Psi Melee - Why so terrible?

[Outrider_01]

2 hours ago, TygerDarkstorm said:

Huh, yeah, Idk, I logged onto my grav/savage dom right before I posted that just to double check the power. I've heard Paragon Wiki can be a bit outdated though.

Yeah, though its usually 90% accurate like  stone monument.  That to its current form, total opposites so probably an uninformed person wrote it before they archived the site.

[biostem]

I think they should either split the set into psi blades and psi fists, or add power customization options so you can have all psi blades or all fists - having a mix of both makes the set feel, IMO, inconsistent.

[Troo]

2 hours ago, biostem said:

I think they should either split the set into psi blades and psi fists, or add power customization options so you can have all psi blades or all fists - having a mix of both makes the set feel, IMO, inconsistent.

 

This could be said for many powersets.. {looking at you Fire and Ice}

 

On 4/30/2021 at 1:08 PM, Lazarillo said:

 (probably not surprising that both Psi and Savage were half-baked, unfinished sets at the time the game originally ended).

 

I'll buy this.

If the animations were buttery smooth, I would play this regardless of effectiveness. The whole windup, pause, release is sub optimal.

 

The animations are so awesome

 

..but the pauses ruin them.

[Leogunner]

4 hours ago, biostem said:

I think they should either split the set into psi blades and psi fists, or add power customization options so you can have all psi blades or all fists - having a mix of both makes the set feel, IMO, inconsistent.

I'm probably in the minority that either doesn't mind the animations or actually likes the juttery motions as they were trying to make it feel impactful.  They could probably improve that though.

 

My Psi melee Stalker has the powers colored to look like air since his attacks are meant to be condensed super-chilled air emitted and controlled by his mind and trying to hurt someone with air might be a bit tougher than anime portrays.  I wouldn't mind them giving alternate animations to help people that want consistency but I get the feeling the design was aiming to make a kind of "construct" melee that creates various objects to attack their targets, not a specific object that you manipulate for all your attacks (like a weapon melee set).

 

That said, yeah, give all the sets a "sword" version and a "hand" version but maybe add in a spiked mace, a gatling gun (for the cone), a pair of wings beating (for the tier 9), or something as wild cards to emphasize the set's concept.

[biostem]

8 minutes ago, Leogunner said:

I'm probably in the minority that either doesn't mind the animations or actually likes the juttery motions as they were trying to make it feel impactful.  They could probably improve that though.

It's not that I dislike the animations - it's that I want, for instance, a psi-blade wielder or a hard-light-construct (fist) user, but not both at the same time...

[MTeague]

On 4/30/2021 at 3:02 PM, Yomo Kimyata said:

I detest all the elemental swords.  They are forbidden.

This exactly why my Fire/Fire/Fire Sentinel is a Sentinel and not a Brute or Blaster.  (yes, I skipped FSC in his epic pool).

And yet... I don't mind the Psi-Blades in Psi Melee. 

 

For whatever reason the flaming scimitar is a total non-starter to me, asthetically, and feel like "why concentrate fire into the shape of a blade to strike a physical blow with it, why not just BURN THEM!!?".  But the Psi-Blade, work for me.  I guess I can see it especially for a character who's background leaves them half-or-totally-untrained,  and they're just making it in the shape of a blade, out of instinct, not really knowing HOW, just reaching for the familiar, trying for a knife, to attack with because they don't KNOW how to just do a psionic blast from afar.  

 

Why don't I afford Fire Swords the same latitude? I don't know.  But that is how the very odd thought process works in my brain. 

Edited May 2, 2021 by MTeague

[Leogunner]

24 minutes ago, MTeague said:

This exactly why my Fire/Fire/Fire Sentinel is a Sentinel and not a Brute or Blaster.  (yes, I skipped FSC in his epic pool).

And yet... I don't mind the Psi-Blades in Psi Melee. 

 

For whatever reason the flaming scimitar is a total non-starter to me, asthetically, and feel like "why concentrate fire into the shape of a blade to strike a physical blow with it, why not just BURN THEM!!?".  But the Psi-Blade, work for me.  I guess I can see it especially for a character who's background leaves them half-or-totally-untrained,  and they're just making it in the shape of a blade, out of instinct, not really knowing HOW, just reaching for the familiar, trying for a knife, to attack with because they don't KNOW how to just do a psionic blast from afar.  

 

Why don't I afford Fire Swords the same latitude? I don't know.  But that is how the very odd thought process works in my brain. 

 

That and it also leaves the concept more open to more than simply psionic melee.  With the advent of weapon, power color and power animation customization, fire melee can be more than just fire melee.

