Going forward, can we have more things that mean something?

[HelBlaiz]

Ultimately what changed the server makes is up to the volunteers running Homecoming. IF they decide to make the statement "All costume pieces are available from the start with no grinding" false, I will hate it vocally, but will have to live with it. On the topic of having things to grind for, my official stance anyone may quote me on is thus:

"I am in full support of adding content locked rewards for people who wish to have them, so long as Costume Pieces (and Power Customization Options) remain freely accessible with no investment. I personally think permanent versions of the Costume Change Powers awarded during Trick or Treating would be an awesome reward that I do not mind being content locked, as I do not count them as Costume Pieces. Other content, such as temporary powers, badges, titles, and story arcs, would also make good unlockable content. I do not wish to run content to unlock hats, please do not make me."

[Hero_of_Light]

1 minute ago, biostem said:

Can we please stop it with these strawmen and/or false dichotomies.  That isn't a real representation of any circumstance that we've been presented with...

I don't even know what those words mean man.  Itikar keeps saying that too

[Itikar]

Just now, HelBlaiz said:

"I am in full support of adding content locked rewards for people who wish to have them, so long as Costume Pieces (and Power Customization Options) remain freely accessible with no investment. I personally think permanent versions of the Costume Change Powers awarded during Trick or Treating would be an awesome reward that I do not mind being content locked, as I do not count them as Costume Pieces. Other content, such as temporary powers, badges, titles, and story arcs, would also make good unlockable content. I do not wish to run content to unlock hats, please do not make me."

Same stance as me.

[Hero_of_Light]

4 minutes ago, Itikar said:

I find the question a little too abstract to be really interesting.

 

But no, I have played plenty of games where you unlock costume parts via grind.

 

If I want that, and a whole new game that can be fun too, instead of just a costume, I can find it elsewhere already. If there are really modders who are so restrictive about distributing the content they have created, and it would not be the first time I hear about something like this, I would rather let them keep their content.

Figured that.  I would be happy with any new content. Would prefer if some was unlockable costumes, but I wouldn't say my way or no way.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Hero_of_Light

[MunkiLord]

Not including costume parts in such locked content is probably the best because that means they could make some of the tasks extremely difficult or a huge grind. If it's simply titles of a special color, I'm onboard if unlocking some of them is inaccessible to most because of the time, luck, or skill involved. 

[Razor Cure]

6 hours ago, Itikar said:

There are already contacts whose story arcs can be played only after obtaining certain badges, sometimes even badges that require quite a bit of work. These are particularly common on redside, Viridian is a good example of this, so perhaps they could be extended to blueside too. There are already accolades that unlock special powers, and there are story arcs and missions that also give you interesting and often very useful temporary powers. Finally all the incarnate content unlocks only at level 50, and there is a lot to be explored and gained in that too.

Just to add my 2 cents..I totally feel like STF and Epic pools for blueside should also have an 'unlock' to get them. I know that would annoy a lot of people, but in a similar manner to the OP, I always felt like I earned the patron pools (that and the arcs all have some pretty amazing missions) and the RSF. I mean..WHY should Recluse give you this super task, unless he has seen you doing all that stuff first (that is, the patron arc).

The patron poools are hardly 'better' than the epics..but those come for no work at all.

Likewise, I also enjoyed getting to 25, and being able to earn an AUra. I mean..its cool we can get them at 0..but maybe if the creation auras were more limited and basic, and the aura missions unlocked some extra cool ones (or at least a badge?).

[Lines]

This thread has given me more pause than any other whether to stay on HC or switch over to rebirth or thunderspy. Not for any particular poster or discussion, but just the reality that the HC trend isn’t really sustaining my interest.

 

Which is a bit sad, but folks are right that a separate server is better for someone like me.

[Hero_of_Light]

Okay.... maybe I can go about it this way. 

 

What is the sword excalibur? 

Why is it special? 

 

Edited November 1, 2019 by Hero_of_Light

[Rigged]

Isn't this exactly what badges are for? They exist to give you a challenge and goal set by someone else. And you get a title to go with it, plus most of the badges actually have a unique graphic, unlike many games' achievements. You get a reward and a way to brag that does not affect either cosmetics or power, which is how this should work.

 

What you want to do is to create content that is exclusive, and to that I say no.

 

What else do you want to put behind this wall? Costumes? I would disagree right away, because that is not a good incentive. People who make costumes for their characters don't want to have to jump through hoops at 50 to finally look the part they were supposed to at lvl1. And for someone who cannot use that costume part as a concept the challenge gets no meaning - why get a costume part that woul do break your concept? This is not World of Warcraft, guys. Your costume is not supposed to be for bragging.

