Mental Manipulation

[Snarky]

Is this a good set?  I like the AoE cone and PB, but I struggle with the added element of timing a drain for my recovery.  
 

How do you slot Drain Psyche for best effect?

[SeraphimKensai]

12 hours ago, Snarky said:

How do you slot Drain Psyche for best effect?

I usually slot it for heals to boost the Regen aspect or to chase ranged or recharge bonuses. I don't often find much need for slotting it for end mod because it provides a stacking 75% end mod buff per mob you hit for 30 seconds, which is usually more than sufficient as I pop it off in melee while surrounded.

[Ukase]

13 hours ago, Snarky said:

Is this a good set?  I like the AoE cone and PB, but I struggle with the added element of timing a drain for my recovery.  
 

How do you slot Drain Psyche for best effect?

The primary with mental manipulation can make all the difference. 
Just my own style of play being referenced ice/mental isn't as synergistic as fire/mental. 
 

I played a dark/mental, and if I'm being real, they weren't that synergistic. 

When you get drain psyche off on a group of 4 or so, it's incredible. better than regen on a regen scrapper. (seems better. May or may not be numerically better - hit points have a lot to do with this, because the 75% regeneration of the buff is going to look at your HP to do the math. 

It's fairly easy to get Drain Psyche perma with liberal pursuit of global recharge. 

Here's the rub - or at least it was for me. 
A lot of my attacks on a blaster are ranged. Only a couple are melee. I can get in melee when they're up, and open with drain psyche. Because if I open with the nuke, I don't get much utility cuz most are dead, or tossed out of range until I get the kb -kd proc in there. (depends on the nuke, of course) 

Fire, in my opinon, with fire sword circle,  and the other PBAoEs is a better, synergistic fit than ice or dark, or really most of the other powersets. 

Drain Psyche is also a recovery and regen debuff, so it's useful against AVs, too. 

But...honestly, it can be fun, but it's not as fun as something you don't have to time properly and think about like frigid protection or caustic aura. But that's just me. 
If my role is dps, trying to ensure I'm in the mob first to get the most out of DP...in this age of people using judgements and fold space...nah, I don't think it's a great set. 

Really good in the right hands in the right circumstances. But I just don't see myself as the right hands, and the right circumstances are not that common. 

[Thraxen]

I love it on my ice/psi/psi dom. I’d have to look how it’s slotted. It’s perma or very close.  Can live through stupid stuff. Like someone else said, it’s better regen that a regen scrap. Or brute really. Just have to dodge the alpha. Last time mine died was being one shot by rommy.  Which wasn’t a lucky roll, but always a possibility. 

[tidge]

I've been kicking around a concept for a Psychic Blast and/or Mental Manipulation character, with a like preference for Blaster. The drive for those sets is that I don't want the character to use weapons, gadgets or obvious elemental-type powers. I also already have /Martial, which I generally find to be a solid secondary for similar concept characters.

 

I have nothing against the Sentinel AT, it's as I already have a Fortunata and I probably want something else from the secondary besides survivability <- read this as me being 'mostly bored' with the Psychic Blast attacks, I have nothing against Sentinel survivability I just feel like a Sentinal might end up playing too much like my ranged Fortunata.

 

I'm aware of how the Psi damage is a really mixed bag... and as I kick Psy/Mental around, I can think of two potential paths for my concept. KBe aware that my personal preference is to have characters have their attack chains not use Epic/Patron powers (i.e. before level 32)

1. Lean into secondary effects/controls more than usual (for me, for Blasters)
2. Lean into %damage (not unusual for me, but unusual for my Blasters)

For the first, it looks like Disorient is the way to go. (I won't take the Alcove of Confusion) Weirdly, I almost wish Flurry had a better Disorient aspect to add to the arsenal. It looks like all the other "controls" are single-target.. and I've got another concept character that uses the Fears from Presence, so I want to take that off the table.

