Enabling old school PhysX support?

[Zep]

It used to work with Nvidia Phys-x. I am betting it is an NV API/coding change.

 

I noticed that the COH client no longer detects the physics as being available.

 

Anyone know a way to force the physics on? Maybe it will work with the current NV API it just doesn't see it there?

[The Fifth Horseman]

Would an actual PhysX card work today? They're not old enough or weird enough to be collectable, so you can get them super cheap.

(would totally buy an actual PPU if it would work, though. Those things are literally only like $15 nowadays)

I hate repeating myself, but here you go:

Getting Ageia's hardware is a non-solution unless you've got an old rig running XP or Vista on hand - the last official driver for it was released in 2008 ( 8.09.04 ) and only supported those systems.

It used to work with Nvidia Phys-x. I am betting it is an NV API/coding change.

I noticed that the COH client no longer detects the physics as being available.

Anyone know a way to force the physics on? Maybe it will work with the current NV API it just doesn't see it there?

We've all tried a bunch of things with no apparent result. OuroDev might replace the old PhysX SDK with a newer version eventually, but far as I understand they're not under any hurry to do so.

[Prototelis]

Michael Cullen has managed to add physX support back into the game for I-24

 

The commit is here https://git.ourodev.com/CoX/Source/pulls/54

 

Link to the ORO page with the commit is here;

 

https://ourowiki.ouro-comdev.com/index.php?title=Magnet_Links

 

With a little homecoming team attention/review and a small patch I think this could be a thing again.

 

Edit; I'm getting ready to try this with a compiled I25 exe with the changes. I'll post up here in a bit if it works.

[Prototelis]

Okay. It worked for me :)

 

Unfortunately sometime during the games life it seems like they nerfed the effects a little. There isn't a ton of debri floating around, but atleast you can now throw trash at people :)

[Prototelis]

Sorry for triple post.

 

Hybrid PhysX works with Michael's patch and modified EXE.

 

One thing I did notice is that it breaks the badge display though, but that's only on homecoming.

[The Fifth Horseman]

I'm not sure if the codebase Homecoming is working from is or is not identical to what OuroDev has in their repository. If it's not, then issues like you describe are to be expected.

[jubakumbi]

I'm not sure if the codebase Homecoming is working from is or is not identical to what OuroDev has in their repository. If it's not, then issues like you describe are to be expected.

 

All expected.

 

Many of us are hopeful 'mods' and 'fixes' of this nature will be picked up by the 'masses'.

 

:)

[Prototelis]

I'm not sure if the codebase Homecoming is working from is or is not identical to what OuroDev has in their repository. If it's not, then issues like you describe are to be expected.

 

Well, they're working from SCORE, which as far as I am aware has had the sources released. If Leandro sees this he can maybe comment on that.

 

As far as sources, I understand that SCORE is based in I24. The source for that is definitely out in the open. I think the developers for homecoming made some changes, and thats why the custom SCORE exe breaks a couple of small things. I tested it for a few hours, even did a rikti raid with it, and the badge display was the only bug I found.

 

Either way, the work is being documented and I have hope that it could be implemented here.

 

Michael has continued to do work on PhysX over the last couple of days (has persistent shotgun shells working!), and I can confirm that atleast with the current iteration of changes all you need is a Nvidia card in your configuration for it to work.

[Prototelis]

https://streamable.com/99nvy

 

A short video of working PhysX, and the primary issue at the moment. :) This is Michael's work and video.

 

LOOK AT ALL THAT DEBRI Y'ALL!

[khy]

That's a good start, I'm wondering how is this being done - finding an old Ageia card and using it with a new version of Windows? Using an old card with an old version of windows? Somehow figuring out how to enable the feature without having the appropriate card?

 

God looking at that debris makes me want to turn on Hurricane and watch it spin around like a washing machine...

[Prototelis]

From what I understand he is using a modified version of the EXE file that points to a more modern version of the physX dlls.

 

Client source code leaked a while ago, and thats how this was accomplished.

[khy]

I would be OK with a bit of wonky physics if it meant having at least SOME entertaining debris issues. Where can I find more info about this Michael guy and his work on it?

[Zep]

Any thoughts how we can get/use the modified client?

[Prototelis]

I would be OK with a bit of wonky physics if it meant having at least SOME entertaining debris issues. Where can I find more info about this Michael guy and his work on it?

 

He sometimes posts in the ourodev discord.

[Zep]

Um.....

 

I dont know enough on the topic to know but here goes.....

 

Could we get the newer, correct, .dll files, rename them and replace the incorrect ones? I am guessing it is more complicated then that, but....

[khy]

Okay, here's the info I have obtained from the Ouroboros Discord :

 

If you use Tequila to download CoH for the Rebirth or Ouro QA server, it'll come with the Ouroboros.exe file. That file is a version of the CoH executable that contains updated PhysX SDK so that the physics works with those. You can rename the file and play on other private servers.

