Star Wars: Andor on D+

[Mr. Vee]

Spoiler

'What have I sacrificed? Have you any idea how long it took to craft this speech? All the long hours editing and re-editing? The practice in front of a mirror perfecting every pause, every nuance? The times I've mentioned sacrifice in conversation only to have some dull-eyed moron leave the bait hanging limp like a dead Gungan's tongue? The times I've prayed to whatever dark gods rule this galaxy for one shot to finish it without interruption before Emmy submission time? You speak to me of sacrifice?'

 

[Techwright]

Andor Episode 10: One Way Out  (Mandalorian:  This is the Way 😁 )

Spoiler

• Monitoring Cassian's "tab", he started his sentence with 2189 (I assume. The "9" is heavily stylized.) and the day of the prison break shows 2155.  So he's only been a prisoner for 34 days.  Three episodes make it feel a lot longer.  This should still keep the story in year BBY 5, unless the calendar just switched to BBY 4.
• Luthen works briefly on what appears to be a decorative bronze helmet in his shop.  This appears to be one of the decorative head pieces worn by Queen Padme Amadala.
• Luthen's seemingly callous regard to 50 men under Anto Kreegyr as "disposable", seems to be based on the legend of Winston Churchill allowing the bombs to fall on Coventry to maintain secrecy regarding the possession of the Enigma cyphering machine.  I say "legend" because a 2012 document online suggests the story might not be entirely accurate.
• One wonders what turned Lonnie.  Clearly it was done at a lower rank.
• We see a few more aliens in Lonnie's walk to the elevator.  I don't recognize any of the species, though one had a slight resemblance...slight...to Devaronians.  This remains my only "major" complaint about Andor:  the Star Wars galaxy has many established, large-population alien species none of which are appearing in the work.  Aliens are few, there's only been one talking role, and all aliens are new, which is fine, but the others need to be present as well.  The second half of this complaint is that droids are largely not present, and with the exception of the K2SO units and one mouse droid, they're not familiar models.  Droids are everywhere doing seemingly most any function in Star Wars.  Even if turned-off, unmanned props, they should be in the scenes.  Raid the Lucasfilm warehouses, producers!
• I like the two "Lady or the Tiger" scenarios in the episode finale:  1) does Keno find another way or does he perish?  2) Did a host of prisoners survive and just wander off, or did only the two from Rogue One survive?  With the former, I wonder if they're leaving an open door for Keno's return should Andy be up to doing the role again, or if gauged audience interest demands his return.  As to the latter, the answer is "YES".  I've read many reaction comments elsewhere, and there's universal praise for Andy's role.
• Luthen's ship is referred to as "The Fondor".  I'm not clear if that is the name of the ship or the manufacturer (Like saying Ford or Rolls Royce.) It's possibly the latter because Fondor is the name of a Star Wars planet with one of the major shipyards of the galaxy.  Darth Vader's custom Star Destroyer, the Executor was built there.  If it is the ship's name, I wonder if this is a hint at Luthen's backstory.  Something important may have happened at Fondor.  It would be like Firefly's Captain Mal naming his ship Serenity after the battle of Serenity valley, where his side lost the war.
• I did not see the betrothal sting coming.  This is so much worse.  Mon Mothma has always been portrayed as not only the cautious Rebel leader, but one who has clear lines of morality she will not cross.  It has led to clashes with Saw Guerra onscreen.  This may be the one time she'll have to cross those lines, something that will hurt so bad it will reinforce the steel of her spine in the future to never let it happen again.
• Sinta Kaz has just been seen by what appears to be a monitoring ISB agent in disguise.  He appears not to realize who she is.  Will this come back to haunt her?
• Maarva is off her meds.  It sounds like she's totally losing it.  I wonder though if she's crazy like a fox.
• The escape feels planned, but only to the shuttle hatch.  No apparent planning for surviving the elements wearing no shoes and having only light prison outfits.  Cassian better be very thankful the lake wasn't stocked with space aquatic carnivores.  They'd better address getting off the rock next episode, and not just doing a handwave.

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by Techwright

[Glacier Peak]

I'm wondering out loud here, but wasn't there more water prison things next to the one the main character was assigned to? 

[twozerofoxtrot]

I assumed they were all a part of the same prison complex. 

[ThaOGDreamWeaver]

13 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

I'm wondering out loud here, but wasn't there more water prison things next to the one the main character was assigned to? 

 

Seems so. There are five Raft type structures visible in this screenshot (though, given the OCD nature of architects, would bet there's actually seven).

 

 BTW. Why, in the name of the Great Bird Of The Galaxy, do Imps insist on building their fancy stuff underwater? Massive unnecessary engineering challenges, just for Rule Of Cool false perception of security.

Industrial park in Reading / Scranton / Leopardstown / De Kalb would have been perfectly fine. And, to be honest, feel more or less the same.