 

For the second, I kinda hate planning to use %damage in a Blaster, but there are certain enemy groups that are painfully slow to solo at x8 when using Psi. I also like that Blasters can leverage enhancement set bonuses better than most other ATs.

 

Anybody want to talk me through this? Point out (subtle, obvious) things I am missing?

[Jacke]

I try to plan ahead for a complete slate of Toons, eventually including builds, though it may be a long time until I get to them.  Looking at the Blasters, it's those different sort of Sustain Powers and some other factors that makes things a bit complex.

 

Example, for Martial Combat, I've decided to make a Psychic Blast/Martial Combat Blaster (someday) because the Damage buff of Martial Combat is doubled for Psychic and Toxic Damage.

 

But wow, Mental Manipulation's Drain Psyche is rather different.  A PBAoE Sustain.  Base Recharge 120s, effects last 30s.  Wow, that's going to need a lot of Global Recharge, perhaps will have to have Hasten.  That's a bummer.

 

On 9/8/2024 at 2:10 PM, Ukase said:

Fire, in my opinon, with fire sword circle,  and the other PBAoEs is a better, synergistic fit than ice or dark, or really most of the other powersets.

 

Fire Sword Circle is in Fire Manipulation, which is another Blaster Secondary.

 

A Fire Blast/Mental Manipulation Blaster could use Fire Ball RgeAoE and Rain of Fire LocAoE at close range, as well the PBAoE T9 Inferno.  There's also the Fire Breath Cone to go with the Psychic Scream Cone.  But Fire Breath has a 2.904s Arcanatime Cast.

 

There's my goto Powerset for close-range Blasting, Radiation Blast.  It's different on Blasters, almost needs to take both the Primary T1 and T2 (when it's only the T1 on Defenders and Corruptors, while Sentinels seem to have the slow recharge times similar to the Blaster).  That has Irradiate PBAoE, Neutron Bomb RgeAoE, and the T9 Atomic Blast PBAoE.  I never take the Electron Haze Cone Attack on Defenders or Corruptors, but it at least has a slightly faster 2.508s Arcanatime Cast.  Had Cosmic Burst ST Damage with 100% Mag3 Stun.  Mental Manipulation's PBAoE Psychic Shockwave only has a 25% chance for a Mag2 Stun.

 

Though there's also Ice Blast, with 2 LocAoEs, Ice Storm and T9 Blizzard, but no RgeAoE.  Has a Cone, but like Fire Blast it's a slow 2.904s Arcanatime Cast.  Has Holds and its Slows would stack with the Slows from Mental Manipulation.  But how good is stacked Slows?  Especially with some mobs ignoring Slows (Werewolves) or worse going crazy with them (Rommy).  There's also stacked -Recharge from both.  I had thought of making an Ice Blast/Mental Manipulation Blaster, but with @Ukase's comment above, maybe it's not such a good idea.

 

Not based upon experience, but I would think either Fire Blast/Mental Manipulation or Radiation Blast/Mental Manipulation could be a good match.

 

[Ukase]

2 hours ago, Jacke said:

Fire Sword Circle is in Fire Manipulation, which is another Blaster Secondary.

Oh my. Ugh..I'm so stupid. Thanks for correcting me. This is one of those things I knew, but just wasn't thinking properly. 

[tidge]

3 hours ago, Jacke said:

But wow, Mental Manipulation's Drain Psyche is rather different.  A PBAoE Sustain.  Base Recharge 120s, effects last 30s.  Wow, that's going to need a lot of Global Recharge, perhaps will have to have Hasten.  That's a bummer.

 

This was my immediate reaction as well. Drain Psyche also has a base accuracy of 1.0! I have a Psy/Mental Blaster build sketched out that I'm going to try, here are my planned strategies:

1. I'm opting for as much %damage as possible, to get non-Psychic damage. I kinda hate that I'm doing this on a Blaster, but I'm going to mix it up.
2. +MaxEnd from set bonuses (and accolades, of course), to mitigate not having a true sustain.
3. 12 points of KB protection, because Drain Psyche won't work if I am being ragdolled.
4. +95% Global recharge, no Hasten (Frankly: I worry about the Endurance burn associated with Hasten, especially without a toggle sustain.)
5. Global +Accuracy and +ToHit, for obvious reasons, plus the PBAoE Drain Psyche will need to hit.