 

I've been told, however, that it won't work with Homecoming due to being different source code. So until the Homecoming team updates the client themselves (or releases their source for someone else to update it for them), we're unable to play with the Physics enabled on newer graphics cards on the servers.

 

I'm not well-versed enough with programming to be able to say how easy or difficult doing such an update to the Homecoming client would be, nor do I have any information as to the priorities of the Homecoming dev team so I can't say if it's something they care to do or if there's other things they have a higher priority on. Personally I REALLY hope that the homecoming dev teams can take a look at this fairly quickly and get it enabled, but that's just my opinion. I have no idea how many players out there care or don't care about the physics, so it's somewhat hard to gauge if it's something the community as a whole really cares for.

[Zep]

There is a response to PhysX in the latest update thread. They are working on staying compatible with everyone for now and when a new launcher is out that supports separate .dll/clients per server they will update. 

[khy]

I saw the announcement but since it didn't say a word about Physics in it, I didn't go too deep into the thread. I found Leandro's post regarding the DLL files and whatnot on page 4 and it does make sense... but I am impatient, so I may have to simply make a second install just for playing around with those features.

[Sundodge]

I don't know how I'd forgotten about this.  I remember Assault Rifle with this  ;D  I hope we see this in the future on Homecoming somehow.

[Midgar]

I have an Nvidia Titan XP and a 1070 GTX dedicated to PhysX. I havent seen any of the old effects, I think only the people managing the server would be able to re-enable this. I dont think it can be done on our end.

[Klaleara]

I remember having that Phys-x card, and boy was that a blast.  One of most pointless and coolest physics implementations I've EVER seen in a game.

[Erydanus]

https://streamable.com/99nvy

 

A short video of working PhysX, and the primary issue at the moment. :) This is Michael's work and video.

 

LOOK AT ALL THAT DEBRI Y'ALL!

Those graphics look better than mine and I started with my card on the regular Ultra settings and then pushed everything that could go higher, higher. Do you think they have some extra HQ textures there too or what?

[WanderingAries]

I don't feel like finding the thread (may even be on Titan) I read on this yesterday, but Leandro basic states that (1) it's not needed; (2) even if it WAS attempted it would break the game and/or require a complete rewrite (aka: not happening).

[justicebeliever]

I hear that PhysX has been fixed elsewhere, any word when the fix will make it hear?

 

I'm going to address this because it keeps being brought up, and it is intentionally not being "fixed" right now.

 

Reason #1: if you bump your Particle Physics to "Very High", you get the same amount of particle physics as if you had a PhysX card. This happens on the CPU, not the GPU, but for modern computers this barely registers.

 

Reason #2: the "fix" involves upgrading the PhysX libraries (the DLLs in your game folder) to a newer version. So if we do that we are no longer compatible with the libraries shipped with Issue 24 Beta. This is a problem because it breaks the original client, as well as the client of any server that doesn't implement this "fix". It's a really bad idea to mess with the DLLs as long as multiple servers are sharing a COH install.

 

A similar problem would happen if we were to enable the error reporting DLL (crashrpt.dll) in order to collect crash logs; as soon as we put that DLL in there, we start getting crash reports from every server, not just Homecoming. Bad idea.

 

The solution is the Sunrise patcher, which will keep server-specific files on their own folders. At that point we can certainly start upgrading DLLs and adding our own features. But as long as all the servers are sharing a COH install folder, messing with the DLLs is irresponsible at best, malicious at worst.

[khy]

I don't feel like finding the thread (may even be on Titan) I read on this yesterday, but Leandro basic states that (1) it's not needed; (2) even if it WAS attempted it would break the game and/or require a complete rewrite (aka: not happening).

 

Not quite! Here's the post you mention.

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/index.php/topic,2875.msg19393.html#msg19393

 

What he says is that changing DLL files would break the i24 Beta client, which is used by other servers. The 'sunrise patcher' he mentions will allow different servers to use different files - IE, homecoming could use certain files while Rebirth would use different ones. That would allow one server to use different DLL files than another without breaking either one.

 

As for it not being needed... it's slightly more in-depth than that. First, yes, physics is entirely optional. Without the physics and debris stuff, the game runs fine and players can play. And I'm absolutely THRILLED about that, don't get me wrong! I love the work that the Homecoming team has done, and I'm super grateful for all the effort they put into for us. And yes, a modern CPU will have no trouble at all handling the physics when you set it to very high.

 

But that said, even if you DO set the physics to very high (Which affects capes, objects summoned by Propel, and other objects in the world), it doesn't enable the extra debris we can see in this video : https://streamable.com/99nvy

 

Enabling extra debris, leaves, spent shell casings, and all the other features are what needs updated physics DLL files. Is it necessary to have that extra debris? Not at all. Is it cool to have all the extra objects? ABSOLUTELY. Watching them get blasted back by explosions, picked up by gravity powers, swirling around hurricane and things like that all make the already-amazing game that much better.

 

I'm happy that Leandro says they'll look into new features and stuff later on; it's great to see continued support. I hope that once the capability to enable Physics like we used to have, that the team can put it in without much hassle.