Bots: Repair - useful?

[Papaschtroumpf]

I'm new to MS and made a Bots/EA MM. Lots of good powers in EA so I'm trying to decide what powers if any are skippable.

 

I'm waffling about the pulse rifle powers, EA can be a busy set so between micromanaging the bots and applying EA, I may not need all rifle powers, although I like the AoE Stun as extra mitigation.

 

I'm trying to understand if Repair is a skippable power. I just hit 20, so I don't have much experience with it, but I find myself relying more on the EA heal that jumps between bots and heals all of them of most times jumps back to me hand heals me too. I've seen several builds slotting it with endurance reduction, like a full set of Efficacy Adaptor, is it as a mule, or do bots run out of endurance later in the game? I've not noticed them running out. But I do have a speed-boost-like power in EA too (not as good though), so many I don;t need it with EA? 

Maybe a good comparison would be would a Bot/Kin MM take Repair? 

 

 

[Greycat]

Eh. It's an "If you have nothing else to take" power. I seem to recall a looooong recharge for it, too, but don't quote me on that.

[Seigmoraig]

Repair is a very skippable power. Not much point to it since you already have 2 heals in EA, not only that but it's single target and has a 120sec CD so it's usefulness is highly dubious at best.

The beam rifle/grenade powers are also skippable since they will be doing very little damage and will mostly be pulling aggro to yourself. The MM damage scale being at 0.55 you can't really rely on it for damage. You could just rely on the P2W powers all the way to 50, Blackwand, Nemesis Staff and Sands of Mu and not be in a too bad place since like you mentioned EA is a click heavy set and you might be busy with those powers a lot. If you want some actual powers to throw at the enemy, I would suggest going down in the Experimentation, Toxic Dart is pretty good with a low cooldown and Corrosive Vial applies a -Def which will help your pets hit better and can fit in a bunch of different procs notably Achilles' Heel and Annihilation -res.

 

Most of the powers in EA are good for a MM, the only one I would consider skipping would be Defibrilate since it's useless for pets, but it's useful in groups so it really depends on how you play, if you mostly solo or group a lot. I have a /EA Corrputor and I have to say that it is a set which can get by with very little slots in most powers. Shock, Discharge/Galvanic Sentinel, Energizing Circuit, Empowering Circuit, Defibrilate and Amp Up are all mainly 1 slot powers that do well with either a Cooldown reduce or a single End Mod. on mine I actually put a Perfomance Shifter end proc in my Energizing Circuit but I'm honestly not too sure how good it is, might be best to just leave a single end mod in it.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[Papaschtroumpf]

thanks for the feedback. I'm still trying to get a feel for EA (Bots too but it feels relatively straightforward). but I was hoping it didn't require too many slots so I have more options for sets, etc...

The one disadvantage of Prestige powers is that they are endurance heavy and not enhanceable. Great under 10, but gets heavy later, although so far this character is one of the easiest on endurance I've had in a long time. Maybe it gets worse after 20. I do like the idea of trying Experimentation since it's new to me too. 

as far as pulling, I have been using Shock from EA, it applies a rather large damage debuff that helps mitigating the hitback.

 

I'll likely keep the stun grenade (with a purple Stun set it also has a -toHit proc), and I just might keep the harder hitting pulse rifle power that does knockback if I can find room for it (likely as an opportunity to slot a set too)

 

 

 

Edited April 22, 2020 by Papaschtroumpf

[Camel]

48 minutes ago, Papaschtroumpf said:

thanks for the feedback. I'm still trying to get a feel for EA (Bots too but it feels relatively straightforward). but I was hoping it didn't require too many slots so I have more options for sets, etc...

The one disadvantage of Prestige powers is that they are endurance heavy and not enhanceable. Great under 10, but gets heavy later, although so far this character is one of the easiest on endurance I've had in a long time. Maybe it gets worse after 20. I do like the idea of trying Experimentation since it's new to me too. 

as far as pulling, I have been using Shock from EA, it applies a rather large damage debuff that helps mitigating the hitback.

 

I'll likely keep the stun grenade (with a purple Stun set it also has a -toHit proc), and I just might keep the harder hitting pulse rifle power that does knockback if I can find room for it (likely as an opportunity to slot a set too)

 

 

 

I’d say Energizing Circuit is your most important power behind your circuit power that grants absorb, I would recommend a minimum of 3-4 slots to maximize its endurance mod, endurance reduction and recharge. This will patch up your end problems entirely and help tremendously on teams. On an MM you can get away with 1-slotting certain powers in EA, but all the other ATs benefit from multiple slots in powers like Defibrillate, Empowering Circuit and Galvanic Sentinel. I 4-slotted Defibrillate on my Elec/Elec Controller and it can drain mobs entirely. YMMV though.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Camel

[TheSpiritFox]

Aid pool heal other is genuinely better than repair. Use a secondary heal or aid pool first. Repair is like your last option just can't fit it in the build any other way. 

