pvp only accolades

[Dan Petro]

If it makes you feel any better Kelly Rocket, any time I post a PVP related change that affects PvE'ers in no way what so ever, I too suffer anxiety.

 

I have anxiety that a bunch of people who are very vocal that they never have and never will take part in any thing PvP related will try to shoot down what are effectively QoL changes for either entirely selfish reasons (waaaah Devs shouldn't spend time on PvP because less people PvP) or they like to ignore that PvP changes have been made to cater to the PvE experience  / crowd and are happy to reap those "easier" rewards, while shooting down making things in any way better/ easier for PvP'ers.   See also PvP IO's dropping from all content now and added to merit reward vendors.  

 

 

[Warlawk]

11 minutes ago, Dan Petro said:

If it makes you feel any better Kelly Rocket, any time I post a PVP related change that affects PvE'ers in no way what so ever, I too suffer anxiety.

 

I have anxiety that a bunch of people who are very vocal that they never have and never will take part in any thing PvP related will try to shoot down what are effectively QoL changes for either entirely selfish reasons (waaaah Devs shouldn't spend time on PvP because less people PvP) or they like to ignore that PvP changes have been made to cater to the PvE experience  / crowd and are happy to reap those "easier" rewards, while shooting down making things in any way better/ easier for PvP'ers.   See also PvP IO's dropping from all content now and added to merit reward vendors.  

 

 

This might be more meaningful if you addressed the content instead of attacking the people whose opinion you don't happen to agree with.

 

EDIT: For example, providing a reason for this change aside from "We don't want to invest the time to earn the rewards like everyone else does" would go a long ways towards some sort of meaningful discussion.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Warlawk

[Haijinx]

15 minutes ago, Dan Petro said:

If it makes you feel any better Kelly Rocket, any time I post a PVP related change that affects PvE'ers in no way what so ever, I too suffer anxiety.

 

I have anxiety that a bunch of people who are very vocal that they never have and never will take part in any thing PvP related will try to shoot down what are effectively QoL changes for either entirely selfish reasons (waaaah Devs shouldn't spend time on PvP because less people PvP) or they like to ignore that PvP changes have been made to cater to the PvE experience  / crowd and are happy to reap those "easier" rewards, while shooting down making things in any way better/ easier for PvP'ers.   See also PvP IO's dropping from all content now and added to merit reward vendors.  

 

 

Seems you enjoy Forums PVP also. 

 

Thus proving her point. 

 

 

[Haijinx]

2 hours ago, kelly Rocket said:

And I'll say it again: I don't "need" Shivans the same way they don't "need" the buffs from accolades!

 

IT'S STILL AN ADVANTAGE!

 

And the damn PvPers can have it when I CAN GET SHIVANS WITHOUT GOING TO BLOODY BAY AND NOT ONE SECOND BEFORE!

It seems like its possible to make benefits contingent on PVP.Since that is how the PVP IOs work. 

 

So they should be able to have PVP only advantages acquired doing PVP related things, without it affecting anyone else.    

 

For example - PVP Accolades that provide the same bonuses as PVE accolades that are easier to get that function in PVP zones. 

 

=========

Although realistically being able to get say "The Atlas Medallion" by doing PVP stuff that works all the time wouldn't actually break anything, since they wouldn't be getting any bonus you could not get doing PVE things. 

 

 

[macskull]

10 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

Seems you enjoy Forums PVP also. 

 

Thus proving her point. 

 

 

I don't think their point had anything to do with forum PvP.

[Haijinx]

1 minute ago, macskull said:

I don't think their point had anything to do with forum PvP.

Nope.  It had to do with getting ganked in PVP.

 

 

[macskull]

3 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

Nope.  It had to do with getting ganked in PVP.

 

 

...That's not happening in Bloody Bay, I can tell you that much. I've gotten Shivans and Warburg nukes dozens of times since the game came back, on the most populated server, and I think I've seen another player not on my team once.

Edited September 1, 2019 by macskull

[Zepp]

First off, if you refer to another post in another forum (OP), provide a link.

Second, as many others have said, this throws up red flags. There is a very short distance between allowing PvP alternatives and PvP content becoming required for high-end play. I've seen many MMOs produce special stuff for PvPers, which then leads to the top gear requiring PvP, which then leads to nobody being able to be a top PvEer without PvPing... That is not a path I can support.

