Solo Act (TF setting/Badge idea)

[EmperorSteele]

I've been musing for a while now that something I'd like to see is a badge that recognizes a player for being able to complete a Task Force or Strike Force by themselves. Using the system that now automatically detects if you have all different ATs, or all the same AT, on a team when doing a TF, I feel like this is something that could be easily implemented.

This poses a significant challenge for some ATs more than others, for sure, mostly due to the existence of Arcvhillains. However, the START vendors exist, and have a plethora of options for temporary powers and pets. Shivan Shards are easy enough to acquire, and getting Incarnate Lore pets is also fairly trivial these days.

And finally, for those who simply just can NOT deal with AVs solo, there is a TF with no AVs at all: Dr. Quaterfield. Yes, it takes a few hours, but it would be the safest route. Also note that this badge wouldn't require one to activate Advanced Mode, or challenge toggles, or use any difficulty setting above +0/x1. So other than a few level-locked critters or set spawns, this wouldn't be an insurmountable challenge.

So really, it would be a matter of either skill, using resources, OR patience, creating multiple avenues for getting such a badge.

Alternately/additionally, maybe branch this idea out for other badges or additional rewards (Spoilered only to make this post look less wall-of-texty):
 

Spoiler

Merit Bonus (reward): Due to the extra time and effort needed, completing a TF solo would yield an extra +50% reward merits (would only apply if you were solo the entire time; no kicking your team when the final boss is at 5% health =P). Does NOT stack with WST rewards (still want to encourage teamwork for those)!

Aether Bonus (reward): If soloing an Advanced Mode TF, gain +50% additional Aether upon completion (again, only counts if you're solo the entire time)

Vanguard Merit Bonus (reward): +100 vanguard merits for completing the Lady Grey Task Force solo (in addition to above rewards where applicable).

Double Trouble (badge): Complete a Task Force or Strike force with only one other teammate; much like with Role Diversity/Archetype Duplication, both team members must be present on each map of the TF for either to get credit for this badge. If above reward structure was also introduced, buffed rewards would be reduced as to make dual-boxing slightly less profitable than soloing (so something like +20% reward merits/+20% additional Aether/33 vanguard merits each, respectively).

Introverted (Badge + 1 time reward): Complete 5 different TFs Solo; gain an additional 100 Reward merits, and 10 Prismatic Aether.

 

Edited August 18 by EmperorSteele

[Glacier Peak]

Yes

[Uun]

18 hours ago, EmperorSteele said:

And finally, for those who simply just can NOT deal with AVs solo, there is a TF with no AVs at all: Dr. Quaterfield.

Also Positron I and Justin Augustine.

[EmperorSteele]

I forgot about Posi1, didn't even realize that for Justin Augustine! 

 

I kinda feel like someone should have to solo both Posi 1 AND 2 for a badge like this, but I suppose having an easy out isn't the worst thing in the world.

[TimesSeven]

I absolutely agree with this... the game celebrates it when there's an all archetype TF or a totally diverse TF, but doesn't even bother to recognize that some people can solo missions. It's insane to think that a team of MM's can just wade into a TF and kill everything onsite and they all get badges, but if ONE PERSON takes a few hours to clear a TF, they get... nothing? What sense does that make?

 

I'm all for this idea! 

[Rudra]

If you want a badge to solo each TF/SF? No. Not every AT can and not every build in the ATs that can are able to either. Whereas anyone can join a team to clear a TF/SF. Neither are those vaunted Lore pets available below level 45, not everyone can manage to get a Shivan pet from Bloody Bay with how the firebases work (because if you're too slow clearing all 8 turrets, the ones you cleared respawn), and trying to leverage START pets/powers isn't within everyone's price range, especially if in heavy use/demand.

 

However, if you just want a badge for soloing any TF or SF? Fine, I can accept that. Because then players do have access to your listed options to clear something.

[biostem]

I just feel like this is a request to get a pat on the back, especially since not all TFs/SFs are created equally...

[TimesSeven]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

If you want a badge to solo each TF/SF? No. Not every AT can and not every build in the ATs that can are able to either. Whereas anyone can join a team to clear a TF/SF. Neither are those vaunted Lore pets available below level 45, not everyone can manage to get a Shivan pet from Bloody Bay with how the firebases work (because if you're too slow clearing all 8 turrets, the ones you cleared respawn), and trying to leverage START pets/powers isn't within everyone's price range, especially if in heavy use/demand.

 

However, if you just want a badge for soloing any TF or SF? Fine, I can accept that. Because then players do have access to your listed options to clear something.

