Proc Info! What You Didn't Know About Beast Mastery! *EXTREME*

[Zeraphia]

So Beast Mastery on initial observation to me seemed... "meh," melee-oriented pets, lethal damage, etc. It seemed to be "weak" to me... I judged it fairly prematurely unfortunately and shelved any thought of a Beast Mastery MM I really had, which is a regrettable mistake. The phrase, "don't judge a book by its cover" applies heavily here. I scoured information online, tried to get info from sites that were taken down from the "wayback machine," all to no avail. There is such staggeringly few literature about this primary that it is concerning. I found almost none of the secondary effects of the attacks anywhere online, so I set this morning aside to test their proc ability... Oh dear lord, did I find some treasures!

 

The strength of this set lies in... The T1. Undoubtedly, the T1 pets are "proc monsters." There are two regular Howler wolves, and one Alpha wolf. The Howler wolves are the monsters, the Alpha wolf is still very good but not as delirious as the Howlers. The Howlers have 3 attacks, Vicious Bite, Maiming Bite and Feral Charge. The Alpha Wolf has Vicious Bite and Maiming Bite attacks. 

 

Howler Wolves

-Vicious Bite 

Achilles

-Maiming Bite (Train Beasts)

Achilles

Touch of the Lady Grey

Maiming Bite

-Feral Charge (Tame Beasts)

Achilles

Lady Grey

Shield Breaker

 

HOLY ****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MONSTERS!!!!!! To summarize: the T1 Howler wolves (there are 2 of them) AND Alpha wolf on EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEIR ATTACKS proc Achilles!!!!! Top that off, 2 out of 3 of the Howler's attacks REGULARLY proc BOTH Lady Grey AND Shield Breaker, the Alpha Wolf procs both on one out of its two attacks... This means you're going to see these procs SWARMING on enemies. The proc opportunity on these things is... ABSUUUUUUUUUUUUURD!!!!!!!

 

 

The Lionesses: I tested the Lionesses with the Stun procs and they're just unfortunately abysmal. I do not recommend slotting them with procs anyways, but this is a blessing in disguise as it leaves room to put in the +res and +def IO's all into these minions, they're also probably the best ones for the Soulbound Allegiance procs.

 

The Dire Wolf: minion is not as exciting as the T1's, but it does benefit from proc's. The minion has 4 attacks, Vicious Bite (works the same as the T1 Wolves' version), Chilling Howl, Maiming Bite (works the same as the T1 Wolves' version), and Freezing Roar.

-Freezing Roar (note, this is an AOE)

Impeded Swiftness

-Maiming Bite

Achilles

Lady Grey

Shield Breaker

-Vicious Bite

 

Additional Notes:

-Glimpse of the Abyss was also tested in the T3 and was found to not proc at all in testing, much have very low proc rate.

-Vicious Bite does trigger Achilles’ Heel but does not trigger Touch of the Lady Grey or Shield Breaker.

 

 

In closing, the T1's are monsters, the T2's are good for dumping +def and +res IO's, the T3 is "meh" with procs and is probably best given Impeded as it is an AoE and works in the ST attack chain 🙂

Edited March 14, 2020 by Zeraphia

[Maxzero]

 

Achilles Heel proc does not stack in any way. So multi proccing that does not help.

 

The -def procs are more interesting. Both Merc's and Thug Enforcers use them well too.

[Roderick]

2 minutes ago, Maxzero said:

Achilles Heel proc does not stack in any way. So multi proccing that does not help.

The effects don't stack, but as far as I know, it still does apply the new debuffs on top of the old ones. This means that, as the (relatively short duration) debuffs fall off, the other copies are still there, meaning that the target stays debuffed. Even if it doesn't allow multiple applications of the debuff to be applied, the rapid reapplication means that the debuff will have relatively low downtime.

 

So, maybe not quite as good as the OP may have thought, but still a useful effect.

[Zeraphia]

3 hours ago, Roderick said:

The effects don't stack, but as far as I know, it still does apply the new debuffs on top of the old ones. This means that, as the (relatively short duration) debuffs fall off, the other copies are still there, meaning that the target stays debuffed. Even if it doesn't allow multiple applications of the debuff to be applied, the rapid reapplication means that the debuff will have relatively low downtime.