[Papaschtroumpf]

I don't know how to link to another post, but I thought took you guys' advice from this thread and applied to my Bots/EA build in this MM forum.

[Dixa]

it's fantastic on TS as it's an aoe 100% heal (still has the long cooldown though). here not so much. 

[Papaschtroumpf]

not sure what TS is?

 

On the other hand I'm not in love with Experimentation so far. Dart is pretty wimpy and Vial has a huge endurance cost, and the run is meh when you have ninja run. it's an expensive way to get -def in the build

[Seigmoraig]

1 hour ago, Papaschtroumpf said:

Dart is pretty wimpy

This info might not be 100% accurate as it is taken from mids ( as I don't personally have a robot mm) and it is known to have some inconsistencies but at base value, unenhanced:
Pulse Rifle Blast has 16.36 Damage per Animation Second

Pulse Rifle Burst has 26.82 Damage per Animation Second
Toxic Dark has 37.16 Damage per Animation Second

About the only thing you can get that hits harder is Knockout Blow at 48.83 Damage per Animation Second and that's a melee attack from a PPP that has a 40 sec cooldown. Also for the sake of comparison, Fireball from Heat Mastery EPP has 38.09 Damage per Animation Second

 

Quote

and Vial has a huge endurance cost,

Agreed on that 20 is expensive, but it shouldn't be that big on an issue with some end reduction IOs on a EA character since you can give yourself end back. It can also take Achilles Heel, Annihilation (-res) and a bunch of other super useful IO procs to make it into a really strong power

Edited April 23, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[Papaschtroumpf]

If per "per animation second" means what I think it means, it's not the value I use to gauge an attack unless I'm building an continuous attack chain. It's not like you sit there spamming dart, so "per activation/use" seems more relevant for my purpose.

I think my MRUB didn't show damage values for Experimentation, I'll have to check next time I'm in game.

Looking at the in-game info from the enhancement screen, the per use/activation of the rifle has a higher base value (I want to say 49 vs 26 but I don't remember for sure).

It's the other way for vial vs stun grenade, vial has a higher damage in addition to its -def. The stun grenade is not really useful for it's damage but it's damage mitigation. Vial also has base recharge of 60s I believe and 20 endurance cost. So I think it would be best if well slotted for rechg/end/-def (and acc too ?) If you take it.

I'm also not huge fan of DoT, they keep shooting at me while they die. But I do agree that better base value it not, I do little damage on my own. I can use Shock to pull, so the Pulse Rifle is not great either. I will likely look at an alternate build that uses neither the rifle (except the grenade?) not Experimentation. Probably use a Villain pool?

 

Since +toHit and -def are more or less directly comparable, I'm thinking Tactics may be a cheaper way to counteract foe defenses and doesn't require clicking. Vial does have a better base -def than Tactics though.

 

I'm sticking to Experimentation for now, I may grow to like it, and it suits the IO set bonuses I need. I wish the travel power was more interesting. You can't really use the TP for quick escape unless you already have the run enabled, otherwise you need to pick the run power first. But it's heavy on endurance. 

 

So many choices!

[Seigmoraig]

18 minutes ago, Papaschtroumpf said:

If per "per animation second" means what I think it means, it's not the value I use to gauge an attack unless I'm building an continuous attack chain. It's not like you sit there spamming dart, so "per activation/use" seems more relevant for my purpose.

That's right, it calculates how fast the skill takes to animate vs the damage it does. Based on a straight damage per click value, Pulse Rifle Burst would be stronger than Toxic Dart but Dart is still better then Pulse Rifle Blast. All 3 are pretty weaksauce though since your base modifier is at 0.55.
As for Vial, the Achilles Heel/Annihilation -res proc is a pretty large damage increase and should not be underestimated, from some great info I got in this thread, Achilles adds around 40dps by itself

 

[Papaschtroumpf]

I also stand corrected I was comparing the the T3 gun attack vs Dart, not the T1. Dart is higher base damage than the T1.

yeah I have the Achilles proc in my build in Vial. 

[tidge]

On 4/22/2020 at 1:17 PM, Papaschtroumpf said:

I'm new to MS and made a Bots/EA MM. Lots of good powers in EA so I'm trying to decide what powers if any are skippable.

