Sovera

If you go to a tram station it lists areas by level.

I'm working on a /Bio brute, but it works on a tank too, that when surrounded by ten mobs has something like 1700% regen and 500% recovery. Combined with softcapped defenses and I'm not sure if regular play can even kill it.

Your answer lays in the Pylon thread over the scrapper forums. Despite being in the scrapper forums all ATs have been posting their times there. Since you're not adding enough constraints, like sustain and burst DPS, length of the fight (a 15 second fight will not favor TW, and if we both start from range and need to approach and fight a Blaster will have shot a mob three times by the time a meleer has bounced to melee range) then that thread has your answers. Several scrappers, brutes and stalkers have posted their times so just have a gander. Street Justice stalker and Titan Weapon scrapper are up there, and we're talking *up* there with one minute times and no gimmicks like -regen.

Though the idea did not have traction I still reiterate that things that would make tankers more valued should be something tanking related. A 30y wide PbAoE that does negative knockback (so, knock-in?) reeling every mob in range that was previously plinking from range would be deeply appreciated by any team when it means all mobs in a pack are balled around the tank and being AoEd down by the team.

/Bio's largesse with offering a '30%' buff, which turned out to be much much less than that with actual testing, is completely overshadowed by the strenuously tight power and sloting which was the original reason I had stopped playing with the powerset. To be honest Fire does not feel like all that but it might still work if paired with Ninjutsu which is my go to defensive sentinel set. The enemies already flee like decapitated chickens the moment their HP reaches 25% ish and Rain of Fire just making them start doing so earlier does not help. With a less tight build we can work in the Elec epic pool, get Chain Fences to force the mobs to stay close (who need agro auras anyway?), have Lightning field to aid in the AoEing down, and finally have more slots to increase recovery. So Fire/Ninjutsu might make better use of the bug fix if one wants to explore Fire's beautifully fast animations. Sadly, Sentinel /Bio does not live to the expectations after seeing the preposterous numbers and what it can do with other ATs.

You have too much energy, Obitus my dude.

Charr is 32 seconds, that's too large a CD. I putzed around a bit and changed things to Psi Epic. to have Dominate since it recharges in 16 seconds, but /Bio is so tight in powers and sloting trying to aim for the 40% goal that it just threw everything into disarray. At this point I'm just ah feggadaboutit.

Fake nemesis are easy to find actually, and can be made to spawn as -1 lieuts so they can be two shot. I have a link somewhere about it but it's a TF in Steel that has them right at the first mission.

Odd discoveries as I tested: - Inferno is supposed to do Fire and Smash damage but only does Fire damage if Aim is not used. If Aim is used Smash and Fire happens. In practical terms who cares, we only use Inferno with Aim anyway, but yeah. - As I mentioned to @modest assumptions are an ass. We hear say, we assume, we napkin math, but empirical test is where its at, and as it goes, no, /Bio is not an around the board 30% damage boost as I kept parroting In particular the omfg look at these T9 numbers hue hue hue. Tested on fire mobs, then lethal mobs, then +0 mobs, then +4 mobs, but the damage increase was within a 0.5%: Inferno: 120 smash + 291 fire = 411 128 smash + 310 fire + 8 Offense damage tick= 446 8.5% Blaze: 170 + 20 fire tick = 190 186 + 22 fire tick +17 Offense damage tick= 225 18% Blazing Bolt: 77 + 8 + 104 from 13 ticks = 189 85 + 9 + 122 from 13 ticks + 19 Offense damage tick = 235 24% Fire Blast: 113 134 18% Unless otherwise stated I always included one tick from the Fire's DoT if the damage does a DoT. This is because I was testing for the % and not the damage that each skill did with their variable DoT ticks.