 

Haven't caught up with this week's show yet, but for those of you still braving the hellscape of Twitter, there is nothin' but love out there for Andy Serkis.

 

Oh, and for architecture nerds / RPG folks / etc, here's the overhead plan.

 

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by ThaOGDreamWeaver
Added Canadian joke translation, eh

[Techwright]

18 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

I'm wondering out loud here, but wasn't there more water prison things next to the one the main character was assigned to? 

Yes, remember all the 7's?  There were 7 prison buildings total, each with 7 sides, 7 prison floors (8th was control area), 7 wives, 7 cats, 7 rats, ....wait, got mixed up there somehow.

 

You're probably asking how the other buildings didn't send help. (By the way, the prisons were probably not inter-connected underwater.) The first prison episode, when Cassian stood before the door to the factory floor, established that they too were running thin on staff.  They probably didn't have help to send, and even if they did, they might not have had the transportation.  I got the impression that the late guard in that scene was shuttled by the ship that brought Cassian.  Lack of transportation keeps the risk of escapes at a minimal, but it also works against the empire in emergencies.  It may be shown in the aftermath that those prisons called for help from space, but this goes back to Cassian's description of the empire as essentially stupid, and they might not have kept an imperial ship nearby.

 

4 hours ago, ThaOGDreamWeaver said:

 BTW. Why, in the name of the Great Bird Of The Galaxy, do Imps insist on building their fancy stuff underwater? Massive unnecessary engineering challenges, just for Rule Of Cool false perception of security.

Industrial park in Reading / Scranton / Leopardstown / De Kalb would have been perfectly fine. And, to be honest, feel more or less the same.

 

Haven't caught up with this week's show yet, but for those of you still braving the hellscape of Twitter, there is nothin' but love out there for Andy Serkis.

 

 

I think you hit it.  The engineering wasn't so much the need for practical , but rather the perception (and mostly reality) that one doesn't escape from this facility, at least at the levels.  You'd be crushed by the water pressure or you'd drown before reaching the surface.  Again, I wonder why they didn't throw space piranha into the water just to reinforce this.  It would be a means of disposing of corpses, gruesome though it be.   There are some benefits to a water-located building beyond security.  Hydro-power and abundant water for filtering for drinking, laundry, and waste facilities for one.  It does beggar the question though as to why the prison didn't permit proper showers rather than a sterilizing mist.  Those prisoners got to exfoliate once in a while.

 

I have to wonder if the writers and architects of this prison concept had Dante's 7 levels of hell in mind when designing this wretched hive of scum and villainy.

 

The YouTube reaction comments have been full of love for Andy Serkis and for Stellan Skarsgård as well.  If anything, the viewers loved this episode even more than "The Eye".   Andy's been doing interviews after episodes air and I'm including a post-episode 10 interview with Andy for you to view.  Be aware, the interviewer has no sense of "Spoilers!" and delves right into them.  DO NOT see this interview until you've viewed the episode:

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by Techwright

[ThaOGDreamWeaver]

I still don't get why they couldn't build it on one of those islands. Alcatraz had all of those benefits without actually needing to block out and pump out several million metric tonnes of water to put it below the surface. Hell, if you want to build an island, that's an awful lot easier.

 

On with the bulletage:

Spoiler

• Andy Serkis, ladies and gentlemen. That's it. That's the comment.
• I'd been wondering why he'd been hacking at the toilet during his break - short the floor.
• It's a sad ending for Andy's character - that last minute irony of beating the system and not being able to beat himself. I'd like to think he stuck around with about 20 guys, waited for the first Imp troop reinforcement shuttle to turn up, shot the lot of them and ran for it.
• Ah, so now we know why Irritating Kid is in the series. Bargaining chip. Something quite guaranteed to make her hate her mother permanently.
• Epic Luthen Speech is Epic. I'm not sure Lonnie's wholly won over though - and if he cracked, game over.
• Luthen knows who Dedra is now, but seems to dismiss her interest and deductions out of hand. Is he arrogant, double-bluffing, or is there going to be a plan to take her out of the equation (possibly with the help of our besotted incel friend as a stooge?)
• Getting out of the prison is part 1. Getting off that rock and home is... a problem. They may still have blasters, but they're on an unfamiliar world that seems to be nothing but sand. 

 

More fun with architecture. Series designer Luke Hull has a bit of a tease over here.

• There were seven prison blocks. Yep, he's OCD.
• What they were making is significant, and may be revealed... later. It might even pay off this series.
• There's even tie-in merch.

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by ThaOGDreamWeaver

[Techwright]

19 hours ago, ThaOGDreamWeaver said:

I still don't get why they couldn't build it on one of those islands. Alcatraz had all of those benefits without actually needing to block out and pump out several million metric tonnes of water to put it below the surface. Hell, if you want to build an island, that's an awful lot easier.

