Wait... no Super Strength for Scrappers?

[twozerofoxtrot]

On 8/5/2024 at 1:23 AM, Thraxen said:

Rage crash on a scrap would suck. Especially when trying to kill nictus things on hard mode ITFs. 

 

I feel like it would be the opposite, depending on build.

 

Unlike tankers or brutes, you aren't forced to taunt. If you're next to one of those, and you're not running a taunt aura set, you can just hang out and let them take the heat. 

 

Also, any Scapper can take Shadow Meld. With zero defense slotting you can totally negate the Rage crash's defense hit. Every time.

Edited August 6 by twozerofoxtrot

[Lazarillo]

31 minutes ago, Hyperstrike said:

Build high enough base defense or accompanying high Resist, and it mitigates the "Oops!  I die now!" effect

I couldn't care less about defensive debuffs.  +Nothing mitigates the "my attacks do no damage." effect.

[twozerofoxtrot]

7 hours ago, Lazarillo said:

+Nothing mitigates the "my attacks do no damage." effect.

 

This was solved years ago with procs.

[Without_Pause]

13 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

Build high enough base defense or accompanying high Resist, and it mitigates the "Oops!  I die now!" effect

 

That's still harmful on a few Scrapper builds. SR doesn't really get the Res to offset the -20% Def. If you are at 50% Def, that's at 30% during the crash which isn't that great. More so considering how long it takes to even get that kind of Def on any build. Rage unlocks at 18. -20% Def at 18? (laughs) Scrappers also have a lower Res cap and again, it would take time to even get that up to better levels. Add in the lower HP and I can see why it would be problematic for some. Now, Rad and Bio would be instant rolls for a number of people. Elec is also great for it, but I prefer Res builds on Brutes. 

[Hyperstrike]

1 hour ago, Without_Pause said:

That's still harmful on a few Scrapper builds. SR doesn't really get the Res to offset the -20% Def. If you are at 50% Def, that's at 30% during the crash which isn't that great. More so considering how long it takes to even get that kind of Def on any build. Rage unlocks at 18. -20% Def at 18? (laughs) Scrappers also have a lower Res cap and again, it would take time to even get that up to better levels. Add in the lower HP and I can see why it would be problematic for some. Now, Rad and Bio would be instant rolls for a number of people. Elec is also great for it, but I prefer Res builds on Brutes. 

Hence my talk about "base level".

I'm not talking about MINIMUM Defense.

I'm talking about maximum defense AT REST.

Can I build 80+% defense?

Crashes?  BRING IT ON!

And yes, 75% Resist isn't phenomenal compared to someone who can do 90%.

The basic point isn't "just build a brute".

Otherwise ALL YOU PLAY IS BRUTES!

BO-RING!

It's "You build the best, most effective "whatever" you can.

YES, sometimes you "fall down and go BOOM".

This is always true.

[Hyperstrike]

6 hours ago, twozerofoxtrot said:

 

This was solved years ago with procs.

BINGO!!!!

[UltraAlt]

On 4/4/2023 at 10:47 PM, Gobbledygook said:

Isn't Rage on TAnks and Brutes 80%?

Make it half of that on Scrappers, and it should be good, no?

 

Scrappers get crits. That should be good, no?

Super Strength is not genre appropriate for scrappers.

[Without_Pause]

16 minutes ago, Hyperstrike said:

Can I build 80+% defense?

Curious to know how a Scrapper 'at rest' has 80% Def. I capped my /sr Scrapper in the area of 45%-50%. I went for other stuff after that. Even if I go back and get it to 60% across the board, that's far from 80%.

[Without_Pause]

7 minutes ago, UltraAlt said:

Super Strength is not genre appropriate for scrappers.

/stone Assassins' would like a word. Hell, just play a /ice Assassin and try to figure out how that sneaks up on anybody.

[Hyperstrike]

1 hour ago, Without_Pause said:

Curious to know how a Scrapper 'at rest' has 80% Def. I capped my /sr Scrapper in the area of 45%-50%. I went for other stuff after that. Even if I go back and get it to 60% across the board, that's far from 80%.

English comprehension.  I asked a question.

And if a solution isn't appealing to you, or doesn't do exactly what you want it to (make you an uber-invincible Tank Mage, not my problem.

 

1 hour ago, Hyperstrike said:

Can I build 80+% defense?

In short, I'm talking about how to get around "gotchas" for in game mechanics.

[Without_Pause]

9 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

English comprehension.  I asked a question.

And if a solution isn't appealing to you, or doesn't do exactly what you want it to (make you an uber-invincible Tank Mage, not my problem.

 

In short, I'm talking about how to get around "gotchas" for in game mechanics.

So you asked a question you knew the answer to. Got it. 

