other problem is Regen has terrible alpha strike survivablity without MoG (which is a must have unlike every other sets tier 9 which is usually ignored).

[Gorgar]

Inv is good for this.  Willpower is decent too.  My Amazonian type is Axe/Inv, was a tank on live but a tanky brute fits her better.

 

I'd go brute, your choice of mace, axe, katana, broadsword, dual blades, staff, titan weapons, with invuln, willpower, shield as good thematic choices for armor set.

 

If you really don't want a weapon set, to me Super Strength has kind of a Hulk-like feel, and Street Justice would fit an unarmed Amazon better.  SS looks strong and slow, StJ looks still strong but also agile, and therefore more fitting.  And it's a decent set.

[TheOtherTed]

On 9/8/2019 at 9:37 PM, Redlynne said:

Not if you're a fan of Xena: Warrior Princess.

 

To a strong Amazon nation.

Was never really a fan, but I went ahead rolled up the Archery / Martial Combat Amazon with a vaguely Greco-Roman outfit, and it's been a crazy amount of fun.  I had tried MC with Dual Pistols, but for some reason, I found that combo surprisingly boring.

 

Maybe I'm just hooked on Archery.  Possibly.

[Heraclea]

Archery is quite appropriate to Amazons generally.   Greek mythology locates the major Amazon homeland to the northeast of the Black Sea, Ukraine, Russia, and Georgia, part of a large area they generally called Scythia.  This was the home of the Kurgan people, an archaeological culture that most scholars believe were the original speakers of Indo-European languages.  They are so called from their 'kurgan' burial mounds.  Archaeologists have recently discovered that among the honored dead given warrior burials in them with chariots and weapons, around a quarter of them were women.  (Until recently, no one thought to check the skeletons; they assumed anyone buried with a sword, crown, and a chariot was male.)  So there just might have been a bit of truth in the mythology: women apparently fought in wars and held leadership positions in those societies. 

 

At any rate, Scythians were famous for their archery skills, and especially with the technique of shooting from a moving chariot.  Now we need the HC team to give us chariots as a travel power. 

 

(And earlier mythographers like Robert Graves and Marija Gimbutas got it bass-ackward.  They usually portray Indo-Europeans as patriarchal conquerors who conquered and imposed male dominance on a paradise of women's equality.)

 

I would go with the compound bow the CC calls the 'Mongolian' one, I think, as the most appropriate weapon for a warrior from the Eurasian steppes. 

[Redlynne]

To a strong Amazon Nation.

[TheOtherTed]

I tried the Mongolian bow, but ran into two issues.  First, there's a bit on each horn that can't be re-colored, and that can't be matched with anything on the palette.  Second, while it otherwise looked fine in the character creator, it looked tiny in game - my tall, fierce Amazon looked like she was plinking away with a toy bow.  I went with the composite bow instead.  Not necessarily true to form, but it looks "good enough" for me.