Idea: a No Buying Challenge

[Yomo Kimyata]

Does anybody equip their characters “old school” fashion, I.e. equipping only drops rather than buying anything from the market?  Converters of course make things much easier.

 

I’m thinking about creating a new alt that is only allowed to sell things on the AH, but never buy anything.  To get things like converters, I would restrict myself to drops and merit spending.  To craft, I’d need to have the actual salvage drop rather than buy it in fungible form.

 

I suspect that I would need a lot of merits, and probably would end up buying them from the merit vendor for a mm a pop.  What would be the best merit farmer?  I’d lean towards some sort of stalker.

 

Your thoughts?

[MunkiLord]

Stalker would definitely get you the quickest start because of Hide. But after slotting a stealth IO or getting invisible, I think the difference between Stalkers, Scrappers, and Blasters would be negligible. If merit farming is the goal over XP, then all three would be great choices to destroy -1x1 content. Electric Melee Stalker I think could be fun for this, as well as a Fire Blaster.

 

I think salvage would be the biggest bottleneck, so I'm very interested in how you decide to deal with that.

[Myrmidon]

Maybe roll that without double XP to see if the drop rate can somewhat keep up with your progress in the earlier level ranges?

[Ukase]

My thoughts: definitely you'd avoid the 2xp. You need to go through a lot of content to increase drops. So, a blaster - unless you play with large teams is probably not the best route. A sentinel, scrapper or brute (or tank when the changes go live) are probably the best bet. I can't say stalker - I've never played one. Still, whatever AT & power set combo you go with, the sooner you can increase mob size, and ergo, drop rate, the better. 

A spines/fire brute would probably be the best way so you could do AE maps to get the salvage you need without paying for them, at least in the higher levels. Your  builds will likely be substandard until you can get the rare salvage you need for the better sets. Sounds like a fun challenge, but I don't think I could handle being substandard until level 22 or so. That would drive me a bit nuts. 

[Yomo Kimyata]

The more I think about this, the easier it seems.  I'd have to make a superbase and store every salvage drop I get.  That's the biggest pain I see.

 

Since I would anticipate spending all of my spare inf on merits for either converters, catalysts, or possibly purples, the main question is:  can I convert enough random dropped recipes to make a big profit while effectively paying 333,333 inf per converter?  I think so, I really do.

 

So then, I'd target an AoE build that will do well on standard IOs, until I am swimming in enough inf to just convert any recipe I get as a drop into the exact one I want.  I can buy ATOs with merits if needed.

[Ukase]

Why would you pay so much inf per converter? Going rate is only 75-80k if you're patient, 90 if you're not. 

[Yomo Kimyata]

28 minutes ago, Ukase said:

Why would you pay so much inf per converter? Going rate is only 75-80k if you're patient, 90 if you're not. 

No-buying challenge!  I can't buy anything on the AH, so any converters will have to come from merits.  I anticipate that it will generally be faster (once things get started) to earn 1mm and buy a merit and then buy three converters than it will be to earn a merit and then buy three converters.

[Ukase]

<headsmack> I knew that, but I forgot I knew it. 

[Lines]

Unless a build is actually struggling (endurance issues usually being the culprit), I always play like this.

 

i have one totally decked out toon, the rest I’m slowly working on.

 

Wouldn’t do it any other way.

 

(edit: oh, I do buy salvage)

Edited November 2, 2019 by Lines

[Yomo Kimyata]

Ok, I’m trying this on, of all things, a necro/traps Mm on Reunion server, for my own esoteric and masochistic reasons.  At lvl 16, and pure solo so far (May go solo all the way).  Ran Outbreak, starting contact missions until lvl 5; three KR radio missions then bank job for jet pack, hollows arc, and working on midnight squad arc., mostly at +1/x3.   A few things I’ve noticed:

 

1. Salvage, specifically uncommon salvage, is going to be a problem.  I think I’m going to have to go AEing for tickets at some point soon.

 

2. I think I’m going to need to turn xp off entirely at points.  There are a number of IOS I can only make from low level recipes and salvage, so I need to plan that out.  Also, for merits I’m going to mostly run story arcs, and I prefer to do them outside of Ouroboros.

 

3.  Speaking of Ouroboros, I’ll want that day job bonus as soon as I can.  I’m planning on doing Faultline next and can get the portal from Doc Delilah at lvl 20.

 

4. Recipes don’t drop as much as I thought they would.  So far, only 4-5 set recipes.  And I only have the salvage to Craft one right now.  But I already see the strategy. For each one.  I’ve got a lvl 15 reactive armor that will be my steadfast protection +def. I’ve got a panacea e/r that will become the Proc.  This is the fun I was looking for.

[Yomo Kimyata]

Currently at level 22, pure solo.  

 

I've had 11 IO set recipes drop total.  That's a lot lower than I expected.  Two were PvP, which led in short order to a Panacea proc and a Glad Armor proc, both of which I kept.  I was lucky that I had the salvage to craft them.  Two were rares, which I vendored.  The other 7 became kismet accuracy (slotted), perf shifter proc (slotted), commanding presence triple (slotted), 4 sold.  In addition, I bought three bronze rolls from AE, which resulted in (after crafting) a slow +smashing proc, a zephyr knockback (slotted) and something else I sold.  