[Erratic1]

11 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

The basic point isn't "just build a brute".

 

This is good as there is absolutely no reason to play a Brute, unless you like being second or third class in whatever you're doing.

[Hyperstrike]

19 minutes ago, Without_Pause said:

So you asked a question you knew the answer to. Got it. 

I've found that going all "Yoda" and asking the question leads to better understanding of the answer as the person is required to do a little bit of skull work and winds up with a better, fuller understanding of what AN answer entails.  Rather than simply regurgitating "THE" answer.

Not trying to be an ass here.
It's just my natural baseline.  HEE HAW  (HELLO?  TANK?)  😁
Also, flat text is a TERRIBLE medium for conveying nuance.
Bonus!   I've found that people GENERALLLY SUCK (mightily) are interpreting this stuff on cold reading.
So if it pisses you off?  I apologize.  Not trying to DELIBERATELY troll you.  (Much.  And there's a real reason being it.)

 

[Erratic1]

11 hours ago, UltraAlt said:

Scrappers get crits. That should be good, no?

 

Getting crits is probably why Scrappers do not have Super Strength. My WM/Nin scrapper does eye watering crits as is. Now take double stacked Rage and make an attack from stealth....

 

Knockout Blow from stealth would be absurd.

[Hyperstrike]

3 minutes ago, Erratic1 said:

 

This is good as there is absolutely no reason to play a Brute, unless you like being second or third class in whatever you're doing.

You are a bear, standing atop a ball at a circus (my pardon for those who are too young to get the reference).

Lots of directions to go.  Lots of ways to get there in a controlled fashion.

[Hyperstrike]

2 minutes ago, Erratic1 said:

 

Getting crits is probably why Scrappers do not have Super Strength. My WM/Nin scrapper does eye watering crits as is. Now take double stacked Rage and make an attack from stealth....

 

Knockout Blow from stealth would be absurd.

PRE-ZACTLY!

[twozerofoxtrot]

27 minutes ago, Erratic1 said:

 

Getting crits is probably why Scrappers do not have Super Strength. My WM/Nin scrapper does eye watering crits as is. Now take double stacked Rage and make an attack from stealth....

 

Knockout Blow from stealth would be absurd.

 

I'm only seeing upsides.

[bAss_ackwards]

We're the masters of melee, the deadliest of duelers, the supreme sluggers! Super Strength fits right in for Scrappers. 💪

 

The HC team have kept the game fun and alive, and I trust that if they were to bring Super Strength to Scrappers that they'd know how to go about it. 😎

[Without_Pause]

10 hours ago, bAss_ackwards said:

We're the masters of melee, the deadliest of duelers, the supreme sluggers! Super Strength fits right in for Scrappers. 💪

 

The HC team have kept the game fun and alive, and I trust that if they were to bring Super Strength to Scrappers that they'd know how to go about it. 😎

They can't even figure out Regen and KM.

[Hyperstrike]

12 hours ago, bAss_ackwards said:

We're the masters of melee, the deadliest of duelers, the supreme sluggers! Super Strength fits right in for Scrappers. 💪

 

The HC team have kept the game fun and alive, and I trust that if they were to bring Super Strength to Scrappers that they'd know how to go about it. 😎

Sorry, one-shotting EBs, Villains and GMs is cool...

For about a minute...

After that, the brokeness  sets in and the fun stops.

A balance pass would eventually leave us with  a new, COMPLETELY SEPARATE "Super Strength" set they'd have to develop and proof, that'd be BROKEN on any non-scrapper.

[Hyperstrike]

On 8/6/2024 at 10:20 PM, Without_Pause said:

So you asked a question you knew the answer to. Got it. 

No.  I asked a question.
Contrary to popular belief, I have not built "one of everything in existence".

Hence, why it's A QUESTION.

So please, drop your personal inflections and assuumptions.

[Without_Pause]

1 minute ago, Hyperstrike said:

No.  I asked a question.
Contrary to popular belief, I have not built "one of everything in existence".

Hence, why it's A QUESTION.

So please, drop your personal inflections and assuumptions.

I didn't assume anything. It is why I asked a question. In the end you asked a non-sensical question to prove a point. Whatever. I'm moving on.

[Hyperstrike]

4 hours ago, Without_Pause said:

I didn't assume anything. It is why I asked a question. In the end you asked a non-sensical question to prove a point. Whatever. I'm moving on.

Have fun....

[Thraxen]

Sentinels get KO Blow and scraps don’t. And Scraps get snipes but sents dont. ?????

[Gobbledygook]

I figured they'd just cut the KoB crit in half like they did with ET from EM.

 

@Erratic1,

Thanks for the idea on the WM/Nin scrapper, I've never played either set.