VEAT Power Customization

[Tower_XVI]

Hello! I made this suggestion two years ago in June and logged in recently to work on my Fortunata and felt the sting of ugly pink psychic attacks once more so I'd like to throw the question out there again if permitted.

 

Would be it at all possible to make VEAT abilities (like Fortunata psychic abilities) customizable color-wise and such like the rest of the abilities in the game?

[Sakura Tenshi]

Regnarj/

 

by which I mean I massively agree. My own fortunata wants green psychic attacks.

[Lazarillo]

The only real downside to this is that I might very well end up losing all will to play anything else.

[General Idiot]

They already did customisable Kheldian powers so there's no reason not to do customisable spiders too beyond the dev resources required to make it happen. Fortunatas would be slightly easier as the customisable FX already exists on other psychic sets (I think?) but customisable energy blasts for Banes and Crabs would be a lot more effort.

 

I'd love to see it happen though, maybe alongside a general balance pass on both ATs. (Make the Bane mace aoe blasts not suck, please!)

[Wavicle]

Color customization.

Weapon customization.

No Redraw options.

 

Please and thank you.

[Alchemystic]

I went poking around to see why this hasn't already happened, and the answer is that VEATs draw from the same power FX files as Arachnos NPCs. They don't use a copy of them, they use the exact same file. This means any attempts to customise the FX that VEATs have results in weird things happening to Arachnos too, so the only way for it to work is if the devs completely overhauled the FX that VEATs have so that they exist as their own separate thing, which is a lot of work.

 

You might be wondering, why doesn't this happen to Mace Mastery? Simple answer is Castle was lazy, he decided when making VEATs to just use the NPC powers to save time and effort instead of making custom powers like Mace Mastery, resulting in yet another technical blunder that the HC team are having to deal with.

 

Thankfully it's something the HC devs are well aware of, and it's being looked into at least.

[General Idiot]

That is honestly an impressive level of laziness, wow.

[Lazarillo]

19 minutes ago, General Idiot said:

That is honestly an impressive level of laziness, wow.

In fairness, VEATs came into being back when the idea of power customization was still "never going to happen", so it probably wasn't seen as too important.

[Greycat]

VEATs always seemed a bit rushed to me, honestly.  Just in little things here or there, like some of the VEAT arcs.

[Rudra]

They still work better than HEATs in my opinion.

[El D]

5 hours ago, General Idiot said:

That is honestly an impressive level of laziness, wow.

 

 

5 hours ago, Lazarillo said:

In fairness, VEATs came into being back when the idea of power customization was still "never going to happen", so it probably wasn't seen as too important.

 

That's definitely an understandable explanation for it, but it's also still using the minimum amount of effort to make the VEATs work. Which, given development constraints and wanting to put time in for making 'actually new things' rather than just a 'modified version of something that already exists and functions perfectly well for the concept' I totally get. It's that kind of 'This does what we need it to do, don't need to go further' type thing.

 

I mean, given that the entire archetype is based around 'Being a playable version of this group of NPCs' it does make sense to just use the attacks that already exist... but it's also still lazy compared to making something whole cloth like the HEATs. Not in a judgmental sense but just a relatable, productive sort of laziness, the 'only go far enough to make it work and move on because we've got a TIME LIMIT' kind that I don't begrudge them at all for.

 

Also, as fun as they are to play I still find it odd that 'Arachnos Minion' was the epic villain archetype of choice given just how many folks took issue with how often CoV already put player characters under Arachnos' thumb. 'Players don't like being reminded that Arachnos rules everything about Reside and want more independent villainous content that's not contracting out to them.' 'I know! Let's make the epic archetype's concept as the player directly working for them!' That said I suppose there weren't too many other options for Redside factions to play around with that would allow for that much customization, and it does still fit the epic AT design scheme of 'signature faction for the player to join' (given Kheldians on Blueside, and the Devoured/Clockwork PEATs that never got off the ground).

Edited May 27, 2022 by El D

[Rudra]

40 minutes ago, El D said:

Also, as fun as they are to play I still find it odd that 'Arachnos Minion' was the epic villain archetype of choice given just how many folks took issue with how often CoV already put player characters under Arachnos' thumb. 'Players don't like being reminded that Arachnos rules everything about Reside and want more independent villainous content that's not contracting out to them.' 'I know! Let's make the epic archetype's concept as the player directly working for them!'

Well, to be fair, as a VEAT you are bucking the system and defying Arachnos to find your own destiny as a self-made Destined One.

[Rudra]

And I guess I should have said I still prefer VEATs over HEATs instead of saying they work better. *shrug* I enjoy playing VEATs. I hate playing HEATs.

[Wavicle]

I really like them both, but they both have outstanding QoL issues.

