Set bonuses not applied during Ouroboros missions (downscaling character's levels)

[squishy]

I've checked to make sure, but it seems like not all set bonuses gets applied when taking an ouro mission of lower level.

 

While I could go behind if it were on powers deactivated, it doesn't seem to be the case.

 

To check, I completed the set Efficacy adaptor on Stamina, which as far as I remember is one of the base power, and none of bonuses were applied.

The only one I could see applied was "numina convalescence."

 

As of this posting, the sets I've got:

 

5 Rooting grasp on Crush.

6 Neuronic shutdown on gravity distortion.

4 Ghost widow's embrace on Gravity distortion field.

2 Stagger on Wormhole.

2 commanding presence on singularity.

4 Impervium armor on steamy mist, plus 2 Impervious skin.

6 Touch of lady gray on Freezing rain.

2 Dampened Spirits on Hurricane.

6 Efficacy adaptor on stamina.

2 Numina's convalescence on Health.

 

 

I'm not sure if that is intended, or if it's a bug.

 

If it is intended, it certainly is not clear how or why it is happening, and can make lower level scaled missions difficult to plan, as there seem to be no way to either see, or predict, which things will get applied or not.

 

 

[Burk]

Just going to be lazy and quote the wiki page on Set Bonuses:
 

Quote

When a character exemplars down to a lower level access to set bonuses (and Global IOs that function as set bonuses) is based on the level of the Enhancement and not the power they are slotted in. Exemplaring more than three levels below the level of the Enhancements renders the set bonuses non-functional. However as long as the character does not exemplar more than three levels below the level of the Enhancement the set bonuses are retained even if the power they are slotted in is unavailable.

Very Rare IOs and PvP IOs are exempt from this rule and their set bonuses function regardless of the character's exemplar level. Attuned Enhancements change their level based on the character's current Combat Level so the set bonuses will only shut off if the character exemplars more than three levels below the minimum level allowed for the Enhancement.

 

[srmalloy]

7 hours ago, squishy said:

 

5 Rooting grasp on Crush.

6 Neuronic shutdown on gravity distortion.

4 Ghost widow's embrace on Gravity distortion field.

2 Stagger on Wormhole.

2 commanding presence on singularity.

4 Impervium armor on steamy mist, plus 2 Impervious skin.

6 Touch of lady gray on Freezing rain.

2 Dampened Spirits on Hurricane.

6 Efficacy adaptor on stamina.

2 Numina's convalescence on Health.

Assuming all attuned for maximum level range... Rooting Grasp, Neuronic Shutdown, Stagger, Commanding Presence, and Impervious Skin are all 10-30, so their set bonuses stop below 7. Ghost Widow's Embrace is 20-50, so its set bonuses stop below 17. Impervium Armor is 15-40, so its set bonuses stop below 12. Dampened Spirits and Efficacy Adapter are 21-50, so their set bonuses stop below 18. And Numina's Convalescence is 30-50, so its set bonuses stop below 27.

 

If you're not slotting attuned IOs, then it becomes more complex, as Burk described; it's an IO-by-IO process -- if your Efficacy Adapter IOs are 25, 40, 40, 45, 45, and 50, you lose the 6-slot bonus at 46, the 5- and 4-slot bonuses at 41, and the 3- and 2-slot bonuses at 36.

[squishy]

Well, that sucks 😞

I'm only in the mid 30's, and was in the mid 20's when I started catching up on all the missed content from Ouro (don't ask me how the hell I managed to miss this much, it's beyond my understanding), I focused on my sets to try and get more efficient in solo play.

 

But the loss is absolutely massive against using SO's when going down just a couple of levels.