Well, what else can I say?  The engineering of these prisons is diabolical, and in some ways well thought out, but there are gaping holes as well, such as not having barred gates between guard stations, allowing the prisoners to swarm every station.  Such is imperial overconfidence.

 

On with the bulletage: (one or two comments of my own added)

  Hide contents

• Andy Serkis, ladies and gentlemen. That's it. That's the comment.
• I'd been wondering why he'd been hacking at the toilet during his break - short the floor.
• It's a sad ending for Andy's character - that last minute irony of beating the system and not being able to beat himself. I'd like to think he stuck around with about 20 guys, waited for the first Imp troop reinforcement shuttle to turn up, shot the lot of them and ran for it.  It's the old Hollywood adage:  we didn't see a body, therefore...  Honestly, I could go either way.  If they leave him completely trapped, and presumably therefore a dead man.  It's a powerful bit of writing.  If they reveal a way he managed an escape, the fans will be ecstatic.  I know many of them want to see Kino become a Rebel leader, and I think the character has that potential, though he may just want to find a quiet beach on a backwater world somewhere and repair a boat.
• Ah, so now we know why Irritating Kid is in the series. Bargaining chip. Something quite guaranteed to make her hate her mother permanently. I get the feeling gangster's designs go far beyond gaining a daughter-in-law.  what he's really seeking (probably) is permanent leverage:  he has wealth and power but not prestige. Being tied to the Senator's family will gain him some of that, as well as tie an Imperial senator perpetually to his machinations.
• Epic Luthen Speech is Epic. I'm not sure Lonnie's wholly won over though - and if he cracked, game over.  Cracked if he's caught, yes, but I doubt he'll crack before then.  Luthen would have ended the relationship, probably with a blaster, if he even suspected that might happen.  Instead he pointed out the sad reality that Lonnie has no options.  Anything he'd say or do against Luthen would be mean his own interrogation and execution, and probably that of his family as well.  What concerns me is that departure of Dedra from the ISB chambers when Lonnie made his suggestion.  Reactors have been speculating different things about it, including the possibility that Lonnie just tipped his hand accidentally to Dedra.  I had initially seen it simply as Dedra acting to set in motion this new idea.
• Luthen knows who Dedra is now, but seems to dismiss her interest and deductions out of hand. Is he arrogant, double-bluffing, or is there going to be a plan to take her out of the equation (possibly with the help of our besotted incel friend as a stooge?)  Don't discount Luthen's concern about Dedra.  He's had a pattern of dismissing his real thoughts and actions to others, even to Saw Guerrera. He told Lonnie he'd nothing to do with the Aldani robbery, so why would he voice concern to Lonnie.  His whole goal was to settle Lonnie and put him back into play.  Showing concern before Lonnie would have caused a lot more panic in Lonnie.
• Getting out of the prison is part 1. Getting off that rock and home is... a problem. They may still have blasters, but they're on an unfamiliar world that seems to be nothing but sand.   Perhaps if they can find items to make a rudimentary lathe...

 

More fun with architecture. Series designer Luke Hull has a bit of a tease over here.  Okay one major tidbit he put out there that wasn't clear in the show:  each prison floor is making different items.  That changes things. 

• There were seven prison blocks. Yep, he's OCD.
• What they were making is significant, and may be revealed... later. It might even pay off this series.  I've yet to hear a good theory as to what those things are.  There are a couple of points in their design that I think are the clues.  I'll drop a spoiler box here to discuss: 
  Spoiler

  I see 4 points in the item's design that are apparently clues:

  • It's a double-stack of 3-armed centerpieces.  Folks saying its a TIE Fighter's 6-sided connection to its panel "wings" do not appear to be taking this double stack into account.  I've now looked at several TIE fighter pictures, even variants, and none have something suggesting a double stack.  all are single-layer 6-spoke cores.
  • It's arms have a joint.  This suggest a need to flex, at least slightly.  Again TIE fighters' wing cores have no need to flex.
  • The vase-side bit at the end of each arm looks like a possible pin for snapping something on.  That suggest something with 6 arms but not connected at a single layer.  Death Star framework hubs is the best suggestion I've heard so far, but that doesn't seem to explain the arm joints from point #2.
  • It has a central socket.  While that in part is to hold the two halves together, it may hold them to something else as well.
  • The fifth clue, if you will, is not the design of the device, but the sheer scale of what is being made.  That suggests something very big, like the Death Star, or very numerous, like a fleet of TIE fighters based in the Death Star.  But each of those runs into the problems on the first three points.

   

• There's even tie-in merch.  That's hilarious, especially the infinity jokes.

 

 

[twozerofoxtrot]

On 11/11/2022 at 4:21 AM, Techwright said:

It would be a means of disposing of corpses, gruesome though it be. 