[Dan Petro]

50 minutes ago, Warlawk said:

This might be more meaningful if you addressed the content instead of attacking the people whose opinion you don't happen to agree with.

 

EDIT: For example, providing a reason for this change aside from "We don't want to invest the time to earn the rewards like everyone else does" would go a long ways towards some sort of meaningful discussion.

Alright I'm going to pose an easy to understand scenario to you.

 

The Devs release a new amazing endgame content for PvE.  All the bells and whistles and everyone loves to run it.  However in order to participate, you need to earn 4 special tokens. You need to get shivans in bloody bay.  You need to launch a Nuke in warburg, you need to capture the zone in RV by getting pillboxes and defeating the AV's, and finally you need earn reputation for defeating 25 unique PC characters in any PVP zone.

 

A very Sad PvE'er comes to the forums with a suggestion "Would it be possible to remove the 25 unique PC defeats?  It seems a bit excessive to have 4 barriers of entry to this amazing piece of content I enjoy.  3 honestly is more than enough in my opinon"

 

A real asshole of a PvP'er who has never run this new amazing endgame content and never plans to, comes into the thread and says "Why should we make it easier for you?"

 

 If you are failing to get the parallel here : there are 4 PvE barriers every  PVP'er has to get through to essentially "compete"  or be relevant in PvP.  Level 1-50.  IO out a build.  Run accolades, and for a vast majority, incarnate out their character (as most PvP takes place in RV and Arena at level 50).  

 

If you can't understand that (for some who think PvE in this game is near brain dead easy and want to avoid it) removing 1 of 4 barriers of entry to just play the part of the game they like is a reasonable request, then you very likely have some issues that need working through.  

 

The difference between PvP and PVE is, you can jump into any PvE content on an SO'ed build with any randomly picked powers and at some level be relevant/helpful to your team / side / self etc.  In PvP that is not true and you are more likely to end up as a detriment if you are missing some or all of the listed requirements. 

 

Edited September 1, 2019 by Dan Petro

[macskull]

8 minutes ago, Zepp said:

First off, if you refer to another post in another forum (OP), provide a link.

Second, as many others have said, this throws up red flags. There is a very short distance between allowing PvP alternatives and PvP content becoming required for high-end play. I've seen many MMOs produce special stuff for PvPers, which then leads to the top gear requiring PvP, which then leads to nobody being able to be a top PvEer without PvPing... That is not a path I can support.

That isn't what's being asked for though. Did you read through the thread and see the posts where I clarified the OP's intention?

[Dan Petro]

15 minutes ago, Zepp said:

First off, if you refer to another post in another forum (OP), provide a link.

Second, as many others have said, this throws up red flags. There is a very short distance between allowing PvP alternatives and PvP content becoming required for high-end play. I've seen many MMOs produce special stuff for PvPers, which then leads to the top gear requiring PvP, which then leads to nobody being able to be a top PvEer without PvPing... That is not a path I can support.

Whoops, too late on that one.  PvP IO's used to only be dropped by defeating other players when the game was live.  However, it was later changed where you could buy them at merit vendors and then even later they were added to all PvE drop tables.  So we already have concrete evidence that the dev's are moving in the exact opposite direction that you are so worried about.  

 

Remember how every PvE'er who IO's a character wanted the 3% glad armor PvP IO's and they were selling for 4-5 billion influence on live? And you had to trade over double the influence cap to get one because it only dropped insanely rarely from killing other players, and there was a rep timer in play that would lock rewards if you killed the same target too fast (i.e farmed)? They cost maybe 10 mil now on the market right now.  

Edited September 1, 2019 by Dan Petro

[Warlawk]

22 minutes ago, Dan Petro said:

Alright I'm going to post an easy to understand scenario to you.

 

The Devs release a new amazing endgame content for PvE.  All the bells and whistles and everyone loves to run it.  However in order to participate, you need to earn 4 special tokens. You need to get shivans in bloody bay.  You need to launch a Nuke in warburg, you need to capture the zone in RV by getting pillboxes and defeating the AV's, and finally you need earn reputation for defeating 25 unique PC characters in any PVP zone.

 

A very Sad PvE'er comes to the forums with a suggestion "Would it be possible to remove the 25 unique PC defeats?  It seems a bit excessive to have 4 barriers of entry to this amazing piece of content I enjoy.  3 honestly is more than enough in my opinon"

 

A real asshole of a PvP'er who has never run this new amazing endgame content and never plans to, comes into the thread and says "Why should we make it easier for you?"

