The Warriors are boring - is that a problem?

[Piecemeal]

Will incorporate, oh ye of many Vile Terrors.

[Hew]

On 3/22/2021 at 6:52 PM, TemporalVileTerror said:

That's a very grim prospect . . . 

Not really. This is an effective way for NCSoft to do a market read on content they ostensibly own, without having to do market research. Its win win win for them. We are just lucky we get to be guinea pigs.

[TemporalVileTerror]

At the risk of subverting what's been a very informative thread with a rant, I'll just say that I am deeply disgusted with the idea of the Homecoming Team handing over the creative rights of their own original work to NC. 

The entire games industry is a fucking disaster for workers' rights presently, and while I know the Homecoming Team may need some leverage to try and secure a favourable position in the negotiations, it really rubs me raw to think of this Team having to hand over their hard work to a company which already demonstrated a cavalier disregard for the value of people's work and creative investment.  

Not that many publishers are any better, of course, so I don't single out NC in this regard beyond the specifics that they are apparently the rights' holders to City of Heroes, on paper.

[Christopher Robin]

On 3/22/2021 at 9:33 PM, Piecemeal said:

In regard to the whole "How do I address you?" question:

 

I'm going to be as delicate and straight-forward with this as I can. And keep in mind, I'm an ally, so I'll always try my best to respect your position and what you tell me you are. But for me?

 

I'm just me. I actually don't mind what pronouns you choose for me. I can happily exist in whatever identity you need me to be. I don't see the world through a pronoun-focused lens, and I don't expect people to subscribe to whatever I consider myself to be mentally or physically. I've always naively seen the world in the best light - we're all just people with limitless potential trying to find our purpose and value in life. I've got who I am and what I liked worked out and locked down, I just never bring it into what I'm doing - it's personal and on this platform, irrelevant to an extent.

 

I rather enjoyed the character of Janet on The Good Place for her all-encompassing knowledge of the universe, and her charming innocence in being limited to human scope of interaction. So consider me a Conduit, an Operator, another program in the system. I'm here for you!

 

 

With that said, there's been a LOT of really good information submitted here and elsewhere. Hopefully in a few weeks I'll have another followup.

 

I love the idea of the Wharf Rats, the weapons, the costumes. I'm working on a LOT of things in these coming patches, a lot of which is subtle and outside of the story arcs. (LFG whatwhat)

I may create another Developer Discussion thread with the ideas pushed forth by you all and some teaser pictures. I hope it doesn't disappoint!

 

Well said Janet.

Also I seriously need to see this show,

it keeps coming up and I've heard good things.

 

To the Binge-Mobile Batman!

[Hew]

The Good Place was FANTASTIC. We heard about it from my sort-of little brother, watched an episode or two, then binged the whole damn thing over a few weeks. 1 to 2 episodes a night. 

[TalynDerre]

I will say, I will be disappointed if they bring female mobs into the warriors.  The Warriors definitely have an ugly, misogynistic 'macho' ethos - that's why they are VILLAINS.  One of my favorite bits of lore about the Warriors was a social worker interviewing people who considered the Warriors to be local heroes (mostly because they fought to keep the Tsoo and the Freakshow out of 'their' neighborhoods) - right up until the point where one of their Elites murdered his girlfriend because she spilled some wine on him when she was serving him.  He picked her up and threw her out of a window, if I recall correctly.

 

Another thing to consider is that their chief, 'Odysseus' Hill, is not only a violent, macho jackass, but he's also disrespectful to the Greek culture he supposedly idealizes - one of the two women in his 'harem' who accompany him in his office is named Persephone; that is, the wife of Hades, the only functional marriage in Greek mythology.  Implying that you were able to 'win' her from Hades is a SERIOUS mythological no-no. 

 

I can't recall the name of the other 'girlfriend,' but it was something equally blasphemous.

 

This guy has got a SERIOUS impious hubris problem.

Edited May 25, 2021 by TalynDerre
Typo demon strikes again!

[Luminara]

1 hour ago, TalynDerre said:

Persephone; that is, the wife of Hades, the only functional marriage in Greek mythology

 

Persephone was kidnapped, held prisoner by Hades until Zeus demanded that he return her to her mother (Demeter).  When Zeus put his foot down, Hades agreed to release her, under the condition that she neither ate nor drank anything while in Tartarus... and proceeded to trick her into eating by telling her he'd release her and suggesting that she eat before leaving, upon which the agreement with Zeus mandated that she spend part of the year in Tartarus with Hades.

 

Furthermore, there's nothing in Greek mythology which states that Persephone was ever happy to be the prisoner, wife or queen of Hades.  Quite the opposite, it indicates that she was as despondent as her mother during her time in Tartarus (Demeter's suffering is given as the explanation for winter, the period during which she mourns the loss of her daughter, when the ground is as barren as her heart).  The one child purported to come from Hades and Persephone, Melinoë, was "the bringer of nightmares", which further reinforces the implication that the union of Hades and Persephone was most decidedly not happy, or functional, especially in light of the fecundity which nearly every other deific representation was portrayed (Greek deities had sex with anything that moved, and some things that didn't (with the exception of Artemis, who was represented as eternally chaste)).

[siolfir]

2 hours ago, Luminara said:

with the exception of Artemis, who was represented as eternally chaste

It was more than just Artemis; Athena and Hestia make up the other "main" virgin goddesses (wikipedia has several others listed).

That's not to say that the rest of the post was incorrect, just that there was more than one that was viewed as chaste.

[Luminara]

2 hours ago, siolfir said:

It was more than just Artemis; Athena and Hestia make up the other "main" virgin goddesses (wikipedia has several others listed).

That's not to say that the rest of the post was incorrect, just that there was more than one that was viewed as chaste.

 

Yeah, I tend to forget... well, everything once I've started talking about Artemis.  She's my favorite Greek deity, always has been.  Archer, huntress, moon goddess...💘.

 

Oh, right.  Staying focused.  Staying focused.  Thanks for pointing out my oversight.

 

The point I was making, though, was that Persephone's union with Hades was anything but functional.  Zeus' marriage to Hera was more functional, and they were doing spiteful things to each other constantly.

[Seen2BeGreen]

9 hours ago, TalynDerre said:

The Warriors definitely have an ugly, misogynistic 'macho' ethos - that's why they are VILLAINS.

9 hours ago, TalynDerre said:

'Odysseus' Hill, is not only a violent, macho jackass,

 

Ugh. Being Macho or manly does NOT make you a villain. There is nothing wrong with a manly man.

[Christopher Robin]

13 hours ago, Seen2BeGreen said:

Ugh. Being Macho or manly does NOT make you a villain. There is nothing wrong with a manly man.

 

I Know Right?

Being a Macho man clearly makes you a "Face" far more often than a "Heel."

 

 

Also...

 

 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Christopher Robin

[Black Zot]

3 hours ago, Luminara said:

The point I was making, though, was that Persephone's union with Hades was anything but functional.  Zeus' marriage to Hera was more functional, and they were doing spiteful things to each other constantly.

 

Considering what the ancient Greeks thought constituted a good marriage, Persephone was considered to have one of the better deals among the gods, where she at least had a faithful husband who considered her opinion on matters not relating to being married.  Still not great, but she was one of the few cases where the woman's side of the relationship was given ANY thought.

 

Also, LOL @ the idea the Zeus/Hera mess was better than that.  The only reason to believe those two were married was because they claimed it was so.  Zeus slept with everyone BUT Hera, and Hera spent most of her time trying to murder his assorted children.  That's WAY beyond spite.