The ability to disable Group Fly/Teleport needs to be made into a command.

[Rudra]

2 minutes ago, Nerio72 said:

What is that the answer to?

We are not going to be given a command that lets us not be affected by Group Fly. The Live devs looked at means of us not being affected by Group Fly and the only method they found that worked was by means of a hidden power that kept Group Fly from affecting us. So we could be not affected by Group Fly, Null the Gull has the ability to grant our characters that hidden power. While I can't speak for the current devs, they have stated they intend to maintain what the Live devs had going as much as possible. So that would mean Null the Gull's ability to grant characters the ability to not be affected by Group Fly is not likely to be expanded to other sources such as trainers. Nor will it be made available to us as a command. And changing Group Fly to be an opt-in system won't work because pets can't choose to opt-in.

[shortguy on indom]

• HAVE NULL THE GULL'S TWIN BROTHER BROTHER DULL THE GULL... BE LOCATED IN OURO.

[Rudra]

4 minutes ago, shortguy on indom said:

• HAVE NULL THE GULL'S TWIN BROTHER BROTHER DULL THE GULL... BE LOCATED IN OURO.

Propagating Null the Gull to other locations has been debated, like @Greycat said on the previous page. That got shot to hell. (I was in favor of propagation. We are apparently not going to see that either.)

 

Edit: Null the Gull is not something any of the devs are proud of. He is a cludge workaround. Something the Live devs would have made go away if they didn't need him to provide the functions he does.

 

Edited November 12 by Rudra

[megaericzero]

38 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Null the Gull is not something any of the devs are proud of. He is a cludge workaround. Something the Live devs would have made go away if they didn't need him to provide the functions he does.

[Luminara]

4 minutes ago, megaericzero said:

 

[shortguy on indom]

• MEH.

 

[Wavicle]

On 11/3/2024 at 6:24 PM, Mystoc said:

To be clear I don't have the issue with how it is now its my teammates who are constantly complaining I have group fly and demand I take it off because they are too lazy/forgetful to go to PD and do it themselves.

 

this is just one example of what I deal with, I redacted this person's name cause I'm not sure if naming and shaming is allowed..

 

 

Having this decision tied to an NPC in a single zone is not good and is disruptive to teamplay.

 

How it is now just makes the person using the group ability appear like the disruptive one because you are demanding they go to a whole different zone to solve the issue while they are demanding you untoggle a single power. One result is instant and the other one going to PD and back can take minutes depending on that persons access to travel utility.

 

Please please just make it a command I can have ready to tell them to use so this friction can stop.. Yes I know I am in the right here but not having to deal with this team friction of constant complainers while playing MM would be amazing /end rant

 

EDIT: many people have pointed out due to game limitations it can't be a command so really any solution that makes it easier to opt out of group fly/teleport for others is something I desire I don't care how it gets done. having it tied to just one NPC is too disruptive.

 

 

It's ok, you were right in the first place, he was a bad leader.

[Nerio72]

2 hours ago, Rudra said:

We are not going to be given a command that lets us not be affected by Group Fly. The Live devs looked at means of us not being affected by Group Fly and the only method they found that worked was by means of a hidden power that kept Group Fly from affecting us. So we could be not affected by Group Fly, Null the Gull has the ability to grant our characters that hidden power. While I can't speak for the current devs, they have stated they intend to maintain what the Live devs had going as much as possible. So that would mean Null the Gull's ability to grant characters the ability to not be affected by Group Fly is not likely to be expanded to other sources such as trainers. Nor will it be made available to us as a command. And changing Group Fly to be an opt-in system won't work because pets can't choose to opt-in.

Ok, thank you for the answer, I wasn't sure to what you were answering and this helped me understand and know where you are coming from. Although because they didn't think it would work before doesn't necessary mean they'll never figure it out. But that does clarify some of the issues.

Thank you.

[Super Atom]

[mistagoat]

Folks, stop directing you frustration at each other and direct it where it belongs, the Devs. By failing to act in any meaningful way on this topic the Devs are complicit if fostering a hostile, exclusionary game environment. They should be embarrassed by Nul as it stands as a monument to their greatest failure and they should be ashamed of themselves for allowing this to go on for so long. Every new GF thread should be a burr under their saddle. For them to state they will not propagate Nul or allow his functionality to be added to other NPCs without offering any alternative tells me that at this time their "solution" is simply to bury their heads in the sand and let players argue, block, kick, 1 star, or ignore one another. I'm sure we can all extrapolate how that affects the health of the community.

