Any guide out there on how to build a Build?

[Bananiac]

Hi there,

 

so, I have been going through my stable of high level toons and incarnates and have tried my hands a little at creating builds, really just by taking over other players builds posted here spomewhere and tweaking them to my liking.

 

But I find that most of my powersets are seemingly more uncommon combinations, it is difficult to find something to start with. So I am thinking about just biting into the apple and starting to create my own builds, but I am struggling with where to start and how to determine power choices, slotting and set boni etc....

 

So asking to the pros: what is the process? Is there any kind of systematic approach to this that one can follow when creating a monster?

 

🙏

[Hyperstrike]

Not really.  Builds are always balancing acts.
And depending on what you're chasing (Recharge, Regen, Resist, Defense, etc) your build loadout can change fairly dramatically based on your priorities.

Power selection is one of the things that can be made more dependable.
As you level up, it can sometimes be hard to justify a power selection at a given level.

But exemping later it can make a lot more sense.  So always keep an eye on exempability.

[Ura Hero]

I just did a build for a Seismic/Time Corruptor from zero.  I knew I wanted as much defense as possible, mainly ranged and AOE.  Secondary was going for a decent amount of recharge.  So this is sort of what I did.

 

1. Pick Primary and Secondary powers that I wanted and that I thought were the best for the first 38 levels.

2. Look at the Pool powers for what I wanted as well as what would help reach goal #1 and #2.

3. Look at Epic/Patron powers for the same.

4. Decided to take as many Defense powers as possible.  This satisfied both build goals by enabling LoTG +7.5% recharge as well as getting the defense from the powers themselves.   I did pick the fighting pool so I could dip into tough for the two +3% defense IOs.

5. Start slotting.  I first slotted my attack powers after looking carefully at the IO bonuses I could get.

6. Other powers were slotted based on what seemed like the best bang for the buck both in bonuses and trying not to break the bank just by slotting all purples if they didn't fit my two goals.

 

Here is the build so you can see how I managed my goals.

 

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Level 49 Magic Corruptor
Primary Power Set: Seismic Blast
Secondary Power Set: Time Manipulation
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1:    Shatter                ShlBrk-DefDeb(A), ShlBrk-Acc/DefDeb(3), ShlBrk-Acc/Rchg(3), ShlBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(27), ShlBrk-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(27), ShlBrk-%Dam(29)
Level 1:    Time Crawl            IceMisTrmt-End/Slow(A), IceMisTrmt-Dam/Rech(11), IceMisTrmt-Dam/Slow(45), IceMisTrmt-Acc/Dam/End(46), IceMisTrmt-Acc/Dam/End/Rech(46), IceMisTrmt-+ColdDmg(46)
Level 2:    Temporal Mending        NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(A)
Level 4:    Time's Juncture            PcnoftheT-Acc/Slow(A), PcnoftheT-Dmg/Slow(5), PcnoftheT-Acc/EndRdx(5), PcnoftheT-Rng/Slow(17), PcnoftheT-EndRdx/Rchg/Slow(25), PcnoftheT--Rchg%(25)
Level 6:    Entomb                ShlBrk-DefDeb(A), ShlBrk-Acc/DefDeb(7), ShlBrk-Acc/Rchg(7), ShlBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(15), ShlBrk-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(15), ShlBrk-%Dam(17)
Level 8:    Seismic Force            GssSynFr--ToHit(A), GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg(9), GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(9), GssSynFr--Rchg/EndRdx(11), GssSynFr--ToHit/EndRdx(13), GssSynFr--Build%(13)
Level 10:    Fly                BlsoftheZ-ResKB(A)
Level 12:    Upthrust            SprMlcoft-Acc/Dmg(A), SprMlcoft-Dmg/Rchg(29), SprMlcoft-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), SprMlcoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprMlcoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprMlcoft-Rchg/Dmg%(34)
Level 14:    Temporal Selection        Mrc-Rcvry+(A)
Level 16:    Distortion Field        Lck-Acc/Hold(A), Lck-Acc/Rchg(42), Lck-Rchg/Hold(43), Lck-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(43), Lck-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(43), Lck-%Hold(45)
Level 18:    Tombstone            ExcCnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExcCnt-Dmg/EndRdx(19), ExcCnt-Dmg/ActRdx(19), ExcCnt-Dmg/Rng(21), ExcCnt-Dmg/Rchg(21), ExcCnt-Stun%(23)
Level 20:    Time Stop            SprEnt-Acc/Hold(A), SprEnt-Hold/Rchg(40), SprEnt-End/Rchg(40), SprEnt-Acc/Hold/End(40), SprEnt-Acc/Hold/End/Rchg(42), SprEnt-Rchg/AbsorbProc(42)
Level 22:    Hasten                RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(23)
Level 24:    Maneuvers            LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 26:    Stalagmite            Stp-Acc/Rchg(A), Stp-EndRdx/Stun(34), Stp-Acc/EndRdx(36), Stp-Stun/Rng(36), Stp-Acc/Stun/Rchg(36), Stp-KB%(37)
Level 28:    Farsight            LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 30:    Kick                SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(47), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(48), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(49)
Level 32:    Meteor                Rgn-Dmg(A), Rgn-Dmg/Rchg(33), Rgn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Rgn-Acc/Rchg(33), Rgn-Dmg/EndRdx(34)
Level 35:    Slowed Response            ShlBrk-DefDeb(A), ShlBrk-Acc/DefDeb(37), ShlBrk-Acc/Rchg(37), ShlBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(39), ShlBrk-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(39), ShlBrk-%Dam(39)
Level 38:    Chrono Shift            PrfShf-End%(A)
Level 41:    Scorpion Shield            LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 44:    Tough                StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(45)
Level 47:    Weave                LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 49:    Hover                LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 1:    Seismic Shockwaves    
Level 1:    Brawl                Empty(A)
Level 1:    Scourge    
Level 1:    Sprint                Empty(A)
Level 2:    Rest                Empty(A)
Level 1:    Swift                Empty(A)
Level 1:    Health                Pnc-Heal/+End(A)
Level 1:    Hurdle                Empty(A)
Level 1:    Stamina                PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(47)
Level 10:    Afterburner    
Level 49:    Quick Form    
------------