I assumed the slots were in used and scaled back, since taking an Ouro mission gives the option to disable the enhancements, but I guess there's no point in that option since most will be disabled pretty quickly, or will be a lot less efficient without the set bonuses vs SOs. 😞

 

But oh well, at least it's not a bug, just a bad design choice from the original makers 🙂

[srmalloy]

Yes, unfortunately the IO scaling formula is still balanced around slotting TOs until 12, DOs from there to 22, and only then being able to slot SOs. Back on Live, I would have characters in TOs until 12, when I could slot level-12 IOs that wouldn't level out like DOs, then respec at 22 to pull them out and replace them with 25 IOs. Now, with SOs blowing away IOs below 25, I stick with SOs until I can replace them with common IOs at 22, then sets as the sets that will go to 50 open up.

[squishy]

I've checked the wiki (didn't know there was one which was up to date! 🙂 ), and even though it says the sets are statistically better, I'm not certain they're better than SOs, since you can multi slot SOs up to 3 times before diminishing returns.

 

I mean, the sets can provide something along the same, but some times, they're not going to be optimal on some powers it seems.

Since the inventions are a lot harder to keep up with level wise, and the attuned ones being even more difficult to obtain, I'm not certain sets are "better", as SOs would be a lot easier to maintain until much higher levels. 

 

Thing is, since I've invested everything in the sets I got now, I simply don't have the cash to try and roll back to SOs to check.

I recon the enhancements could use some TLC on how they work, as right now, going onto lower levels is quite penalizing for someone who supposedly should have much better stats when being scaled down. It nearly feels like a punition 😄

[Major_Decoy]

40 minutes ago, squishy said:

I've checked the wiki (didn't know there was one which was up to date! 🙂 ), and even though it says the sets are statistically better, I'm not certain they're better than SOs, since you can multi slot SOs up to 3 times before diminishing returns.

 

I mean, the sets can provide something along the same, but some times, they're not going to be optimal on some powers it seems.

Since the inventions are a lot harder to keep up with level wise, and the attuned ones being even more difficult to obtain, I'm not certain sets are "better", as SOs would be a lot easier to maintain until much higher levels. 

 

Thing is, since I've invested everything in the sets I got now, I simply don't have the cash to try and roll back to SOs to check.

I recon the enhancements could use some TLC on how they work, as right now, going onto lower levels is quite penalizing for someone who supposedly should have much better stats when being scaled down. It nearly feels like a punition 😄

Single Origin enhancements also suffer from enhancement scaling when exemplaring or doing Ouroboros missions. https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Exemplar_Effects_on_Enhancements

Honestly, you should see better results from exemplaring with Invention sets because the multi-aspect enhancements have somewhat smaller bonuses and are less likely to be reduced by exemplaring.

 

Also, you shouldn't need to "keep up" with invention sets level wise. Any level 25 or better enhancement will be almost as good as an even-level Single Origin enhancement and will provide that enhancement bonus all the way to 50. Unlike Single Origin Enhancements, you can just slot them and forget about them. I have a couple of sets of attuned Invention Enhancements that I just trade between characters as I level them and create new ones.

 

Attuned Invention Set Enhancements shouldn't be any harder to attain than normal ones. The Auction house pools all enhancements, and if someone crafts a level 30 Crushing Impact: Acc/Dam, you can buy it as a crafted level 30, a crafted level 50, or an attuned enhancement, all for the same cost.

[squishy]

That's odd.

So far I only managed to get 1 attuned one.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but I'm not seeing the attuned versions on the auction house very often, as in, in the list of choices when searching for something.

 

*edit*:

 

After the previous post, I searched, and could not find the recipes for it. Since I mostly buy recipes, and only bought one on the market, that's why.

 

Should anyone be like me, and unaware of how it actually is crafted, here's the video: 

 

There's a merit item allowing you to convert them to attuned... *sigh* ... At least, I've learned something new today 😄

 

Edited May 12, 2023 by squishy

[Major_Decoy]

It won't show up as a recipe, they're enhancements. You can use enhancement catalysts, if you want. Those will also drop at level 50 (but no more than one Enhancement Catalyst per day).

 

It's the very first option when you open up "enhancements"

Edited May 12, 2023 by Major_Decoy

[AboveTheChemist]

8 hours ago, squishy said:

Thing is, since I've invested everything in the sets I got now, I simply don't have the cash to try and roll back to SOs to check.