 

I'm way past being annoyed with players over this, it is not their fault for using a power they were offered and it is not the fault of anyone who hasn't selected the option at Null. It is the failure of the Devs to implement a solution that works within the confines of the way people actually play the game. They could make the most functional solution that's ever been devised of, however if people don't use it because it's inconvenient or limited then it is a bad solution. Nul is a bad solution! Devs, you know its a bad solution, it doesn't matter that it was implemented by the live Devs, that just means it's a long standing bad solution. Please dedicate some of the precious volunteer Dev time to finding a better solution. You are the stewards of this game, it is your responsibility to keep it healthy, we are all counting on you to succeed in your charge.

 

 

 

 

[Owl Girl]

i have a different philosophy regarding dev responsibilities. it's the duty of players to use resources available to them and develop positive cultures. the devs shouldn't waste time finding ways to make annoying parts of character set up easier unless it pleases them to do so. they should instead spend their time on labours of love like The Labyrinth and new power sets, since they are unpaid volunteers and the players are just opinionated freeloaders.

 

iirc this server used to be invite only. since its now open to all sorts of loathsome and vile characters (like me <3), i am happy to do my part to promote a harmonious community by visiting Null so i don't get annoyed at a MM Who just wants their mercs to stay out of melee. if i forget? well... i'm not so important as to impose myself over a mistake i really am fully accountable for.

[Super Atom]

2 hours ago, mistagoat said:

Folks, stop directing you frustration at each other and direct it where it belongs, the Devs.

 

Do you want an aspect of the game to never be touched again? Because this is how you get an aspect of the game never touched again. See every rage thread ever.

[mistagoat]

For the record, I do visit Nul on every new toon, this has not been a problem FOR ME in years. However it pains me to see this as source of constant frustration and exclusion and it is not healthy for the community. Arguing against a better, more inclusive system seems silly.

 

 

[Super Atom]

13 minutes ago, mistagoat said:

For the record, I do visit Nul on every new toon, this has not been a problem FOR ME in years. However it pains me to see this as source of constant frustration and exclusion and it is not healthy for the community. Arguing against a better, more inclusive system seems silly.

 

 

 

The forum dwellers will argue against any and everything because they're bored. even if they know absolutely nothing about how its added or what goes into making it. This does not mean you should be disrespectful to the Homecoming developers. You can disagree with them, maybe call them a nerd in the heat of the moment but please understand they're just people too. Be kind in your requests and they may actually add it when they can. except to people with over 4k+ forum posts. they're demons who need to be banished.

Edited November 12 by Super Atom

[Ghost]

Dear Wonderful Devs.

Please create a toggle that will allow us to turn off OTHER players ability to use their group fly power.

 

Thank you

#banMMs

 

[mistagoat]

3 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

 

The forum dwellers will argue against any and everything because they're bored. even if they know absolutely nothing about how its added or what goes into making it. This does not mean you should be disrespectful to the Homecoming developers. You can disagree with them, maybe call them a nerd in the heat of the moment but please understand they're just people too. Be kind in your requests and they may actually add it when they can. except to people with over 4k forum posts. they're demons who need to be banished.

Calling out a well known failing, the source of which predates their tenure, doesn't feel disrespectful to me. I do appreciate everything the Devs have done for the game but that doesn't make it okay to ignore the pain points people are experiencing as evidenced by the never ending stream of GF posts and stories of being kicked off a team for using it. Aren't we supposed to "Be excellent to each other"? Kicking, blocking and ignoring seems antithetical to that notion.

[UltraAlt]

On 11/3/2024 at 9:24 PM, Mystoc said:

Please please just make it a command I can have ready to tell them to use so this friction can stop.. Yes I know I am in the right here but not having to deal with this team friction of constant complainers while playing MM would be amazing /end rant

 

On 11/3/2024 at 9:37 PM, Rudra said:

Null the Gull gives characters a power that makes them unaffected by Group Fly. That was the only way to get Group Fly to not affect us. And we aren't going to be given a command that gives us powers.

 

I'm not going to take the time to dig through the countless post on this in the past to find it, but I'm pretty sure a DEV made it clear that the use of Null the Gull was the only work around to disable Group Fly for those that didn't want to be affected by it.

 

It can't be added to the options menu, and it appears that a command can't be added to the game to do the same thing.

 

It is unfortunate that is the case, but it is what it is.