 

I'm waffling about the pulse rifle powers, EA can be a busy set so between micromanaging the bots and applying EA, I may not need all rifle powers, although I like the AoE Stun as extra mitigation.

 

Maybe a good comparison would be would a Bot/Kin MM take Repair? 

 

 

 

On 4/22/2020 at 8:02 PM, TheSpiritFox said:

Aid pool heal other is genuinely better than repair. Use a secondary heal or aid pool first. Repair is like your last option just can't fit it in the build any other way. 

 

The Robotics primary Repair power is 100% skippable. Heal Other is much more useful.

 

Now, having written this... I respec-ed out of the Medicine pool completely... after a certain level I found that my MM didn't need to micromanage the health of my pets. This was independent of how I was playing (i.e. as a tankermind or not). My main MM's secondary is Traps, so I invested in Triage Beacon instead. This is no substitute for a healing power, but for a team of 'bots against swarms of enemies it is as much attention I want to spend on their health.

 

While leveling up: I skipped the Rifle attacks and focused on Pool powers to vary my play options. I used the Concealment pool (Grant Invisibility), Medicine, Teleportation (Teleport Foe, Recall Friend), Flight (Group Fly with pets is fun!). It was only after lvl 50 that I respec-ed into the Rifle attacks... but that was specifically to add KnockDown into the attacks (because the Bots also had knockdown and I wanted the enemies to sit in the fire patch) and to have the option to draw aggro from the bots.

[Crysis]

Repair has limited value to a Bots/EA MM.  Skip it.

 

Amp Up has very limited value soloing, and marginal value when teaming unless you team with a player who can get value from the things Amp Up actually “amps.”  The Power Info tab is absolutely erroneous for the power and it boosts only half of what it’s showing.  Power Boost from Epic pools would be a better choice and it actually boosts some of your own powers. Amp Up has almost no effect on Henchmen.

 

Defibrillate has almost zero value late game.  Draining mobs is useless for a steamrolling team in the mid 40’s and up.  The sleep is wasted when nothing survives the first five seconds anyways.

 

I would take at least Photon attack....procc’ed out it does ok damage but the Stun is nice.

 

Almost a dozen Bots/EA Builds in this thread.  EA is “ok” as a set.  Hard to beat /Time.

 

 

 

[Lost Deep]

Repair is skipable if you have other healing sources (like from EA), but on other builds it becomes more prudent. It takes a long time to recharge, but it's a 100% heal for the targeted minion and it can save a minion's bacon if used at the right time. I can certainly see Aid Other from the medicine pool being better if you invest enough to get field medic, but without the investment the interruption chance is problematic. If you want another heal for your minions, Repair definitely works, especially on the T2 or T3 minions with more health.

 

I'd give it a 3 out of 5; it's not essential, but it does what it says it does and isn't a bad choice.

[EyeLuvBooks]

If I have room for it in the build, I take it and add one additional slot and use it to mule Healing IOs. It's great as the 100% heal on the minion that just dropped to 10% health but as others have said simply taking Heal Other will be consistently more useful IMHO.

 

[TheSpiritFox]

Aid pool is really actually a solid little pool if you have an MM with no healing like cold or traps. While the heal isn't a large amount, you can 5 slot it for a panacea 5 piece recharge bonus and take aid pool and field medic with their default slots and aid other becomes something you can fire in the middle of a jump with a quick recharge. The heal is lower than repairs but you can heal again in 5 seconds or less generally. Lots more healing over time than repair provides, and firing field medic makes it heal for more in a pinch. I think mine heals for like 380 with field medic popped? That's a solid chunk of a bruiser or assault bot's health every 5 seconds. I've had my assault bot tank AVs directly and healed him through it with aid pool. 

[LordScrod]

Echoing other folks here: If there's literally nothing else to take, then sure. Repair is a nearly instant full heal with good range on it, so that's cool, but if you already have access to another heal via your secondary (and Electric Affinity has a solid, fast-cycling chain heal), then you don't need it at all.

 

--Scrod

[Dakkaface]

Not worth it. Repair is kind of nice as an emergency full heal with range, but if you don't have an AOE heal in your secondary, Aid Other has way more uptime and is more functional for healing than Repair.  Especially with how your protector bots can make you waste your cast by hitting your target with their own heal. It also means that if you want you can grab Aid Other, Aid Self and Field Medic. Medicine is especially helpful for Bots/FF, since you'll have plenty of time to apply heals, and your emergency strategy is just PFF+Aid Self. 

Edited June 20, 2020 by Dakkaface