 

The goop from those feeding tubes were definitely Soylent Blue.

[MistressOhm]

New Rockstars speculated that the prisoners are building armatures for

Spoiler

probe droids.    You know, the floating six-armed blaster-and-self-destruct-fitted beeble droids from TESB.

 

 

Edited November 12, 2022 by MistressOhm

[Mr. Vee]

Asking myself the implications of 

Spoiler

The Rebels having that fighter spinny laser tech in pretty much every space battle that followed. Seems like that'd have come in handy but I'm not the type to analyze the particulars.

 

[ThaOGDreamWeaver]

Prepare for a hail of bullets.

Spoiler

• To begin with: I am not happy about them 'fridging (bricking?) Maarva like that as a throwaway plot point. As she was pretty sure she was dying, I was expecting her to go out in a blaze of glory bombing that hotel. Fi Shaw deserves better than an offscreen death scene.
• Clearly The Kid wants to be a Handmaid (or whatever) and came to it herself. Her mother's a rebel of sorts: so rebelling against her mother by complying. Nice. Doesn't seem to be making it any easier for Mon.
• Cassian seems to have a strong strand of luck - not just avoiding getting sliced up by our fishermen friends, but a lift off the rock.
• The mysterious art piece conversation - was that about Cassian or some other scheme that will shape the season's grand finale?
• Maybe they should have called The Fondor the Bondor: Q branch would be proud. Spaceship-sized lightsabers do seem very Rule Of Cool and wildly impractical, but fun. Would have been better if they hadn't thrown that gag away in the trailers.
• Did Bix take the opportunity to give up Kreegyr instead of her actual contact, or is she too spaced from the torture?
• Has Cinta twigged that her best customer's an Imp?
• I have a feeling our obsessed young incel friend is about to do something terribly, terribly stupid to Prove He Was Right All Along...
• ...which will screw up Dedra's cunning trap. And may well be the death of him. Or, if he joins the Rebellion, the making of him.

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by ThaOGDreamWeaver

[Mr. Vee]

Re bullet point #5 - exhibit a for why I never watch trailers for things I know I'll be watching 😄

[Techwright]

Andor finally addressed one of my few issues with the program, yet created another.   First though, responses in orange...

 

18 hours ago, Mr. Vee said:

Asking myself the implications of 

  Hide contents

The Rebels having that fighter spinny laser tech in pretty much every space battle that followed. Seems like that'd have come in handy but I'm not the type to analyze the particulars.

As TOGDM pointed out in their reaction, this is James Bond level stuff.  The fact that Luthen surprised the Empire with his gadgets strongly suggests they hadn't even seen this level of fight, and therefore nothing was in the manual for dealing with it.   The rebel alliance has canon documentation that they have to scrape and innovate for much of what they have.  Luthen's spy kit is probably heavily subsidized by his trade and wealth at great cost to each, and is simply not something the full rebellion can afford.  Also, that type of lazer is good for a solo fight.  It would be too dangerous with a friendly squad in combat.

 

 

13 hours ago, ThaOGDreamWeaver said:

Prepare for a hail of bullets.

