Which secondaries for Rad Armor and Shield Defense?

[BuiltDifferent5]

 Returning to the game after a long hiatus. I’ve decided that I’m gonna level two tankers, one Rad Armor and one Shield. 
 

The secondaries I’m interested in are Fiery Melee and Martial Arts. Which secondary do you think would go better with each primary?

 

Basically either going:

Rad Armor/Martial Arts and Shield/Fiery Melee

**OR**

Rad Armor/Fiery Melee and Shield/Martial Arts

 

Which two would you choose? Is one set of combos more synergistic than the other?

 

Thanks!

[ZemX]

Shield Benefits more directly from Martial Arts' Storm Kick +def.  It has the Defense Debuff Resistance to protect that extra defense too.  You could try to bulk up DEF from nothing with Rad Armor but I've not found it very reliable and hence don't bother with it myself.

 

That's not to say MA can't go with RadA.  RadA does add a couple procc-able AOEs that could certainly help make up for MA's lack there.  I have a Rad/Katana and a Rad/Staff Tanker and neither really benefits much from those sets' +def attacks either.  Still works.

 

Fiery Melee is going to go well with either.  You'll have ridiculous AoE with Rad/Fire but Shield/Fire can be nice too and there's a good selection of shield customizations that can look pretty good next to a fire sword.

[BuiltDifferent5]

8 minutes ago, ZemX said:

Shield Benefits more directly from Martial Arts' Storm Kick +def.  It has the Defense Debuff Resistance to protect that extra defense too.  You could try to bulk up DEF from nothing with Rad Armor but I've not found it very reliable and hence don't bother with it myself.

 

That's not to say MA can't go with RadA.  RadA does add a couple procc-able AOEs that could certainly help make up for MA's lack there.  I have a Rad/Katana and a Rad/Staff Tanker and neither really benefits much from those sets' +def attacks either.  Still works.

 

Fiery Melee is going to go well with either.  You'll have ridiculous AoE with Rad/Fire but Shield/Fire can be nice too and there's a good selection of shield customizations that can look pretty good next to a fire sword.

Thanks Zem. I remember @Werner doing cool things with his Shield/MA. I just didn’t know if the extra defense is overkill or not.

 

I think both option or combos seem enticing.

 

I view one as covering the weaknesses of the other. In Rad/MA case, you get some snappy ST dmg with MA and extra AOE with Rad. Shield lacks AOE on it’s own (other than Shield Charge) so Fiery Melee really helps there.

 

On the other hand, the other options seem to be doubling down on strengths. Rad/Fiery would be an AOE monster. Shield/MA would have ALL the defense 😂

[ZemX]

27 minutes ago, BuiltDifferent5 said:

On the other hand, the other options seem to be doubling down on strengths. Rad/Fiery would be an AOE monster. Shield/MA would have ALL the defense 😂

 

Clearly the answer is.... FOUR MORE TANKERS!

 

Get crackin! 🤪

[BuiltDifferent5]

15 minutes ago, ZemX said:

 

Clearly the answer is.... FOUR MORE TANKERS!

 

Get crackin! 🤪

THAT’S MY FEAR 😂

[StriderIV]

Man, this is tough. Push come to shove, I’d probably go Rad/MA and Shield/Fiery. I like the idea of covering your primaries weaknesses, as you said.

[Warboss]

Or... Rad/Fire.... just sayin'...

 

 

...and you can never have too many Tanks!

[BuiltDifferent5]

34 minutes ago, Warboss said:

Or... Rad/Fire.... just sayin'...

 

 

...and you can never have too many Tanks!

Rad/Fire is one of the options! Haha I want to run a Rad Tanker and a Shield Tanker. So basically either:

 

Rad/Fire and Shield/MA 

 

OR

 

Rad/MA and Shield/Fire

 

I know you run a lot of tankers! Would you lean towards one pairing or the other?

[Onlyasandwich]

18 hours ago, BuiltDifferent5 said:

Rad Armor/Martial Arts and Shield/Fiery Melee

**OR**

Rad Armor/Fiery Melee and Shield/Martial Arts

 

I'd probably go the latter, though either combo would be excellent.

 

Some would say to layer Martial with Rad, as it will provide a solid defensive boost to layer with your resists, and make softcap approaches easier. This is not a bad approach! However, on a tanker I find myself too easily debuffed when trying to layer substantial defense without defense debuff resistance. It works great against some enemies, but may as well not exist against others. I'd rather just rely on Rad's baseline power (it's very survivable without a defense focus) and have the damage of Fire.

