X-Men, are they still heroes?

[Player2]

If anyone has been reading the House of X aftermath of the X-Men, there's been some changes to the status quo.

 

• Without getting into details, death is no longer a thing.
• Mutants have set up their own nation on Krakoa and bribed and/or extorted diplomatic immunity in a hundred countries.
• And they seem content to exploit that diplomatic immunity to do whatever they want, including the exclusion of mutants from being judged by human laws, even when the mutant in question was a criminal before the immunity was granted and commits capital offenses after the fact. (Sabretooth)
• Apocalypse and other villainous mutants brought into the ruling council of the mutant nation.  All past sins and rivalries forgiven.
• They are bringing back dead mutants all the time, and this allows any that previously lost their powers thanks to the Scarlet Witch's "No more mutants" edict to regain their powers.  However, those that remained alive without their powers have to face a brutal death in combat with Apocalypse before being granted this benefit.
• They are rescuing mutants worldwide from situations where they are oppressed, but they also insist on taking mutants from non-oppressed scenarios.  X-Men vs Fantastic Four has Xavier, Magneto, and other X-Men showing up at the FF's home and insisting that they be allowed to take Franklin Richards with them because he belongs with his people, even though there has NEVER been any evidence that Franklin has suffered any of the stereotypical mutant oppression.
  • In fact, the only mutants who really seem to suffer that oppression are the ones who are criminals or join the X-Men or are side characters to be rescued by the X-Men in their book.  Beast never seemed to suffer this when he was an active member of the Avengers back in the old days.  Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver (when they were still considered mutants) only ever seemed to have to deal with that when there was a mutant-related plot to push.
  • The X-Men representatives suggested that the FF are making Franklin a target by keeping him with his family, but people have been killed for being associated with the X-Men, even after losing their powers... so let's put him on an island filled with almost all the mutants in the world where any anti-mutant angst would be directed.

 

I'm sure there's other stuff, as well, but I lost interest in the direction the mutant titles have been going and now am only hearing about incidents second hand.

 

They don't seem like heroes anymore, and Magneto's statements about being above humans (and even other superhumans like the Fantastic Four), as well as outright stating that mutants are the new gods of the world combined with Xavier's own change in outlook to embrace being "better" than humanity just makes these comics and the former heroes seem less heroic.  They're more like a political statement, and not a good one.

 

[Haijinx]

Sounds kinda dumb tbh. 

[Purrfekshawn]

Some of them are heroes, some of them are villains, some of them prefer not to do aything heroic or villainous.

[FireBrandi]

I don't care for the current direction either.  The whole 'yea we are superior to you, we got our own country now that lets us enter pretty much any other country without permission, so fuck off' isn't very heroic.  The cult like atmosphere, especially about the cloned people.  And that is what it is, they are not saved from death.  Those characters die, and they create a clone with memories of the original copied into it.   Hell, Sinister had been doing that for years with his Marauders, don't see what makes it different that Xavier is doing it.  

 

Also tired of the overdone alternative timeline plots.  Would love to see them get back to actually good stories that included downtime for the characters.

[Gobbledygook]

11 hours ago, FireBrandi said:

I don't care for the current direction either.  The whole 'yea we are superior to you, we got our own country now that lets us enter pretty much any other country without permission, so fuck off' isn't very heroic.  The cult like atmosphere, especially about the cloned people.  And that is what it is, they are not saved from death.  Those characters die, and they create a clone with memories of the original copied into it.   Hell, Sinister had been doing that for years with his Marauders, don't see what makes it different that Xavier is doing it.  

 

Also tired of the overdone alternative timeline plots.  Would love to see them get back to actually good stories that included downtime for the characters.

 

I haven't read any of it, but I do follow Newsarama and CBR, some of the articles has suggested that the cult like mentality is being questioned by some of the X-men. I don't remember particulars. It may be building to an internal conflict, I don't know.

The only thing I really read is Red Hood and the Outlaws TPBs. Fortunately the first volume of the new Young Justice is out, I just have to pick it up. Drake and Kon-El are my favorite characters, besides Wolvie, of course.

[Nafsmar]

Kinda happy I no longer collect comics. I quit 12 years ago when my daughter was born. I honestly never cared for the X-men favoring the Avengers and FF. Sounds like I am not missing anything.