The plan for Drain Psyche is 3x Touch of the Nictus: Heal/Recharge, Accuracy/End/Recharge, Accuracy/End/Heal. I may end up replacing this with some combination of IOs/HOs/DSyncs... I feel like I'll need to do some testing. Touch of the Nictus is a 30-50 set, so it isn't like the set bonuses cover all the game's content. There are a handful of level 50+5 pieces for Accuracy/Recharge that can be used, and IIRC from similar powers with three slots I can hit ED caps for Accuracy and Recharge and also squeeze in other boosts (End Mod, Health).

 

For +MaxEnd, I'm opting to split Defiant Barrage into two sets of 3-pieces each, and some of the %damage powers will be franken-slotted with 2-pieces of Annihilation.

 

I've also put Unleash Potential in the build at level 24, with plans to 6-slot with Preventive Medicine (Endurance Discount, Global Recharge). This is the 'backup' for Drain Psyche that doesn't rely on nearby enemies. I'm using Weaken Resolve and Mighty Leap to get to Unleash Potential. Weaken Resolve will be single slotted for Accuracy and Defense Debuff, Accuracy to hit a hard target, Defense Debuff to make it slightly easier for the %damage to hit.

 

I seriously considered (and have not completely abandoned) the idea of getting 21 total points of KB protection, because FREEM! The 12 points I have planned are from the 3 unique pieces (Blessing of Zephyr, Karma, Steadfast Protection), and I could add two 3-pieces bonuses of Fury of the Gladiator and a 3-piece Gladiator's Armor for 9 more points. My issue with THAT idea is that I'd have to sacrifice too many other important (to me) set bonuses; I can just craft 10 more temporary points in the SG base.

 

I wish I could do better with Melee defense, but I need to see how the build plays first.

[Jacke]

2 hours ago, tidge said:

This was my immediate reaction as well. Drain Psyche also has a base accuracy of 1.0! I have a Psy/Mental Blaster build sketched out that I'm going to try, here are my planned strategies:

1. I'm opting for as much %damage as possible, to get non-Psychic damage. I kinda hate that I'm doing this on a Blaster, but I'm going to mix it up.
2. +MaxEnd from set bonuses (and accolades, of course), to mitigate not having a true sustain.
3. 12 points of KB protection, because Drain Psyche won't work if I am being ragdolled.
4. +95% Global recharge, no Hasten (Frankly: I worry about the Endurance burn associated with Hasten, especially without a toggle sustain.)
5. Global +Accuracy and +ToHit, for obvious reasons, plus the PBAoE Drain Psyche will need to hit.

The plan for Drain Psyche is 3x Touch of the Nictus: Heal/Recharge, Accuracy/End/Recharge, Accuracy/End/Heal. I may end up replacing this with some combination of IOs/HOs/DSyncs... I feel like I'll need to do some testing. Touch of the Nictus is a 30-50 set, so it isn't like the set bonuses cover all the game's content. There are a handful of level 50+5 pieces for Accuracy/Recharge that can be used, and IIRC from similar powers with three slots I can hit ED caps for Accuracy and Recharge and also squeeze in other boosts (End Mod, Health).

 

For +MaxEnd, I'm opting to split Defiant Barrage into two sets of 3-pieces each, and some of the %damage powers will be franken-slotted with 2-pieces of Annihilation.

 

I've also put Unleash Potential in the build at level 24, with plans to 6-slot with Preventive Medicine (Endurance Discount, Global Recharge). This is the 'backup' for Drain Psyche that doesn't rely on nearby enemies. I'm using Weaken Resolve and Mighty Leap to get to Unleash Potential. Weaken Resolve will be single slotted for Accuracy and Defense Debuff, Accuracy to hit a hard target, Defense Debuff to make it slightly easier for the %damage to hit.

