Ukase

The math tells me that spending another 50-80k on rare salvage, above what I deem "the fair price" of 500k isn't going to hurt me that much. But my brain tells me that if I buy that salvage, I am taking influence out of my stack and adding it to someone else's stack. If I knew, with 100% certainty that the someone else wasn't the player(s) that seems to be gobbling up all the rare salvage and relisting it at a higher price, I'd be okay with it. Really. But, I don't know - and since I do not with to arm this mercenary marketer with my influence, I have been thinking about how to quench my desire for the rare salvage. I thought: Do AE for tickets. It literally only takes a minute or so to get the ticket cap, because the ticket cap is so low. It takes about 2 sets of 5 asteroid maps to cap a character with AE tickets. The dilemma is while I can exchange the 10K ticket cap for 18 pieces of rare salvage, even at a million each, that would only give me 18 million. I could run that same farm for standard xp and drops, potentially get a few rares, purples, etc. and those drops would certainly bring in more than 18M. A lot more. Probably 4x or 5x, depending on what dropped, of course. But then - if I'm to craft the lower tier recipes that require the lower tier salvage (level 1-24), I'd have to fork over the inf for that salvage. That does a couple of things. It would satisfy some of the bids that this mercernary marketeer would have, potentially allowing others to buy more reasonably priced salvage. But, we all know this Merc is just going to relist my reasonably priced salvage at a higher price. I think that just adds fuel to their fire. So, I am saying screw the math! I'm now farming for tickets to grab the lower tier rares, costing myself millions just so I don't have to pay this merc. It's certainly faster than crafting and converting. And it does save me some time, and some converters. But, I wonder...what if I made a farm, specifically for my fire/fire tank that has burn at level 18, and can run the map at level 21, and fight the npcs at -1/8? And do that for standard drops. I would think that the dreck map would give a fair amount of rares, uncommons, maybe even some decent recipes. It may be counterproductive, but I can't condone spending over 500k for a rare salvage. That path leads to madness. Just as an FYI, I have a number of bids in for the rare salvage at 500k. They haven't filled in weeks. This Merc has held me hostage for the last minute!

I am very often both. Too often.

"Forum Warfare"....a new alt name? This sentence has me confused. I mean, if it's literally a war, then yeah. Accurate enough. But this forum isn't a battlefield. If this forum's purpose isn't to literally teach and/or learn, why do you think it's here? Sure - in some cases, we give feedback. And I'll admit that I often give feedback in the form of my opinion in how something will impact my pattern of play. And sure, many people will disagree with my premise in this scenario or that. Fair enough. And yeah, I'm sadly in semantics here. I don't disagree with you on the whole. Assholes can be annoying and it can take more emotional/intellectual energy to deal with some folks than we'd like. My position is that in some cases, that energy is worth it to me, and I think it could be worth it for others. But, each of us has a different tolerance for ass-hattery, so fair enough.

I merely asked the question. Opinions will vary. I suppose it's possible some folks could cross a line. But either the mods remove those threads before I see them, I've just never seen anyone cross it before. It would have to be very personal and very toxic, and really off-topic. I don't always agree with people, but I do try to get what I can from their perspective - even when I can't even fathom how they get any enjoyment from that path. I just think the ignore function is kind of limiting. I can ignore what people post without using ignore. And I can see what they said - because sometimes what they say deserves a response. But hey - by all means, - do what you like. If everyone did things like me, it'd be a damned strange world.

Going to have to disagree...in context. As you wrote it - no issues. But as I wrote it, I stand by it. If a dozen people tell me I'm overly verbose, and I just put them on ignore so that I don't see or engage with them further - that makes me a fool. I'd be sticking my head in the sand and being a fool. But, if I take in the criticism, and try to be more concise and clear - that's growth. That's a good thing. Is that not the purpose of these debates? For us to learn? To teach? It may be demeaning for some - but does that mean it isn't accurate? In some cases, it won't be. In the case of me being overly verbose - it is true. See? 5 lines. Not 600 lines of text.

Yeah, but I have to continually remind myself, it's not real money. So, when you have a number of badgers like I do, there is some motivation to just get them complete so you can do something else. At the time, I had no idea that PAPs were going to be part of ToT EB defeat badge awards, even though I was on Brainstorm multiple times to figure out a better farm build. No indication that anything like that was going to happen - at least nothing that hit my on my head to get my attention.