 

I can get behind that. But I also understand that not EVERY person needs to have a badge. Just because it's available doesn't mean everyone should get it. I don't team... I hate it.  Why should I miss out on the badge? Because I CAN team but choose not to? Good point. Everyone here could create a toon that could solo some "not all" of the TF's. If you don't do it because you don't like to solo, then how is that fair?

 

Again, I see you point... every TF that doesn't have an AV or could easily be soloable at +1x1 should have the option of having a badge for it. Not down for it? No problem. This is something we all can agree on... if you solo the TF, at least give bonus XP or bonus merits. Now that's fair. 

[TimesSeven]

29 minutes ago, biostem said:

I just feel like this is a request to get a pat on the back, especially since not all TFs/SFs are created equally...

I guess for some that would be the case, but every badge is a pat on the back if it doesn't do something for you. If it doesn't lead to an accolade then it literally is a pat on the back. 

 

Besides, isn't a "All archetype" badge also a pat on the back? Isn't an "all diverse team" also a pat on the back? 

Edited October 3 by TimesSeven
Additional line

[biostem]

Just now, TimesSeven said:

I guess for some that would be the case, but every badge is a pat on the back if it doesn't do something for you. If it doesn't lead to an accolade then it literally is a pat on the back. 

My main point is that it isn't specific to any TF/SF;  It doesn't really signify anything, IMHO.  I could get it on a Yin run at -1/x1 on an AT that can complete it easily, or something a lot more difficult,  At least to get "Penelope Yin's Friend", you need to complete a specific TF...

[Rudra]

10 minutes ago, TimesSeven said:

 

I can get behind that. But I also understand that not EVERY person needs to have a badge. Just because it's available doesn't mean everyone should get it. I don't team... I hate it.  Why should I miss out on the badge? Because I CAN team but choose not to? Good point. Everyone here could create a toon that could solo some "not all" of the TF's. If you don't do it because you don't like to solo, then how is that fair?

 

Again, I see you point... every TF that doesn't have an AV or could easily be soloable at +1x1 should have the option of having a badge for it. Not down for it? No problem. This is something we all can agree on... if you solo the TF, at least give bonus XP or bonus merits. Now that's fair. 

I do not agree with this. You are correct in that just because a badge exists, that doesn't mean everyone has to get it. However, I am of the firm belief that anything added to the game should be achievable by anyone playing the game with sufficient applied effort. And some things are just beyond some characters. Saying those characters can't have something the game provides though because you think they aren't good enough if they can't get it without help? That I have issues with.

 

I can take a Controller or Dominator on some missions, just regular missions, not a TF or SF, and have to call for help because the boss, not the EB or the AV, the regular boss is effectively immune to my layered mezzes and I lack the HP and damage to triumph. (Hello, Fortunata Mistresses.) Especially if they spawned at a higher level than me. (Which can happen even if you lower the difficulty to -1 depending on the mission.) That isn't a bad thing in and of itself. It means I either need to out-level the mission or call for help. (Typically, it means I have to call for help because I'm going to need multiple levels over the enemy to prevail in the provided example. Other examples, I may just need an extra level and sufficient inspirations.) Both are viable options. Now if I'm trying for a badge because that badge title suits my character concept and I can't get it because someone decided that only players playing characters that can complete that content unaided are deserving of it? I have a problem with that. If it is a team badge? Okay, I have the option of joining a team to get it even if I prefer to play solo. (I've actually joined multiple teams expressly for this purpose despite being a soloist.) If it is a solo only badge? Not even a mission or task accomplishment, but strictly a "I did this completely solo" badge? And the badge requires the solo character clear a TF or SF that the character cannot without help? Then how is that a player choice? So I have issues with it.

 

(Yes, I had issues with the Master of badges back on Live for this reason too. [Which I still got eventually, but for a long time there, there were players running around with Master of badges mocking players on their team that didn't have them. Personal experience. And those same players screamed when the Master of badges started being achieved by everyone else. They weren't the elites of the CoX world any more as proven by their badge title. And that is something I would rather stayed dead.] It is also why I am not a fan of MM only badges and similar. What if that badge is the perfect title for my Stalker? Well, too bad, so sad, your Stalker should have been a Mastermind despite that not being the character concept.)

 

So yeah, if there is to be a "I soloed this! Huzzah me!" badge for every TF/SF in the game? No, I oppose it. If it is for soloing any TF/SF though? Okay, I'm fine with it because the badge will be achievable with sufficient applied effort and the penal length comparing stays dead in the game.