 

On my Fire/Shield/Leviathan once-Brute-but-now-Tanker, his fire melee is actually a manifestation of his Dragon-necromancy powers while the rest of his fiery moves are literal fire since he's a dragon...but fire really only comes from his mouth (dragon heritage and all that) so he only uses the swords, Combustion (only while flying) and Breath of Fire.  If the rest of the melee attacks had sword attacks, I guess he would use them as other dragon-necromancy sword attacks but the fun of his concept is that he can swap out his "throat" for that of other elemental dragons.  He's got a sonic mouth blast, ice breath and acid breath to accompany his sword that melts living flesh to bone.

 

Overall, I think it's what you make of a concept that's the most fun about making characters in this system.

[Eldyem]

I think that the Insight lockout is the reason Psi feels so terrible. I understand that there was a desire to not be a "hit three times and then use a big attack" set again but the loooong lockout feels atrocious when Insight is random enough as-is. I feel like I'm doing good, not great, damage with Insight up and trash damage without it. It's just an awkward mechanic that messes up the flow of the set.

I actually really like Psi's bizarre animations, very JoJo's Bizarre Adventure meets Psylocke, but I can't for the life of me figure out how they came to that artistic direction.

[ForeverLaxx]

10 hours ago, Leogunner said:

One could say that is either a "you" problem or one could use this as another example of just how exceedingly easy the game is that mostly no thought is utilized when committing to a combat engagement.

 

Some might respond that "they like the game easy so they can relax" to which I'd reply "turn your settings down then".

You're right. It's definitely a "me" problem that teams can nuke spawns faster than Boggle takes to animate and no one cares if that Sky Raider Drone is friendly or not. You caught me.

[Lazarillo]

On 4/30/2021 at 11:56 PM, Outrider_01 said:

Savage melee is pretty decent, trick is to build it up to 3-4 and consume with Hemorrhage or Rending Flurry before hitting 5. 

I know how the "best" use of it works, I just don't really feel like, given how much more "effort" it takes compared to other sets, with how closely the management works, that it's comparatively rewarding.  Basically you have to do more, to get the same results.

 

And Psi is similar, with the addition of a luck factor to make it even more annoying.

[Kismet Cowboy]

On 5/1/2021 at 7:04 AM, ForeverLaxx said:

The animations are what I don't like, or rather, how stiff and ad hoc they are.

This is what has always put me off the set. Thematically I love it, the sfx I think is great, and even the sound design works for me, but the animation looks very stiff, unnatural, and unfinished. Would work great for a robot/cyborg character though, where the stiffness might actually compliment the concept.

[Hexquisite]

As someone who mains a Psi Melee character - my namesake here, Hexquisite, Psi/Invuln Brute - I can say that a lot of what's said here is accurate, with the exception of the comments about the animations. I've never found those to be particularly stiff. And Greater Psi Blade has one of my favorite animations in-game, for feeling like a complete badass. It's damage is adequate, but nothing to write home about, and it's very lacking in really strong AoE.

 

All that said, Psi Melee is the first set I ever took to 50. And I took it to 50 the long way - no farms, just going through content. Mostly solo, only regularly joining teams after around level 40. It's not a set you want if you're biggest concern is the Orange Numbers or being able to steamroll* through everything. There are more powerful, much more obvious choices for that. What Psi Melee was, for me, was a perfect fit for a character concept - Hex is not psionic. She's a witch who specializes in physical magic, and Psi Melee was the most interesting set I could find that I could RP as being just raw magical force without tying it into any specific element. And it was a set I'd never played before, which was another draw factor.

 

Keeping an eye on Insight is something you can do, but honestly, not something you should concern yourself with - unless, again, the Orange Numbers are what's important to you. It works like a proc, gives a little boost, but always best to end it on your terms rather than attempt to eke out every last bit you can. Missing out on the massive burst damage an Insight-fueled Greater Psi Blade strike isn't worth letting it run out because you want a few more swings of Psi Blade Sweep or Telekinetic Blow. Wait out the lock, wait for it to pop again, repeat.

 

It takes a bit more forethought to effectively use Psionic Melee, and again, if the Orange Numbers are what you concern yourself with most, you're never going to satisfied. I would even argue that Psi Melee is a good melee set for someone looking for a challenge - you won't steamroll* everything, and your focus is on single-target damage, so some strategy is in order.

 

And most importantly, the set is fun. It's not the best. It doesn't need to be. But calling it "terrible" is honestly just showing that you haven't really tried.

 

 

 

*This almost caused a tangent on my hatred for the steamroll mindset, but it was grossly off-topic.

[Hew]

I never played psi on a stalker, so take this with some salt: Insight is the worst mechanic EVER.