Super Atom

I think increasing the knockback as (most) sets are now in any shape is a mistake. For every person who does do the correct thing and change their AOE/Cone to KD theres a lot who don't. Making an already hot issue worse is unwise.

so like champions teleport? champions had a cool teleport. I mean, it was like fly + phase shift but still.

I'm fine with that, you can only explain why knockback is more a negative than a positive so many times before you become a jaded self righteous jerk.

This seems to imply you want stronger knock back on already undesirable sets. This would probably be a bad thing. Knock back is a negative effect way more then it's a positive effect. Gonna have to be a strong no in my opinion. What i would like to see, and if done i wouldn't mind your suggestion, is things like energy blast that have knock back to be given a damage increase to reflect their negative modifier. While It's true you could just KB>KD the set, that's 9 slots used just to achieve it. Some things wouldn't need an increase in stat like Hurricane/Force bubble, but energy blast and gale for example should be beefed up to reflect their knockback. Before anyone freaks out, I love energy blast. It just doesn't do the best damage while also having to deal with knock back.

If you can't explain what you mean by effectively then don't toot your own horn about how cool you are.

I don't need to play with you to understand how knockback works. Even if you position yourself very specifically in every mob to use knockback "effectively" which again, could literally only mean knocking runners back into teams, you've now become extremely useless because you could have just been doing damage or applying a actually useful form of CC. Trying to use knockback effectively is just leeching with extra steps. If you'd like to explain what you mean by "Effectively" by all means go on

It's a relic of a coh that doesn't exist anymore. Don't pretend you're helping. Knocking enemies out of AOE's and breaking up mobs does nothing but slow it down. Even -if- you were using it to knock one or two runners back twords the mob, it'd still be better to just kill them. Every second you spend chasing runners to knock them back to mobs is seconds you don't spend just killing it. Stop pretending knockback isn't a negative and shouting at every post that tries to address it even in the slightest.

fixed it for you

oh nice, didn't know heroes even had one. makes sense they would but lol

So you want the villain contact who lets you do all of them but for heroes

It's also important to note, It's a rule of thumb and not a law. It isn't the end all be all of balance nor is it a fundamental principal of this game. It was a comment made by a developer and not even a lead developer.

You're misusing his words to push your own narrative. That Quote is used in reference to changes posted because they're experimental and not final. It has nothing to do with him acknowledging Tier 9's need to be discussed.

Don't misquote people to get last word, it's petty and makes you look stupid. Naturally, experimental changes would be subject to change. In specific, he was saying the tier 9's were an entire conversation on their own and not related to current changes.

Certainly, but even so it's a kind of impossible task. What exactly do we do to reconize them? Balancing around specific choices is extremely difficult. Some people PvP slot even in PvE by over use of proc. Some people go for recharge, some for defense, some for resistance. etc etc. How do you choose which direction to balance for without forcing a more specific meta than there already is. Leadership/fighting/leaping etc. I think the easier solution is creating new content that is balanced around people having IO's than to readjust anything else. To further on that, DA arcs were a good start. We can go further, incarnate malta where the sappers turn off your incarnate abilities for example. Theres a lot we can do with enemy groups without risking re balancing of stats. I think the battalion and the real rikti were going to be this content.

The cottage rule has its own out written into it. It's literally dev discretion and can be broken if the circumstances are right and in the case of Tier 9's they're more than right.

Tier 9's are bad. Get over yourself. on a side note, powerhouse already addressed Tier 9's in the tank feedback threads. I don't remember his exact quote but it was along the lines of "A discussion for another time". So to double down, the paragon devs knew it and the HC devs know it.

Nope. T9's are bad(except meltdown/bio), even the paragon devs knew this and planned a big overhaul of them because of it. Opinions are cool to have and often come into effect in terms of whats fun in this game and what isn't. For example, I don't find Titan Weapons to be fun. This is an opinion. Titan Weapons is over preforming. This is a fact. See the difference?

Except that's all people do on these forums. They bring up cottage rule anytime someone wants to fix shitty powers. Example, your initial post about cottage rule. Anytime someone thinks they're being personally attacked because a power they enjoy/like is up for debate they immediately and without fail bring up cottage rule and usually incorrectly so.

Cottage rule at its core is a giant exaggeration. What if build up summoned hamidon?! no duh that's a dumb idea. However over the years its been corrupted to mean "This power can't be changed to fit in modern coh because thats how it was in issue 01!11!!1!".

Fundamentally, i agree with you. Most T9's aren't good regardless of where the game is balanced. The only thing i don't agree with you on is the idea of moving balance away from SO's. It's not that some dev said something 10 years ago, that would be the cottage rule, It's that the game would need a dramatic overhaul something the current devs are unequipped to do, to re balance around IO sets. Not only stats but how you got IO's would need to be changed because even this private market that is partially seeded still is having a lot of IO's be 0 available or they're over priced due to converters. City of Heroes like i said, has always been an easy MMO and more importantly an accessible MMO. A large part of the player base wouldn't know how to min/max a build to reach the heights you're suggesting they rebalance to. Imagine a casual based mmo that for its entire existance was easy to get into it and easy to be helpful in suddenly needed a icy veins. You're not just asking for difficulty at this point, you're asking them to remake an MMO.

no

I don't want to quote you a hundred times mainly because im lazy So, you're kind of doing this whole slippery slope thing by saying "Well we might as well do x because of y" and just completely missing the point of why x was done in the first place. City of Heroes was never a hardcore game and likely never will be. They tried to offer us more challenge with +4/x8 but most people who invest in IO's can solo through it (Funny how progression works). I'm very opposed to changing the entire games balance just to factor in IOs. You should always keep IO's in mind when balancing stuff but it should never be the focus. Rather than nerfing everything to need IO's, under preforming sets should brought up to speed and other options for difficulty should be explored, see +5/6, see newer enemies entirely. Keeping city of heroes alt friendly and casual player friendly will benefit it far more than trying to appease those of us who have 0 challenge in the game, again not to say that shouldn't be addressed through other means. also i don't really wanna do the whole "no u" back and forth thing and derail this thread too much, if you disagree cool everyone's got their own ideas man.

That has nothing to do with IO's and a lot more to do with set design. Specifically in that a lot of modern sets were seemingly just better version of older sets meant for a modern coh and they didn't want to change the older ones so cottage nerds don't get pissy and cry. Kin > energy melee Savage > Claws Titan weapons > everything etc etc Also, you can't really balance sets around IO's. Sure they're easier to get now but to expect everyone to fully IO every alt just to be helpful in a team situation is asking a lot, more so back on live where good builds costed in the billions not hundred millions like now.

Meltdown and Bio armor are perfect examples of good t9 powers. While Meltdown is less useful on tankers, it still gives enough bonuses to warrant taking. The biggest problem with T9 is the crashes, similar to why rage is good on paper and bad in practice. We've known for a long time the paragon devs had plans to fix this but it's never gonna be as simple as adjusting values.

Right? Even if you hated him putting him back in means you get to beat him up. This is a win/win for everyone.