 

 If you are failing to get the parallel here : there are 4 PvE barriers every  PVP'er has to get through to essentially "compete"  or be relevant in PvP.  Level 1-50.  IO out a build.  Run accolades, and for a vast majority, incarnate out their character (as most PvP takes place in RV and Arena at level 50).  

 

If you can't understand that (for some who think PvE in this game is near brain dead easy and want to avoid it) removing 1 of 4 barriers of entry to just play the part of the game they like is a reasonable request, then you very likely have some issues that need working through.  

 

The difference between PvP and PVE is, you can jump into any PvE content on an SO'ed build with any randomly picked powers and at some level be relevant/helpful to your team / side / self etc.  In PvP that is not true and you are more likely to end up as a detriment if you are missing some or all of the listed requirements. 

 

Alright, I'll post an equally easy to understand scenario, and I won't even have to throw in personal attacks to get there.

 

A small number of PvP players come to a game that is heavily PvE focused, always has been and to all appearances always will be. This is embraced by the vast majority of the players of said game.

 

The small number of PvP players then choose to participate in a completely optional and voluntary activity called PvP.

 

To gain advantages in PvP, these players feel that they must have certain shiny bits which are only obtainable through PvE.

 

These players decide that even though this is a PvE focused game, which was known coming into this situation, they do not want to invest the time to obtain said PvE shiny bits and the coding of the game should be changed utilizing very limited development resources so that they don't have to invest the same amount of time everyone else does to get the same result.

 

Alternative solution to the OP. Disable all accolades in pvp. Even playing field, no investment of time needed.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Warlawk

[Kimuji]

20 hours ago, justicebeliever said:

Spot on!  Totally transparency, I have not ever, nor plan to ever engage in any pvp.  That said, we can't use a slippery slope argument against the pvp'ers.  It can't be no because “if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile”.  Because that's not how game development works...each change is evaluated on it's own merits.

 

+1 to the OP’s suggestion...

I'd say it's more about how much pressure the community can put on the devs. That's how it works sadly. Bandwagoning is a thing (might not be a word though lol). No, I don't trust the community to make sensible requests, or, to be a bit less pessimistic not using sensible requests made by others as a mean to push their own unreasonable demands. Just look at this section of the forum, it is the very definition of “if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile”.

And I still don't understand how pvp accolades will make pvp more attractive and more alive. Is there a single pvp player out there who left pvp because he couldn't get the accolades through pvp only? Is there a dormant pvp community that will rise and come to bolster the ranks of the current active pvp community if accolades are made available through pvp? I very doubt so.

Oh and last question, do you actually think that all pve players find the accolades acquisition process not tedious? Just like crafting your incarnate powers, your purple sets, your ATOs etc...

[kelly Rocket]

43 minutes ago, Dan Petro said:

Alright I'm going to pose an easy to understand scenario to you.

 

The Devs release a new amazing endgame content for PvE.  All the bells and whistles and everyone loves to run it.  However in order to participate, you need to earn 4 special tokens. You need to get shivans in bloody bay.  You need to launch a Nuke in warburg, you need to capture the zone in RV by getting pillboxes and defeating the AV's, and finally you need earn reputation for defeating 25 unique PC characters in any PVP zone.

 

A very Sad PvE'er comes to the forums with a suggestion "Would it be possible to remove the 25 unique PC defeats?  It seems a bit excessive to have 4 barriers of entry to this amazing piece of content I enjoy.  3 honestly is more than enough in my opinon"

 

A real asshole of a PvP'er who has never run this new amazing endgame content and never plans to, comes into the thread and says "Why should we make it easier for you?"

 

 If you are failing to get the parallel here : there are 4 PvE barriers every  PVP'er has to get through to essentially "compete"  or be relevant in PvP.  Level 1-50.  IO out a build.  Run accolades, and for a vast majority, incarnate out their character (as most PvP takes place in RV and Arena at level 50).  

 

If you can't understand that (for some who think PvE in this game is near brain dead easy and want to avoid it) removing 1 of 4 barriers of entry to just play the part of the game they like is a reasonable request, then you very likely have some issues that need working through.  

 

The difference between PvP and PVE is, you can jump into any PvE content on an SO'ed build with any randomly picked powers and at some level be relevant/helpful to your team / side / self etc.  In PvP that is not true and you are more likely to end up as a detriment if you are missing some or all of the listed requirements. 

