page 3 [OPEN BETA] Patch Notes for December 19th, 2025

[Captain Citadel]

1 minute ago, Zahnee said:

Show me how Rage has “so much power.”

Um...are you serious?

It's Rage, dude. Just look at the tooltip on Mids Reborn.

It buffs damage output by 80% for 2 whole minutes, most equivalent damage buffs in other sets only do that for 10 seconds. You can double-stack it for a fairly long time, even without Hasten my IO sets and Ageless Incarnate power have its recharge time down to 86 seconds. Yeah, there's a crash, but that still makes it far stronger than all other equivalent "attack buff" powers. There's no comparison.

[Captain Citadel]

2 minutes ago, Biff Pow said:

 

Just legacy. It's hard to make major changes in a twenty year old game. It's why in the past I've suggested a new "Mighty Melee" set and leave Super Strength as is for the double-stacked diehards. But the Unleashed Might toggle was a clever workaround, sort of creating a new set while leaving Rage (mostly) as is.

As much as I would hate having to reroll, I'd like a "Mighty Melee" powerset as well. It's a shame Sonic Melee exists now, because I loved the idea of a "Mighty Melee" set that traded the unbridled aggression of Rage for a more focused application of superhuman strength, namely using it to stack -Res debuffs on a target. Conceptually this would represent your character's successive strikes slowly cracking open the target's armor. Now that Sonic Melee does exist, I'm not sure there's another suitable niche for a Mighty Melee set.

[FupDup]

2 minutes ago, Captain Citadel said:

As much as I would hate having to reroll, I'd like a "Mighty Melee" powerset as well. It's a shame Sonic Melee exists now, because I loved the idea of a "Mighty Melee" set that traded the unbridled aggression of Rage for a more focused application of superhuman strength, namely using it to stack -Res debuffs on a target. Conceptually this would represent your character's successive strikes slowly cracking open the target's armor. Now that Sonic Melee does exist, I'm not sure there's another suitable niche for a Mighty Melee set.

Sonic Melee has surprisingly very little -res, so technically another set could take that niche (but that would be strange because Sonic should be the best at it). 

[Zahnee]

6 minutes ago, Captain Citadel said:

Um...are you serious?

It's Rage, dude. Just look at the tooltip on Mids Reborn.

It buffs damage output by 80% for 2 whole minutes, most equivalent damage buffs in other sets only do that for 10 seconds. You can double-stack it for a fairly long time, even without Hasten my IO sets and Ageless Incarnate power have its recharge time down to 86 seconds. Yeah, there's a crash, but that still makes it far stronger than all other equivalent "attack buff" powers. There's no comparison.

Have you compared the performance of Super Strength (including Rage) to any other sets within the same AT? Or are you just looking at numbers of Rage and saying it looks overpowered?

[phandaal]

2 hours ago, PoptartsNinja said:

I really hope you reconsider "not touching" the Armor T9s. People feel strongly about them because most of them really do need an overhaul. Crashes feel awful and aren't good game design, T9 self-rezzes are generally bad, and some sets really do need something that lasts longer than 30 seconds.

 

Yeah the crash is not fun, and I just won't use T9 armor powers because of it. To me it is an automatic skip every time, something I basically do not even take into account when looking at power choices.

[Captain Citadel]

3 minutes ago, Zahnee said:

Have you compared the performance of Super Strength (including Rage) to any other sets within the same AT? Or are you just looking at numbers of Rage and saying it looks overpowered?

Yes. They have slightly higher base damage. They don't have Build Up powers that basically last forever or can be double-stacked. So they're not designed with the assumption of perma-Build Up. Hell, most of the time I don't even take it on those powersets. I'd rather have consistent performance than a buff that only lasts 10 seconds.

Super Strength doesn't need Rage, it needs to have its base damage brought in line with other sets so they can get rid of Rage. The power made way more sense thematically when we didn't have Brutes (because of the Fury mechanic having similar themes) and didn't have IO sets and Incarnate powers to make it far easier to perma and double-stack. It's a relic that seems to be preventing Super Strength from getting the rework it so badly needs.

[legendaryjman]

There is most likely a more elegant solution to super strength. Add all the Unleashed Might changes to all of the powers to make them awesome. Keep Rage the way it is and add in the hand clap changes as a second hand clap called Shock Wave or something. I don't think we really need to jump through hoops to make a powerset better, just make it better.