First tests in with Degenerative 75% chance and 25% DoT, Musculature 45%, Hybrid (not clicked): - Endurance is incapable of keeping up with the demands. Even without Tough and Tactics toggled on, even with Defensive Opportunity, I ran dry in two minutes. I had to take some slots from other places to slot a Miracle and add a second +5 slot to Stamina for the build to manage to hold on to the four minute mark when I ran dry again, but since it was the very end of the test I kept on without toggles. - Disappointing performance. At the four minute mark I stopped the test since the pylon still stood and had 1/5th HP. There goes the dream of reaching three minutes thanks to /Bio pushing more than /Ninjutsu.

A spin-off from the Rad/Bio to embrace our firey overlord (while also enjoying the elegantly fast animations of Fire instead.. of.. posturing... and...shooting.. Matrix slow motion...). Same deal, same idea: With /Bio being so arduous to softcap the defenses are pushed close to 40% and then Barrier takes the slack adding the last 5% (Barrier *always* adds at least 5% defense). Fast animations, Offensive Adaption, KO Blow to accelerate the build and do Inferno levels of damage in single target every 12 seconds. Inferno backed by Aim goes to 646 damage and then Offensive Adaptation pushes it further to 839. In the same vein KO Blow starts at 691 with Aim to then reach 898 😅...that poor boss in the middle of a pack taking Inferno + KO Blow to the face backed by Aim... This is currently a place to write things down and ponder how to best achieve best overall results instead of pure damage in a vacuum. For example Fire Blast allows Defensive Opportunity which pretty much negates endurance woes all by itself (and in actual testing from the Rad/Ninjutsu Defensive Opportunity actually made for better times than Offensive Opportunity), but Fire Blast is a 'long' 1.8 animation steering away from Fire's beautifully fast combo making. So, decisions time. But with Justin the PTS back up it's easy enough to just try the different things and see what works out better. Current questions: - Worth it to lose 10% recharge time to fit the -res in Fireball? Or instead lose a damage proc in Blaze to regain the 10% recharge? Or sacrifice the -KB in Blazing Blast? -KB is mostly 'cosmetic', but pushing and then doing a KB on top of that is incredibly obnoxious since the inertia of being repelled is added to the KB distance. - The endurance seems like it will be a problem. Worth it to slot Fire Blast to make it a non thing? - Accuracy seems low-ish. This makes wanting to run Tactics tempting, but, its slotting is atrocious and the endurance problems rear its head once more. Rotation musings: At first glance simply changing Flares for Fire Blast would allow for Blaze (1.2 animation, 3.11 recharge), Blazing Blast (1.8 animation, 3.44 recharge) and Fire Blast (1.8 animation, 1.4 recharge). 1.8 + 1.8 = 3.6, Blaze has recharged when the cycle starts again. 1.2 + 1.8 = 3 seconds, Blazing Blast has a 0.44 gap before it recharges which can be filled with Fireball (1.2 animation, 4.46 recharge). 1.2 + 1.8 + 1.8 = 4.8 animation which fits Fireball's recharge and Fireball can be fitted with a -res proc so this is practical. But if we add Fireball we can cut down on Fire Blast's 'long' animation and move back to Flares because 1.2 + 1.2 + 1.8 + 1.2 = 5.4 animation which is more than enough to get Blaze and Blazing Bolt back up. So Blaze, Blazing Blast, Fireball, Blaze and Flares, where Flares can be substituted for Haste/Destiny/KO Blow/Aim. Or 1.2, 1.8, 1.2, 0.11 gap, 1.2, 1.2. And now a 2.2 gap until Blazing Blast recharges. With Fire Blast this would become a 1.6. No need to chase Flares quick recharge if it gives a larger gap in waiting, incidentally fixing endurance problems by activating Defensive Opportunity, and instead of substituting Fire Blast for Hasten/Destiny/Aim/KO Blow we use the 1.6 second gap for those. Or we ignore the 0.44 gap since it's so minor. The tiniest bit of latency, Hasten/Destiny going off, etc etc and half a second is gone making the rotation take 1.2 + 1.8 + 1.8 + 0.44 = 5.24 animation + gap. Sort of a wash except in EPS and -res proc chances. With the build having some endurance problems due to being so tight in slots EPS is a consideration. Using Fire Blast is not perfect because Fire primes for the beautifully short animations and we mar it with FB, but Fire Blast does trigger Defensive Opportunity which can be a consideration for some builds because of the endurance recovery, and it also does more damage (121 Flares VS 189 Fire Blast) though it eats more animation time. KO Blow for the Force Feedback proc to accelerate the build (and because T9 levels of damage ST every 12 seconds, sure) can take the place of Fire Blast/Flares, or even Fireblast/Flares + Fireball combined (not counting with Aim or Offensive adaptation KO Blow 2.4 animation and 447 damage. Flares + Fireball 2.4 animation and 243 damage total. KO Blow also has the Force Feedback to make everything recharge faster).