 

I've used 92 converters so far.  I initially cashed in 50 merits for 150 converters, and I have another 126 merits.  Sitting on about 15mm inf, which I may use to buy SOs.  I'm not sure if buying IO recipes from the workbench violates my no buy rule!  

 

I could probably make a decent living by just playing AE for tickets and bronze recipe rolls, with the occasional dip for an uncommon salvage I am missing, but I don't want to have to AE.  I'd rather just play the standard content.  I've done Hollows, Faultline, and have started on Striga -- that's where the merits have come from mostly.

 

 

[Myrmidon]

On 11/1/2019 at 11:30 AM, Yomo Kimyata said:

I’m thinking about creating a new alt that is only allowed to sell things on the AH, but never buy anything.

I would say that because you’re not buying from AH, you don’t violate this by picking up Common IO recipes from the crafting table.

[Heraclea]

I very seldom buy any enhancements or recipes on the market.  I craft whatever I have salvage in stock for.  Then I run converters, dropped or bought with merits, until they land on something one of my characters can use. 

[nihilii]

Very cool idea. Might steal it.

I've done a streetsweeping-only character, and it's amazing how different the game can feel when you put these constraints on yourself. Revisiting or exploring so many places we're used to zoom by. And the game really holds up as such; even as momentum moved to instances very early, devs still took care to fill the zones with appropriate encounters.

[Sakai]

How is this working out a week or so in?

[Yomo Kimyata]

18 hours ago, Sakai said:

How is this working out a week or so in?

So far, I've refined the model a bit.  I only buy things that I exchange merits or tickets for, so I have not been crafting generic IOs unless I get that recipe to drop (or I guess I could have bought it with AE tickets).  I guess I could slot SOs that drop, but eh, why bother.  If I were to restart, I might add the caveat that everything I sell on the AH has to be at a specific cutoff, either 5 or 500,000 or 1mm or whatever.  I'm pretty good at getting close to maximum value, so that has probably helped me so far.

 

At level 30, I've run solo through Hollows, Faultline, Striga, and about 1/2 through Croatoa.  When I hit certain level barriers (like 30+ to continue Kelly's Croatoa missions), I run AE missions, usually 5-starred Developer's Choice (so no farms) for tickets.  I've turned in 150 merits total for converters for a total of 450, had a few drop.  Currently have 189 merits, 115 converters, 932 AE tickets.  Sitting on 51.5mm in inf.  The rest of my record keeping may be shoddy, so bear with me if the numbers don't add up.

 

I've had 22 uncommon recipes drop, got 5 uncommon recipes from bronze ticket rolls (20-24 and 25-29), 2 PvP recipes.  Crafted all of them.  

 

I've had a handful of rare recipes drop, and most of them I vendor.  I'm holding onto a few of them in case the rare salvage drops.  This also includes one uncommon recipe that requires rare salvage.  I'm sitting on 4 more uncommons that I haven't gotten around to crafting yet.

 

The 2 PvP recipes I got lucky with, and got the rare salvage to drop.  One was a Panacea something something that I rolled twice by set into the proc.  6 converters.  Slotted into Health.  The other was a glad strike, converted by pvp once to get a shield wall, converted by set x5 to get the proc.  16 converters. Slotted into Combat Jumping.

 

Converted and kept/slotted:

1. lvl 12 stun, converted by stun x1 to rare, converted by rare x1 to kismet, converted in set x1 to +accuracy proc. 6 converters.

2. lvl 21 endurance mod, converted by end mod x1 to perf shifter, in set x1 to proc.  5 converters.

3. lvl 21 pbaoe, converted by uncommon x5 to commanding presence triple.  5 converters.

4. lvl 22 multistrike, converted by uncommon x2 to jumping, by jumping x1 to rare, by rare x2 to zephyr knockback.  6 converters.

5. lvl 21 slow, converted by slow x2 to impeded swiftness, by set x7 to proc.  25 converters.

6. lvl 22 triage, converted by healing x1 to miracle, by set x1 to proc.  5 converters.

7. lvl 25 ruin, converted by uncommon x1 to flying, by flying x1 to rare, by rare x2 to edict of the master, by set x2 to proc.  11 converters.

8. lvl 25 focused smite, converted by uncommon x2 to knockback, by KB x1 to rare, by rare x1 to res damage, by res damage x3 to steadfast prot knockback, in set x2 to defense.  17 converters.

9. lvl 24 stun, converted by uncommon x1 to to hit debuff, by to hit debuff x1 to rare, by rare x1 to annihilation proc.  4 converters.

10.  lvl 25 focused smite, converted by uncommon x2 to flight, by flight x1 to rare, by rare x11 to shield breaker, by set x1 to proc.  18 converters.

11. lvl 25 ruin, converted by uncommon x2 to knockback, by kn x1 to rare, by rare x4 to cloud senses, by set x12 to proc.  44 converters.