 

https://www.midsreborn.com/builds/download.php?uc=1424&c=672&a=1344&f=HEX&dc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

Edited April 1, 2022 by Ura Hero

[Omega Force]

I start with the concept and power animations.  If a power looks stupid in Icon or doesn't fit the character, I don't take it.  Travel power NLT 14, for Posi 1.  I try to take the pools in alphabetical order, because the screaming voices in my head don't like it otherwise.  (First letter, at least.  Reverse order is managable, too.)  Flight, Fighting, Leadership, Leaping, [Epic], unless another pool is important enough.

 

Then I start throwing down slots.  Six-slot attacks, ~3 slot defenses while including space for the procs and breakpoints.  (4-slot Reactive Defense for F/C res, Shield Wall for E/N; Titanium Coating or Aegis for SL).  3 slot Health and Stamina, use no more than 2 slots for powers who need common IOs like Hasten.  Before I start using sets, I check the toon's defensive levels and set goals: 90 SL resistance for brutes or tanks with 32% defense; 75 SL for scrappers and squishies (which also aim for 45% ranged defense); enough recharge for perma-dom or -PA.  If those aren't attainable (like resistance for Super Reflexes or perma-Doms), I find a pretty number to compromise.  (I have a SR scrapper build that has 55 SL resistance and positional defense.)  While doing that I try to keep the powers properly enhanced.  (High acc/endredux, red damage, reasonable recharge.)  After achieving my goals, I continue to tweak.  Maybe I can shuffle sets or slots and get a second position to 45%, or can spare the 5th and 6th set bonuses in a hold for purple procs?  Do I really need to 3 slot Stamina when I could throw in another Perf in Quick Recovery?  Do I have thematic melee and ranged options?

[Nemu]

There are 2 things you need to be mindful of when making builds:

 

1 - Focus. Most builds out there lack focus and they try to do a little bit of everything and end up being not so good at anything they attempt to achieve. Know your game plan, know what powers and what set bonuses you need to achieve your game plan, and don't deviate from from that plan until you achieve your planned goal. For example, if my goal on a blaster is survival I'd try to hit the survival goals such as softcap range defense, before I start playing around with other ideas such as procs or other bonuses.

 

2 - Slotting efficiency. If you allocate just 1 slot to get 1.25% defense in one power and you have to allocate 5 slots to get 2.5% defense in another power, what's more efficient for your slots? Spotting opportunities like that is what top end builders do. A lot of average builds out there will 6 slot a full set into a power and call it a day. If you want to elevate your builds above those, understanding and optimizing your slots is the key. The very rare purple sets are a good example. If your build focuses on global recharge, you get that bonus at the 5 slot from your hecatombs, Armageddons, apocalypses. etc... Yet you'll see a lot of builds that slot the full set. What's that last slot doing for your global recharge? Absolutely nothing. Good builders will spot those, and move those slots elsewhere to squeeze in another recharge bonus or something else useful somewhere else.

