Clean up character recomendations

[KaizenSoze]

I usually make characters that are out in front. Attacking the next group just as the last one goes down.

 

Looking for the opposite of that, if it exists, chars that do well at clean up. That trail behind the team and deal with that's left of the spawn. That could mean finishing off bosses, buffing players, anything.

 

Suggestions?

[biostem]

39 minutes ago, KaizenSoze said:

Suggestions?

Hmm... I'm thinking you'd want someone who is semi-independent, but still able to handle a tough enemy that may still be alive.  Two ATs come to mind - either a Mastermind, where you wouldn't have to worry about an abundance of alphas that'd wipe out your minions, or a Sentinel, who has good damage and armors, to handle any survivors that could still pose a threat...

[Captain Fabulous]

FWIW I really loathe tank-types that run off to the next group leaving critters behind to attack the squishies on the back line.

[KaizenSoze]

37 minutes ago, Captain Fabulous said:

FWIW I really loathe tank-types that run off to the next group leaving critters behind to attack the squishies on the back line.

I agree I don't leave strays, but it happens a lot these days. Hence, the thread.

[Psyonico]

Since we're talking clean up, I'd say something single target oriented, maybe an Energy Melee scrapper?

 

Alternately you could do a reverse on the traditional thinking and go a Gravity controller and wormhole stragglers back on to the tank that ran ahead.

[kito]

1 hour ago, Captain Fabulous said:

FWIW I really loathe tank-types that run off to the next group leaving critters behind to attack the squishies on the back line.

Depends on the team. Got a scrapper or brute then you fine to move on when 90% of the wave is dead and get the next one into a nice big ball for team aoe. Only melee on team looks like your stuck babysitting till the last man.

[Snarky]

lol.  i TANK into fresh spawns on my Corruptor.  And with Scourge?  Half dead enemies are taking Blaster+ damage....

[kito]

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

I usually make characters that are out in front. Attacking the next group just as the last one goes down.

 

Looking for the opposite of that, if it exists, chars that do well at clean up. That trail behind the team and deal with that's left of the spawn. That could mean finishing off bosses, buffing players, anything.

 

Suggestions?

Controller? They can lockdown strangers and finish them off.

[DougGraves]

for finishing off stragglers I suggest scrappers and corruptors

[SteelRat70]

12 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

Suggestions?

A game mechanic that.. "encourages" more cohesive team play thus negating the need for this role in a team in the first place.

[KaizenSoze]

2 hours ago, SteelRat70 said:

A game mechanic that.. "encourages" more cohesive team play thus negating the need for this role in a team in the first place.

That would be nice, but this is the current game state. Probably for quite a while.

 

Anything encouraging more team play would have to hurt soloing.

[ZemX]

14 hours ago, Captain Fabulous said:

FWIW I really loathe tank-types that run off to the next group leaving critters behind to attack the squishies on the back line.

 

Tankers SHOULD leave early.  They want to establish aggro and collect the next spawn for efficient disposal before the team Leeroys into it with all their AoE.

 

In my experience, this is only ever a problem... when the tanker isn't the only one leaving early.  No reasonable team of seven other ATs shouldn't be able to dispatch a couple half dead bosses when the rest of the spawn is already on the floor.  But that's not what is happening.  

 

To answer the thread question: Stalker, Scrapper, or Brute.  In that order and preferably with a single-target focus on bosses.  I mean, usual caveat with this game that anything can be made to work, but if we're answering the question in an "all else being equal" manner... that's the answer.

[Snarky]

4 hours ago, SteelRat70 said:

A game mechanic that.. "encourages" more cohesive team play thus negating the need for this role in a team in the first place.

yeah like in console game where you can never get too far from your fellow players.....

or cannot leave an area until everyone is dead...

or some other horrid mechanic....?

[KaizenSoze]

49 minutes ago, ZemX said:

 

Tankers SHOULD leave early.  They want to establish aggro and collect the next spawn for efficient disposal before the team Leeroys into it with all their AoE.

 

In my experience, this is only ever a problem... when the tanker isn't the only one leaving early.  No reasonable team of seven other ATs shouldn't be able to dispatch a couple half dead bosses when the rest of the spawn is already on the floor.  But that's not what is happening.  

 

To answer the thread question: Stalker, Scrapper, or Brute.  In that order and preferably with a single-target focus on bosses.  I mean, usual caveat with this game that anything can be made to work, but if we're answering the question in an "all else being equal" manner... that's the answer.

I am going to disagree. As I said many times on forums, watch the behavior of tanks/brutes on a kill most Market Crash to see this issue.

 

Players seem to forget there is an aggro cap. It is extremely common for 3-5 Freakshow bosses to be running around all over the place while the "tank" is half up the map.

 

I have seen this behavior again and again with many different groups, so it's not just a few players.

[Snarky]

48 minutes ago, ZemX said:

 

Tankers SHOULD leave early.  They want to establish aggro and collect the next spawn for efficient disposal before the team Leeroys into it with all their AoE.