 

I seriously considered (and have not completely abandoned) the idea of getting 21 total points of KB protection, because FREEM! The 12 points I have planned are from the 3 unique pieces (Blessing of Zephyr, Karma, Steadfast Protection), and I could add two 3-pieces bonuses of Fury of the Gladiator and a 3-piece Gladiator's Armor for 9 more points. My issue with THAT idea is that I'd have to sacrifice too many other important (to me) set bonuses; I can just craft 10 more temporary points in the SG base.

 

I wish I could do better with Melee defense, but I need to see how the build plays first.

 

Wow, @tidge, that's an interesting plan.  At least Drain Psyche doesn't have a Pseudopet and will benefit from the Toon's Global ToHit and Global Accuracy.  Good point on not needing perma on Drain Psyche, as Endurance and Hit Points will provide a buffer when it drops.  And using Unleash Potential as a not-needing-targets backup +Rec +Regen.  Either Power would be a good place for my goto for +Rec enhancement, an Attuned 2-set of Synapse's Shock, EndMod and EndMod/+RunSpeed.

 

Don't know if it would be easier to go after SL+ Defense.  I'm also starting to get alarmed at some Toons' need for so many Click Powers to keep going.

[Ukase]

This is a plan I've made and have yet to create it. I make no claims that this is as good as it can get, but it looks okay. I'm a bit concerned about the lack of defenses in certain types of damage, but I'm almost always having purple inspirations on my characters. I don't seem to ever run out. I don't know that I'd take it to any kind of tough content for badges, like a Master of, but for gobbling up reward merits and such, it may work out. 

Because Drain Psyche being what it is, I did attempt to grab the max HP for a blaster - which as you folks are likely aware means you can't pursue other things, like positional defenses. At least, not with most sets. 

The recharge is kind of low, which is why I've got hasten. I almost went the other way - and chased recharge, regardless of Drain Psyche. And that probably is the smarter approach if teamed more often than not. But that's generally not the case for me. 

 

UkaseisMental- Blaster (Fire Blast).mbd

[Frozen Burn]

I love /Mental, but it's the one secondary where I have to slot up Stamina since it's difficult to always get a mob and have Drain Psyche recharged for perma recovery, like other secondaries give with their sustain power.  When DP is down and/or no one or not enough mobs are around, you need Stamina slotted and the typical Panacea/Numina/Miracle IO(s) in Health to fill those gaps.  

 

So... I slot Drain Psyche with Health and End Mods - heavier on the health for the +regen and use and End Mod set to cap the recharge on the power - any minutia of End Mod % is a bonus.

[Snarky]

i've looked at a lot of this and come up with a plan.

 

Still in mid-40s.  Drain Psyche is a bitch to land sometimes, and it takes away from the see spawn nuke spawn fire Blaster solution.  You GOT to drain.  You almost need a tank in there 1st.  

 

But for late game TF my build has Epic Force Mastery Force of Nature.  This will be up every 7 minutes or so for major battles.  The crash will be more dealable with than on any melee.  

 

 

Snarky's Brain - Blaster (Psychic Blast - Mental Manipulation) v1.01.mbd

[tidge]

My plan was also to go Epic Force, but mostly for the ability to mule multiple Resistance pieces.

 

I'm only at level 30, and I've had the spawn sized turned up for a bit... the defense numbers are definitely an issue for solo play. It feels very "classic CoX" so far. (not a bad thing, just writin')

[Hedgefund]

Snarky, this isn't meant as in-depth, but just some off the top of my head thoughts.

 

1.  Psi Tornado doesn't do knock BACK so doesn't need any conversion to kb.  It does knock up

So you don't need Overwhelming Force.  It is a fantastic home for the Force Feedback proc though.  Using the power of (1-probability of no procs firing) it will have a very high chance of firing with decent mob density.  I frankly would proc bomb it, there are tons of options.   If you want to make up the lost mag 4 kb protection you could use Blessing of the Zephyr piece in fly.

