MM improvement: Group flight?

[Seldom]

Hello! I LOVE the fact that masterminds are getting some much-needed attention.
Huge thanks for the past patch making group flight range unlimited for pets!

 

That said, I still have an issue:

Group flight affecting players
Why is this an issue?
Group flight is AWESOME for masterminds, and barely taken otherwise. Why?

Pros:

• Pet pathing is bad, FLYING pet pathing is great! Instead of trying to find a zig-zag path up a hill, or find a way up to a second floor, they fly straight to the point!
• Flying pets look awesome! (especially bots with their rocket boots!)
• Ranged pets survive way better, out of melee range

Cons:

• Players aren't comfortable flying. I have played with many players that only use superspeed because  two dimensional navigation is way easier for them than three-dimensional navigation.
• There are a number of powers that CAN'T be used by a flying player, so group flight actively prohibits another player's powers
• The only current way to opt-out of group flight is for a player to visit Null the gull (NOT documented) to undo another player's choice of powers

 

To be clear: This is the only power that when I use it in a group, other players almost always request I STOP using it. For the above reasons.

Suggested solutions:

A : have a new Null the Gull option: "Make group flight work only on my pets"

Pro:

• This should hopefully take the onus off of others, making this something the player choosing group flight to stop bothering others
• Hopefully this would be easier to implement, code-wise?

Cons:

• This would be harder to change given a specific circumstance, unless you hike all the way back to Pocket D
• This would still be something a player would have to read about/be told about, not something easy to use for a new player who doesn't read specific patch notes/forums

B : Rename 'Group flight' to 'summoned flight', make it never affect other players, just summons/pets/minions

Pro:

• This would make the power never conflict with other players
• This would hopefully be a quick-ish fix, code-wise?

Cons:

• This would break the power for non-pet centric players
• Players could no longer help up their team/league member who didn't get a jetpack in a flight/un-jumpable situation

C : new 'hotbar' toggle with 'Group Flight' running: 'Air lift' without this running, the power costs less still provides additional flight speed, and only affects summons/pets/minions. With it, other players are granted flight as currently occurs

Pro:

• This allows the power to remain as-is, but by default it won't conflict with other users. the player can situationally drop/pick up fellow players
• Minion/pet players could more cheaply float pets around

Cons:

• This would require more coding, I assume
• Yet. Another. Hotbar toggle. Some folks HATE all the pop-up toggle bar options, but they DO have a way to toggle those off.

Edited October 18, 2022 by Barneysaurus

[SeraphimKensai]

This should likely be moved to suggestions/feedback as this doesn't seem related to the beta server and is offering a suggestion for group flight.

[Sovera]

I agree with whatever solution that does not involve messing with other players. It's needed and adds a substantial survival boost to all ranged MMs.

[TheZag]

I quit taking my titan weapons scrapper to MSRs because i couldnt use my T9 power while flying and i dont bring my MM to teams because alot of people dont want group fly.

 

The former i can solve myself but the latter requires my team to do it.  Every one,  on every team,  every time.  I would be in favor of group fly being controllable in some way from the users end.

 

[Deva1165]

Great suggestions.
As a MM I love Group Flight, but this look only used (usable ?) by MM and most of the time boring for other players.

+1 Barneysaurus !!!

 

[Rudra]

The idea behind Group Flight and Team Teleport were so that those with the travel powers could help their teammates that had no travel powers get around. Except everyone took their own travel power, so having a taxi teammate power was wasted. The closest taxi teammates got to being viable was the Taxibot SG that helped lower level characters get around the Hollows. They didn't use Group Flight or Team Teleport though.

 

It wasn't until MMs got added in City of Villains that Group Flight and Team Teleport actually started having a practical use since MM pets couldn't get their own travel powers. And the holdover effect upsetting players (like me) that wound up on a team with an MM running Group Flight is why Null picked up the ability to grant characters a hidden power rendering them immune to Group Flight. There was a push for a while for MM pets to automatically inherit the MM's travel power, specifically Flight, because so many players (like me) HATE being affected by Group Flight. Not even counting those players whose characters lost access to attacks because they were now not in contact with the ground.

 

Counter-thought: However, if even MM pets no longer need Group Flight to exist, then why even keep the power? Removing the power will cause pushback. (I have no idea how much or little, but pretty sure someone will be upset if it is proposed for removal.) I like the idea of those that want Group Flight being able to use it. I hate the idea of it affecting players that don't want it to affect them. And most times, I don't even think of using Null to avoid it. (I mostly play solo, so when it comes up, it tends to catch me off guard.) So some of the proposals in the OP are definitely winners in my book. Particularly option A.

[srmalloy]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

I like the idea of those that want Group Flight being able to use it. I hate the idea of it affecting players that don't want it to affect them.

Along with having MM pets inherit the MM's travel power if within a certain radius of the MM, simply change the default value of whatever internal flag Null flips for enabling/disabling the effect of Group Fly on your character to 'not affected'.

 

And while looking at that, look at what causes, when a group teleport power is used, when an MM has the teleport prompt setting turned on, the group teleport power teleports your pets to you before you choose whether or not you accept the teleport. I've seen this happening with my MMs during ToTing at the murder motel in PI.

[Fade]

Love your Option C. Very elegant, already uses a feature we have in the game.

 

Only tweak I'd suggest is having the "me and my pets" functionality be the default option of Group Fly, and the extra toggle allowing it to affect other players (who don't have it turned off at Null the Gull). It's probably just my own personal associations, but that seems to me like the best way to indicate the ideal use while not removing functionality for players who like it the way it is. I'd probably not have the two versions have any difference in endurance cost, either.

[kelika2]

This seems like a Null the Gull thing with "other peoples movement powers" option and such

Right up there with Team Teleport as well

 

Did you know with the <crap i forgot the command> command you can target someone in your group around a corner or through a door and team teleport right to them?  awesome in general, perfect for melee pets

 

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I think this got changed, I was not able to teleport through walls using a player anchor in ITF a little bit ago.

/bind r powexeclocation target "team teleport"

Edited October 18, 2022 by kelika2
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[biostem]

I like the idea of a "only my pets" option for the group travel powers.  That being said, we need a way to control just how closely those pets follow the MM - we almost need a "maintain formation" type of setup, where they track much closer and more rigidly...