 

In my experience, this is only ever a problem... when the tanker isn't the only one leaving early.  No reasonable team of seven other ATs shouldn't be able to dispatch a couple half dead bosses when the rest of the spawn is already on the floor.  But that's not what is happening.  

 

To answer the thread question: Stalker, Scrapper, or Brute.  In that order and preferably with a single-target focus on bosses.  I mean, usual caveat with this game that anything can be made to work, but if we're answering the question in an "all else being equal" manner... that's the answer.

Yes and no.  Leapfrog Brute/Tank ROFLSTOMP teams got a huge boost when Redside came out.  Brutes NEEDED (no longer sigh) to grab agro to do damage.  Two Brutes on a team would (when played well) take turns cannonballing into the next big group.  Thats the Yes.

 

As agro mgt team the Tanks/Brutes need to not abandon an area until it is effectively done.  That does not mean mopping the floors but it does mean watching the enemies/teammates/map and making tactical decisions on where to be, when to stay or go.  That can be the No

[Nemu]

I find that teams without lol melee usually are more cohesive. Especially if you know you can carry the team and you invite a lot of lowbies that do not dare stray too far off from the team.

[InvaderStych]

18 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

Suggestions?

 

I was doing something similar with a Beam/Dev blaster built for Hover/EvM. Beam is high damage, decent range. Take those Talons bosses that love to fly across the map for a minute. Beam/Dev was great for that sort of stuff. I wouldn't worry too much about solo survival as it sounds like you're building for teams.

 

Turns out there's a "Containment Specialist" badge. (I forget how I got it, but I'm sure its on the wiki). Great badge title for a character built for taclking strays and headless chickens.

 

 

... I should finish that toon, its sitting at 50 waiting for a respec and some iPowers.

[tidge]

13 hours ago, DougGraves said:

for finishing off stragglers I suggest scrappers and corruptors

 

I think Masterminds are the best at "cleanup", primarily because the MM can dispatch the henchmen to go after runners (if not immobilized to begin with) and can debuff hard targets left behind.

[SteelRat70]

44 minutes ago, Snarky said:

yeah like in console game where you can never get too far from your fellow players.....

or cannot leave an area until everyone is dead...

or some other horrid mechanic....?

No.  Nothing like that.  Obviously.

Make the game less of a lolzerg cake walk?  Just like the live game did?  Currently there is no real incentive to work together, so few people do.  When was the last time, as a blaster you had to pull mobs from a group to thin the group out a bit, or waited for a tank to corner pull and bunch a group together to make it easier for the /Kin to fs so that the blaster could Nova them to oblivion?  Those kinds of scenarios just don't happen any more, so you're left with this group of 8 people soloing on the same map, largely oblivious of what the rest of the team is doing.  The only reason people play together in the modern game is because of the XP and inf bonuses associated with doing so.  Beyond minimum team requirements for TFs and what you might call "forced group content", there is no other reason to team anymore.

[DougGraves]

5 hours ago, SteelRat70 said:

A game mechanic that.. "encourages" more cohesive team play thus negating the need for this role in a team in the first place.

 

I consider having a tanker go forward to herd the next group while someone cleans up the last stragglers to be more cohesive team play.

 

Everyone moving in a clump doing everything together is less teamwork.  It is just mindlessly moving in a herd.

 

Working as a team means characters having roles and doing different things.

[SteelRat70]

16 minutes ago, DougGraves said:

Everyone moving in a clump doing everything together is less teamwork

That's actually the very definition of teamwork.  Whilst you could argue that "working in the same space to achieve a common goal" is also teamwork, running off to do something else while you leave every one else to clear up your shit is not.

[SteelRat70]

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

Anything encouraging more team play would have to hurt soloing.

Good.

 

This is a team game.  Want a solo game, play a solo game; don't expect a team game to make soloing easier.

[MoonSheep]

i think a scrapper would be a perfect cleanup AT, a great allrounder too

[Snarky]

57 minutes ago, SteelRat70 said:

No.  Nothing like that.  Obviously.

Make the game less of a lolzerg cake walk?  Just like the live game did?  Currently there is no real incentive to work together, so few people do.  When was the last time, as a blaster you had to pull mobs from a group to thin the group out a bit, or waited for a tank to corner pull and bunch a group together to make it easier for the /Kin to fs so that the blaster could Nova them to oblivion?  Those kinds of scenarios just don't happen any more, so you're left with this group of 8 people soloing on the same map, largely oblivious of what the rest of the team is doing.  The only reason people play together in the modern game is because of the XP and inf bonuses associated with doing so.  Beyond minimum team requirements for TFs and what you might call "forced group content", there is no other reason to team anymore.

they have made theings more difficult.  In the starred Aeon and ITF.  But those tactics (real old school, props) dont work a ton in the new content.  The writers accounted for our standard closed shield formation and F-ed with us quite a bit.  Sometimes it works well....othertimes....anything but lolzerg

[Snarky]

20 minutes ago, SteelRat70 said:

That's actually the very definition of teamwork.  Whilst you could argue that "working in the same space to achieve a common goal" is also teamwork, running off to do something else while you leave every one else to clear up your shit is not.

Well, as a Redsider it is called PLAYING IN CHARACTER