 

If you want to tinker with different enhancement slotting and don't want to waste cash, you can always create a copy of your character on the Brainstorm test server (under Account > Beta Account on the forum page top ribbon) and try different enhancement combos there. All types of enhancements are available for free via the freebies menu. You can access that using the little chat bubble button at the end of the chat bar, or use /popmenu freebiesmenu.

 

One other thing that wasn't explicitly mentioned previously is that while you can attune enhancements using enhancement catalysts (as shown in the YouTube video you linked), you are throwing money away by doing so. Attuned enhancements cost the same as their non-attuned counterparts on the auction house (which Major_Decoy mentioned) so it makes way more financial sense to buy attuned from the auction house per Major_Decoy's screenshots above rather than attuning using a catalyst.

[srmalloy]

9 hours ago, squishy said:

I've checked the wiki (didn't know there was one which was up to date! 🙂 ), and even though it says the sets are statistically better, I'm not certain they're better than SOs, since you can multi slot SOs up to 3 times before diminishing returns.

It depends on the power. Virtually all set IOs boost two or more aspects of a power, so if you have, say, an auto-power that grants you Resistance, then you lose on pure enhancement value slotting set IOs, and three common Resistance IOs gives you more bang for your slots. Sometimes frankenslotting -- using IOs from two or more sets to maximize enhancement value for powers with small numbers of slots.

[squishy]

1 hour ago, AboveTheChemist said:

 

If you want to tinker with different enhancement slotting and don't want to waste cash, you can always create a copy of your character on the Brainstorm test server (under Account > Beta Account on the forum page top ribbon) and try different enhancement combos there. All types of enhancements are available for free via the freebies menu. You can access that using the little chat bubble button at the end of the chat bar, or use /popmenu freebiesmenu.

 

One other thing that wasn't explicitly mentioned previously is that while you can attune enhancements using enhancement catalysts (as shown in the YouTube video you linked), you are throwing money away by doing so. Attuned enhancements cost the same as their non-attuned counterparts on the auction house (which Major_Decoy mentioned) so it makes way more financial sense to buy attuned from the auction house per Major_Decoy's screenshots above rather than attuning using a catalyst.

 

I've been crafting pretty much all my enhancements. The recipes are a lot cheaper considering I've only used merit for the missing expansive rare items here and there 🙂

If you're crafting them, the attuned extra step is just a whole lot cheaper.

 

I can also confirm that the sets are active at lower levels using attuned sets. I'm not sure all of them are, but it certainly is already a whole lot more easier than it was previously.

 

I'll redo some much lower content later on to confirm the set's bonuses presence, but if they attune to your level, unless the actual slots gets ignored when going lower, there's no reason the sets bonuses would not be working, even if only partially. I've only been doing arc stuff from Ouro for now, most being in the +10 region, I think it's fine. For the under 10, the enmies are so easy, it makes no nevermind 😄

[squishy]

1 hour ago, srmalloy said:

It depends on the power. Virtually all set IOs boost two or more aspects of a power, so if you have, say, an auto-power that grants you Resistance, then you lose on pure enhancement value slotting set IOs, and three common Resistance IOs gives you more bang for your slots. Sometimes frankenslotting -- using IOs from two or more sets to maximize enhancement value for powers with small numbers of slots.

Yes, I've been pondering about that, the mix and match of sets. But for my controller, so far, it seems to make more sence to go full sets, as the 4/5/6 bonuses are usually pretty useful be it resistance or defense.

[AboveTheChemist]

6 hours ago, squishy said:

If you're crafting them, the attuned extra step is just a whole lot cheaper.

 

I stand by my statements, but I don't want to get into the economic weeds of it. And I certainly don't want to come off as trying to dictate another player's playstyle (especially if auction house trading isn't your thing), so if attuning via catalysts puts the biggest smile on your face then that's all that matters.