Honestly, I wouldn't say a thing. Because the error would be in my favor. BUT - if they said, "Hey, we found this error. It's not going to change the way you do anything, should we spend time to fix it?" I'd say "Don't bother". Regardless of the rate of XP, people are going to do the same things, they'll just level at a different rate. For most folks, yeah, faster is better. Some days, I'm not so sure what the rush is to get all the XP, and other days, I groan at having to earn another level because I'm having a clear hole in my build, like needing another slot in stamina, or needing more defense or some other attribute.

Yeah, but don't you see responses to some ignored entity and wonder what the heck they're talking about? Also - ignoring people just because you don't care for their views or their tone...well, doesn't that something about you? If we cannot read other people's opinions without it ruining our day, then isn't something amiss? You can't let things out of your control impact your life. Particularly things that only exist in pixel form. Yes, you can certainly get frustrated that something happened in game, or you can certainly be irritated by words you read. But if you have to ignore those people for your own piece of mind, than I would think there's really something else going on. But hey, that's just me. There's about 6 folks in these forums that I pretty much KNOW they are going to take the opposite side of my issue. A couple of them, I swear they are specifically trolling just me, but I also know that's just perception bias. The other 4 seem fairly well thought out. And I make a point to send DMs to those people that I appreciate their efforts to be civil, and while I respect their views, I still disagree. Sure, I could ignore the first two, but I have to keep an open mind in these crazy debates, because sometimes I'm very wrong. To be a man, you MUST be willing to appear inconsistent, and then change your mind, if the facts tell you that you've been wrong. Otherwise, you're a fool, sticking your head in the sand.

I am open to the possibility that I didn't remember things accurately. But I certainly did run the trial. I don't just make stuff up. It has been almost 2 years ago. I do know that I'd read that ambrosia was supposed to work on pets - but apparently I got my info from a set of patch notes that was imprecise. And I had expected my lore pet to assist and they were instantly crushed. I had expected to take down the titan in 4 minutes, I only had 5 ambrosia. And I just didn't have the dps (to take down the titan in 4-5 minutes) due to ambrosia not working for my pets.

I thought I was posting a reply to this ...and it disappeared. (EDIT: This had nothing to do with GMs being sneaky. Simmer down, you rebels! This was me screwing something up before I hit "submit" ) Apparently there are multiple sets of patch notes for page 2. One was from March, the other in April. The link Hedgefund posted that showed the MM references was in April's patch. The one I referenced was from March. So, the only ninja move by the GMs was over a year and a half ago when they put out a second set of patch notes that I missed. Damn shame. It was a good idea to make the insps count for pets. Too bad it didn't work out. And too bad I didn't see these notes before I wasted 90 minutes.

It sure didn't say that in the patch notes I saw when page 2 dropped, and again today when I copied it. I promise you, I didn't do any editing to my snip & sketch. Another ninja move by a GM.

I made a fiery aura/battle axe tank, thinking I'd test two things that would need a look. So far, the one thing I've seen that may need a quick look is Pendulum. When I was looking to choose the power after leveling (never played battle axe before) it looked to me like it was an AoE, and not an arc. So, I check the patch notes and see why. But the tool tip from the mouse hovering over the name of the power says, "Pendulum is not affected by arc changes"...which confused me. It's a targeted AoE now, so why would it? I'm just saying for this obtuse player, it's confusing. I think the mouse over tool tip should say "Melee AoE", whereas before it was a cone. The green text still suggests it's a cone. The detailed info upon actually choosing the power Melee AoE. A minor thing, but because I think many folks will try it for the first time (myself included) we may benefit from making it more clear prior to choosing the power.

Thank you for that thorough response. It IS useful to see why something so reasonable was abandoned instead of just saying the patch notes were in error. So, the spaghetti code wins another battle.

I did, at least a year ago when it happened. I ran that TF like the day after the patch hit, just to see if I could, now that the inspirations were supposed to work for pets. Time wasted.

If I'm remembering correctly, the patch notes clearly stated that Ambrosia would work for pets. They made no distinction. As shown here, from issue 27 page 2 patch notes: So, again, the Eden Trial is borked in this regard. The Ambrosia is supposed to work for pets. They do not work for any pets. Not lore pets, not phantasm, not PA. Where do you think a controller gets most of its damage from? Spectral wounds? Pfff. Damn things can barely out punch a level 7 hellion at level 50. I solo'd most of that map, until I got to the Titan. Even with my rad secondary, I just couldn't do enough damage because the trial didn't let me pets live due to the foolishly implemented auto-hit. In fairness, I remember a change in Hamidon Raids regarding Phantom Army on live. The playerbase solved the problem that was Hamidon, and the Paragon devs decided to change things up, to make Illusion controllers more useless than they already were. But there wasn't such a change to PA in the Eden trial that I remember, but that was a long time ago. Still, the patch notes were clear. But in practice, they are incorrect. Ergo - the trial should be adjusted to protect all pets. It really is that simple, as far as conclusions go. But I already know you won't see it like that. That's your right, of course, but I disagree. I'm the schmuck that blew 90 minutes of time in that trial to walk away empty handed because of this mistake.

