Copyrighted Generics Issues

[ShardWarrior]

2 minutes ago, Greycat said:

And *this* is why they don't put down a list of guidelines versus "use common sense." "But mine was only 98.5%! I was called Super-man, notice the dash, and used a different belt!"

Would that not be how clear cut rules would work? 

[Greycat]

1 minute ago, ShardWarrior said:

Yes, they are as they should be in protecting their property.  However, it is important to understand Disney does not go after everyone.  They target those who are trying to make a profit without a license or are using their property in a way that went against Walt Disney's express wishes. 

 

Trust me, I understand it is a risk that Disney might issue a C&D.  However, I think the likelihood of this happening are not even slim to none and chances are greater the C&D will come from NCSoft before anyone like Disney.  Trying to infer that a Disney suit is somehow imminent because someone made a Hulk character is fear mongering. 

 

Again, I have no issue with the rules that Homecoming has set forth.  I will be even more clear that if someone is naming their character Superman or Batman or Captain America, then yes they should get it changed. 

I did not say one was imminent. Not even close. (In part because Homecoming has and enforces that policy.)  And about profit - why do you think donations get shut down as costs are met monthly? One less argument that can be used against Homecoming.

[Greycat]

2 minutes ago, ShardWarrior said:

Would that not be how clear cut rules would work? 

No. THat is a request from someone who wants to rules-lawyer their way into being able to play Ir0n-m4n because two of the letters are numbers *and* there's a dash.

 

This was gone into on live, as well, multiple times.

[ShardWarrior]

1 minute ago, Greycat said:

And about profit - why do you think donations get shut down as costs are met monthly?

They met their donation goal. 

[ShardWarrior]

1 minute ago, Greycat said:

No. THat is a request from someone who wants to rules-lawyer their way into being able to play Ir0n-m4n because two of the letters are numbers *and* there's a dash.

 

This was gone into on live, as well, multiple times.

Ok however if clearly defined rules specify that, then what is the problem?

[altaholic]

5 minutes ago, Greycat said:

And *this* is why they don't put down a list of guidelines versus "use common sense." "But mine was only 98.5%! I was called Super-man, notice the dash, and used a different belt!"

copy as in 100% -  the rest is not in-game most likely for that purpose, but what is there can be used, so it should be removed to mitigate , right?

[Greycat]

Just now, ShardWarrior said:

They met their donation goal. 

RIght. Meaning *they do not make a profit.* If they DO make a profit, it puts them into the realm of "making money from someone else's IP" - in this case, NCSoft. You're really arguing against using common sense here, aren't you.

[ZacKing]

3 minutes ago, Greycat said:

No. THat is a request from someone who wants to rules-lawyer their way into being able to play Ir0n-m4n because two of the letters are numbers *and* there's a dash.

 

This was gone into on live, as well, multiple times.

WTF do you think rules are for?  lol

[Greycat]

I see we  have people who prefer selfishness over protecting the game for everyone and want to rules-lawyer their "but I was .00001% different."

 

I'm out. Policy is what it is, don't like it, take it up with the dev team. I can guarantee you you're not getting your list of rules so you can get just as *close* to the line as you dare.

 

Me, I'll go on making thousands of costumes and characters that have zero chance of being generic'd, like I have since I3 on live.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Greycat

[ShardWarrior]

1 minute ago, Greycat said:

RIght. Meaning *they do not make a profit.* If they DO make a profit, it puts them into the realm of "making money from someone else's IP" - in this case, NCSoft. You're really arguing against using common sense here, aren't you.

Well no, it just means they met their donation goal.  I would be far, far more concerned about profit issues from the legal owner of the IP than I would from Disney.

[ZacKing]

2 minutes ago, Greycat said:

I see we  have people who prefer selfishness over protecting the game for everyone and want to rules-lawyer their "but I was .00001% different."

Yeah and you have people who don't want clearly defined rules so they can make up whatever they want on a whim.  Clear cut rules aren't a bad thing man. and again, no ones saying to lift the rule.

[altaholic]

3 minutes ago, Greycat said:

I see we  have people who prefer selfishness over protecting the game for everyone and want to rules-lawyer their "but I was .00001% different."

 

I'm out. Policy is what it is, don't like it, take it up with the dev team. I can guarantee you you're not getting your list of rules so you can get just as *close* to the line as you dare.

I'm all in favor of getting as close to the line as possible. Just don't move the line as you wish for whatever reason you deem fit

[Blastit]

10 minutes ago, ZacKing said:

Yeah and you have people who don't want clearly defined rules so they can make up whatever they want on a whim.  Clear cut rules aren't a bad thing man. and again, no ones saying to lift the rule.