[FireBrandi]

Oh, and I'm expecting the entire storyline to be retconed at some point.  The start of it was Moira is now revealed as a mutant, her power is when she dies she goes back to her infancy with all memories intact.  Destiny told her she could do it 10, maybe 11 times.   So I'm guessing they will have her killed and the entire timeline will reset without this Krakoa nonsence.

[Dreamboat]

I haven't kept up with current comics for a couple of years (seriously, it's an insanely expensive hobby) but I don't remember thinking much of 2010s X-Men outside of Gillen's run on Uncanny. Personally I've never been huge on them being a part of the larger Marvel world.

9 minutes ago, FireBrandi said:

Oh, and I'm expecting the entire storyline to be retconed at some point.  The start of it was Moira is now revealed as a mutant, her power is when she dies she goes back to her infancy with all memories intact.  Destiny told her she could do it 10, maybe 11 times.   So I'm guessing they will have her killed and the entire timeline will reset without this Krakoa nonsence.

Huh. Does her son Proteus figure in at all?

[FireBrandi]

1 hour ago, Dreamboat said:

I haven't kept up with current comics for a couple of years (seriously, it's an insanely expensive hobby) but I don't remember thinking much of 2010s X-Men outside of Gillen's run on Uncanny. Personally I've never been huge on them being a part of the larger Marvel world.

Huh. Does her son Proteus figure in at all?

Proteus is one of the five mutants needed for their cloning/reincarnation method.  Exactly how he is in control of himself, (and not dead n all) is a mystery to me.

 

I've never followed New Mutants, X-Factor, or some of the other solo/spin-off books, so there are plenty of "when did that happen?" plot developments for me.   The only one of the current books I'm kinda liking is Excalibur.  Betsy Braddoc is no longer an asian ninja, the ninja body she had been using for years is back to its original owner.  Betsy has become Captain Britain now as her brother is under Morgan Le Fay's control.

[Dreamboat]

59 minutes ago, FireBrandi said:

Exactly how he is in control of himself, (and not dead n all) is a mystery to me.

Yup. Yupyupyup.

59 minutes ago, FireBrandi said:

I've never followed New Mutants, X-Factor, or some of the other solo/spin-off books, so there are plenty of "when did that happen?" plot developments for me.   The only one of the current books I'm kinda liking is Excalibur.  Betsy Braddoc is no longer an asian ninja, the ninja body she had been using for years is back to its original owner.  Betsy has become Captain Britain now as her brother is under Morgan Le Fay's control.

I actually gave myself the mission a few years back of reading everything that came out of Claremont's time with the X-franchise (this is a terrible idea), so I've read a bunch of the New Mutants stuff and I really like them. I'm just a big fan of this new, young team being brought up whilst the original X-Men are off doing their own thing. It's a nice progression, and they've got those swish black and yellow matching outfits! Nice!
I never got around to any Excalibur, but it's been on the backlog for a long time. I have liked Captain Britain's solo stuff and the "Captain Britain and MI:13" team books and the very different world they inhabited with things like Avalon around. Will have to check out the latest run sometime.

Edited March 11, 2020 by Dreamboat

[Brutal Justice]

Didn’t the X-men slowly kill of almost all of their major villains a while back?  That was pretty much the beginning of the end.  Bringing them all back is a reboot for another generation.  

 

The 90s X-men will live on eternally.  I will deny reality and substitute my own.  

[Player2]

9 hours ago, FireBrandi said:

Oh, and I'm expecting the entire storyline to be retconed at some point.  The start of it was Moira is now revealed as a mutant, her power is when she dies she goes back to her infancy with all memories intact.  Destiny told her she could do it 10, maybe 11 times.   So I'm guessing they will have her killed and the entire timeline will reset without this Krakoa nonsence.

That's a given considering the retcon to Moira MacTaggert.  Reality goes awry, she gets killed and starts over with all of her memories from all of her previous lives.  Hopefully current events will get real dark and Moira will realize she's taken mutants down an unwinnable path, get herself killed, and then stop meddling in her next go around.

[Gobbledygook]

Captain Britain is my favorite Superman Pastiche/Flying Brick. I discovered him in the 90's run of Excalibur with Nightcrawler and Phoenix II. I thought he was cool, when I found out he was Psylockes brother, it made me more intrigued so I delved into his background more. 

I have also loved almost every costume he has had.

I actually have a character partially based on him. Kind of an amalgamation of Captain America and Captain Britain.

He was an Inv/Em tank, until he was neutered by Paragon.