So...my problem is my phantom army pets still get killed by the crystal titan, even though the selling point is they're supposed to be impervious to harm. And my phantasm doesn't get any benefit from ambrosia - which I had thought was supposed to be fixed. So, yeah, even when it's not a master attempt, the trial is not working the way it's supposed to - at least not for illusion controllers. These crazy powers devs have this idea that everyone wants these challenges that used to be rather simple for some folks, challenging for some folks to be challenging for the folks it was simple for, and nigh impossible for the ones that found it challenging before the change. Truth is, if I put myself in their shoes (which wouldn't fit and make their shoes stinky) - I can see why. Like minded folks will find each other. These guys like things to be challenging. They remember how hard things used to be before IOs, and probably want these master badges to mean more than they have recently. When I think back to how things were during live...maybe 4 people across all the servers had all the badges, at least, maybe 4 folks had them posted through Beefcakes verification site, whatever that was. Badgewhore? I forget. Now, each server has a badgers post, and dozens have completed all the badges. Some folks have dozens of badgers that have earned all the badges. They see this and think it's a testament to how easy the game is, and not a testament to the mental disorder this kind of badging really is. I can't imagine the compulsion to torture one's self to do all those ouro badges a dozen time. Let alone "Avoids the Green Stuff". In that time, before inventions, team composition did matter to most teams. For some reason, just speculating here, these power devs want team composition to matter again. I don't think they remember the annoying times when you couldn't find a tank. You couldn't get a decent empath or debuffer. And oddly, some days, although rarely, you couldn't find a blaster or scrapper for the dps you wanted. This was abated a good bit with invention enhancements and the morality alignment system, so the villain and hero ATs could mix and match. Apparently, these guys have a solid core of teammates to choose from when they decide to do any type of content. They are blissfully unaware that some folks have vision issues, Some folks are hearing impaired, and some folks simply lack the temperament to deal with others or go afk too much to be useful to a team. These folks generally understand they won't be able to do everything in game, but these moves forward will not make things better for those folks, certainly. But yeah, the powers devs, and they know who they are, even though we don't - they might throw the casual player a bone - but it usually comes with the comment, "It's supposed to be hard, noob!" (the noob part is my own inserted sarcasm, because their actions suggest they think of the casual player in this way, at least, to me) This is going to become a game where the casual player will be relegated to being carried through by others, or just not doing certain tasks unless some of the more casual players find their way in the closed beta and become firm, logical and clear about why certain changes should not be proposed. From what I hear, a powers devs makes a suggestion and everyone agrees. Nobody has a dissenting view. Now - that's just one person that made that observation to me, and no idea how valid that is, but one thing is clear - we need more casual players in the closed beta to help right the course, because the game is not going in the right direction from what I see. But that's mostly speculation on my part - I'm no insider. Yet. But if they insist on secrecy, it'll never happen, because I want everyone to know fully, ahead of time spent coding. Doesn't matter if a movie or tv show keeps plot lines secret for fear of a spoiler - this community needs those spoilers. That way - being fully informed, I can decide now if I want to still play. Suppose "they" choose to have the game change to where nobody could solo a task force again. Would I still invest my time getting badges on characters? New characters? Would I even still play? Because I would assume eventually, new task forces would be created. But to not have the option to solo them, or worse - have the option, but it automatically scaling to 8 players, even if solo...that's not where I would have the game go. I do not think CoH is supposed to be viewed as City of Hard Mode. I think HC got it right at the beginning - City of Options. These power devs are guilty of the same flaw I have myself. Assuming my way of thinking is typical of everyone else. It isn't. Pull your heads out of your asses, power devs. It stinks in there. The CoH world doesn't revolve around me, but it shouldn't revolve around you, either. Expand the orbit so we're all included.

Glad you don't have the need to farm. I really don't farm anymore myself, although sometimes, I do prefer to afk the vet levels, rather than suffer through the same itrials or DA arcs over and over. I understand the reason for the changes. But I still would have preferred they just left it alone. In the overall scheme, I don't think the reason was really anything to worry about - but I guess snowballs can build in size if you let them roll down a snow covered mountain. It's weird. I get it, but at the same time, I think it was much fuss over nothing. (the reason for the change) As for the difference between a page 4 AE map and pre-page 4 maps, the XP differences can be quite startling comparing the two types of maps, particularly if you're looking at multiple maps over time.

