Hjarki

What I'm getting from this line is that 801.7 has no psi damage. 🙂

I don't like 'tier lists' for melee because they tend to overlook the synergy between primary and secondary. For example, my current (non-farming) Brute is Staff/Stone. I would consider it one of the best combination possible on a Brute for general purpose play. But I'm not sure I'd consider either Staff or Stone 'top tier' in isolation. Staff has relatively weak single target damage while Stone has serious endurance problems. However, the combination of two sets that can each fix the problem in the other makes it a top tier combination - I can tank pretty much anything with confidence while also dishing out more damage than other comparably tank-y builds can generate and I can do it without Incarnate powers.

I've linked one of my builds below to amplify my thoughts on what Ill/TA 'should' be. Holds (Blind, Ice Arrow, EMP Arrow). I don't actually use these all that much. While I could theoretically lock down a single target pretty well, it's normally superfluous. These mainly exist as mules for Basilisk's Gaze. EMP Arrow I primarily use defensively - for the 'bubble' effect - and then generally only on major fights (even in a build like this, it doesn't recharge fast enough for every spawn). Additional Controls (Deceive, Spectral Terror). These are also mules for excellent sets. I don't use them all that much because they're unnecessary in most cases. However, they're nice to have as an option. Single Target Debuffing (Entangling Arrow, Poisonous Ray). These generally only come out against an AV/GM encounter. Entangling Arrow can theoretically set Containment, but I do so little personal damage that it's not all that meaningful. Since all of my knockback is suppressed, I don't need to lock enemies in place either. Multi-target Debuffing (Flash Arrow, Disruption Arrow). These are really my bread-and-butter debuffs. Flash Arrow shuts down most everything and makes Ill/TA the ultimate Stealther - you can even manipulate clickies right next to a spawn. Disruption Arrow is an every-spawn damage increase. Note that, as with virtually everything else in the build, these are slotted primarily for recharge. AE Damage (Oil Slick Arrow, Disruptor Blast). Oil Slick does massive damage, but needs something to set it off. Disruptor Blast not only sets it off, but lets me slot Force Feedback to reduce its recharge even more. AE damage is normally a big hole with Illusion and being able to patch that hole is a major reason why Trick Arrow pairs so well. Pets (Phantom Army, Phantasm, Tarantula). All of these are perma-pets at the levels of recharge I run. I have all four pet uniques slotted, but the Phantasm/Tarantula are primarily relying on the PA taunt and Flash Arrow to stay alive. I've suppressed the knockback on Phantasm to avoid scattering spawns. The Tarantula is particularly nice due to the -fly on attacks bringing enemies into my ground AE and removing them from my sky. Defenses/Utility (Fighting pool, Flight pool, Leaping pool, Speed pool). There shouldn't be many surprises here. I don't aim for pre-Incarnate soft-cap because my primary defense is Invisibility + Flash Arrow. In those rare circumstances where I can be spotted, Evasive Maneuvers will normally give me enough defense to lay in a Flash Arrow. I'm mostly unconcerned with resists because I can't get them high enough to make much difference and I'm expecting my PA to tank most anything I can't dodge. This approach is not for 'farming' (although I suppose it's possible). The goal is to avoid as much fighting as possible and focus on hard targets for mission completion while bringing significant support to a team (if one is present). My main method of managing endurance is the simple expedient of not doing stuff. Mostly I support the pets as they do their job. I open with Flash Arrow followed by Disruption Arrow. If I want to AE, I lay in an Oil Slick and ignite it with Disruptor Blast. Against AV/GM, I'll use Entangling Arrow and Poisonous Ray to further reduce their resistance. EMP Arrow is an option for tough fights to provide safety from status effects.

With my Ill/TA, I don't really spend much effort - if any - on single target attacks because none of them are really worth the endurance compared to just letting the Phantom Army rip up my enemies. With Ice Arrow in particular, having an attack that I'll rarely ever use at the expense of +2.5% E/N defense and +7.5% recharge from Basilisk? Not remotely worth it.