I'm going to move this out since it's derailing the topic of the thread.

At first glance simply changing Flares for Fire Blast *seems* like it would allow for Blaze (1.2 animation, 3.11 recharge), Blazing Blast (1.8 animation, 3.44 recharge) and Fire Blast (1.8 animation, 1.4 recharge). 1.8 + 1.8 = 3.6, Blaze has recharged when the cycle starts again. 1.2 + 1.8 = 3 seconds, Blazing Blast has a 0.44 gap before it recharges which can be filled with Fireball (1.2 animation, 4.46 recharge). 1.2 + 1.8 + 1.8 = 4.8 animation which fits Fireball's recharge. But if we add Fireball we can move back to Flares because 1.2 + 1.2 + 1.8 + 1.2 = 5.4 animation which is more than enough to get Blaze and Blazing Bolt back up. Or we ignore the 0.44 gap since it's so minor. The tiniest bit of latency, Hasten/Destiny going off, etc etc and half a second is gone making the rotation take 1.2 + 1.8 + 1.8 + 0.44 = 5.24 animation + gap. Sort of a wash except in EPS. My Rad/Bio Fire/Bio mock-up has some endurance problems due to being so tight in slots so EPS is a consideration. Using Fire Blast is not perfect because Fire primes for the beautifully short animations and we mar it with FB, but Fire Blast incidentally does Defensive Opportunity which can be a consideration for some builds because of the endurance recovery, and it also does more damage (121 Flares VS 189 Fire Blast) though it eats more animation time. That Fire/Bio I mentioned is using KO Blow for the Force Feedback proc to accelerate the build (and because T9 levels of damage ST every 12 seconds, sure) that can take the place of Fire Blast/Flares, or even Fireblast/Flares + Fireball combined. Edit: Though including Fireball has its perks since it too could take the -res proc.

I will say that... yes, turning a tanker into a brute by raising their damage is off. In the end just bring a brute then. But if a brute is selfish damage what about tanks contributing damage FOR the team, which is what the tank is about, what the players who use tanks tend to be and want to be about: being a team player. People don't make brutes *to* tank, they just incidentally tank. People who make tanks don't do it for the damage or to farm AE, they do it to be in a team and they *want* to have everyone safe and all eyes on them. Something like every mob that is taunted by the tank receives a (I'm going to say a random number) -20% resist. So it's like, bring a brute for incidental tanking and for the brute's selfish damage, and bring a tank (perhaps not make the 20% stack) not just tanking and grouping up mobs, but also because the tanks would literally increase everyone's damage. Another thing that might help make tanks more appealing is doing something similar to what Death Knights tanks in WoW have which is an AoE pull move. When a lot of the game is about getting packs grouped up for AoE and knockback is generally reviled to the point a specific IO set was invented to remove it, then bringing a tank that groups up annoying scattered mobs plinking it from afar in order to be AoEd them would make a tank as precious as DKs in Wow are where they are universally loved for their ability to group packs for the same AoE purposes. Imagine Taunt not being a targeted AoE but a PbAoE that does knockback of... (random numbers again, bear with me) 10 magnitude, but MINUS 10! Horry sheet, tanks hitting that in a (random numbers, it's ya boy again) 20-25 radius and all mobs in that range hovered up would make them as precious as their weight in gold.