[TimesSeven]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

I do not agree with this. You are correct in that just because a badge exists, that doesn't mean everyone has to get it. However, I am of the firm belief that anything added to the game should be achievable by anyone playing the game with sufficient applied effort. And some things are just beyond some characters. Saying those characters can't have something the game provides though because you think they aren't good enough if they can't get it without help? That I have issues with.

 

I can take a Controller or Dominator on some missions, just regular missions, not a TF or SF, and have to call for help because the boss, not the EB or the AV, the regular boss is effectively immune to my layered mezzes and I lack the HP and damage to triumph. (Hello, Fortunata Mistresses.) Especially if they spawned at a higher level than me. (Which can happen even if you lower the difficulty to -1 depending on the mission.) That isn't a bad thing in and of itself. It means I either need to out-level the mission or call for help. (Typically, it means I have to call for help because I'm going to need multiple levels over the enemy to prevail in the provided example. Other examples, I may just need an extra level and sufficient inspirations.) Both are viable options. Now if I'm trying for a badge because that badge title suits my character concept and I can't get it because someone decided that only players playing characters that can complete that content unaided are deserving of it? I have a problem with that. If it is a team badge? Okay, I have the option of joining a team to get it even if I prefer to play solo. (I've actually joined multiple teams expressly for this purpose despite being a soloist.) If it is a solo only badge? Not even a mission or task accomplishment, but strictly a "I did this completely solo" badge? And the badge requires the solo character clear a TF or SF that the character cannot without help? Then how is that a player choice? So I have issues with it.

 

(Yes, I had issues with the Master of badges back on Live for this reason too. [Which I still got eventually, but for a long time there, there were players running around with Master of badges mocking players on their team that didn't have them. Personal experience. And those same players screamed when the Master of badges started being achieved by everyone else. They weren't the elites of the CoX world any more as proven by their badge title. And that is something I would rather stayed dead.] It is also why I am not a fan of MM only badges and similar. What if that badge is the perfect title for my Stalker? Well, too bad, so sad, your Stalker should have been a Mastermind despite that not being the character concept.)

 

So yeah, if there is to be a "I soloed this! Huzzah me!" badge for every TF/SF in the game? No, I oppose it. If it is for soloing any TF/SF though? Okay, I'm fine with it because the badge will be achievable with sufficient applied effort and the penal length comparing stays dead in the game.

 

Well, again I can see your point of view, it's just a shame you can't see mine. 

 

At least there should be SOME reward for soloing missions other than "great, you just did Time's Arrow in four hours and it takes a team thirty minutes to do the same thing." Increase merits, increased XP.... something other than --- NOTHING. 

[Greycat]

4 hours ago, Rudra said:

not everyone can manage to get a Shivan pet from Bloody Bay with how the firebases work (because if you're too slow clearing all 8 turrets, the ones you cleared respawn),

 

 

... actually, yeah, everyone CAN if they know how the respawns work.

 

1. Find a firebase with nothing but minion and lt turrets (low level dual and quads, no boss missile turrets.)

2. Take *all* of them down to  a sliver of health. (If you're low damage, the hardest is probably the MG turrets in the middle, actually, because you get fired on from at least three sides.)

3. Defeat ONE outer turret, preferrably one of the weakest ones (dual gun.)

4. Wait for that *one* to respawn. You now have the full 5 minute timer to take it, plus all the weakened ones (they don't respawn or regen) out.

 

Been able to do this with at-level (15) low damage characters since live. Given there's almost no chance of anyone actually attacking you in the PVP zones with how dead they are now, usually the biggest threat is whatever NPC is around.

[Rudra]

10 minutes ago, Greycat said:

 

... actually, yeah, everyone CAN if they know how the respawns work.

 

1. Find a firebase with nothing but minion and lt turrets (low level dual and quads, no boss missile turrets.)

2. Take *all* of them down to  a sliver of health. (If you're low damage, the hardest is probably the MG turrets in the middle, actually, because you get fired on from at least three sides.)

3. Defeat ONE outer turret, preferrably one of the weakest ones (dual gun.)

4. Wait for that *one* to respawn. You now have the full 5 minute timer to take it, plus all the weakened ones (they don't respawn or regen) out.

 

Been able to do this with at-level (15) low damage characters since live. Given there's almost no chance of anyone actually attacking you in the PVP zones with how dead they are now, usually the biggest threat is whatever NPC is around.