  Hide contents

• To begin with: I am not happy about them 'fridging (bricking?) Maarva like that as a throwaway plot point. As she was pretty sure she was dying, I was expecting her to go out in a blaze of glory bombing that hotel. Fi Shaw deserves better than an offscreen death scene. 
• I too hated that Ms. Shaw was off the set going forward.  Her role was marvelous done.  That said, I saw one reaction comment that suggested she's faked her death somehow, possibly with the reluctant cooperation of key members of the community.  It's a long, thin shot, probably born of fan desperation, but it's out there.  Maara may be dead, but she's already gotten her wish.  Through love and care, she's forged a weapon that won't stop until he's successfully engineered the greatest of heists, and struck a death blow to not only the greatest (and most expensive) weapon of the Empire, but also millions of imperial soldiers, including the military's top brass such as both the head of the ISB and the #3 man in the Empire.  Maarva would be blazingly proud.
• Clearly The Kid wants to be a Handmaid (or whatever) and came to it herself. Her mother's a rebel of sorts: so rebelling against her mother by complying. Nice. Doesn't seem to be making it any easier for Mon. 
• At this point Kid Mothma needs a rude awakening as to how rude and ungrateful she's been.  I doubt we're getting that, though, at least in season 1.  Any chance we could get Luthen to make it look like the missing funds were stolen by a spoiled brat?
• Cassian seems to have a strong strand of luck - not just avoiding getting sliced up by our fishermen friends, but a lift off the rock. 
• You mean...the Force? Star Wars canon shows that "luck", even to those without midichlorians, happens due to the will of the Force.  Cassian is one of the major tools for rebalancing the universe, so yes, he's Force lucky (which is pretty much the same thing as plot armor.)
• The mysterious art piece conversation - was that about Cassian or some other scheme that will shape the season's grand finale? 
• I've heard that dialog twice now, and will probably have to watch it more.  At this point, Cassian or Vel are the only two that spring to mind.
• Maybe they should have called The Fondor the Bondor: Q branch would be proud. Spaceship-sized lightsabers do seem very Rule Of Cool and wildly impractical, but fun. Would have been better if they hadn't thrown that gag away in the trailers. 
• Agreed.  A guy at work tried to argue from the trailer that he was seeing giant red lightsabers, and was upset that the Jedi never used this on their ships.  🤣 At least they didn't spoil the countermeasures.
• Did Bix take the opportunity to give up Kreegyr instead of her actual contact, or is she too spaced from the torture?  She was in a "damned if I do, damned if I don't" situation.  She doesn't know Kreegyr, and has none of the information the viewers do.  While we want her to dump on Kreegyr, as he's already a dead man, from her view the character may be a fiction created by the ISB to test her truthfulness.  Silence seems to be her only recourse, but any option could have her back to hearing death screams.
• Has Cinta twigged that her best customer's an Imp?
• Good question.  She's extremely clever, and if she's working the coffee house, she's surely seen how much this guy hangs around staring at Maarva's house.  And if he's doing that, how is it that he is asking what's happening there?  I guess it boils down to how much distraction her own search is causing.
• I have a feeling our obsessed young incel friend is about to do something terribly, terribly stupid to Prove He Was Right All Along... 
• Just so long as he doesn't break into song that "It was Cassian all along". 😉  Honestly, I've no idea where Syril's role is going.  I'm pretty sure it is villain from cast comments made during interviews, but then they may just be messing with us.  I hate just watching and letting it play out, but this role, I'm currently doing just that.
• ...which will screw up Dedra's cunning trap. And may well be the death of him. Or, if he joins the Rebellion, the making of him. 
• As we mentioned last episode, he's the show's wildcard.

 

 

Now a few comments of my own:

Spoiler

• This episode finally answered the critique I had that the show was severely lacking in aliens, something very, ahem, alien to Star Wars.  Three talking alien roles in one episode, more than the rest of the season combined, and we even got a sleeping alien and alien blue seagulls (who didn't talk, but were probably squawking "mine!"). 
• They've still not addressed the reduced number of droids, but at least they gave one more screen time.
• ...and that bugs me.  Who in their right mind gives a droid the programming for massive depression? I guess I can understand a bit of fear in the emotive programming, such as R2D2 was known to occasionally exhibit.  After all, fear in bio-organics alerts and motivates self-preservation, something potentially useful in expensive astromechs.  I'm with Bael Organa on this one: wipe the droid's memory.  Or perhaps wipe the subroutine for depression. At very least, turn the droid off and stow it, since technically the droid falls to Cassian now.  It's his decision.  But this is not a beloved organic pet whose emotions come by nature and cannot be helped.  This is a machine with programming to act emotive.  Cute, absolutely, and probably useful in a lonely human's home, but not an organic.
• I can understand low-rent apartment videophones, but the Empire is strangely making extensive use of such for communication, despite holo-communications being a standard tool for some time in-story.  In fact, back in the Prequels era, they were using holo-communicators the size of a hockey puck. 
• I've seen some reactors not understand why Luthen guns his engines while fighting the tractor beam before using his countermeasures weapon.   He did so precisely because of the countermeasures.  His ship's A.I. had just assessed the tractor beam at level 2. By struggling, he caused the Imps to ramp up their tractor grip five more notches, thereby improving his weapon, sending his shrapnel flying even faster at the dish.  Smart secret agent man.  Also smart was doubling back and hitting the TIE bomber before the pilot felt clear of their mothership.  I just wish Luthen had decided to take one last pass at the bridge of that mothership and activate the lazer one last time.
• Nitpicky detail, but the ship's commander should not have referred to his TIE squadron as an "air wing".  He's not in the atmosphere, and they fly there only part of the time, the rest of the time they're in space, as was true this episode.  "Fighter wing" would have been more appropriate.
• By the way, I'll have to look into it, but I'm pretty sure that ship first appeared as a kid's toy.  That might explain the odd look with oversized dishes on both front and wings.
• This show is so well cast, it might be easy to overlook Brasso.  I'm really loving this character.  In a quiet sort of way, he's just a "man's man", the kind I'd want as a best friend knowing he'd look after my mom and my pet dog, er, droid, if I couldn't.   I'm hoping this character doesn't also end up dead, but eventually joins the rebellion.  I can't see him just returning to work, staying away from the conflict the empire is stirring. I'd love to see more tales with him.  I've not seen actor Joplin Sibtain before, at least that I can recall, but am hoping this is a stepping stone to great things for him.
• Speaking of joining the rebellion, it would be a cool tie-in if at the end of the entire series, many on planet Ferrix would have turned to a rebel nature because of the Andors, and needing to evacuate because of the empire, Kawlan Roken wold show up to ferry them to the rebellion.  Roken is, of course, the ship leader Obi-Wan Kenobi encouraged to continue to lead the fight in OWK's eponymous Disney+ series. In-story, that was 4 years before Andor.  Actor O'Shea Jackson Jr. has referred to his character as a founder of the Rebel Alliance.
• I did not see the break-up coming between Cassian and Melshi.  I'd just assumed they'd be traveling and bonding together.  As near as we know, Melshi leaves without even knowing Cassian's real name.  I'm really hoping to see how they each work their way to Yavin IV.  Also, why on earth does Cassian give Melshi the blaster, but not some credits?  He's got enough to spare.
• I still think Kleya's got a serious ego, and some overreaching goals to function at a higher decision level, and that may cause some serious problems for Luthen.  We've still seen no evidence that Luthen is even aware of the hit on Cassian that she ordered in Luthen's name, and her reluctant discussion with Vel seems to underline that Kleya is sneaking around her boss.  That said, that mysterious double-talk about another antiquities piece might be an argument between her and Luthen about Cassian's value or liability.