 

So, maybe not quite as good as the OP may have thought, but still a useful effect.

I was aware that Achilles didn't stack, but it will reapply itself in a continuous loop, this makes it very worthwhile because there are 3 dogs that are continuously attacking giving near permanent -res, there's also a ton of proc options in the personal attacks from Beast Mastery to give legitimately permanent -20% res (Call Swarm and Call Ravens). The dogs will often attack enemies so quickly and maw at them, given there are 3 of them, that the Achilles proc may as well be an actual AoE. This may possibly be the most consistent set to keep the -res in the Achilles proc on enemies. For a lethal set, the -res is exceptionally handy given the enemies that resist it. Keep in mind, this started in my head as one of the "worst" mm sets, almost purely melee, lethal damage, and very little information online at my disposal to properly slot it. Honestly, when I started the testing for this I was saying in my head "I don't believe that there is anything to be truly gained from this, it seems like a very basic set," and then I actually tested them with as many procs as I could against the Rikti test dummy, and I was very very very wrong. 

Edited March 15, 2020 by Zeraphia

[BGSacho]

That's weird, does Vicious Bite have a -def effect? I don't see why it would slot the -def procs.

It's not just beasts that have a good T1, it's also Mercs, who have 3 -def attacks on the T1 soldiers and 3 -def attacks on the Spec Ops. -Def on pets is generally great for MM as it allows 3 useful procs(lady grey, shield breaker, achilles heel).


The only problem is that the OP sets are slightly ahead here still - enforcers have four -def attacks, two of which are AoE, and all are ranged. So yeah...

 

Interestingly, thanks to recent testing by another forum member, it seems that BM might ultimately do more damage than Ninjas, since Ninjas are really poor at utilizing their overloaded skill sets. Needs more testing, and I have been too lazy to get off my ass and do so 🙂

[Redlynne]

It's right about now that I'm starting to wonder what happens when combining Beast/Cold and adding Group Fly into the mix ...

[R3v0]

No update?

[Dakota Whitemane]

A while back someone asked in the MM channel of the HC discord if Thug's Enforcers where the only ones that could slot the Gaussian Chance for Build-Up proc. Did a little testing at the time on the test server with the fix for Gaussian at the time. Well the T1 wolves can also slot it, but can't do anything with it until the upgrade at 32, which gives them a 15sec AoE +hit+dmg Howl. It will proc nearly everytime on the t1 wolf that uses the howl. Confirmed it carried over to live with the patch on my 33 beast/kin, not done anymore testing other then that it procs with the howl given with the second upgrade. So I don't know how useful it is on the t1 wolves compared to the Enforcers.

[Redlynne]

The uptime of the Build Up on the Wolves would be only 5.25 seconds for that specific wolf, and given that their Howl has a 60s recharge (which can't be budged) that's a 8.75% uptime ... assuming they even bother to attack something after Howling (which won't always happen, so cut that uptime even more!).  You're FAR better off slotting a Soulbound Allegiance Build Up proc into Wolves than a Gaussian's ...

[R3v0]

Maybe im doing something wrong, but on test server, i've managed to do literally shit with tier 1 wolf ( 6 proc) and the kill was ridicolous high

[PhoenixV117]

Hmmm, what secondary would you reccomend for beast MM ? 

 

I was thinkifn about rolling EA but I have 0 experience with either, does anyone have a build for it ? (Inf is not a problem)

[Coyote]

Nature, Rad, Dark, and Time all work well. I think so would Pain Domination. The first four have toggle debuffs that can be used to group spawns, and the last one stacks -Resist with the solid resists of Beasts.

EA is an excellent set, but works best when the henchmen are all grouped together for the buffs and heals. However, Beasts run all over the place, even worse than Ninjas (Ninjas at least have an AoE Immob from the Oni, and some ranged attacks, so they'll at least slow down in chasing everyone). So they won't be in the Faraday Cage for protection, and they won't be in the area for the chaining powers, unless you corner-pull mobs with Provoke. It'll be playable because both are solid sets, but it will have positioning issues. One good thing is that the +Recharge from Energizing Circuit will make it easier to run perma-Fortify Pack if you wish to go for that kind of build.