12.   lvl 27 undermined defenses, converted by category x1 to lady grey, in set x6 to proc.  20 converters.

13. lvl 28 brilliant leadership, converted by pet damage x7 to sov. right proc.  14 converters.

14. lvl 28 brilliant leadership, converted by uncommon x4 to adjusted targeting, by category x1 to gaussians proc.  6 converters.

15.  lvl 28 stagger, converted by uncommon x1 to defense debuff, by category x1 to rare, by rare x5 to neuronic shutdown proc.  8 converters.

16.  lvl 30 running, converted by running x1 to celerity, by set x3 to +stealth.  11 converters.

 

I think that's 205 converters, and an estimated sellable market value of 50-55mm inf.

 

I also crafted and sold 11 other recipes that took 125 converters.  I could list the process for them, but it's already getting tedious!  That probably netted me about 50mm inf.

 

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

My takeaways:

1. I really suck as a mastermind.

2. I really REALLY suck as a necro/traps mastermind.

3. As long as I am willing to use AE, I can get whatever I need.

4. Without AE I'd be screwed, particularly with respect to uncommon salvage.  Also when I start reaching for sub-30 IOs, I will need to buy recipes through bronze rolls since no more will drop in regular content.  

5. The stuff I crafted and kept are worth less on average than what I crafted for sale.  (Edit: except the PvP.  Those are serious cash money, homie!).  It works out pretty close to the same in terms of converters spent per IO.

6.  At some point I'm going to have to buy catalysts with merits.

7.  I think that I can eventually get to a steady state where I can spend 10mm inf on merits for 30 converters and turn that into more than 10mm inf in IOs, but it will not be easy.

8.  The AH makes everything ridiculously easier by NOT doing it this way.

 

 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Yomo Kimyata
Added "cash money, homie!"

[Sakai]

Nicely done. I hope your journey continues well. 

[Moka]

This is sort of what I had to do already when Homecoming first started.

[Sakai]

1 hour ago, Moka said:

This is sort of what I had to do already when Homecoming first started.

True enough I guess. Those days are well behind except in a voluntary fashion it seems. 

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

I'm certainly not claiming this is extraordinary or ground breaking in any way.  I guess part of it was a way to demonstrate how you don't have to use the AH in order to max out your builds, but that it makes it a hell of a lot easier.  Part of it is to demonstrate how easy it is to use converters to get something specific.  In a thread months ago, I doubted that someone could make hundreds of LotG 7.5% from a random lvl 25 recipe and consistently make a profit.  I no longer doubt that, which is why I no longer bid high amounts on anything unless I need it soon(tm).

[Sakai]

Are you still soloing or are you mixing it up now?

[Yomo Kimyata]

On 11/16/2019 at 11:25 PM, Sakai said:

Are you still soloing or are you mixing it up now?

Still solo.  I'd like to be able to say at the end of the day, you can solo, with a really bad skill set, without using the AH, and still have a fully tricked out build.  I've even learned a few things on the way.

 

Like a new rare roulette technique.  Buying uncommons at lvl 15 that will only convert to a rare in category.  It's a thinner market, i.e., fewer buyers, but profit per converters seems significantly better than the lvl 30, lvl 31, and lvl 41 techniques I've played around with.

[nihilii]

On 11/16/2019 at 2:20 AM, Moka said:

This is sort of what I had to do already when Homecoming first started.

Oh God. Repressed memories flooding back. Wasting so many empyreans on merits because I didn't know any better and thought I'd keep earning threads and empys every vet level. Then having nothing left to craft incarnate stuff. 🙂

I think I hit vet level 100 before I had T4 everything. Embarrassing.

[Yomo Kimyata]

Finished Croatoa and ran some AE to hit lvl 32.  I'm no expert on masterminds, but it seems like lvl 32 is a sweet spot, what with the empowerment power.  Seems to add a lot of value, especially to the zombies.

 

I think I'm going to need to take some time and figure out what I want my build to be at 50.  Normally, I'd wait until 49 for that, but I realized I'm even more dependent on the AE than I thought.  I should have realized, but didn't, that when you select a bronze recipe roll 25-29, you get the recipe at your level if it comes in your level.  So, if I want things that are sub-lvl 30, I'll probably need to select bronze rolls at a lower range to reduce the odds of getting a 10-50 recipe.  For example, if I want another Cloud Senses proc, I can't get there unless I start with a recipe that's 30 or below.  And for that I'll also need low or middle salvage, which has/will stop dropping.  So more tickets.  Lots and lots of tickets.

 

Also, up to this point I've been converting mostly roulette-style.  I suspect I've going to have to start spending a lot more merits on converters to get specific things.  For example, I'll need a Call to Arms +def at some point.  Probably should have targeted it already.  But that could cost me hundreds of converters to roll for directly.  It may be something I just have to do without. 

 

I'm also trying to figure out what to run next for content/merits.  I guess aim for story arcs.  I could also just do them directly through Ouro, but I prefer to do them directly with the contact.  That's inefficient, but that's how I roll.