 

As a user of Group Fly, if you don't want to turn it off while on a team, it is your responsibility to let the other players on the team know that you would like to use it ... before you start teaming with them ... and direct those that don't want to be affected by Group Fly to Null the Gull so that they can disable it from affecting them.

... and ... in any case ... if the Team leader asks you to turn off Group Fly, you should turn off Group Fly or be prepared to be booted from the team.

 

You and others that are using Group Fly are in the minority, and it is on you to change your behavior if you want to use Group Fly without offending other players.

You can always run teams and boot players that opposed you using Group Fly and see how that works out as well.

 

As a team mate, I would hope that you are trying to work to be part of the team and are willing to do what you need to do in order to help the team to succeed.

I often have to change my playstyle for the betterment of a team. I am willing to do so within the powers that my characters have an my ability to adapt to the situation.

 

Perhaps Group Fly does not need to be on constantly and you could turn it off when you don't really need it to be on. This could elevate some of the conflict with team mates as well. The range is limited so perhaps you could fall back from the group when activating it and then stay away from your teammates while it is active.

 

 

[Super Atom]

9 minutes ago, mistagoat said:

Calling out a well known failing, the source of which predates their tenure, doesn't feel disrespectful to me. I do appreciate everything the Devs have done for the game but that doesn't make it okay to ignore the pain points people are experiencing as evidenced by the never ending stream of GF posts and stories of being kicked off a team for using it. Aren't we supposed to "Be excellent to each other"? Kicking, blocking and ignoring seems antithetical to that notion.

 

Sure but there -is- a solution to it already, you'll never fix players being cringe. Homecoming isn't exactly open about their development so how do we even know they aren't looking into it already?

 

Also i gotta be real, i can count the number of group fly or team teleports i've experienced on one hand. It's not really common in my experience. I forget they even exist until i go to an MSR or Hami raid.

Edited November 12 by Super Atom

[Rudra]

43 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

except to people with over 4k+ forum posts. they're demons who need to be banished.

Because how dare people be active on a forum. Yep. There should be a limit to how often a person can post before they are silenced forever. Why wait until 4,000 though? Why not just make it 400? Maybe 40? How about 4. Maybe no one should even post on a forum at all. I was fine with your post until I got to this part.

[Rudra]

27 minutes ago, mistagoat said:

Kicking, blocking and ignoring seems antithetical to that notion.

So is using a power that you admit you don't need to be using and insisting on using it when asked not to.

[mistagoat]

2 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

 

Sure but there -is- a solution to it already, you'll never fix players being cringe. Homecoming isn't exactly open about their development so how do we even know they aren't looking into it already?

That's a fair point, maybe they have a fix in mind and this will all be moot, fingers crossed! 

 

I think the problem with Nul is one of social engineering (apologies if I'm using that term incorrectly). It's like the story of installing a beautiful new walking path on a college campus. It looks great and it's functional but it wasn't getting used because it was placed where the engineer wanted people to walk but not where people wanted to walk so they ended up with an unused walking path and lots of little worn out dirt paths across the lawn. So we could tell everyone that they're using it wrong but it won't change their behavior, it would be far more advantageous to adapt the plan to the behavior of the masses that would see it's use.

 

 

 

[Super Atom]

I still think they should just move it to the START vendor, since most people visit that after character creation anyway and it's in the starting zones.

[mistagoat]

1 minute ago, Rudra said:

So is using a power that you admit you don't need to be using and insisting on using it when asked not to.

Hang on buddy, I have never stated such a thing. I don't take/use GF, never have, never will so I have certainly never insisted on using it. I'm sure you misread, all good.

[Rudra]

6 minutes ago, mistagoat said:

Hang on buddy, I have never stated such a thing. I don't take/use GF, never have, never will so I have certainly never insisted on using it. I'm sure you misread, all good.

That was "you" as in generic, not "you" as in you specifically. Check some of the Group Fly thread OPs. At least one was from a person that in the OP admitted that (s)he/they do not use Group Fly all the time and doesn't need to, but decided to use it while on a team and when asked to stop, pitched a fit. And presented that fit as the OP. Point is, it happens. Players that by their own admission do not always use Group Fly or even rely on it, getting upset because they popped it on their team and got asked to turn it off, then got booted when they refused.

 

Edited November 12 by Rudra
Edited to correct "GP" to "Group Fly".

[Psyonico]

25 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

I still think they should just move it to the START vendor, since most people visit that after character creation anyway and it's in the starting zones.

The other advantage of having it in START is that the one in Pocket D is usable while in a TF.

 

Since START grants powers, I'd assume it can grant tokens as well.