I haven't seen this code. I want so much to download it and look at it, but I shudder to think of how much space it would take up on my machine. That said, not having seen the code, my first mind told me that it was simply a math error. No doubt that's presumptuous of me. But, it makes sense. It's an easy error to make, depending on how the formula was initially laid out. I guess what I'm saying is, it wasn't a bug. It was just an incorrect value used instead of the proper one. That's my theory anyway. Anyone know how many terrabyte of room I'd need to download the code and my system still function?

I think we need a historian to keep these interesting tidbits available so we can look at them later. So, it was discovered by accident. And fixed on purpose. Generally, as an outsider looking in, every change comes from someone. And if we're all players, the impetus for the change came from a player. So, the question is still worth asking. The person that discovered it - do they not play the game? Did they not see how it would impact the perceptions of players? On the other hand, with 2xp(fixed version) giving plenty of XP, I don't want to overact - but still, why would anyone fix this? If they level up their characters, they'd have to appreciate the boost. And if they PL to 50, they'd certainly appreciate the saved time. I just don't see it as a win/win fix. More like a lose/lose fix. But that's just my opinion. I'm of the mind that we should have insta-50 as an inf sink for a nominal 10m to 50M inf cost. I understand why some folks would be against it, but I certainly get why some folks want it. See, if I were in that closed Beta and this discrepancy was brought up, I would have suggested they forget about changing it until we get another 50 lower level story arcs in place, which would give a reason for many folks who farm to 50 to level up organically. But, that's just me. Other opinions would vary, as they should.

I tend to hoard those BS Ideas for when I'm doing a ton of crafting - like 100 recipes, and the characters simply don't have the salvage. So, it's either let this marketer squeeze 100-200k out of what should be my profits, or just tab out, farm for tickets and get what's needed. The problem is, getting what's needed would be a full time job, and adds to what's already tedious enough. The Winter Packs I've got...I still have about 1500 left to open, maybe 2k. So many characters have them, I'm really not sure. And this is a process I wish I could afk, lol. Just [Ctrl + click] the macro I have that opens them, but it seems it's impossible to do that to a macro button. I sure would like an "Open all" or a "claim all" button, which I put in the suggestions sub-forum.

It's not a question of difficulty of testing for me. It's seeing a need to test it in the first place. Why would anyone do this? Further, why would they report it? As a real life example, if I notice I got more xp than I expected to get, I might retry it, just to confirm. And if I did, I would say to myself, "interesting". But in order for me to see it as an actual exploit worthy of reporting, it would have to give me a f**kton. Like, 50 to 100X for me to even notice it. The only time I notice XP is when I'm not getting any, (for whatever reason, like the game somehow turned it off, or for whatever reason, I turned it off) and when I complete a story arc, I make a note of how much I got, to see if the story arc is worth repeating on the next character. For whatever reason, some pay more than others. I cannot fathom what kind of person said to themself "Hey! This is too much XP. We better put a stop to this!" And then that same person actually reports it as if they were doing the game a favor. It's just being insane. We were all doing fine with it, oblivious to the fact it was more than we're supposed to get. It's like a kid in elementary school raising his hand to be the hall monitor, ratting on his classmates. A legit nerd. I just hope they got bug hunter for such nerdish behavior. If not, shame on the devs. Because if it was bad enough to fix, then it's good enough to reward the badge.

So, after getting distracted by countless posts about Page 5, I'm finally settling in here, where things feel more like home! It's no secret that one, some or maybe all of you are working your magic with the rare salvage. I honestly couldn't do what you do, too damned tedious for me. I've had hundreds of bids for rare salvage at 500K, and not one of them has gone through since. Color me impressed. To get my salvage, I've done a number of things. Run AE for tickets. I spend more time setting and resetting because the ticket cap per map is so very low, but I do get my salvage for free. At the cost of recipe drops and..other salvage. But, I can select precisely what I want. So, I've thought about Brain Storm Ideas. 20 of them, and I can make a random rare salvage. If I don't get the ones I want, I can sell them and get more than 500k. Seems like a no-brainer. But..earning brain storm ideas...I'm telling you - it's easier to buy the winter packs and get them from the packs, even with the delay "please wait a moment" message. You have to spend two full weeks, one week to get the badge, then log in - to actually get the badge, then log out for a week to get a full 2 hours of a brain storm dropping after each mission. It's quite annoying having to stop playing a given character to re-fill the timer on the bonus. I've got three of them doing it, and I need more still, lol. But, it all begs the question - why is this such a tiny reward? 1 brain storm idea after each mission. So, 20 missions and you essentially get a free rare. A random rare, which you may not need. And if you think you can buy the rare for the same price as you sell it, think again. I sell them for 500K, get 545k and when I try to buy them, it's closer to 650K. (well, who has patience when you're trying to craft?) So, I'll do AE for them, lest I fund the very same market shenanigans I'm trying to avoid. May I ask - what is the marketer's work around for this hostage taking of the rare salvage? It's lowering my profit margins to the point where I'm just not going to do it.