 

[Mr. Vee]

Spoiler

I'm with you on the blades being a bad squad weapon. I was just wondering how much damage a single fighter with heavy forward shields could do as a vanguard when star destroyers are deploying their TIE squadrons. We know how little the Empire fears single fighters. Pure speculation on my part but I could see an instance of this as motivation for Thrawn's TIE defender program.

 

[Techwright]

1 hour ago, Mr. Vee said:

  Hide contents

I'm with you on the blades being a bad squad weapon. I was just wondering how much damage a single fighter with heavy forward shields could do as a vanguard when star destroyers are deploying their TIE squadrons. We know how little the Empire fears single fighters. Pure speculation on my part but I could see an instance of this as motivation for Thrawn's TIE defender program.

 

Vanguard, yes, I see where you are coming from.  That makes sense as an opening move, though an expensive and dangerous one, even with the conditions you name.

[ThaOGDreamWeaver]

Spoiler

8 hours ago, Techwright said:

..and that bugs me.  Who in their right mind gives a droid the programming for massive depression?

I don't think they do. Droids have intelligence at varying levels (R2 is clearly a genius astromech: B2EMO is more the level of the family dog). I can't remember where it's mentioned, but the "older" a droid gets between memory wipes, the more curious habits and tics they pick up. B2EMO has been in Maarva's family for years, and was as fiercely loyal to her as R2 was to Luke. No wonder they're depressed.

 

8 hours ago, Techwright said:

she's surely seen how much this guy hangs around staring at Maarva's house

I noticed she doesn't ask questions about it, and he rather obviously does. If she doesn't twig him (or fridge him), I will be most disappoint in her.

8 hours ago, Techwright said:

I hate just watching and letting it play out, but this role, I'm currently doing just that.

Oddly, I love it. I've had no idea where a lot of this series is going to go, even with the huge spoilers in the trailer (I thought the prison was some kind of Stormtrooper brainwashing facility - half right, I guess). It takes a lot to surprise and delight a jaded old nerd like me. I also note that pretty much everything in the trailers has now been played out, so our final episode could be a complete surprise.

8 hours ago, Techwright said:

Just so long as he doesn't break into song that "It was Cassian all along".

Aww, c'mon, that'd be awesome. For a bet, he screams and points out Cassian to the Imps, fucks the plan, Cassian escapes (again) and he gets put in an Imperial asylum or similar hole. Or maybe that prison. He'd enjoy the routine of it.

 

[twozerofoxtrot]

Spoiler

12 hours ago, Techwright said:

By the way, I'll have to look into it, but I'm pretty sure that ship first appeared as a kid's toy.

 

The Spaceshipper wrote an article on this ship (free to read). Neat story going back to the original designs for ANH, and a nice tribute (Cantwell Class).

 

12 hours ago, Techwright said:

Also, why on earth does Cassian give Melshi the blaster, but not some credits?

 

That's the Corpo Guard pistol from Morlana. Cassian rid himself of the murder weapon and potentially threw the scent onto Melshi. I really liked this, it was so subtle yet hints at the Cassian we're first introduced to at the start of Rogue One.

 

11 hours ago, Mr. Vee said:

I was just wondering how much damage a single fighter with heavy forward shields could do as a vanguard when star destroyers are deploying their TIE squadrons.

 

Probably right but likely unfeasible for practical military purposes.  My take is that the long countermeasure charge up we see is to power those weapons, not the flechette launcher (which "realistically" wouldn't have put so much strain on a vessel's power pack to require the delay).