 

These two ideas also does not equate to cookie cutter builds. But just because you veer off the beaten path doesn't mean you can't optimize within your own framework of pool powers and power combinations.

 

If you want to learn I can teach you. Here's some reading material to start:
 

 

[Bananiac]

This is plain and simple the first step of what I have been looking for. Thanks a lot guys for taking the time to write down and explain these things.
I will give it a try on another of my more exotic toons and maybe what follows is another masterclass of dissection and reassembly 🙂 

 

[Without_Pause]

I have two schools of thoughts.

 

1. Use Mids to plan out a build and get the numbers down as well as you can. I can do this more with things I am comfortable with and I know I can crank out a build after 4+ passes. Then I roll the character.

 

2. Wing it. Seriously. You can get to 50 just fine on common IOs. Adding anything from the rarer IOs is just gravy even if it isn't the ideal slotting. I don't use 2x XP boosters pretty much ever these days unless it is a build I am really comfortable with and just wanting to get it to 50. Lesser known builds, I feel like I want to slow level it and even solo to where I get a proper feel for it. I soloed a Ice/stone Brute to 50 because of this. I'm doing normal leveling/soloing for a Grav/ta partly because I enjoy playing it and want to savor the ride to 50. Also, I feel like I don't know what I'm doing with building it. I actually refuse to really even look at a person's build because I want it to be "mine." So yeah, I'm winging it. Trying out "all the things." See what works. Seeing what doesn't. There was a time I also grabbed numerous uncommon recipes and even ones without 6 in a set for lower level slotting. I even grabbed one with just 3 in a set. I would frakenslot away. Again, any bonus is exactly that. We get so many respecs, additional builds, and unslotters there's no reason not to experiment away and embrace a flawed and messy build.

 

Builds are just so different to do across all ATs there isn't a good way to find set in stone guidelines. The closest thing I have to a generic list is this.

• Know where to slot the ATOs.
• Know where to slot your ones offs, see auto powers.
• Know what sets give you the set bonuses you need.
• Know the slots you need to get said bonuses.
• Add in procs where deemed beneficial. Not all procs are worth slotting.
• Make sure you have a proper end recovery/end drain balance.
• Can get the recharge to perma anything you need.

[Bananiac]

 

On 4/5/2022 at 4:32 PM, Without_Pause said:

...

2. Wing it. Seriously. You can get to 50 just fine on common IOs. Adding anything from the rarer IOs is just gravy even if it isn't the ideal slotting.

...

 

 

Thanks for the input. This here has really been my takeaway for most of the toons I got to 50 now. I usually get by without any slotting anything until I hit the 20ies, where I start to add standard lvl25 or lvl30 IOs to boost up hit rate, endu management etc. This is usually where I start to notice that your effectiveness takes a serious hit if you don't do something about it. 

And then I ride this out until I hit 50. At this point I have probably taken most of the powers from my primary and secondary, just to get to understand which mechanics I like and which powers hit hard and which don't, which pool or epic works well with the concept, etc.

 

And then it is getting interesting, putting a build together and developping the complementary incarnate abilities. This is where I still use the help of other builds, which I tweak for the powersets and powers I want to use. I generally give thematic fit and concept the nod over efficiency, so my builds tend to be not super optimized. But the immediate power level jump from my "level-up" build to the Set IO build is usually so massive that I still feel god-like with the monsters that I have created! 🙂 

 

Money not being an issue for my builds is going a long way in supporting this playstyle, I have to admit...

 

 

 

[Hyperstrike]

If you haven't FOOBAR'ed a build in Mids, you've never used Mids.

[User]

Are there any good rules of thumb for when it's worth it to invest in winter origin enhancements? There's the obvious fire farming case and I guess for some def builds they're a good choice? It feels like they ask for a pretty big slot investment though.

[Hyperstrike]

35 minutes ago, User said:

Are there any good rules of thumb for when it's worth it to invest in winter origin enhancements? There's the obvious fire farming case and I guess for some def builds they're a good choice? It feels like they ask for a pretty big slot investment though.

For set bonuses?