[aethereal]

Okay, can we all please just agree though that if Super Strength had a "basically good set of attacks," like on the order of Katana or something, plus Rage-as-it-exists-today, it would be obviously overpowered?  Like...  the following are all reasonable positions:

 

1.  Rage is very strong, but the Super Strength attacks are mostly weak, and on balance this makes the set-as-a-whole kinda weak.

 

2.  Rage is very strong, and the ability to use two strong attacks in the set and one okay attack in the set and then attacks not in the set make the set-as-a-whole pretty strong (assuming that you don't use Jab and Punch very much).

 

3.  Fuck Rage, let's get rid of it, bring the attacks of the set up to par, and replace Rage with something less user-unfriendly and also less powerful to go with the newly balanced attacks -- we could call this new power something like Shmunleashed Shmight.

 

But this is not a reasonable position:

 

4.  Rage should remain as it is today (very strong), plus the attacks of the set should be brought up to middle-of-the-road or better for a melee set (but KO Blow and Footstomp should also remain very strong attacks), such that you've got something that looks like any other melee set (or better) plus a vastly, vastly better Build Up Replacement.

[Heatstroke]

3 hours ago, PoptartsNinja said:

 

The Electric Armor changes went over really well, because Electric Armor has never needed a 'panic button' style power. It's a very durable set, so turning Electric Armor's T9 into a shorter-duration utility tool suited the set's needs pretty perfectly. But just because that design worked for Electric Armor doesn't mean that same design works for other powersets.

 

 

 

Personally I hated those changes. I loved the way my character was and  I didnt like being shoehorned into a different style of play tat I was very accustomed to. I also didnt like the changes to Icy Bastion. I have been and will continue to be a fan of creating TWO T9s as options.. one that is stronger with some kind of crash ( although not as severe ) that great simulates that comic book feel of being uber powerful and then extremely exhausted, and then a second option which is not as strong, but can be used more often without the horrible crash.. 

There is no real reason why there cannot be two options..

[dangeraaron10]

I know this is small potatoes but...

 

Thank you for increasing Breath of Fires target cap back to 10 on the non-Tankers.  I appreciate it.

[Heatstroke]

Chain Induction

This power is now a true chain

Attack type changed from Melee_Attack to AoE_Attack

No longer accepts Melee Enhancement sets

Now accepts Melee AoE Enhancement sets

 

This change kind of concerns me as it forces a build change to enhancements which means I have to change my entire build. I have +5 Purple IOs in a power that are now useless in a power I got good use out of. I could place them in Lightning Clap, but not power is exclusive from Thunderstrike which I like..  Well time to adapt again.. 

Edited 11 hours ago by Heatstroke

[tiberius0477]

Loving the electric melee changes personally. Definitely more fun.

[TheMoncrief]

4 hours ago, Psi-bolt said:

I thought I was clear that the point was exactly that.  Rage was being made a worse choice than UM except that Rage provided better offensive buffs with a big downside.  The only people who still were expected to take Rage were those that value damage over any other consideration.

 

I hate the crash just like you do, but which was why I was going to respec out of Rage on my SS Tanker and pick up UM.  I tank with my Tank and so the Blasters/Scrapper and other damage dealers can do the killing.
 

I think the difference is that I really don’t care where SS with Rage sat via a vis the other sets. So it’s in the middle or worse?  Maybe Tanker SS is the absolute worst performing set with UM.  It wouldn’t bother me in the least.  I’ve been playing this game since 2004.  I’m not in a rush to get rewards.  
 

 

I mean, I don't even use Rage on my SS Brute *NOW*, without Unleashed Might. I take it, but I basically never use it. Unleashed Might was a dream come true for me, a way for my primary power set to be less bad *WITHOUT* the annoying Rage crash. Now I'm just sad.

 

Oh well, I'm sure I'll get over it.

[Heatstroke]

12 minutes ago, tiberius0477 said:

Loving the electric melee changes personally. Definitely more fun.

 

MY issue isnt the power changes its the change in the Enhancement sets that create an issue for me.. I'll have to try and figure it out where I can keep the recharge I like and the defenses in the build as well. I'll just have to find a way around it. I do have admit I am finding it kind of bothersome to have to rework entire builds that I have dialed in and gotten used to over the years.. 