 

I'm sure that charge up bit was just an element of writing to give room for exposition and build tension but if we're going down the rat's nest of theory crafting that's where I'm placing my bet: too difficult to power, too hard to apply practically,  X-Wing Smash.

 

[Techwright]

1 hour ago, twozerofoxtrot said:

  Hide contents

 

The Spaceshipper wrote an article on this ship (free to read). Neat story going back to the original designs for ANH, and a nice tribute (Cantwell Class).

Well I was right and wrong.  Hot Wheels did make a toy of it, but the history is much older.  Thanks for linking that.

 

That's the Corpo Guard pistol from Morlana. Cassian rid himself of the murder weapon and potentially threw the scent onto Melshi. I really liked this, it was so subtle yet hints at the Cassian we're first introduced to at the start of Rogue One. 

I...did not consider that.  Interesting.  Not that it would matter much.  It wouldn't take the ISB long to realize Melshi was at their prison during the murders, but there would be a delay while they looked.

 

Answering in the hide box.

 

EDIT:  forgot to add the following thoughts to my ep. 11 post:

Spoiler

• Luthen's ship is cool and Luthen is free, but unless he can reconfigure the looks of that "hauler", its not a ship he should be using again.  The imps got a very good look at it.
• A comment by a reactor gave me a crazy idea:  I'm getting the idea that B2EMO won't survive the show.  It's in pretty bad shape, both physically and emotionally.  I'm wondering if Cassian will use components from his little droid to hack the K2SO unit.  It would be in similar vein to Lando using the brain of his droid to repair the navigation of the Millenium Falcon.

 

 

Edited November 18, 2022 by Techwright

[ThaOGDreamWeaver]

Spoiler

6 hours ago, Techwright said:

Luthen's ship is cool and Luthen is free, but unless he can reconfigure the looks of that "hauler", its not a ship he should be using again.  The imps got a very good look at it.

They're looking for a Fondor Haulcraft with no "plates". There's not much lore around it yet, but it's apparently a light hauler with a completely stock exterior (unlike the Falcon, which even in Ep4 was an out-of-date heap of junk with some odd aftermarket mods. It stood out.)

 

For an Earthsider comparison, you're looking for an unmarked, quite new, high-spec but otherwise unremarkable delivery van, such as you would find marked "Bob's Landscaping" or "The Telephone Company" quietly parked across from a mob boss's lair for no more than 2 hours at a time, and with workmen in uniforms with carefully calibrated dirt patches and safety trainers (workboot/running shoe crossover) doing many small jobs that don't tie them up for very long. And wearing sunglasses.

 

Or if you prefer less cinematic metaphor, if you're not looking for it and looking carefully, it's going to be a perfectly natural part of the scenery.

If the defensive circuitry doesn't power up until it's manually switched on, it's going to take a canny sensor officer to spot the difference.

 

9 hours ago, twozerofoxtrot said:

My take is that the long countermeasure charge up we see is to power those weapons, not the flechette launcher (which "realistically" wouldn't have put so much strain on a vessel's power pack to require the delay).

Sounds a decent enough tension crank. Also, it's fairly common sci-fi lore that a sensor officer would know when a ship is powering weapons, which you really wouldn't expect on a "van". If you draw power slowly...

 

[Techwright]

I'm continuing to watch the Andor episode 11 reactions as they're slowly being released, and I've got to agree with one reactor I just saw:  the cello interpretation of the Andor theme in the last shot of episode 11 was just outstanding, and really captured the emotion of the moment.  That's one of the rarely spoken bits of modern Star Wars: those shows that are not blessed with a John Williams theme or score, are nevertheless blessed with creative composers who clearly realize whose shoes they're having to try to fill, and are bringing their "A game" to the shows.

[Techwright]

Have you seen the crazy theory out there about Luthen?

Spoiler

This is nuts but the name gave me pause.  The theory goes that Luthen Rael is actually a former Jedi.  This brief video describes the theory and its reasons:

 

The point that gave me pause was Dooku's first apprentice being named "Rael".  We know that survivors of Order 66 go by name changes, though some retain elements of their name.  "Ben Kenobi" being the poster child example.  There's also the odd loan of the Kyber crystal.  It's an interesting theory, though I hope it doesn't prove accurate, or at least doesn't turn out exactly like folks think. 

 

Reasons I don't think it's accurate:

1. The producers wanted to show as side of the galaxy away from the force users.

2. As someone in the comments section mentioned the toys show a metal blade coming out of Luthens "truncheon", not a light saber.  (Though another commenter pointed out that the particular brand of toys often has flaws in the looks.)  In my opinion, Luthen's "staff" is too long for a light saber handle, and it's made of wood.  That last part is not a dismissal.  We've heard in canon that wood can be used, it is just a rare choice.

3. Revealing a Jedi would immediately compromise the viewers' interest, and suck the life out of all the other storylines in Andor, especially that of Cassian.