 

Slot2

Melee: Run Speed/Fly/Recharge Time Slow Resist
PBAOE: Run Speed/Fly/Recharge Time Slow Resist
TargetedAOE: Run Speed/Fly/Recharge Time Slow Resist
Ranged: Fire/Cold/Mez Resist
Hold: Fire/Cold/Mez Resist

 

Slot3

 

Melee: End Recovery
PBAOE: Fire/Cold/Mez Resist
TargetedAOE: Fire/Cold/Mez Resist
Ranged: Run Speed/Fly/Recharge Time Slow Resist
Hold:  Run Speed/Fly/Recharge Time Slow Resist

 

Slot4

 

Melee: Fire/Cold/Mez Resist
PBAOE: End Recovery
TargetedAOE: End Recovery
Ranged: End Recovery
Hold: End Recovery

 

Slot5

 

Melee: SLM Defense
PBAOE: SLM Defense
TargetedAOE: FC-AoE Defense
Ranged: ENR Defense
Hold: ENR Defense

 

Slot6

 

Melee: FC-AoE Defense
PBAOE: FC-AoE Defense
TargetedAOE: FC-AoE Defense
Ranged: FC-AoE Defense
Hold: FC-AoE Defense
 

 

If you're fighting lots of stuff tossing down slows?  2-3 slotting.

Fighting stuff tossing lots of Cold/Fire Damage?  2-3 slotting.

End Recovery's always nice.  All 5 Winter-O sets at 4 slots will give you 20% End Recovery.  Add that to all your Accolades, End boosts from Health uniques, and that's a HELL of a lot of End efficiency.

Additional defenses at 5 and all Fire/Cold/AoE at 6 slots.  Tankmania.
 

[User]

I totally blanked on the end. Sounds like it might be a great choice for dark/dark then.

[Hyperstrike]

5 hours ago, User said:

I totally blanked on the end. Sounds like it might be a great choice for dark/dark then.

Not to put TOO fine a point on it?

[Six-Six]

Here's my take:

builds are quite intimate. they don't depend so much on the AT or Power sets/combos (e.g. you can slot a Corr's X-blast the same way you slot a Blaster's X-blast, or similarly a Y armour whether you're on a Tanker, Stalker, Scrapper or Brute). Yes there will will be variations, but they will be minimal. 

The thing that sets a build apart is your play style. If you and I have the exact same powers on the same AT, they can still be built different. Even if they were built the same, one could be used to greater effect than the other. And this is the beauty of the game.

I think the best way to get what you're looking for is to play your toon and fine tune it as you go. When I was teaching myself the different ATs, I would lurk around threads trying to pick up tips here and there. I would even try a build someone shared and use it as a starting point. Then I would modify it to fit my style.

a few tips I've picked up over the years:
some powers tend to favour procs more than others.
some will have you chasing set bonuses while others can be left with just one or two slots.
I've also found that I enjoy certain powers even if they suck or if I thought they would suck.
just because a power is available to you doesn't mean you have to take it.

Bottom line is, play, play and keep playing. and just have fun. there's no right or wrong. 

[Hyperstrike]

17 minutes ago, Six-Six said:

Here's my take:

builds are quite intimate. they don't depend so much on the AT or Power sets/combos (e.g. you can slot a Corr's X-blast the same way you slot a Blaster's X-blast, or similarly a Y armour whether you're on a Tanker, Stalker, Scrapper or Brute). Yes there will will be variations, but they will be minimal. 

The thing that sets a build apart is your play style. If you and I have the exact same powers on the same AT, they can still be built different. Even if they were built the same, one could be used to greater effect than the other. And this is the beauty of the game.

I think the best way to get what you're looking for is to play your toon and fine tune it as you go. When I was teaching myself the different ATs, I would lurk around threads trying to pick up tips here and there. I would even try a build someone shared and use it as a starting point. Then I would modify it to fit my style.

a few tips I've picked up over the years:
some powers tend to favour procs more than others.
some will have you chasing set bonuses while others can be left with just one or two slots.
I've also found that I enjoy certain powers even if they suck or if I thought they would suck.
just because a power is available to you doesn't mean you have to take it.

Bottom line is, play, play and keep playing. and just have fun. there's no right or wrong. 

Yeah.  My main precept is "When in doubt, TANK IT OUT!".

I've tanked the craziest things.  On ATs where people are like "Uh.  What're you doing?"

I tend to like durability over maximal damage output.

This makes my kill speed slower.  But I can usually survive that.

Or I can at least fight to an eternal stand still (alone).  So I rely on my teammates to bring the damage output.

Edited April 25, 2023 by Hyperstrike