 

Powers? Again I would disagree. That is entirely what the incarnate system is for. I would happily endorse a continuation if the incarnate system, especially with new itrials, and the accompanying metaplot, but that looks like a lot of work.

 

Archetypes and powersets? Also no. Do not make me play another archetype I do not want to play just so I can play the archetype that I actually want to other play. Freeing VEATs and Kheldians was one of the best things ever.

[Hero_of_Light]

4 minutes ago, Rigged said:

Isn't this exactly what badges are for? They exist to give you a challenge and goal set by someone else. And you get a title to go with it, plus most of the badges actually have a unique graphic, unlike many games' achievements. You get a reward and a way to brag that does not affect either cosmetics or power, which is how this should work.

 

What you want to do is to create content that is exclusive, and to that I say no.

 

What else do you want to put behind this wall? Costumes? I would disagree right away, because that is not a good incentive. People who make costumes for their characters don't want to have to jump through hoops at 50 to finally look the part they were supposed to at lvl1. And for someone who cannot use that costume part as a concept the challenge gets no meaning - why get a costume part that woul do break your concept? This is not World of Warcraft, guys. Your costume is not supposed to be for bragging.

 

Powers? Again I would disagree. That is entirely what the incarnate system is for. I would happily endorse a continuation if the incarnate system, especially with new itrials, and the accompanying metaplot, but that looks like a lot of work.

 

Archetypes and powersets? Also no. Do not make me play another archetype I do not want to play just so I can play the archetype that I actually want to other play. Freeing VEATs and Kheldians was one of the best things ever.

So if someone wanted to make a lord recluse sucessor with peices of his armor,  they should be able to do that from the start and not have to overthrow lord recluse and strip his armor from him?

Edited November 1, 2019 by Hero_of_Light

[Rigged]

3 minutes ago, Hero_of_Light said:

So if someone wanted to make a lord recluse sucessor with peices of his armor,  they should be able to do that from the start and not have to overthrow lord recluse and strip his armor from him?

They should have to overthrow Lord Recluse to say they overthrew Lord Recluse.

 

But I should not have to overthrow Lord Recluse to dress up like him.

 

You are mixing two completely different things. I should be able to dress like the President of the United States without actually having to defeat the President of the United States.

 

Once you beat Lord Recluse, you can then SAY your outfit was torn from his lifeless corpse even if it is visually identical to the outfit you were wearing fifteen minutes before.

 

More specifically, if I want that nice furry coat thing I should go to Amazon.com and not look to killing dictators.

[Razor Cure]

10 minutes ago, Rigged said:

What else do you want to put behind this wall? Costumes?

Was it so bad having to earn things like capes, aura and other stuff? Like getting high enough to fight/help Vanguard, before actually getting to use some of their bits?

 

8 minutes ago, Hero_of_Light said:

why get a costume part that woul do break your concept?

Well..you wouldn't, right. But doesn't the reverse apply? Why can you get a costume part that adds something special to your concept (like vanguard armour) without having to DO anything? If the concept is so important to the character, wouldn't that unlocking be a clear progression of said character?

 

10 minutes ago, Hero_of_Light said:

Your costume is not supposed to be for bragging.

Costume Contests say Hi.

[Hero_of_Light]

1 minute ago, Rigged said:

They should have to overthrow Lord Recluse to say they overthrew Lord Recluse.

 

But I should not have to overthrow Lord Recluse to dress up like him.

 

You are mixing two completely different things. I should be able to dress like the President of the United States without actually having to defeat the President of the United States.

 

Once you beat Lord Recluse, you can then SAY your outfit was torn from his lifeless corpse even if it is visually identical to the outfit you were wearing fifteen minutes before.

 

More specifically, if I want that nice furry coat thing I should go to Amazon.com and not look to killing dictators.

So then his armor has no special significance.

[Rigged]

Just now, Hero_of_Light said:

So then his armor has no special significance.

Yes! I am glad you understand.

[Hero_of_Light]

2 minutes ago, Razor Cure said:

Was it so bad having to earn things like capes, aura and other stuff? Like getting high enough to fight/help Vanguard, before actually getting to use some of their bits?

 

Well..you wouldn't, right. But doesn't the reverse apply? Why can you get a costume part that adds something special to your concept (like vanguard armour) without having to DO anything? If the concept is so important to the character, wouldn't that unlocking be a clear progression of said character?

 

Costume Contests say Hi.

I agree with all of that

[Hero_of_Light]

2 minutes ago, Rigged said:

Yes! I am glad you understand.

And that's where we disagree.  I enjoy it when some costumes had special significance and I want to see some costumes like that return.