Staff Mastery is another option for endurance mitigation, although normally it's used for damage amplification/mitigation instead.

With Ill/TA, I solve this issue mostly through a more strategic playstyle. I'm rarely trying to 'nuke' but instead just setting up the battlefield and letting the pets do the work. Phantasm is far more effective than in most Illusion builds due to the debuffs and Phantom Army is, as always, massive damage. Since almost everything I'm doing are long recharge once-per-battle type powers, it doesn't really cost all that much endurance.

Illusion/Trick Arrow is probably my current favorite. While you definitely need to get a bit creative to make the recharge work, Ill/TA has all of the debuffs you want, adds AE damage and even brings status protection.

Thoughts: Physical perfection is a very minor recovery buff that really won't make much of a difference. You'll almost certainly need to deal with your endurance woes with Incarnate powers regardless. The norm would be going for Gloom to improve the ST rotation. Ice Melee has an almost unlimited demand for recharge, meaning that almost any 'optimal' dps build will include Hasten and have significant endurance problems. Ice Patch is likely to be superfluous. Mobs don't normally run away from taunt auras and Stone is already a comprehensive armor set. Since it's unslottable, I normally don't take Ice Patch except to deal with a defense debuff hole in secondary. If you already have Teleport, taking Super Jump isn't of all that much use. Teleport is a far more universal travel power and Combat Teleport/Sprint can get you around missions. Fold Space is also a great way to gather mobs without the inconvenience of having to chase them down. Overall, I don't think Ice/Stone has particularly good synergy. From the standpoint of pure game mechanics (as opposed to theme), it's not a combination I'd choose.

Ill/TA is more of an AV-killer and mission runner than a farm build. While Oil Slick Arrow does compensate somewhat for Illusion's otherwise anemic AE, it doesn't compensate enough to make it particularly effective at AE damage.

I've been taking a different approach. Rather than deciding Granite vs. non-Granite, I set up to run either as necessary. 95% of the time, I'm just running around with soft-capped S/L/E/N/P + hard-capped F/C. But if I need something more, I can simply activate Granite and go to 90% hard-cap against non-Psi and fairly decent defense against non-Psi. The benefit of this approach is that I'm a lot less concerned with trying to be a tank-for-all-seasons. I can just build for mostly-good-enough and not worry terribly much about the fringe cases because I can simply use Granite Armor for those. My general approach tends to look something like: Rock Armor: LotG (global +rchg, defense), Shield Wall (unique) Stone Skin: Gladiator’s Armor (unique, resist), Unbreakable Guard (unique, resist), LotG (global +rchg, defense) Earth’s Embrace: Preventative Medicine (unique, heal, heal/recharge), Impervium (+psi resist, resist, resist/recharge) Mud Pots: varies based on primary Rooted: Panacea (unique, heal), Numina’s Convalescence (unique, heal) Brimstone Armor: Impervium (+psi resist, resist, resist/end), Steadfast Protection (unique) Crystal Armor: LotG (global +rchg, defense) Minerals: LotG (global +rchg, defense) Granite Armor: Reactive Armor (unique, defense, defense/end), Aegis (unique, resist, resist/end) Combat Jumping Kismet (unique). Note: This cannot go in most Stone powers because it’s a proc. Since I use both Granite and non-Granite armors, I can’t guarantee most of the Stone powers will be active 100% of the time. Maneuvers: LotG (global +rchg, defense) Tactics: Rectified Recticle (unique, ToHit) Combat Teleport: Gaussian’s (unique, ToHit) Health: Miracle (unique), Regenerative Tissue (unique) Stamina: Performance Shifter (unique, EndMod), Power Transfer (unique, EndMod) Between primary and Mud Pots, there will be some combination of the ATOs, purple sets like Hecatomb/Armageddon, Superior Blistering Cold, Mocking Beratement. I've used Eradication to bolster E/N Def sometimes as well. Because I normally don't take the Fighting Pool, my S/L and E/N Resists tend to be about the same (although both aree capped in Granite). The primary is a bit of a tough call. While the endurance demands have been reduced and a bit of recovery added, most primaries will easily out-end the limited recovery of Stone Armor. There's also the issue that the ST rotation needs to be able to operate at two different haste breakpoints (normal and ~-65%). This isn't normally a huge problem because Tankers are forced to take the normally superfluous first attack in the melee sets but it does mean actually slotting that power.