[PhoenixV117]

29 minutes ago, Coyote said:

Nature, Rad, Dark, and Time all work well. I think so would Pain Domination. The first four have toggle debuffs that can be used to group spawns, and the last one stacks -Resist with the solid resists of Beasts.

EA is an excellent set, but works best when the henchmen are all grouped together for the buffs and heals. However, Beasts run all over the place, even worse than Ninjas (Ninjas at least have an AoE Immob from the Oni, and some ranged attacks, so they'll at least slow down in chasing everyone). So they won't be in the Faraday Cage for protection, and they won't be in the area for the chaining powers, unless you corner-pull mobs with Provoke. It'll be playable because both are solid sets, but it will have positioning issues. One good thing is that the +Recharge from Energizing Circuit will make it easier to run perma-Fortify Pack if you wish to go for that kind of build.

I wanted to run EA with Beast as I’ve never ran either, would it really not work to just manage your pets targets inside the cage 😕 disappointed 

[Redlynne]

37 minutes ago, PhoenixV117 said:

Hmmm, what secondary would you reccomend for beast MM ? 

 

I was thinkifn about rolling EA but I have 0 experience with either, does anyone have a build for it ? (Inf is not a problem)

Beast/Electric would be something of an odd duck in that the combination has what amounts to two modes of operation ... quick burst and sustained pressure.  The quick burst would be all the beasts dog(and cat)piling onto a single $Target together to rip them a new one, while the sustained pressure would be the sapping via endurance+recovery draining so as to make $Targets helpless to fight back against your Beasts.

29 minutes ago, Coyote said:

One good thing is that the +Recharge from Energizing Circuit will make it easier to run perma-Fortify Pack if you wish to go for that kind of build.

This was my thought as well, however you'd be able to do something a bit peculiar with Fortify Pack and Pack Mentality in that you want battles to start off with Fortify Pack so as to send your Beasts in Defense buffed at the start, rather than Tankerminding, so as to buy yourself enough time to lay down your sapping attacks which neutralize incoming attacks.  So the build would kind of yo-yo between Tankerminding while building up Pack Mentality and letting the Beasts grab all the aggro under Fortify Pack while your Electrical Affinity powers are sapping whatever your Beasts are mauling to death defeat.

 

 

 

And yes, I took a stab at seeing what such a build might look like ... although that was just a first draft which is not informed by actual gameplay experience with either powerset.

[Coyote]

3 hours ago, PhoenixV117 said:

I wanted to run EA with Beast as I’ve never ran either, would it really not work to just manage your pets targets inside the cage 😕 disappointed 

 

I wouldn't say that it wouldn't work. I mean, you'll lose some protection for the beasts as they run out of the cage (and more importantly, out of chain range for heals and absorption refreshes), but in many cases they'll chase down stragglers, at which point they're not in great danger. You may have to resummon a bit more than if you're using Cold or Thermal or some other set where the protection goes with the beasts, but it's not going to be such a major issue that it will break the character.

[StrikerFox]

With the recent chatter about Beast pets, I tried another pylon run. I'm still not seeing their potential. Kill time of 229 seconds for 295 dps. Included the log, maybe BGSacho can drop it into his parse calculator.

 

T4 Musculature Core, T4 Degenerative Radial, and T4 Assault Hybrid Radial (Untoggled). Personal MM attacks used to help build Pack Mentality. They were only slotted for acc, rech and end redux.

 

T1 pets: Achilles', Lady Grey, Shield Breaker procs

T2 pets: Soulbound Allegiance proc

T3 pet: Impeded Swiftness proc

 

chatlog 2020-04-13.txt

Edited April 14, 2020 by StrikerFox

[Redlynne]

2 hours ago, StrikerFox said:

T1 pets: Achilles', Lady Grey, Shield Breaker procs

T2 pets: Soulbound Allegiance proc

T3 pet: Impeded Swiftness proc

T1 Howler Wolf attack powers: Achilles' Heel (3.5 PPM), Shield Breaker (3.5 PPM), Touch of Lady Grey (3.5 PPM)