 

The problem with your analogy is that I'm perfectly happy to let PvPers have this... If they also take all the things that I'd have to go into PvP zones to get which can be used in PvE, and make it so I don't have to go into those zones to get them anymore.

 

But any time I make that quite reasonable suggestion, I'm instantly attacked by all the PvP players for my selfish desire to have these "non-required" things in PvE. So, if that's their attitude then mine is I don't think these accolades are required for them either.

 

I'd be happy to let PvPers level from 1-50 without ever playing PvE. I'd be happy to let them get all their IOs through PvP. I'd be happy to let them never ever have to set foot in the PvE zones at all. As long as there's nothing in the PvP zones which is useful in PvE and can't be obtained through PvE.

Edited September 1, 2019 by kelly Rocket

[macskull]

12 minutes ago, Kimuji said:

I'd say it's more about how much pressure the community can put on the devs. That's how it works sadly. Bandwagoning is a thing (might not be a word though lol). No, I don't trust the community to make sensible requests, or, to be a bit less pessimistic not using sensible requests made by others as a mean to push their own unreasonable demands. Just look at this section of the forum, it is the very definition of “if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile”.

And I still don't understand how pvp accolades will make pvp more attractive and more alive. Is there a single pvp player out there who left pvp because he couldn't get the accolades through pvp only? Is there a dormant pvp community that will rise and come to bolster the ranks of the current active pvp community if accolades are made available through pvp? I very doubt so.

Oh and last question, do you actually think that all pve players find the accolades acquisition process not tedious? Just like crafting your incarnate powers, your purple sets, your ATOs etc...

I seriously doubt there are any PvPers who would leave because they have to accolade their characters. The point was made that it's lowering the barrier to entry, which is a good thing, but that's more a positive side effect than the main purpose of the request. Honestly, if we had the ability to get insta-50 and IO'd and accoladed but could only use those characters in a PvP environment, I'd be completely okay with that - but that's not going to happen. The OP's request is a far more reasonable one

 

You don't have to accolade, get incarnates, get purples, get ATOs, any of that other stuff to PvE. You can do just fine on an un-accoladed and SO'd build because this game really is that easy. That's not the case in PvP.

[Haijinx]

4 minutes ago, macskull said:

I seriously doubt there are any PvPers who would leave because they have to accolade their characters. The point was made that it's lowering the barrier to entry, which is a good thing, but that's more a positive side effect than the main purpose of the request. Honestly, if we had the ability to get insta-50 and IO'd and accoladed but could only use those characters in a PvP environment, I'd be completely okay with that - but that's not going to happen. The OP's request is a far more reasonable one

 

You don't have to accolade, get incarnates, get purples, get ATOs, any of that other stuff to PvE. You can do just fine on an un-accoladed and SO'd build because this game really is that easy. That's not the case in PvP.

if getting incarnates is a requirement, then I'm not sure why this thread exists.  That takes 25x as long as the accolades. 

[Warlawk]

12 minutes ago, macskull said:

Honestly, if we had the ability to get insta-50 and IO'd and accoladed but could only use those characters in a PvP environment, I'd be completely okay with that - but that's not going to happen. The OP's request is a far more reasonable one

If only there was a server where you could get all of that.

 

Justin exists and serves to remove ALL barriers to entry into pvp. This would also consolidate all of the pvp population onto a single server for better community population.

 

Yet, you don't seem to want to even acknowledge that this exists.

 

EDIT: So no one advocating pvp even wants to acknowledge the suggested solution of removing accolades from pvp entirely.

They do not want to invest the time to earn the rewards the same way everyone else does.

They do not want to play on the available server that removes all barriers to entry.

They do not want to be told that they are acting entitled.

 

That's an... interesting stance.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Warlawk

[Kimuji]

I get that accolades make a bigger difference in pvp, but aren't all pvp players already required to go through the same process to get them? The pvp players who take the time to do the content required for the accolades get an advantage over those who don't, it doesn't seem unfair to me.

Warlawk's idea might be something worth digging though. Why not disabling accolades in the arena where the duels or team duels are supposed to be fair? I don't really see why accolades should be disabled or given for free in open pvp zones though.

[macskull]

17 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

if getting incarnates is a requirement, then I'm not sure why this thread exists.  That takes 25x as long as the accolades. 