The proc for Brimstone Armor is somewhat equivalent to the +damage abilities from other primaries. However, it's handled in a different fashion so it provides the same bonus damage across all melee attacks (ranged attacks are slightly lower). In non-Granite mode, you're definitely nigh-unto-indestructible and have a diverse array of abilities. I'd say it's one of the top tier armor sets. However, due to existence of Toughness and the general bias of set bonuses, you're normally going to be much weaker vs. E/N than S/L or F/C. So Granite can help in oddball situations like Lord Recluse. Having two different options means you'll rarely ever face a situation where neither is sufficient.

The problem I have with these sorts of 'tier' lists is that I don't get the impression that anyone - myself included - really understands the builds well enough to make these sorts of comparisons. Moreover, it doesn't appear that the lists are based on doing the work - actually figuring out what should be best and then playing it. For example, Stalker rotations are notoriously tricky due to the interactions with the ATO and the 10 sec window. I'd feel a lot more comfortable if people weren't just saying "X > Y" but telling us what rotation they're using for X and Y to make that call. On the armor sets, you see a lot of the same issues. One thing I've noticed for a lot of players with armor sets is that they have an ITF > Shadow Shard bias. That is, they'll highly rate sets that are victimized the moment they face Psi damage over sets that struggle against -def debuffs. Yet both types of content are in the game. Supplemental features of sets are often overlooked - consider how common it is to extol the damage-boosting abilities of Bio but players will give you a blank look when you point out the damage boosting potential of Radiation or Super Reflexes (both grant recharge bonuses). Even pure utility can matter. A Stalker can breeze through missions and teleport the entire group to the end. A Shield Stalker can do this almost on top of a spawn due to their ability to cloak a team. Synergies also make a difference. That Shield Stalker may has its virtues, but if you attach it to set that requires enormous recharge/end like Electric, you're going to need to fiix a lot of problems with IIncarnate powers - a decision that may come to haunt you when you drop a few levels to do older content or run a no Incarnates challenge. But that same primary may work just fine with a set like Energy Aura that fixes those issuses.

Taunt has a -range debuff attached that allows you to pull purely ranged enemies closer. For sets like Invulnerability, it also provides a useful mule for Mocking Beratement (gives S/L/F/C Defense and Recharge).

Some notes: Taser is a powerful ST attack and should be part of your core ST rotation. Caltrops isn't a particularly good damage power, even with procs. It's very good for area denial, although not so much on a Hover Blaster. Trip Mine is a great damage power roughly equivalent to a second ultimate. Vengeance isn't a particularly good choice for a LotG mule when you also have Evasive Maneuvers available. Electrical Mastery is an odd pool selection. If you want Charged Armor, Mu Mastery lets you take it without wasting a power pick on Static Discharge. If you want to build for S/L Defense, it becomes much easier with Cold Mastery or Mace Mastery. Rains (Ice Storm, Blizzard) aren't all that great of a place to put procs due to how the mechanics work. You're missing a number of the common uniques, particularly those dealing with End Management. For a purely ranged build, pursuing S/L Defense rather than Ranged Defense is likely a less effective choice. It also forces you to take/slot a lot of powers in inefficient ways since you don't have an S/L Defense toggle.

Should be able to find whatever you need here: https://cod.uberguy.net/

Without going into a lot of details, I'd caution that the two sets you're choosing are generally mediocre from the standpoint of game mechanics. If you want to play them for thematic reasons, that's perfectly acceptable but you should do so with an understanding of what you're getting into. While leveling up with standard IO, Corruptor would almost certainly be better. Force Field is front-loaded in terms of powers, so it develops quickly even in secondary. Couple this with better damage in primary and Corruptor is just a solid choice. Once you're at 50, Defender starts to look a lot better due to how you slot the powers. A large part of your damage comes from procs (which are the same regardless of AT) and Defenders are easier to build since they have better fundamentals to build around (which can also sometimes translate into more of those procs).