[biostem]

41 minutes ago, El D said:

Also, as fun as they are to play I still find it odd that 'Arachnos Minion' was the epic villain archetype of choice given just how many folks took issue with how often CoV already put player characters under Arachnos' thumb. 'Players don't like being reminded that Arachnos rules everything about Reside and want more independent villainous content that's not contracting out to them.' 'I know! Let's make the epic archetype's concept as the player directly working for them!' That said I suppose there weren't too many other options for Redside factions to play around with that would allow for that much customization, and it does still fit the epic AT design scheme of 'signature faction for the player to join' (given Kheldians on Blueside, and the Devoured/Clockwork PEATs that never got off the ground).

Unless I'm mistaken, VEATs can still go through the alignment missions and become heroes.  On top of that, you blatantly defy your patron in at least Black Scorpion's arc, so using Arachnos' training and resources for your own benefit doesn't seem all that out of line...

[Sakura Tenshi]

On the note of powers, I just find it a little surprising since I was sure VEATs possess a number of powers actual Arachnos don’t like Heavy Burst, Venom Grenade, Psychic Wail, and Omega maneuver. Also wouldn’t this mean if the live devs came to see some Arachnos mobs as too overturned, a nerf to them would nerf VEAT characters?

[El D]

3 hours ago, Rudra said:

Well, to be fair, as a VEAT you are bucking the system and defying Arachnos to find your own destiny as a self-made Destined One.

 

3 hours ago, biostem said:

Unless I'm mistaken, VEATs can still go through the alignment missions and become heroes.  On top of that, you blatantly defy your patron in at least Black Scorpion's arc, so using Arachnos' training and resources for your own benefit doesn't seem all that out of line...

 

You're both right, though I more meant regarding in-general concept rather than what the storyline/side-swapping mechanics provide - bucking the system and becoming another alignment or not, powers-wise and costume-slot-wise, still locked into being a spider minion. >.>

 

Also, not sure I'd consider the Destined One thing bucking the system too much. Sure, it gets them out of the rank-and-file, but it's still a massive program controlled by Recluse for 95% of the game's content. That said, 'completely depose Arachnos from the Isles' was also never going to happen, so I suppose that's really as close as the game was ever going to let us get. xD

Edited May 28, 2022 by El D

[Rudra]

9 minutes ago, Sakura Tenshi said:

On the note of powers, I just find it a little surprising since I was sure VEATs possess a number of powers actual Arachnos don’t like Heavy Burst, Venom Grenade, Psychic Wail, and Omega maneuver. Also wouldn’t this mean if the live devs came to see some Arachnos mobs as too overturned, a nerf to them would nerf VEAT characters?

Aside from Omega Maneuver and the summons, the powers listed for Arachnos Soldiers and Arachnos Widows all seem to exist on the existing mobs in some form. Psychic Wail is the description for Static Overload on the Arachnos Heavy Blaster. Heavy Burst is used by the Wolf Spider Assaults. So on and so forth. Except, as stated, Omega and summons. So the PC versions are all types in a pick your adventure style set up for development.

[biostem]

13 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Aside from Omega Maneuver and the summons, the powers listed for Arachnos Soldiers and Arachnos Widows all seem to exist on the existing mobs in some form. Psychic Wail is the description for Static Overload on the Arachnos Heavy Blaster. Heavy Burst is used by the Wolf Spider Assaults. So on and so forth. Except, as stated, Omega and summons. So the PC versions are all types in a pick your adventure style set up for development.

Even the Kheldians are mostly recolors of existing powers, with a few new ones built just for them.  I wonder how much of the VEATS was decided upon from a practicality standpoint and how much for thematic/creative reasons...

[Wavicle]

Included in Weapon Customization: Making sure the Bane Spider Mace and the Black Scorpion Mace have plenty of overlapping skins!

[General Idiot]

On 5/28/2022 at 12:43 PM, biostem said:

Even the Kheldians are mostly recolors of existing powers, with a few new ones built just for them.  I wonder how much of the VEATS was decided upon from a practicality standpoint and how much for thematic/creative reasons...

They're really not though. Mechanically they are I suppose but the VFX for Kheldians were just for them. They reuse animations on the player model like basically everything did up until issue 5 or so, but all the particle effects are unique.

[biostem]

6 hours ago, General Idiot said:

They're really not though. Mechanically they are I suppose but the VFX for Kheldians were just for them. They reuse animations on the player model like basically everything did up until issue 5 or so, but all the particle effects are unique.

I meant the human form attacks and such, yeah.

[Panthonca7034]

I don't like the fiendish, foul, conniving, ruthless, remorseless, relentless, *goes in a small endless tirade of adjectives to describe the redsider arachnos factions* shennanigans that the spiders like to engage in. HOWEVER...

 

 

I am 100% in favor of being able to change the coloring of all the power effects of my heroic, brave, steadfast *goes on a tiny rant describing the virtuous qualities of his bluesider arachnos alts* former VEAT toons :)

 

Yellow blasts of Crabspider backpack poison beams, blue blasts from the Mace Beam, or patriotic psychic colored blasts of a former fortunata turned seer.  YES I agree 100% with VEAT customization. Just not to be at the service of Lord Recluse... -.-