[Rigged]

9 minutes ago, Razor Cure said:

Was it so bad having to earn things like capes, aura and other stuff? Like getting high enough to fight/help Vanguard, before actually getting to use some of their bits?

One of my characters uses the Vanguard face mask. She is not a member of Vanguard. She did not steal it off a Vanguard member. She just got some metal together and made a mask that looks a lot like the vanguard one.

 

On Live, I did the grind for that mask. I did not care either way. I understood that NCsoft needed me to spend time grinding for it since it made them money.

 

But I never did that grind again. Not because I was boycotting it or anything, but because I didn't need the part.

 

Let people have their costumes.

9 minutes ago, Razor Cure said:

Costume Contests say Hi.

Why should someone win a costume contest just because he grinded more than a newbie? This is in fact a great argument not to have a wall for costume parts, because costume contests are about creativity, and having access to the same pool of parts is exactly what a contest should entail.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Rigged

[MunkiLord]

3 minutes ago, Rigged said:

One of my characters uses the Vanguard face mask. She is not a member of Vanguard. She did not steal it off a Vanguard member. She just got some metal together and made a mask that looks a lot like the he vanguard one.

 

On Live, I did the grind for that mask. I did not care either way. I understood that NCsoft needed me to spend time grinding for it since it made them money.

 

But I never did that grind again. Not because I was boycotting it or anything, but because I didn't need the part.

 

Let people have their costumes.

Why should someone win a costume contest just because he grinded lore than a newbie? This is in fact a great argument not to have a wall for costume parts, because costume contests are about creativity, and having access to the same pool of parts is exactly what a contest should entail.

Costumes contests have always been and always will be about impressing the judges, that's it. Creativity will play a huge factor for most judges, I don't disagree. But the contests themselves are not and never have been about creativity, they are about the opinions of the judges. 

[Razor Cure]

2 minutes ago, Rigged said:

Why should someone win a costume contest just because he grinded more than a newbie? This is in fact a great argument not to have a wall for costume parts, because costume contests are about creativity, and having access to the same pool of parts is exactly what a contest should entail.

Did I say they won BECAUSE they earned bits? I am merely saying that costumes are totally a bragging thing, and something to feel proud of. Even if the lvl 50 who 'earned' a few costume parts didn't win, that does not take away the sense of accomplishment for doing that.

 

5 minutes ago, Rigged said:

I understood that NCsoft needed me to spend time grinding for it since it made them money.

Let's go to the next step. We aren't paying for HC. They dont need to give us a grind to keep us here. So lets go ahead and auto level everyone to 50, and give us whatever IOs we want, because..no one needs to grind for anything, ever.

[Razor Cure]

10 minutes ago, Rigged said:

But I never did that grind again. Not because I was boycotting it or anything, but because I didn't need the part.

Exactly. You did it ONCE. Once. So costume bits behind some kinda..effort..would not need to be done for every alt. I totally forget what was needed to actually unlock this, but even if the requirements were toned down a lot (say..to completing one of the RWZ story arcs), in order to make it much less of a grind, and something easily done on the journey to 50.

[Rigged]

1 minute ago, Razor Cure said:

Did I say they won BECAUSE they earned bits? I am merely saying that costumes are totally a bragging thing, and something to feel proud of. Even if the lvl 50 who 'earned' a few costume parts didn't win, that does not take away the sense of accomplishment for doing that.

You can get a sense if accomplishment without denying costume parts to people who didn't do your accomplishment. Also, you have a badge for that.

 

Tell you what, I would be okay with putting a challenge for a costume part if there was ALSO a button that granted the costume part without doing the challenge. Let people opt in.

 

 

[Hero_of_Light]

17 minutes ago, Razor Cure said:

Did I say they won BECAUSE they earned bits? I am merely saying that costumes are totally a bragging thing, and something to feel proud of. Even if the lvl 50 who 'earned' a few costume parts didn't win, that does not take away the sense of accomplishment for doing that.

 

Let's go to the next step. We aren't paying for HC. They dont need to give us a grind to keep us here. So lets go ahead and auto level everyone to 50, and give us whatever IOs we want, because..no one needs to grind for anything, ever.

Right?! Lol

[Rigged]

22 minutes ago, Razor Cure said:

Let's go to the next step. We aren't paying for HC. They dont need to give us a grind to keep us here. So lets go ahead and auto level everyone to 50, and give us whatever IOs we want, because..no one needs to grind for anything, ever.

 

5 minutes ago, Hero_of_Light said:

Right?! Lol

 

I am completely in support of this.

[Omega-202]

13 minutes ago, Rigged said:

 

 

I am completely in support of this.

Me as well.

[Itikar]

Don't have any issue with that either.