 

In general, you've got a lot of ST attacks from the primary.  You could ditch one and you'd never notice.  Personally I'd swap TK Blast for TK Thrust and NOT slot for kd conversion.  This is a "personal taste" thing, I like to use it as "get outta my face" power.

 

Tactics is sufficient for giving enough perception to attack stealthy mobs.  I don't know of PVE cases (apparently it's helpful in PVP) where the Rectified Reticle proc is what makes the difference between an enemy being seen or not when you already have Tactics.  So I'm saying just an EndRedux, or a ToHit/EndRedux (+5d) piece or a Cytoskeleton (ideally lvl 53) if you're living large.

 

In Drain Psyche, in lieu of the two basic recharges there are heal/recharge and endmod/recharge HOs that would still get you to ED cap for recharge while buffing the stats of heal and/or end mod.

 

With PFF, you've already got a "get out of jail" card and with Hasten active you've got only 5 seconds of DP downtime so I'm not feeling a lot of love for Force of Nature.  The resists it gives is hardly god-mode (30% on top of no resists except for s/l).  I don't feel strongly about this but I think there's something better to do here.

Edited Friday at 12:24 PM by Hedgefund

[Snarky]

1 hour ago, Hedgefund said:

Snarky, this isn't meant as in-depth, but just some off the top of my head thoughts.

 

1.  Psi Tornado doesn't do knock BACK so doesn't need any conversion to kb.  It does knock up

So you don't need Overwhelming Force.  It is a fantastic home for the Force Feedback proc though.  Using the power of (1-probability of no procs firing) it will have a very high chance of firing with decent mob density.  I frankly would proc bomb it, there are tons of options.   If you want to make up the lost mag 4 kb protection you could use Blessing of the Zephyr piece in fly.

 

In general, you've got a lot of ST attacks from the primary.  You could ditch one and you'd never notice.  Personally I'd swap TK Blast for TK Thrust and NOT slot for kd conversion.  This is a "personal taste" thing, I like to use it as "get outta my face" power.

 

Tactics is sufficient for giving enough perception to attack stealthy mobs.  I don't know of PVE cases (apparently it's helpful in PVP) where the Rectified Reticle proc is what makes the difference between an enemy being seen or not when you already have Tactics.  So I'm saying just an EndRedux, or a ToHit/EndRedux (+5d) piece or a Cytoskeleton (ideally lvl 53) if you're living large.

 

In Drain Psyche, in lieu of the two basic recharges there are heal/recharge and endmod/recharge HOs that would still get you to ED cap for recharge while buffing the stats of heal and/or end mod.

 

With PFF, you've already got a "get out of jail" card and with Hasten active you've got only 5 seconds of DP downtime so I'm not feeling a lot of love for Force of Nature.  The resists it gives is hardly god-mode (30% on top of no resists except for s/l).  I don't feel strongly about this but I think there's something better to do here.

Great. Points thanks.  I will relook at Tornado. I will prob keep all ST range.  I love to plink from afar. Tactics will get the end redux and Drain Psyche will get the Hamis!!!  Great points. I like Force of Nature because it gives End help in long tough battles.  I am thinking vs an AV drain psyche will give me little end help but will debiff the AV some, while Force Nature will prop up my weak end bar. 

[tidge]

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

Great. Points thanks.  I will relook at Tornado. I will prob keep all ST range.  I love to plink from afar. Tactics will get the end redux and Drain Psyche will get the Hamis!!!  Great points. I like Force of Nature because it gives End help in long tough battles.  I am thinking vs an AV drain psyche will give me little end help but will debiff the AV some, while Force Nature will prop up my weak end bar. 

 

I've found that Psychic Tornado offers me a chance to move in close to activate Drain Psyche (or any other PBAoE).

[Snarky]

new build (just hit 50!)

 

Snarky's Brain - Blaster (Psychic Blast - Mental Manipulation) v2.01.mbd