Vicious Bite: No procs apply

Maiming Bite: 3.5 * (6+2.47) / 60 = 49.41% chance for 3.5 PPM proc

Feral Charge: 3.5 * (8+1.4) / 60 = 54.83% chance for a 3.5 PPM proc

 

T1 Alpha Wolf attack powers: Achilles' Heel (3.5 PPM), Shield Breaker (3.5 PPM), Touch of Lady Grey (3.5 PPM)

Vicious Bite: No procs apply

Maiming Bite: 3.5 * (6+2.47) / 60 = 49.41% chance for 3.5 PPM proc

 

T2 Lioness attack powers: Soulbound Allegiance (3.0 PPM)

Claw Rake: 3.0 * (3+1.27) / 60 = 21.35% chance for a 3.0 PPM proc

Vicious Bite: 3.0 * (5+1.47) / 60 = 32.35% chance for a 3.0 PPM proc

Claw Swipe: 3.0 (8+2.13) / 60 = 50.65% chance for a 3.0 PPM proc

 

T3 Dire Wolf attack powers: Impeded Swiftness (3.5 PPM)

Vicious Bite: No procs apply

Chilling Howl: 3.5 * (14+1.87) / (60 * (0.25 + 0.75 * (1 + 80 * (11 * 20 + 540) / 30,000))) = 36.74% chance for 3.5 PPM proc

Maiming Bite: 3.5 * (6+2.47) / 60 = 49.41% chance for 3.5 PPM proc

Freezing Roar: 3.5 * (14+2.83) / (60 * (0.25 + 0.75 * (1 + 50 * (11 * 30 + 540) / 30,000))) = 47.03% chance for 3.5 PPM proc

Terrible Howl: 3.5 * (60+3.67) / (60 * (0.25 + 0.75 * (1 + 15 * (11 * 360 + 540) / 30,000))) = 90% (Pre-clamp: 138.20%) chance for 3.5 PPM proc

[Redlynne]

Something I want to draw @Zeraphia's attention back to this topic to see if there's any confirmation available for the notions.

1 hour ago, Redlynne said:

It occurs to me that no one has really tested what would happen if combining a Stealth proc IO in either Group Fly (Stealth effect only lasts while toggled on) or Team Teleport (Stealth effect lasts for 120s after teleporting) or even Inertial Reduction from Kinetics (Stealth effect lasts for 120s after use) and then combining THAT with Grant Invisibility to achieve "double stacked stealth" effects for yourself AND your pets.  The question is whether the Stealth proc effect gets shared out to everyone affected by the power(s) or if the Stealth proc effect only affects the caster.  Some research on this point may be required for an answer.

Now I've never seriously considered the possibility of double stacking Stealth for Pets (in addition to your own Mastermind) before the question got brought up in a completely unrelated topic here in the Mastermind forum (follow the link in the quote to see the full context) ... but now I'm starting to wonder if "group travel" powers like Group Fly, Team Teleport and even Inertial Reduction would be able to be slotted with a Stealth proc IO, confer the benefit of that Stealth proc IO to your Pets in addition to yourself when that power is either toggled on or clicked, and then be able to double stack that Stealth proc IO with Grant Invisibility.

 

Because ... if that works ... that's perhaps the easiest way possible to use Fulcrum Shift on a Beast/Kinetics Mastermind (as promoted by @Zeraphia HERE) by literally stealthing yourself and your entire pack of Beasts into the midst of a pile of foes and alpha striking them with Fulcrum Shift while in Bodyguard Mode so the Beasts respond when everything attacks you.  I'm thinking that might be a pretty dastardly (and thoroughly appropriate!) way of initiating combat when you have the initiative to open on your own timetable (or because you've got a team who wants you to "soak" the alpha strike for them).

 

The only question here is ... if you put a Stealth proc IO into Inertial Reduction, does that Stealth effect also get applied to your Pets or not?  Is the Stealth effect a self only?  Under the circumstances, I'm thinking this is an answer worth knowing, since it would mean that taking Concealment: Stealth and Grant Invisibility would make a LOT of sense for a Beast/Kinetics Mastermind at that point, even if you're only interested in keeping Inertial Reduction as a One Slot Wonder™ power.  Being able to initiate combat with a Fulcrum Shift from relative safety while buffing all of your Beast Pets (or indeed an entire team, given time and endurance!) so as to start from a position of extreme buff/debuff disparity would seem to be one of those Mastermind Tricks that really deserves to be tested ... wouldn't you say?