Brute is 0.75 damage scale with 700% cap, so 5.25 scale. Tanker is 0.95 damage scale with 500% cap, so 4.75 scale. 5.25/4.75 = 1.11.

Brute, at damage cap, gives 10% more damage than Tanker. Indeed, the main damage advantage Brutes have is probably that they're not forced to take the (normally weak) first attack. For AE, the significant target cap and arc/radius advantages of Tankers mean they're often more effective at basic room clearing. Scrappers and Brutes have the same numbers on their armor sets. Brutes have slightly more health and a higher resist cap. However, the higher resist cap isn't necessarily all that meaningful since you're not even reaching the Scrapper resist cap for most resists in most sets. I'm far more likely to choose Brute > Scrapper over issues like existence of taunt auras than I am general durability.

Neither Trick Arrow nor Traps have any particular obstacle for being in melee range from the standpoint of game mechanics. Powers like Repel aren't any more inimical to melee range than 1+ force Knockback AE in existing melee sets. Repel effects like Hurricane and Force Bubble are often used to trap enemies in corners. As for personal protection, both AT with Assault sets (Blasters, Dominators) already have even less personal protection than virtually any support set provides. I really don't see the problem. Certainly you could go back and forth about what is 'ideal', but a naive direct port of the existing melee sets from Tanker -> Defender/Corruptor wouldn't break the game.

When I'm building a character, I tend to think of AT last. The first thought is either thematic or mechanical. Only then do I decide what AT I'll be use - I've got 4 to choose from after all. However, when I'm doing this "what AT?", Brute usually isn't the answer. If I'm concerned about raw durability or I'm going to be using a lot of Cone AE, then Tanker is probably the right choice. If the attack set is insufficient in single target, that leads towards Stalker. If the armor set has damage buffs or the melee set has a very imbalanced attack chain (one high damage attack amidst low damage ones), that probably means Scrapper. About the only time Brute is an unqualified 'win' is when I'm concerned with afk farming.

Blappers and Dominators would beg to disagree. There are also support sets that have explicitly close range abilities like PBAoE. They could probably just copy Tanker primaries, adjust the damage scale, attach them to Defender support sets and be done with it.

Wouldn't it be easier to just make it a toggle?

I posted pictures of a test I did as a Seismic/Devices Blaster. II had xp for 50, but only 26 actual levels (minimum for Stalagmites). I believe I took all the powers in primary except for the cone. Nothing was slotted on the character and the only powers I had active were the Devices stealth power and movement powers (Super Jump/Combat Jumping). I started at Ms. Liberty, hopped over to Perez Park and just engaged the first mobs I saw there (they were all grey Hellions). II attacked them with a combination of the various single target powers until the ground was shaking, then I used Stalagmites and got a 1:45 recharge. However, the only reason I ran the above test in the first place was to generate the screenshots to demonstrate what I was observing. I had already seen the behavior consistently on a 'real' test character that was fully leveled and slotted on legitimate at-level content. I just assumed that was intended behavior. When I went to test the Corruptor (Seismic/FF), I went to Talos and engaged some random street Tsoo (probably not the wisest choice given Hurricane, but they were still grey). The Corruptor recharge was 20 sec. When I took the Blaster out to Talos, the recharge was 1:45 sec on the same sort of Tsoo.

How do you get City of Data to display data from the Beta?

As I stated, I was fighting against random street mobs in Perez Park. However, this behavior is consistent wherever I used the power. Also, in the first picture you can see the recharge on Entomb at 4 secs. If I was being affected by the kind of recharge reduction that would impact Stalagmites so significantly, Entomb would have never been recharged by the time the second picture was taken. I rolled up a Corruptor and the recharge on both the empowered and non-empowered version was 20 sec. So it might be an AT-specific bug.