Tried that. Most times, every firebase had at least 1 boss turret. And even taking the approach of weakening every turret to near dead and then trying to blitz them, which I was successful at, by the time I reached the computer inside, it told me I had to clear the base defenses first to use it. Tried that 3 times, always taking the approach of getting all eight turrets as low on health as I dared to avoid accidentally killing them, wiping them out post-haste starting with the missile turret because it took the longest to kill, racing inside, and getting told again that I had to clear the base defenses. There was no way that was a 5 minute respawn time. (I completed it at the time because a PvP'er came by, was not a villain, and lent me a hand.) (Edit: Hells, even with the Blaster helping me, it took us another 3 tries to get to the computer and not be told we still had to clear the base defenses.) (Edit again: It may have actually only taken 2 tries with the Blaster, but it definitely took more than 1.)

 

Admittedly, this happened back on Live, but still, unless the turret respawn times have been adjusted to be longer by HC, some builds cannot solo clear the Bloody Bay firebases.

 

Edited October 3 by Rudra

[Greycat]

Right, you found them with a boss turret. They don't all spawn with that. And yeah, it's a 5 minute respawn time - even on live. You do sometimes have to "base shop" for where to do this. But this was a normal stop for me on a character hitting 15, and I made plenty of controllers and defenders.

[Rudra]

Except I did base shop. All the bases had bosses. So I chose the 1 that had just the 1 boss. (And I was on a flying Scrapper at the time.)

 

(Edit: I swear we've had this discussion before....)

 

Edited October 3 by Rudra

[TimesSeven]

On 8/18/2024 at 1:01 PM, EmperorSteele said:

  Hide contents

Merit Bonus (reward): Due to the extra time and effort needed, completing a TF solo would yield an extra +50% reward merits (would only apply if you were solo the entire time; no kicking your team when the final boss is at 5% health =P). Does NOT stack with WST rewards (still want to encourage teamwork for those)!

Aether Bonus (reward): If soloing an Advanced Mode TF, gain +50% additional Aether upon completion (again, only counts if you're solo the entire time)

Vanguard Merit Bonus (reward): +100 vanguard merits for completing the Lady Grey Task Force solo (in addition to above rewards where applicable).

Introverted (Badge + 1 time reward): Complete 5 different TFs Solo; gain an additional 100 Reward merits, and 10 Prismatic Aether.

This is what the original poster put up and it's a very doable idea. Maybe instead of five, you make it three solo TF's grant you a badge. There are DEFINITELY  three TF's just about any toon could solo with enough time and patience. Even on my best toon, I couldn't solo the LGTF, but I normally play +4x8 so that could be the culprit and it does have a heavy Psychic AV on the front end. That might stop most in their tracks right there.  But Quarterfield, Justin, and Posi 1 don't have any AVs and could be readily soloed. I like that idea of the Introverted Badge for that.  Now you've got a badge that almost any toon could get. 

 

And I like the idea of extra Aethers or Merits for the tougher ones as well. No badges:? Fine. Just give us something for being able to do the hard work. 
 

 

[Greycat]

52 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Except I did base shop. All the bases had bosses. So I chose the 1 that had just the 1 boss. (And I was on a flying Scrapper at the time.)

 

(Edit: I swear we've had this discussion before....)

 

 

maybe?

 

And I've almost never seen that happen. I *have* seen it, but it's exceptionally rare for them all to have boss turrets.

[TimesSeven]

22 hours ago, biostem said:

My main point is that it isn't specific to any TF/SF;  It doesn't really signify anything, IMHO.  I could get it on a Yin run at -1/x1 on an AT that can complete it easily, or something a lot more difficult,  At least to get "Penelope Yin's Friend", you need to complete a specific TF...

 

We literally have badges for people who can ski down a ski slope in under a minute. THAT's the most worthless badge in the game, but I'm not seeing any protests against having it.  

 

It's just a badge, I really don't see why everyone is so up in arms about it. If you don't have a toon that can get the badge, then you don't get the badge. I HATE PUG groups, so I accept the fact that I can't get some of the badges in the game. I HATE pvp, so I accept the fact that I can't get those badges. 

 

I don't see anyone here protesting PVP or arena badges.

[biostem]

2 hours ago, TimesSeven said:

It's just a badge, I really don't see why everyone is so up in arms about it.

Then propose a different solo badge for each TF/SF, not a universal one that doesn't differentiate between them...

[Rudra]

8 minutes ago, biostem said:

2 hours ago, TimesSeven said:

It's just a badge, I really don't see why everyone is so up in arms about it.

Then propose a different solo badge for each TF/SF, not a universal one that doesn't differentiate between them...

You and I are in complete disagreement over this. Reasons given above. I can accept a single badge for soloing any TF or SF, but not specific badges for each.

[Frostbiter]

I see it like Hard Mode badges. Are they for everyone? You could argue that they are but I'll never see them because I don't group. I'm not going to argue that they shouldn't exist because some players will never see them. I can however run TFs solo. That is an accomplishment and rewarding an accomplishment with a badge doesn't mean someone else lost out.