[Zeraphia]

31 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

Something I want to draw @Zeraphia's attention back to this topic to see if there's any confirmation available for the notions.

Now I've never seriously considered the possibility of double stacking Stealth for Pets (in addition to your own Mastermind) before the question got brought up in a completely unrelated topic here in the Mastermind forum (follow the link in the quote to see the full context) ... but now I'm starting to wonder if "group travel" powers like Group Fly, Team Teleport and even Inertial Reduction would be able to be slotted with a Stealth proc IO, confer the benefit of that Stealth proc IO to your Pets in addition to yourself when that power is either toggled on or clicked, and then be able to double stack that Stealth proc IO with Grant Invisibility.

 

Because ... if that works ... that's perhaps the easiest way possible to use Fulcrum Shift on a Beast/Kinetics Mastermind (as promoted by @Zeraphia HERE) by literally stealthing yourself and your entire pack of Beasts into the midst of a pile of foes and alpha striking them with Fulcrum Shift while in Bodyguard Mode so the Beasts respond when everything attacks you.  I'm thinking that might be a pretty dastardly (and thoroughly appropriate!) way of initiating combat when you have the initiative to open on your own timetable (or because you've got a team who wants you to "soak" the alpha strike for them).

 

The only question here is ... if you put a Stealth proc IO into Inertial Reduction, does that Stealth effect also get applied to your Pets or not?  Is the Stealth effect a self only?  Under the circumstances, I'm thinking this is an answer worth knowing, since it would mean that taking Concealment: Stealth and Grant Invisibility would make a LOT of sense for a Beast/Kinetics Mastermind at that point, even if you're only interested in keeping Inertial Reduction as a One Slot Wonder™ power.  Being able to initiate combat with a Fulcrum Shift from relative safety while buffing all of your Beast Pets (or indeed an entire team, given time and endurance!) so as to start from a position of extreme buff/debuff disparity would seem to be one of those Mastermind Tricks that really deserves to be tested ... wouldn't you say?

This is very interesting indeed, I honestly have no idea, I could test this though on the beta server at some point. You are totally right about this though, IF it does work, that could indeed be life-changing for the mastermind as it would enable them to "stealth" missions without having to resummon pets. It seems very good IF this is the case, my HYPOTHESIS would be that it DOESN'T, but I don't know for a fact one way or the other without testing. 

[StrikerFox]

Tested. Freebird, Celerity and Unbound Leap in Group Fly, Speed Boost and Inertial Reduction and none applied additional stealth, to any pets. It could have been nice.

 

[Zeraphia]

13 minutes ago, StrikerFox said:

Tested. Freebird, Celerity and Unbound Leap in Group Fly, Speed Boost and Inertial Reduction and none applied additional stealth, to any pets. It could have been nice.

 

Yes, I just tested these ideas as well, and unfortunately, my results yielded the same answer. It's a shame too, that would've been pretty "dope."

[StrikerFox]

Actually looking at that screenshot, Grant Invisibility should be enough to stand in most enemy groups undetected. It provides the same amount of stealth as Invisibility, 55'.

 

And it is.

 

Edited April 24, 2020 by StrikerFox

[Redlynne]

Okay, so it's only Stealth that is "half invisibility" while Grant Invisibility and (actual) Invisibility are "full invisibility" ... so you only need Stealth and Grant Invisibility for this trick, and a Stealth IO proc SOMEWHERE in a Kinetics build for the Surprise Alpha Fulcrum Shift with all of your Pets getting all of the benefits while on Defensive Follow for Bodyguard Mode.

[Coyote]

Did they upgrade Grant Invisibility to be a team AoE when used, or is it still on a single target?

[StrikerFox]

10 hours ago, Coyote said:

Did they upgrade Grant Invisibility to be a team AoE when used, or is it still on a single target?

Single target. It's a bit of a hassle but GI is up quickly. About 3s with zero recharge/global bonus.