Wishful Thinking: Nerf AND Buff Kinetics.

[Leogunner]

1 hour ago, Razor Cure said:

Curious Leo. Are you saying that Kin +IOs is the equal of 'super' sonic res (like sonic if it performed like in your above example). If that is the case..it should be pretty clear that Kinetics is overpowered?

Change that..FS is OP.

Way back on Live, I did a rough (very rough) comparison of the T9 powers in support sets. Basically no set came close to the equivalent of FS to fully cap an entire teams damage, every mob, all the time. Granted, this way before sets like Time and Nature, but i do find it interesting that both time and nature have totally awesome T9s (huge +damn, rech, to hit, heal, etc..all great effects with big values)...which cannot be perma without a huge investment of IOs. There is only a few of the older sets that have T9s that can come close. COld dom and Heat Loss (also needs a lot to get perma, Pain, which is 'only' a single target buff, therm which also needs a lot to get Perma. Maybe a few of the others. But the point is, no t9 comes close to the power of FS.

Melee T9s are mostly useless, but at least they FEEL godly. Same as most t9 attacks.

I'd prefer some adjustment of the T9s in other sets, but I can still admit FS is too good.

It's not so much that it's overpowered and moreso that it has all the essentials of a specific kit all rolled into one set and in not-so-small amounts.  That specific kit being offense.

 

The outlined Sonic Resonance kit would just be the opposite but with defensive support.  The main different between them though is, very few people care about overwhelming defense if its at the cost of offense.

 

Again, I'm not saying it's OP per say, just VEEEERY convenient when you're mostly only caring about offense.

 

Like, if kinetics had fulcrum shift buffed even more (more damage?) it wouldn't really be that breaking if the set completely lacked any +rech buffs.  Or if the damage buffs came at the cost of +Endurance Costs so you NEEDED that extra recovery just to break even...But no.  Kinetics is pretty much your 1 stop shop if you want to overcharge your team's offense.

 

But I tend to look at Empathy as a set that is properly proportioned.  Strong buffs are not group wide and upkeep is likely why so many play the set (people that like to support like using their support powers, i.e. upkeep, and for those powers to make a nominal difference to the recipient).  

[nzer]

12 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

For whatever reason, it's not letting me slot with more than one. How were you able to get more than one slotted?

I don't think they mean more than one copy of the proc, just other knockback enhancements.

 

20 minutes ago, Infinitum said:

Nah.

Then this conversation is a non-starter.

[Solarverse]

2 minutes ago, nzer said:

I don't think they mean more than one copy of the proc, just other knockback enhancements.

 

Yeah, I just slotted it with one Sudden Acceleration (which I already had there)and added two Knock Back Enhancements...it's a no go for me. Still only randomly knocks them down, majority of the hits are ineffective. Trying to figure out how @Infinitum is getting better results than I am, there's got to be some other trick to it. Do they have to be other Sudden Acceleration enhancements within the set to work, or can they be any KB enhancement?

[Leogunner]

FYI, I'm actually surprised a "nerf" thread hasn't erupted into angry personal attacks and accusations.

 

Very different.  I don't like it. 🤔

[Troo]

2 hours ago, Wavicle said:

just to be clear, I'm not saying it isn't functioning as intended.

I'm saying the intention wasn't that well thought out.

Translation that I read: 'While it is working as intended, it was done wrong'

 

um, good luck with that.

[Leogunner]

3 minutes ago, Troo said:

Translation that I read: 'While it is working as intended, it was done wrong'

 

um, good luck with that.

I mean, apparently Stalkers were "done wrong" and initial Domination was "done wrong" and Katana animations were "done wrong", and no enhancement diminishing returns was "done wrong".

 

Just saying, they might have had certain intentions and then meta-gamers flipped them the bird and broke the game like the devs would never imagine.  It happens.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Leogunner

[Solarverse]

11 minutes ago, Leogunner said:

I mean, apparently Stalkers were "done wrong" and initial Domination was "done wrong" and Katana animations were "done wrong", and no enhancement diminishing returns was "done wrong".

 

Just saying, they might have had certain intentions and then meta-gamers flipped them the bird and broke the game like the devs would never imagine.  It happens.

We pulled off things the Devs never dreamed were possible. I'm sure the first time a Dev watched a Tank herd literally hundreds (plural) of NPCs and burn them all in a matter of less than a single minute, the Devs probably had an "OH SHIT!" face with their jaws on the floor.

 

[Infinitum]

2 hours ago, Solarverse said:

For whatever reason, it's not letting me slot with more than one. How were you able to get more than one slotted?

I mean with the whole sudden accel set

[Solarverse]

35 minutes ago, Infinitum said:

I mean with the whole sudden accel set

Okay, that makes sense then. Thanks.

[Infinitum]

2 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

Okay, that makes sense then. Thanks.

yeah basically it increases magnitude of the KD  ive always been able to control a group with around 3 or 4 slotted, in my corruptors case i have all 6 slotted cause i had room.

[Solarverse]

39 minutes ago, Infinitum said:

yeah basically it increases magnitude of the KD  ive always been able to control a group with around 3 or 4 slotted, in my corruptors case i have all 6 slotted cause i had room.

Fore sure going to give that a try, appreciate the help. Learn something new every day.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Solarverse

[SwitchFade]

6 hours ago, Wavicle said:

Again, part of the goal is explicitly to justify nerfing FS.

But like I said, I don't expect this to happen. More like a suggestion of what SHOULD have been done from the start.

Absolutely not. Kin is exactly right. Calling for a nerf to it is not what "should" happen. Moreover, the rest of the set is solid as well.

 

/Jranger

[WindDemon21]

5 hours ago, Infinitum said:

yeah basically it increases magnitude of the KD  ive always been able to control a group with around 3 or 4 slotted, in my corruptors case i have all 6 slotted cause i had room.

Except the mag has zero bearing on whether they get knocked down or not,  just whether they are knocked down or knocked back.

 

What might be happening, as which I shouldn't see but do on my sonic repulsion, are a bunch of misses happening as if the power is requiring a to hit check even though it's auto and you can't slot for it.

 

With this showing what's likely happening is that inadvertently your slotting of the sudden acceleration set has an accuracy stat and is boosting it that way.

 

If it's anything like my sonic repulsion, I can tell it's clearly bugged for how little it actually knocks down, and I think these misses are the reason. It should be knocking enemies down far more often, and if those misses I'm seeing were knockdowns, that would make more sense to where it should be.

 

I think when they did the homecoming patch for this to lower the kd chance when the kb-kd proc was updated, that they messed up the code for this. Especially for how ridiculous the end cost is on these toggles (there REALLY should not be an extra end cost per target hit) the knockdown should be MUCH more consistent.

[AerialAssault]

This is the least fun suggestion I have ever witnessed

[Night]

No nerfs, no

[Ruin Mage]

these threads are the reason why i desire the heat death of the universe.