I should have been more specific - I was referring specifically to IOs and accolades in this case. Most PvP builds will do just fine with only the alpha slot and that's about 10 minutes of work.

17 minutes ago, Warlawk said:

If only there was a server where you could get all of that.

 

Justin exists and serves to remove ALL barriers to entry into pvp. This would also consolidate all of the pvp population onto a single server for better community population.

 

Yet, you don't seem to want to even acknowledge that this exists.

I think that was brought up earlier in this thread. On live, a lot of the high-end competitive PvP took place on the test server because you could easily copy characters over and build however you wanted. However, the test server was unreliable at times (it was taken down for updates or maintenance during matches with no heads-up) and there were oftentimes new and interesting bugs because the test server was exactly that - a test server. Justin has the same issues. At some point we may decide to do things on Justin especially because the "free everything" that's there is quite appealing from a PvP perspective (I already make extensive use of it to test things) but it isn't reliable. Besides, not all PvP takes place in the arena, and if everyone who is PvPing is on the test server they're not able to monitor global channels and friends on the regular servers. There are plenty of times where I'm killing time in a PvP zone and see my friends are forming up a TF or something, so I switch and hop on that. Am I supposed to be running two separate instances of the game whenever I want to PvP?

 

EDIT: In response to the edit about "no one wants to acknowledge removing accolades" - I'm acknowledging it, and I'm going to refer to you my next post for that. It's a non-starter.

Edited September 1, 2019 by macskull

[macskull]

8 minutes ago, Kimuji said:

I get that accolades make a bigger difference in pvp, but aren't all pvp players already required to go through the same process to get them? The pvp players who take the time to do the content required for the accolades get an advantage over those who don't, it doesn't seem unfair to me.

Warlawk's idea might be something worth digging though. Why not disabling accolades in the arena where the duels or team duels are supposed to be fair? I don't really see why accolades should be disabled or given for free in open pvp zones though.

I think you're underestimating exactly how much difference the extra 20% HP makes. I understand that you likely don't PvP so it makes it difficult to explain, but believe me when I say that disabling accolades for everyone isn't a solution anyone would be happy with.

[Zepp]

1 hour ago, Dan Petro said:

Whoops, too late on that one.  PvP IO's used to only be dropped by defeating other players when the game was live.  However, it was later changed where you could buy them at merit vendors and then even later they were added to all PvE drop tables.  So we already have concrete evidence that the dev's are moving in the exact opposite direction that you are so worried about.  

 

Remember how every PvE'er who IO's a character wanted the 3% glad armor PvP IO's and they were selling for 4-5 billion influence on live? And you had to trade over double the influence cap to get one because it only dropped insanely rarely from killing other players, and there was a rep timer in play that would lock rewards if you killed the same target too fast (i.e farmed)? They cost maybe 10 mil now on the market right now.  

I love how you use an example that proves my argument for approaching PvP-specific aspects of the game with a great deal of skepticism and caution to retort my post... It is quite common for MMOs to head down that path. This game did this in the past with Gladiator's, as you pointed out.

Am I glad that the game was fixed so that PvEers could play at an equal level to PvPers? Yes.
Do I think we should head down on the same path that led to the problem you described in your post once again? No (but if we do, with great caution and skepticism).

[Warlawk]

8 minutes ago, macskull said:

I should have been more specific - I was referring specifically to IOs and accolades in this case. Most PvP builds will do just fine with only the alpha slot and that's about 10 minutes of work.

I think that was brought up earlier in this thread. On live, a lot of the high-end competitive PvP took place on the test server because you could easily copy characters over and build however you wanted. However, the test server was unreliable at times (it was taken down for updates or maintenance during matches with no heads-up) and there were oftentimes new and interesting bugs because the test server was exactly that - a test server. Justin has the same issues. At some point we may decide to do things on Justin especially because the "free everything" that's there is quite appealing from a PvP perspective (I already make extensive use of it to test things) but it isn't reliable. Besides, not all PvP takes place in the arena, and if everyone who is PvPing is on the test server they're not able to monitor global channels and friends on the regular servers. There are plenty of times where I'm killing time in a PvP zone and see my friends are forming up a TF or something, so I switch and hop on that. Am I supposed to be running two separate instances of the game whenever I want to PvP?