 

but such is progress..

Edited 11 hours ago by Heatstroke

[noogens2]

Could the mastermind ATO's be slotted into Trick Arrow -> Oil Slick Arrow ? That's a damage power as well.  

[Auroxis]

3 hours ago, Heatstroke said:

 

MY issue isnt the power changes its the change in the Enhancement sets that create an issue for me.. I'll have to try and figure it out where I can keep the recharge I like and the defenses in the build as well. I'll just have to find a way around it. I do have admit I am finding it kind of bothersome to have to rework entire builds that I have dialed in and gotten used to over the years.. 

 

but such is progress..

 

The single target enhancement sets and procs will continue to work the same as before until a respec, and if you do decide to respec you'll get access to Lightning Clap, so it's not a trap.

[Myrmidon]

Thanks, @Faultline. 
 

 

 

 

While I’m more than ready for the Kinetic Melee changes, I’ll saved any excitement for this patch until I see the Release Candidate notes.

[legendaryjman]

9 hours ago, Heatstroke said:

I do have admit I am finding it kind of bothersome to have to rework entire builds that I have dialed in and gotten used to over the years.. 

 

I believe "because I have to respec" should not be a reason to stop a change. There can be plenty of reasons a change is not the correct decisions, but if a change doesn't actually effect current builds, that means there shouldn't be a change in the first place. Which, of course, there can be an argument made that there shouldn't be any changes and the way the game was ended in 2012 should be the way the game is always and forever more, but I don't agree with that argument and think changes to all things should keep coming.

[Erratic1]

11 hours ago, Captain Citadel said:

Yes. They have slightly higher base damage. They don't have Build Up powers that basically last forever or can be double-stacked. So they're not designed with the assumption of perma-Build Up. Hell, most of the time I don't even take it on those powersets. I'd rather have consistent performance than a buff that only lasts 10 seconds.

 

Raw hit damage does not mean anything, but rather how often you can apply it--hitting for 5 damage every second is better than hitting for 15 damage every five seconds. As you cannot be using your second attack before your first attack finishes animating, Mid's and City of Data 2.0 both provide statistics on how long it takes for a power to deliver its damage.  You say other powersets have, "...slightly higher base damage..." but let's just take a look at how Super Strength compares to Battle Axe:

 

 

Battle Axe's yellow bars are not slightly exceeding Super Strength's blue bars. Of the top five bars, four of them are yellow and they are blowing most of the blue ones out of the water with the exception of Knockout Blow (holding the second place amongst the two sets) and Haymaker (coming in at sixth place and just barely ahead of two more Battle Axe powers). Of course, one cannot just look at the raw length of the bars because some of the attacks are area attacks. Foot Stomp will obviously lengthen its bar based on how many targets it hits. But then, so too will Pendulum and Pendulum already has Foot Stomp outclassed.

 

11 hours ago, Captain Citadel said:

It buffs damage output by 80% for 2 whole minutes, most equivalent damage buffs in other sets only do that for 10 seconds.

 

While a true statement, it is misleading because that 80% boost does not exist in a context where the underlying powers between Super Strength and whatever you are comparing are otherwise equal for damage output. Jab is providing 26.51 damage per animation, Beheader 41.71. After you factor damage enhancement, that becomes something more like 51.69 dpa for Jab, and 81.33 dpa for Beheader. Adding 80% of the base damage to Jab moves it up to 72.90--just behind Beheader. So Rage is only bringing Jab up to where Beheader is normally...except Rage also bring its crash every 2 minutes while Beheader just chugs along without care. Oh...and that ignores that Build Up can be added to Beheader to further boost it. At maximum recharge, you can have Build Up active over 50% of the time with no penalty whatsoever.*

 

 

*Personally, I would not want to be manually activating it that often nor having it automatically interrupting that often either, but hey, I am not one to double stack Rage either because twice the crashing does not seem inviting at all.

[Gobbledigook]

Maybe reduce Rage to a 30 second buff with 2 minute recharge with no crash at all. Adjust numbers if needed.

 

Turn handclap into a cone attack for some earlier AoE.

 

Hurl stays single target but improve the activation time the same as Dominators version.

 

Buff jab and any SS numbers where needed.

 

Seems simpler.