Vanden

Because the way it is has already made the set one of the most popular in the game.

We really don't know what, exactly, made Powerhouse pull the plug on those changes. I know there were a lot of people upset that they couldn't just leave Rage on auto any more because it would stop them from bypassing the crash. It seemed backwards to me that they apparently didn't mind the periodic 10 seconds of no damage, but having to spend less than 10 seconds manually clicking Rage less often than they'd get the crash was a dealbreaker for them. Still, it's not like their point (or their feelings) were invalid. It's something I kept in mind when I was coming up with my Rage proposal I linked earlier in this thread; rather than alter the mechanics of the crash, I put tools in the set to mitigate it.

A fair point, but pool attacks are intentionally undertuned compared to primary/secondary powers, not unlike Super Strength attacks, so it still doesn't unbalance Super Strength as a whole to have this advantage with non-Super Strength attacks.

Still fixating on the negative! You see it as bad attacks that need an amazing buff to lift it up, I see it as an amazing buff that needs bad attacks to keep it in check.

I think you better just explain what you think the word "balanced" means, because I don't think you and I are working from the same definition. Middle-of-the-pack =/= terrible

It's hardly Super Strength's, or any other set's fault if players don't want to use it to do what it was designed to do. Oh, Super Strength absolutely does stand above other sets in certain areas, just not on the time it takes to defeat enemies. It's the only set I've ever played where enemy ToHit debuffs or defense buffs are barely an inconvenience. It's the only set I've ever played where Temporary Powers are worth mixing into the attack chain because they'll actually land and do decent damage all the time. And while this isn't unique to SS, the knockdown on every attack makes it extremely survivable even against enemies your armor set is poor for, like Invulnerability against psychic enemies.

Again, fixating on the negative. The penalty period is 1/12th the length of the buff period. 6.5% of the time. And calling the player useless during this period is nothing less than hyperbole. You can still manage aggro, you can use the two AoE controls SS gets to stop the enemy attacking, both things that are well within the expected role of the tank classes Super Strength is available to. Wrong. Rage is the only melee self buff power that penalizes the player for using it, but that only means Rage itself should stand above all other melee self buff powers, and it does. This is subjective. I have no doubt it’s true for you, but it’s undeniably one of the most popular sets in the game and no doubt plenty of people find it fun. I know I do.

What is “it” in this sentence? Super Strength, or Rage? If you mean Super Strength itself, then no. If they’d given Super Strength a power that is simply much better than any other power in any other melee set, and consequently Super Strength itself was also much better than any other melee set, that would be the opposite of balance.

No, the original post is that Super Strength is an example of good balance because despite its self buff being heads-and-shoulders above the self buffs in other sets, Super Strength itself isn’t heads-and-shoulders above other sets, but closer to the middle.

No, my comment is that Super Strength has the best, longest-lasting self damage buff in the game, yet in spite of that isn’t the undisputed top dog of the melee sets. Instead, it’s more middle, top-of-the-middle. Because it has been balanced.

Now I have to eat crow My bad, I thought you were still talking about Aimed Shot. You're right, Snap Shot does do damage above the formula, but it's scale .84, so I still don't know where you were getting scale 1.39. Aw, you're right, I am.

I’m always interested in what people think of my proposed changes to Super Strength, especially the Rage replacement for the Scrapper port. I think having Brutes and Tankers get Rage and Scrappers and Stalkers get something else is a passable compromise between the people who like Rage (like me) and the people who can’t stand it. (You don’t have to tell me you don’t like my proposed Rage changes, I assume people don’t unless they specifically say otherwise. So far I don’t think anyone has.)

Blaster Aimed Shot is 6 seconds recharge and deals scale 1.32 damage - exactly where the formula would put it. Where are you getting that it does scale 1.39?

Blaster T1/T2s still follow the standard damage formula, they just have different/higher base recharge times in some cases than they do on other ATs.

Ah, so like a spherical cow, then.

I’d prefer variety among the power sets.

If the rest of the set was designed around it, and the 90% of uptime was spent at a higher baseline level than normal, yes. Absolutely.

I think ToHit is plenty valuable. Say you're fighting +3s and get hit with a -30% ToHit debuff; suddenly that 100% accuracy enhancement you've got that put you at 95% chance to hit is putting you at only 36%.

Well I guess I have to, since you absolutely refuse to present any evidence to support your claim. I'm not even trying to dismiss your claims that the damage is too low, but every time it seems like you're about to point out some aspect of the game that doesn't show up on paper you refuse to elaborate further.

That's how the game works. Attacks follow the standard damage formula and powers shared between archetypes only differ by AT mods except when the powers themselves are actually modified. Is that the case? You haven't answered me on that, but you have twice now assured me that Sentinels do less damage than Defenders, even though I can plainly see that Defenders' .65 ranged damage mod is barely over 2/3rds of Sentinels' .95 ranged damage mod.

If you really get it, why do you keep bringing up all the aspects that make the set balanced among melee sets and concluding that they make it unbalanced?

I don't think you understand. Rage is a stronger self-buff than any other set gets. But Super Strength is not a better set than every other set is, because the advantages Rage gives are made up for by disadvantages elsewhere. Thus, balance. I'm not sure Galaxy Brain's got data on Super Strength, since AFAIK he's only done those charts for Scrappers, Blasters, and Masterminds, none of which get Super Strength.

That sounds exactly like balance to me.

It's absolutely fixating, the downside is in effect less than 10% of the time yet it's all you can talk about. That and the name of the power, which has no effect in gameplay.

They have the same sets except Sentinels have the Snipes and some control powers replaced with more traditional attacks. How are their ST attack chains so much worse, then?