[Rudra]

52 minutes ago, Frostbiter said:

I see it like Hard Mode badges. Are they for everyone? You could argue that they are but I'll never see them because I don't group.

That is a choice you have. You can always choose to join an Advanced Mode team and get the badges, you can't choose to temporarily change your AT to be able to solo TFs/SFs.

 

Edit: It's just like the PvP badges. You don't PvP so you can't get them? Wrong. You can choose to PvP until you get them, and then stop PvP'ing. That is a choice. However, badges that are keyed to specific ATs? Are a problem in my book. Because that takes away player agency, now in order to get that badge, they have to limit their character concept to get it. Badges for soloing things not every AT can solo? Just as bad. That limits player's choices if they want that badge. (As well as gives a reason for the toxic attitudes/behaviors I witnessed back on Live with Master of badges until everyone started getting them.)

 

Edited October 4 by Rudra

[TimesSeven]

On 10/3/2024 at 9:55 PM, Rudra said:

That is a choice you have. You can always choose to join an Advanced Mode team and get the badges, you can't choose to temporarily change your AT to be able to solo TFs/SFs.

 

Edit: It's just like the PvP badges. You don't PvP so you can't get them? Wrong. You can choose to PvP until you get them, and then stop PvP'ing. That is a choice. However, badges that are keyed to specific ATs? Are a problem in my book. Because that takes away player agency, now in order to get that badge, they have to limit their character concept to get it. Badges for soloing things not every AT can solo? Just as bad. That limits player's choices if they want that badge. (As well as gives a reason for the toxic attitudes/behaviors I witnessed back on Live with Master of badges until everyone started getting them.)

 

 

I'll say this and then I'll stop beating this dead horse.... not every AT can PVP. Sure you could try it, but you'll lose horribly to stalkers, brutes, tanks...etc. Again, by setting PvP badges, you are rewarding AT's that can do it successfully. That is literally NO DIFFERENT than a solo badge. With all of the Lore pets, purchasable pets, START abilities... etc, most people can solo AV's at -1/x1. It's a question of it they want to. 

 

Compromise point: Dr. Quarterfield should at LEAST have a solo badge option. AT LEAST. Any TF/SF that doesn't have an AV or independently scalable NPCs, can be won by most AT's. Hell, I can solo Times Arrow/Imperious -- and that's not impressive to anyone reading this. 

 

Again, I'm done arguing the point, because this is  starting to sound like "woke" participation trophy nonsense... "If everyone running the race can't have a trophy, then trophies shouldn't exist."  I would like this as an options for the reasons stated above... the game favors teamwork above soloing and that is clearly evident. If you don't agree with me, well... that's on you.  PS: I'm not even the one who started this topic, yet I'm the one getting the heat. SMH

Edited October 6 by TimesSeven
spelling error

[Rudra]

1 hour ago, TimesSeven said:

I'll say this and then I'll stop beating this dead horse.... not every AT can PVP. Sure you could try it, but you'll lose horribly to stalkers, brutes, tanks...etc. Again, by setting PvP badges, you are rewarding AT's that can do it successfully. That is literally NO DIFFERENT than a solo badge.

And yet players that suck at PvP like me get PvP badges. All it takes is someone willing to work with you or an alt account. So yes, anyone can get the PvP badges. Not all of them, but the ones that can't I've heard are broken and even PvP'ers have difficulty getting them even when they meet the victory conditions to. (The Swiss Draw one I believe has that issue.) So again, with sufficient effort, even someone that sucks at PvP can get PvP badges.

 

1 hour ago, TimesSeven said:

Again, I'm done arguing the point, because this is  starting to sound like "woke" participation trophy nonsense... "If everyone running the race can't have a trophy, then trophies shouldn't exist." 

The difference, is, and I'm against participation trophies too, is that participation trophies are being handed out for competitions and the OP is requesting a "I done good!" reward for doing stuff alone. Where the TF/SF already has its rewards and the solo player that is clearing it is already getting the TF's/SF's rewards without having to gather a team to do so. So at least to me, the OP is all about being able to boast, and it was that being able to boast back on Live before the Master of badges were finally figured out enough that it didn't take specific character and team builds to accomplish them that enabled players to belittle team members that lacked those badges. (I was even kicked off a non-Master run LRSF because I lacked the badge, the rest of the team had it, and so felt I was going to get in their way. Again, on a non-Master run. Just a regular SF run. So the last thing I want to ever rear its ugly head in this game again is an opportunity for people to go around comparing e-peen sizes and mocking others for it.)