page 3 [FOCUSED FEEDBACK] Super Strength Adjustments

[Captain Citadel]

3 minutes ago, lemming said:

I think there are definitely some people that liked Unleashed Might and just stayed out of the Rage argument because we preferred a non-crash toggle.

Been putting off a respec on my regen/ss tanker since I figured it would be better to incorporate UM, instead of redoing it now and then doing it again. bleh.

Yeah, this was me. I was so excited for UM and was just trying to decide if I wanted Absolute Amazement or Apocalypse in Hand Clap. Had a brand-new new build all worked out with 80% or better resistances, softcapped typed defense and melee defense. Would've been nice to be able to build without the Fighting pool, but that's only because the SS changes made it so I no longer had a gap in my rotation, with Foot Stomp and Hand Clap having shorter base CDs.

I'm literally demotivated to play at this point. Went from huge excitement to negative interest in the span of a couple days.

[OverkillEngine]

9 minutes ago, Captain Citadel said:

Yeah, this was me. I was so excited for UM and was just trying to decide if I wanted Absolute Amazement or Apocalypse in Hand Clap. Had a brand-new new build all worked out with 80% or better resistances, softcapped typed defense and melee defense. Would've been nice to be able to build without the Fighting pool, but that's only because the SS changes made it so I no longer had a gap in my rotation, with Foot Stomp and Hand Clap having shorter base CDs.

I'm literally demotivated to play at this point. Went from huge excitement to negative interest in the span of a couple days.

Yeah this is one of the design benchmarks that needs to be met with any Rage+SS rework.

Floor: In set attacks need to be good enough that pool attacks are not superior or necessary picks regardless of if Rage is up or not. Crash cannot be made equitable or fun, thus crash needs to go.

 

Ceiling: Rage effect needs to be equitable without weird selective effects that would invalidate pool powers as picks as well.

Edited Saturday at 06:10 AM by OverkillEngine

[flakoff]

6 hours ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

Do you think maybe that's why they're so upset over a minor penalty that can be cured by a single tier 1 inspiration? Because you can't use that inspiration if you're AFK?

 

That makes more sense than anything else I can think of. Man, I hope that you're wrong. I hope that the devs aren't taking the opinions of AFK farmers into account when balancing powers.

I personally don't afk farm, but still thought the new proposed crash was too much.

But let's not keep turning feedback threads into places where you're wrong we're right.

We all have different opinions,  no good blaming a certain group of people. 

Nobody here is better than anyone else.

[Indystruck]

9 minutes ago, Captain Citadel said:

Yeah, this was me. I was so excited for UM and was just trying to decide if I wanted Absolute Amazement or Apocalypse in Hand Clap. Had a brand-new new build all worked out with 80% or better resistances, softcapped typed defense and melee defense. Would've been nice to be able to build without the Fighting pool, but that's only because the SS changes made it so I no longer had a gap in my rotation, with Foot Stomp and Hand Clap having shorter base CDs.

I'm literally demotivated to play at this point. Went from huge excitement to negative interest in the span of a couple days.

 

Well, not Absolute Amazement as the changes were going, cause the stun was set to replace and not stack. So if it maintained the same stun duration (I didn't see that being altered in notes, just that it lacked a chance for 1 additional mag in UM form) it's essentially perma-stun effect if you put one generic level 25 stun IO in it.

[Erratic1]

Seems the only contentious issue was the actual change to Rage (to the extent it was actually contentious...most people had decided if they were keeping Rage or swapping to UM). Make the change, if it turns out to be too much, roll them back later. If they are not too much then done.

[Eirei07]

Oh gosh, two whole pages since the rollback. Ah well, closing thoughts:

 

I made my opinion on UM clear very early on. I thought it was good. Maybe a bit too good on Brutes, but that's a future patch problem. But it's a move to the right direction in addressing an inherent issue on SS, being the low in-set base damages. Making Hand Clap better overall was a good move too, but no explanation given as to why it was exclusive to UM was questionable and a bit ill-advised, imo.

 

I understand why the Rage change was pulled, but puzzled as to why UM was pulled as well. It had an almost universal positive feedback going for it. If anything, it is looking to be a mistake to roll it back this far into the open beta. Perhaps the dev team should reconsider?

 

There will be future updates, surely. So the devs can always give it another go at addressing just Rage alone in the future.

 

Though. Thankfully other people had called out the bs blame game going on regarding the wholesale rollback, so I don't feel like I have to address it.

Edited Saturday at 07:09 AM by Eirei07

[Wavicle]

I don’t think we’re terribly far into open beta.

[Troo]

16 minutes ago, Erratic1 said:

Seems the only contentious issue was the actual change to Rage

 

Sure if we ignore that lagging powers in the set were improved but only if a player selected Unleashed Might; and that Unleashed Might often outperformed Rage which flips the paradigm between toggles and clicks (don't even have to include a crash).

 

I like Unleashed Might as a concept but it's current implementation would result in Rage having to be boosted in order to just maintain the status quo. The numbers need some polish.

 

Folks pointing to how much better they did with Unleashed Might as a light endurance toggle is/was actually problematic.

(folks who wanna blame someone could just as easily look to the white-knighters as well as the anti-crashers or however we are grouping sides on this one)

 

Forcing respecs and having to adopt new play styles to just end up back at average.. that's not very super.

[Troo]

Wanna be helpful at this point? Maybe say what we did like.

 

For me:

• Hurl was an interesting change that added some flavor (in a good way).
• A toggle boost instead of Rage or Build Up has definitely shown it could work as a mutually exclusive option.
• It's exciting to see Hand Clap as something the powers team is willing to explore.
• Seeing scale damage numbers adjusted up (anywhere) seems to acknowledge Jab, Punch, Haymaker as being inferior to other options available with those power picks.
  • (I'm really trying)
• Foot Stomp not getting revamped was pretty awesome.

[Signalrunner]

7 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

I understand it completely. You've proven time and again that you don't. And you keep bringing up my slotting of Followup like it's some cardinal sin to choose set bonuses over procs like I'm the devil that I am. Hail fucking Satan.

 

I'm curious, have you tested DPS between both methods of slotting?

[Shin Magmus]

10 hours ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

Do you think maybe that's why they're so upset over a minor penalty that can be cured by a single tier 1 inspiration? Because you can't use that inspiration if you're AFK?

 

That makes more sense than anything else I can think of. Man, I hope that you're wrong. I hope that the devs aren't taking the opinions of AFK farmers into account when balancing powers.

   The fact that anyone here is making disingenuous factually wrong claims like this, ignoring the fact that if someone were AFK farming they:

1: Couldn't even click Rage at all because their Auto power would be Foot Stomp

2: SHOULD be using Spines or Rad Melee for the extra passive impact of a damage aura

3: Would be picking a commonly-known mid-tier set in Super Strength that hasn't been relevant in AE farming at all for a decade

   ...is insane to me.  This kind of easily-refuted nonsense is why nobody takes the forums seriously.  I'm not attacking you, just your incredibly bad "argument."

 

   UNLEASHED MIGHT WOULD BE A BUFF TO SUPER STRENGTH AFK FARMERS.

Edited Saturday at 10:31 AM by Shin Magmus
Are you guys serious?

[Rand0lk]

Thanks to all the rivers of crying and floods of delusional babbling everything is rolled back to the previous, uninspired, boring version of SS.

Well done, folks. You never cease to amaze me.

[Faultline]

Since the changes were reverted, I am closing this thread. Please read my post on the topic here: 

 

[Player-1]

Just a reminder, this has only been rolled back until the next patch.

 

I am taking some time to evaluate the feedback to come back with a better total package for Super Strength.