Thanks, @Yomo Kimyata But I don't think his comment really needs one. We're all human, and man, even though I think some of the abuse is self-inflicted - Six isn't the problem. The problem is...well, it's us. Or Zuul, whatever the f**k that is. I was unaware, blissfully so, that we had a closed beta system that developed somewhat organically through Discord. And the folks that seem to be guiding our CoH "ship", to continue with that analogy, is .."us". Not me. But other players. I know that I've teamed with GMs. I have a reasonable assumption that folks like @Bopper and maybe even @macskull might know enough code to be in that volunteer group of "power devs". I might have teamed with Mac a couple years ago, or done some hami raiding with him. But that was a long time ago. And we all know Bopper is mathematically gifted, with a penchant for number crunching, and has shared builds, insights on procs, and a host of other guides for helping the average player learn more about what's really going on behind the combat attributes and attack mechanics. I don't know why these players aren't coming out and sharing why they wanted to go the path they went. Maybe they're busy. And there is a small chance they know better. They certainly know more about coding. I'm just a null pointer exception looking for garbage collection. I probably goofed up that joke, too. I can't pretend to know what in the world is going on behind the scenes. For me - some days, I want to get on my high horse and trumpet that they're screwing things up by not consulting the player base. Some folks, who I respect, tell me that it's customary and counterproductive to be so transparent. I vehemently disagree, but I respect their view. I will continue to trumpet that all things should be disclosed prior to coding. Just because folks are great at coding doesn't mean they should be the only ones to pilot this figurative ship. It should be kind of like Oprah. "You get a say, and you get a say, and you , and you and you get a say! Everybody gets a say". The sane part of my brain is fully aware that there would be problems with that - because what happens if @Bionic_Flea insists on a band of wandering minstrels playing behind him as he travels through zones and @Snarky insists they be in front, heralding his arrival? How would such conflict be resolved? And it's that conflict - that's why we can't have nice things. Too many of us want what we want, and may or may not be thinking about the long term for HC:CoH and what that looks like. But, there's nothing rational about playing this game. Spending hours with nothing tangible to take into the real world. Except frustration from changes that we cannot control. Only a tiny voice, after the changes have been "Proposed". So, the crazy part of me says, "Screw it. I want to know. I want us all to know. Now."

So, while you were in WoW, a lot of things occurred that had a genuine impact on afk farmers, for sure. And active farmers were also impact, but to a lesser degree. At least, with an active farmer you can gobble a purple insp or some reds or maybe a green if you need them. With these changes - and tons of heated debate that went with them - we learned that incoming damage is now going by a different set of rules, and it's not terribly clear to me what those rules are - I just know my afk farmers could no longer afk farm without a respec. And after the next patch, given the proposed changes to the procs in irradiated ground, they may (or may not be) tenable any longer for afk purposes. For me, not a real big deal. I've already made my loot. For others, yeah, it's going to bug them. Consider your afk farmers as the baby, and the concept of afk-farming as the bath water. Well...that may be too harsh. Some folks will adjust and still be able to afk-farm, most likely. So, there is this whole 3x to 2x fix...and candidly, I didn't think it was broken. But I never paid attention. It's still faster xp than we had on live, so I'm all for that. Rather than rehash all the stuff that I've been in words with so many people about on these forums, ask me about it over discord and I'll do my level best to explain what they've done, why they've done it and my best guess as to why they're going the direction they're going.

And that would be more information. Sure - some of us might go off track. But the points to be made would be in there to absorb and discuss. Nobody said it would be easy. Nothing worthwhile ever is. (so they say. I can think of a couple of dates that were exceptions to that rule) And what's wrong with angry posts? They're more fun than an MSR or a Hami Raid, for sure. As long as we can avoid labeling people, it should be fine. So what if someone attacks me or you? If their opinions had any validity, we wouldn't be arguing, right? (that's a joke) Sometimes, people need to vent. I can't tell you how many pages of ranting I've written out and deleted. And still a lot of that trash makes its way here. So what? Sometimes, feedback is that annoying pitching tone that comes out of the speakers. But you have to suffer through that sometimes to hear the music.