"Don't copy characters" is pretty clear already, though. Not writing multi-paragraph Laws of Character Creation is a good idea because the GMs can then simply exercise their judgement and won't have to bother with rules lawyering.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Blastit

[tidge]

47 minutes ago, Greycat said:

Right at the top of the forums. Code of conduct.

 

Use of copyrighted characters and content without permission is not permitted when creating characters or Architect content. This includes characters and stories from intellectual property belonging to any IP that is not City of Heroes.

 

The infringing people were reported. The GMs agreed it was infringing. You are in the wrong. Period. This argument was tiresome on live, it's tiresome here. Here, however, you do have choices:

 

1. Find a server that doesn't care and play there.

2. Get the code. Be sure to pay NCSoft a license. Talk to Marvel. Pay them for a license for similar characters. Do the same with DC, Dark Horse, ... who's the one that does Dragonball, Toyama or something? Them, etc. You will now have paid out a bunch of money, but have a license to use the characters.

Greycat's post was missing something...

 

[AerialAssault]

Just saying, I don't see anyone volunteering to write this metaphorical list of can's/cant's of character creation.

[altaholic]

Ok, so lets just see if we can get a bit of clarity from this pool of opinionated posters here. So, you make a character, you give him SS/Invul abilities, you make him large and green and call him "Mike" -  is that a generic-able offense?

[Blastit]

Just now, altaholic said:

Ok, so lets just see if we can get a bit of clarity from this pool of opinionated posters here. So, you make a character, you give him SS/Invul abilities, you make him large and green and call him "Mike" -  is that a generic-able offense?

Why don't you try it and find out? It's unlikely that the people who own the Green Giant will send assassins after you.

[Starforge]

I think the more pressing issue is explaining what common sense is because a lot of people here don’t seem to understand that first of all and are looking to argue just to argue.

[altaholic]

10 minutes ago, Blastit said:

Why don't you try it and find out? It's unlikely that the people who own the Green Giant will send assassins after you.

Unless Mike is the green giants name, I agree.

But you didn't answer the question.

Edited April 22, 2020 by altaholic

[ShardWarrior]

4 minutes ago, altaholic said:

Ok, so lets just see if we can get a bit of clarity from this pool of opinionated posters here. So, you make a character, you give him SS/Invul abilities, you make him large and green and call him "Mike" -  is that a generic-able offense?

Too vague an example I believe, but I get the gist of what you are after. 😉

[Jaegernault]

Call him Jolly Green Giant and ull have the tinned frozen food industry after you!

[altaholic]

6 minutes ago, ShardWarrior said:

Too vague an example I believe, but I get the gist of what you are after. 😉

Nah, its not vague - its the entirety of this whole discussion - there are too many "gray" areas to get definitive unless there is a clear cut explanation of what is generic-able. If it were so, a lot of people would have to look at their accounts.

[Blastit]

Obviously it would depend on the execution. If it's the huge bodytype, Mike has short shaggy hair, only wears a tattered pair of purple trouses and the bio is in broken English and mentions radiation and anger then you'll get clubbed. If instead the costume is just a big green dude then that's not a problem. Trolls are in the game and they're big, green, strong and speak clumsily but they're not an issue. A character that is inspired by the Hulk and by super mutants from Fallout isn't inherently a problem either. It's all about how much they look like either.

[altaholic]

2 minutes ago, Blastit said:

Obviously it would depend on the execution. If it's the huge bodytype, Mike has short shaggy hair, only wears a tattered pair of purple trouses and the bio is in broken English and mentions radiation and anger then you'll get clubbed. If instead the costume is just a big green dude then that's not a problem. Trolls are in the game and they're big, green, strong and speak clumsily but they're not an issue. A character that is inspired by the Hulk and by super mutants from Fallout isn't inherently a problem either. It's all about how much they look like either.

No shirt , no shoes, tucked in not tattered pants, no bio - just named "Mike".

[Blastit]

Oh, that sort of Mike. They would delete your account for it.

 

 

 

That you are trying to argue the case of an intentionally maximally ambigious hulkalike is precisely why it's good that the GMs don't have strict procedure to follow and can simply read the mood and come to a decision. If they get the vibe that this person accidentally got close to the line then they can just tell that person to add boots and a belt or w/e, and if they get the vibe that they're dealing with a rules lawyer they can delete the costume.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Blastit