 

Shield on the other hand has solid DDR, and would appreciate the extra defense for:

• Greater build flexibility.
• Incarnate content.

 

Ultimately theme is king! Choose what you find to be most interesting.

[BuiltDifferent5]

1 hour ago, Onlyasandwich said:

 

I'd probably go the latter, though either combo would be excellent.

 

Some would say to layer Martial with Rad, as it will provide a solid defensive boost to layer with your resists, and make softcap approaches easier. This is not a bad approach! However, on a tanker I find myself too easily debuffed when trying to layer substantial defense without defense debuff resistance. It works great against some enemies, but may as well not exist against others. I'd rather just rely on Rad's baseline power (it's very survivable without a defense focus) and have the damage of Fire.

 

Shield on the other hand has solid DDR, and would appreciate the extra defense for:

• Greater build flexibility.
• Incarnate content.

 

Ultimately theme is king! Choose what you find to be most interesting.

The lack of DDR on Rad is a really good call out. This is the way I’m leaning currently, Rad/Fiery for more offensive minded amd Shield/MA for a true turtle Tanker haha.

[Warboss]

It really depends on what you want to do, I'd go Rad/Fire and SD/MA myself... However, I recognize that not everyone has my addiction to Rad Armor and Fiery Melee. If you look at the recent  Rad/* thread, somewhere around here on the Tanker forum, @Spaghetti Betty and @ZemX sum up how to build a Rad Tank sans Def, so I'd look at that thread when designing your Rad Tank (whichever 2ndry you decide to go with). That said, Rad/FM is an AoE Machine (which I love about the pairing, and is my main reason for playing the combo). SD/FM is pretty good at it too especially with SDs teleport attack, but... SD isn't Rad (;)), and as others have mentioned the Def bonus from MA won't go all that far once you jump into the middle of a mob. So, taking MA on your Rad Tank should be for other reasons than the Def "bonus" (as fleeting as it will be).

 

To sum up:

Two Tanks, not a bad thing.

Rad/FM

SD/MA or.... <.<  >.>  SD/FM, because you can never have enough FIRE!

 

However you decide to go, enjoy your Tanks!!

[Bronana16969]

Both are meta when it comes to farming, with rad/ma being technically the most optimal from what I've read.  Leveraging procs against high cd abilities being s lynch pin in it.

 

Seems pretty solid when you have a constant rotation of abilities that give the recharge of force feedback.

[Carnifax]

5 hours ago, Onlyasandwich said:

 

Some would say to layer Martial with Rad, as it will provide a solid defensive boost to layer with your resists, and make softcap approaches easier. This is not a bad approach! However, on a tanker I find myself too easily debuffed when trying to layer substantial defense without defense debuff resistance. It works great against some enemies, but may as well not exist against others. I'd rather just rely on Rad's baseline power (it's very survivable without a defense focus) and have the damage of Fire.

 

MA is good for Rad to me because the constant Forced Feedkbacks in Dragons and Crane Kick work well with Rads slow recharging AoEs (and absorb shield). And MA likes the extra AoE Rad can bring. You can also get def cap on melee, s & l without giving up on resists, 2 stacks of the Tank ATO and I'm capped to everything bar Cold. Yes the Def can and will be stripped but it's like layer one of your protection. Think of it as the "starter", you've still got the main course of capped resists and the dessert of Absorb shield + heal to go. And Ageless Radial for when you're deeply debuffed and fancy a timeout to remove the cascading -Def. 

 

But there's probably no bad choice here anyway. 

[skoryy]

Rad Armor is very much an offense-friendly set, what with the recharge, recovery, and the crash-free damage boost from the T9.  I pair it with Street Justice because crunchy smashy, but I can see it easily working well with Fire too.  

 

I can also see Shield and Martial Arts co-existing, less Storm Kick topping off your defense than Shield Charge giving you an extra AoE you'll really need.  Take it from me, the WP/MA tanker who relies on a weaker Spring Attack.

[Hjarki]

Shield has no endurance management. Neither do Fire Melee or Martial Arts. So you'll be gasping for end with those combos. If you're planning to do Shield, I highly recommend a secondary like Savage, Energy or Dark that mitigates your endurance issues.

 

Radiation is probably the most generally powerful armor set available to Tankers. Rad/MA is arguably the best farming build at the moment and it's a strong build for general play. I don't like Fire nearly as much - while it eventually does pretty well, it's a painfully long slog until you get all the key powers at the end of the set.