It's not a perfect solution, but it is a solution that solves every barrier to entry of play for pvp and it is not being utilized in any meaningful way. Running a second instance to serve as a chat server is not likely to tax the computer of anyone these days and offers a solution that requires zero changes to code or use of resources.

 

It really seems this amounts to:
I don't want to put in time to earn my rewards!

Ok, here's a way to get all that for free!

No, I don't wanna do that either, change the game for me!

 

Justin is not a perfect solution, but the people advocating PvP in this thread have shown zero willingness to even try it. There's an available solution right now, even if less than perfect, but it isn't giving you exactly what you want, so is completely disregarded without even attempting to utilize it.

[macskull]

1 minute ago, Zepp said:

I love how you use an example that proves my argument for approaching PvP-specific aspects of the game with a great deal of skepticism and caution to retort my post... It is quite common for MMOs to head down that path. This game did this in the past with Gladiator's, as you pointed out.

Am I glad that the game was fixed so that PvEers could play at an equal level to PvPers? Yes.
Do I think we should head down on the same path that led to the problem you described in your post once again? No (but if we do, with great caution and skepticism).

The counter to that is simple - people that didn't want to PvP to get the PvP IOs didn't have to. They could buy them on the auction house. Hell, that's how most PvPers got theirs too (using inf that they got from PvE'ing or playing the market, not from PvP). Most of the supply came from people AFK farming them because the drop rates were so abysmally low. What @Dan Petrois trying to say (I think) is that there is nothing in this game that provides you PvE benefit that requires you to engage in PvP to obtain, but almost everything that you need to engage in PvP requires you to PvE.

[Haijinx]

1 minute ago, Zepp said:

I love how you use an example that proves my argument for approaching PvP-specific aspects of the game with a great deal of skepticism and caution to retort my post... It is quite common for MMOs to head down that path. This game did this in the past with Gladiator's, as you pointed out.

Am I glad that the game was fixed so that PvEers could play at an equal level to PvPers? Yes.
Do I think we should head down on the same path that led to the problem you described in your post once again? No (but if we do, with great caution and skepticism).

It is almost universal that this happens.  

 

Then they dumb down PVE thinking that will keep the non pvprs happy without the pvp shinies.  

[macskull]

13 minutes ago, Warlawk said:

It's not a perfect solution, but it is a solution that solves every barrier to entry of play for pvp and it is not being utilized in any meaningful way. Running a second instance to serve as a chat server is not likely to tax the computer of anyone these days and offers a solution that requires zero changes to code or use of resources.

 

It really seems this amounts to:
I don't want to put in time to earn my rewards!

Ok, here's a way to get all that for free!

No, I don't wanna do that either, change the game for me!

 

Justin is not a perfect solution, but the people advocating PvP in this thread have shown zero willingness to even try it. There's an available solution right now, even if less than perfect, but it isn't giving you exactly what you want, so is completely disregarded without even attempting to utilize it.

Remind me again which server was designated by the Homecoming team as the PvP server? Last I checked, it wasn't Justin.

 

EDIT, because reasons: It's not a perfect solution. It's a workable one sometimes. Here is a scenario: I have a match scheduled for a certain time. All players involved have cleared their schedules for a few hours for that time. That same day Justin goes down for an update. This update introduces a bug which breaks quite a bit of stuff, but which would have been caught before it went to a live server. Now everyone who blocked their time off has to figure out a different time, but no one knows when that'll be because there's no ETA on a patch to fix the bug. Or a real-life example - when Homecoming moved their servers to OVH Justin was down for an extended period of time. You're saying no one should be PvPing during that time? What about the times when there are "release candidate" patches on Justin, and all the extra freebies are disabled? Am I screwed if my team needs me on X character but I don't have that one?

 

Justin as a solution isn't being disregarded. It's been discussed in the PvP Discord before, at least for hosting tournaments and events, but ultimately the issues are the ones I described and that's why it's not a good solution. By the way, the idea that you'd be okay with keeping a second instance of the game running as a chat client is completely absurd (plus I'm not going to be tabbing back and forth between instances to check chat channels while I'm PvPing because that's how I get killed).

 

I think it was Issue 16 that significantly revised most of the accolade powers and removed almost all the PvP requirements from them because people didn't want to PvP in order to get PvE bonuses. There's precedent there. I understand that some people would rather not engage in PvP to get PvE stuff, and that's fine, but why is it so wrong to want to remove at least some of the PvE you have to engage in for PvP?

Edited September 1, 2019 by macskull