 

Possible alternatives:

1.  Luthen's past had a deeply personal connection to the Jedi: a family member, a best friend, etc.  It would explain his hesitation at giving up the kyber crystal, if it came from a friend.  However, it would be consistent with his self-description, having to sacrifice anything to move his rebellion forward.

2. Possibly Luthen's first efforts in the dawning empire years was to help Jedi escape.  He may have bought marketable goods from fleeing Jedi as a way of financing their escape.  This would allow him to have a Kyber crystal, one that he found important, if say a Jedi surrendered their second light saber's crystal as a means of financing their escape.  It would explain certain Jedi artifacts in his store.  As an alternative to that, some of the Jedi artifacts may have come to him via scavengers at the Jedi temples and also those who pick a Jedi clean after the Jedi is killed.

 

[ThaOGDreamWeaver]

12 hours ago, Techwright said:

It's an interesting theory, though I hope it doesn't prove accurate, or at least doesn't turn out exactly like folks think. 

 

Thoughts thereon:

Spoiler

• I don't think he's Jedi. Too easy, especially given the intricate plotting of this series. He does have an uncanny nose for people, a little bit of Spidey-sense, and quite handy with an archaic hand-weapon, but that's not enough to scream Jedi to me.
• Kyber crystals are exceptionally rare, pricy... and slightly alive. So at the very least, it's a valuable thing which was meant to test Andor's honesty.
• From a writing point of view, it's a neat call-forward / foreshadowing to the Death Star, which needed massive stones from Jedha to power the big gun. 
• It's possible he's more than a little superstitious (given how much battlefield commanders and pilots depend on luc... sorry, the Force being with them, not an uncommon thing.) He wanted Andor to succeed, so gave him something lucky...
• ...or would get him in enough trouble if found (and nearly did) that if Cassian screwed up early, it wouldn't blow back.

 

But all that said, I do have a theory or two of my own. It's on a chain and is clearly personal to Luthen. So my two theories - not mutually exclusive - are:

1. Luthen's an ex-Imp who quit following Order 66 - and is destroying the system he once was part of.
2. The crystal belonged to someone he was very close to. Jedi don't normally do "attachments", Anakin aside, so not a lover. Either he befriended a Jedi while working for the Republic - or...
   ...and this is my personal top bet...
   ...his kid was a Temple youngling. Jedi normally don't need anything, but as a proud father who wants their kid to have the best of everything, he hunted down one of the finest examples he could lay his hands on. Perhaps as a "graduation" gift, which will now never be given.
   It's an older trope, Sir, but it checks out: There are very, very few things in the Universe that can stand between a grieving parent and revenge.
   Because your kids are your Universe.

 

Edited November 21, 2022 by ThaOGDreamWeaver

[Hyperstrike]

Never thought I'd hear myself say it.

But I am unable to manufacture even a single, shoddily constructed damn.

Star Wars is a dead franchise.

Killed by the franchise holder in an act of mob violence.

[Techwright]

11 hours ago, ThaOGDreamWeaver said:

 

Thoughts thereon:

  Hide contents

1. The crystal belonged to someone he was very close to. Jedi don't normally do "attachments", Anakin aside, so not a lover. Either he befriended a Jedi while working for the Republic - or...
   ...and this is my personal top bet...
   ...his kid was a Temple youngling. Jedi normally don't need anything, but as a proud father who wants their kid to have the best of everything, he hunted down one of the finest examples he could lay his hands on. Perhaps as a "graduation" gift, which will now never be given.
   It's an older trope, Sir, but it checks out: There are very, very few things in the Universe that can stand between a grieving parent and revenge.
   Because your kids are your Universe.

 

I'm hoping this thought (in the hide box above) is what is revealed.  I can think of a couple of expansions on it:

Spoiler

1. I agree that the Jedi lover is an unlikely scenario, though we do have soft canon to suggest in the past Jedi did produce heirs through brief relationships. 

2. The scenario of the loss of a close Jedi friend I find intriguing.  Imagine if Luthen were present when a Jedi (friend?) was slain during Order 66.  Luthen may have been smart enough to shut his mouth, preventing his death by association, but he may have stolen the kyber crystal from the light saber as a token reminder.  He couldn't very well steal the saber itself, that would be noticed.  (That said, I still hold out hope that Luthen was given the crystal by Galen Erso, expert in kyber crystals)

3. The idea of a relative child being killed in Order 66 might actually make sense from a thematic viewpoint.  We know the show has driven at least one repeating theme: "climb!", and that it borrowed the idea from Rogue One, tying the two together in yet another way. The loss of children might be another theme.  Galen Erso sacrificed his life with his daughter for her safety, Mon is about to sacrifice her daughter for Mon' safety and to continue her rebellion, so why shouldn't Luthen have a loss as well?