When I read that I think 'Bring either then'.

HYPE!

I was in your boat at the start of the week. I *wanted* to try a Fire sentinel and level it up. But I looked at the numbers and they did not *look* amazing. And then I looked at Blazing Bolt *still* being bugged four months later and no ETA, so I went with the tried and true Rad for triple procs.... The damn animations are so *glacial* though. I half feel I ought to have gone Fire anyway and hope that the devs will have fixed it, but if they haven't in four months... Just looking at the character creator and it does not seem the the homogenization did Fire any favors. Someone correct me if wrong, but the attacks seem to be on par with the other sets and what damage Fire's DoTs add are eclipsed by being able to slot procs that Fire is unable to. Even the T9s are all equal. Where it shines is in the blazing fast animations. The T2 is an 1.8 animation (I found Defensive Opportunity better than Offensive because of endurance), but since there would be no procs then attacks could be better slotted which would remove the need for Endurance and thus Defensive, I guess, Blaze still that beautiful 1.1 all attacks aspire in City of Animationlock, BB is 1.8 which is boo, but okay. I tried Rad already and it did not get great times. Only 4 minutes despite all the procs. I blame all the uber slow animations though. 1.8, 1.8 and 2,2. That's basically one extra attack for Fire in the time Rad does a full rotation.

No no, just me waiting until the end of the week when Justin goes back to being a test server for what you mention. We don't get free incarnates and merits atm.

I wish I could.

Other than all the hami brouhaha I just want to say thanks for something much more minor that is a slider for name scaling. I couldn't read most names, and now I can, so thank you.

Wow, I go to bed and this just explodes. With Justin still down for testing this is not really possible, but the ultimate put-your-money-where-your-mouth-is is to simply head there, stock up on purple and greens inspirations, do a pylon run (not because it matters but to be used as a reference) and come back saying the time it took to kill it and the rotation/buffs used. Once that is done we can dissect a build and see *why* it got the times it got, which was how we collectively got to epic pool Holds being such godnabbit proc holders that improved on builds. Doing math to predict results is nice and it sort of works, but not when assumptions are made or small errors start creeping up unnoticed. A nice empirical test clears all nay saying and assumptions. It's why @Sir Myshkin's work in proc monsters is so *amazing*. He does not just sit down with a calculator and assume but he goes out there and tests for hours and then relates the empirical results he got, to then build on them. Edit: I'm reminded of the spreadsheet that was going around for a while when Homecoming started. The guy was trying to see which sets did the most damage and it started being taken as gospel despite voices questioning things like, where, exactly, would *anyone* manage to run at recharge cap, outside of a MSR, so how feasible were the conditions for the numbers he was putting on display and that were starting to be parroted around, or how the rotations used to decide the damage of a set were not optimal (and probably not even taking -res procs into consideration which some sets can use and others not). Empirical.... data.... 4thewin!

Yes, we have established that in the last two pages and now I'm starting to feel like we are bullying the poor guy.

What? No Flares? *flees harder!*

I keep talking of 3 minutes in Nihilii's run, but I completely forgot/missed his 2:20 run(s). Dayum! That's... that's downright Blaster territory. Firmly in there actually. And with a gimped Fire set that has its big attack bugged. I'm not sure if he didn't click on his Hybrid toggle. I was pondering leveling a Rad/Bio I recently cooked up but I don't think it will ever catch up. The slow attack chain with two 1.8 animations and one 2.2 make for a glacial rotation. With the Rad/Ninjutsu I only reached 4 minutes despite all the procs built into it and I don't think /Bio will shave two minutes. I blame the slow animations.