plainguy

I never said I wanted to keep them in a corner but they don't stay.. Someone else posted an issue or a request and I came up with a suggestion via an IO.. But after thinking about it and reading it, you know I wouldn't mind being able to just have hurricane debuff or a team or even myself and not have the repel.. I think Hurricane without repel and its hit debuff is more useful on a team on a regular basis then how it is atm.. But I also see the benefit of repel as well even if situational or behind a team and during AV fights..

I have a AR Device and a AR TA both can solo 8/3 and even 8/4 as well dependent on the mobs just like many other toons and builds. AR Device is good if you are a hover blaster with Range defense and good recharge.. You can have up 2 Gun Drones up. You can be around 13 seconds on Full Auto. Before the Recent Aggro changes to Gun Drone it was still good and NOT getting TONS of Aggro, I am guessing due to the height thing. Far enough to shoot but not within aggro range so much. I do also have a DP Device and discovered again BEFORE the recent Gun Drone aggro changes that Gun Drone was useless because I wasn't a hover blaster on my DP Device.. The amount of aggro generated by Gun Drone before the current changes only gave Gun Drone a few second life cycle.. The Aggro was IMMENSE.. There was no amount of aggro I could build up before using Gun Drone that Gun Drone would not simply take the mobs away from me. With the current changes to Gun Drone though Gun Drone on my DP Device is a million times better. My AR Device was build before the Trip mine changes.. Now that you can place Trip Mine at will without interrupt I would probably still go range cap with some SL Defense via Scorpion shield and Trip mine even if not six slotted.. You have enough AOE that its pretty cool. You could use jet pack to get you out of danger if needed and hover blast with Jet pack on.. Again I just have not been that anal that I am going to look at AR Device VS some other build and complain that AR device took 5 minutes to clear out a mission and it took this other build 4 minutes or even 3.. It just picking fly sh1t out of the pepper I think at that point..

Thank you.. I Believe someone mentioned this as well earlier.. I glazed over it but now caught the comparison..

Basically he conceded that the IO isn't an issue for him but he had to stress that the idea sucks.. The analogy is giving an apology and then using the word but in the same sentence.. It pretty much negates the apology.. Sorry I messed up but wouldn't have happened if you didn't do this.. Then I wouldn't need to apologize if you didn't do that.. As for the IO well I think it's an undesirable change in how Hurricane works but okay if someone wants to neuter their ability to use Hurricane's soft control ... He half arsed conceded about the IO but still is expressing his discontent and expressing on how it would ruin the power..

Yep.. Look maybe this opens the door for other unique one off IOs. I know someone in this thread brought up water blast powers related to this. Again my idea is to give suggestions that will not imbalance or make sweeping changes across the game for everyone.. This is not game breaking at all. Again the Devs could toss this in the round file basket. Or This can be that new 20 million INF sink..

I couldn't help but laugh.. This is okay I'm sorry BUT you still messed up and this is why it happened.. But I will apologize.. But you know.. Again just YOUR OPINION.. Which is fine.. I think it just a different way of using the power.. Mind you no one needs a stormer to herd.. No one is saying in LFG MUST HAVE STORMER TO HERD... Yea on certain teams not having repel and just the hit debuff of hurricane can be more useful.

They go in an IO slot for the power.. They are pre-crafted IOs.. They are not player crafted IOs.. But offer a proc and bonus to damage and recharge.. Holy cow you are either trolling or splitting hairs here..

Something else just popped into my head.. Have you ever used PW vendor ? Have you never seen those SINGLE IOs that are only good until level 20.. They have procs and such.. That sort of blows your always comes in sets statement out of the water..

You know oddly enough as much as they did asymmetrical shoulders and boots.. I have NOT seen may new costumes come out with these changes being posted here.

Yes I see what you are saying.. But your analogy isn't the best because they are sort of a necessity or you can have a bad outcome.. You are required by law to turn headlights on at night.. Failure to do so could be a summons or arrest for neglectful homicide. There are guidelines. There are no guidelines here.. I also mentioned in a previous post you failed to quote in which I mentioned that players usually end up doing thing with powers that Devs never expected.. For example like herding with hurricane. This was echoed by another poster Alty in attempting to refute a comment but also failed to see I mentioned this as well. The issue is Wavicle is stuck in the notion of LRN2PLAY. Is completely ignoring the fact that this is a suggestion forums.. The fact that no one is saying to change the power out of the box for everyone and that an OPTION to make a change with an IO is possible.. MAYBE.. I say Maybe because it could be possible that Repel is baked into the power somehow and just cannot be changed without recoding the whole power. And now in an attempt to grasp at straws is now challenging me on what this IO set would be and its requirements.. Again not an impossible feat of recoding since I believe the current Devs have done this with other powers. Not minimizing the task or the prioritization either.

Do you see now you are coming after me on parameters of the IO set.. Do you see how you keep moving the goal post. It was about a change in repel.. I mentioned the IO OPTION.. Now you want to hawk me for details on an IO Set and how this whole concept now is bad in your mind because I cannot produce the accurate information on an IO SET that could be somehow validated and approved by the community ( specifically you). Or even required to post a suggestion on the Suggestion forums. Who says always.. Just because that is how it is TODAY.. It doesn't mean that how it MUST BE TOMORROW.. Again the devs could come here and say No dude.. IOs just can't work that way.. THEY MUST BE a FULL SET.. Or They might come here and say you know with one off IOs we can put in a bunch of different options and it just up to the player to decide if are willing to loose the benefit of an IO set.. Or They create an IO set.. Someone smarter than me can figure that out and post it here if they are so inclined.. Suggestion forums.. Nothing says we have to outline the whole project when giving a suggestion.. That is the whole point of putting out on the suggestion forum. Someone else gets an interest and says you know I have an idea for this so called set.. Here is a break down of my IO set bonus for this Repel removal IO set.. EDIT old Devs said Mastermind pets could not be changed.. Other servers have found work arounds to make that possible. The new Devs have made it clear from time to time that some of this code they see is utterly messed up.. Just horrible patch jobs that even they cannot discern why its there and what it is doing and have cleaned it up.. I gave you this great idea.. My job is done..

I will add that some players do calculate INF like when farming the INF per minute.. If they can do an 8/4 mission setting in 5 minutes and now they are doing it in 8 minutes it can be a big issue for some players.. In their minds they know they are loosing X amount of INF and they just don't like it.. EG Speed ITF vs Non Speed.. I farm for example but I never do the math of how much I make or am missing.. For me I am just happy I can do it when I want to and I can PL one of my crazy builds to 50 when I know I can never get a team with them for example.. No.. because when you move against a flat wall YOU are now creating the angle that pushes a mob out.. Again you are really stuck on this LRN2PLAY hurricane power notion.. Its about repel and if there should be an OPTION not to have it.

Look in all honesty you cannot keep mobs up against a flat wall.. The mobs will get knocked down and repelled. Eventually they get back up and move.. They might fall again.. But eventually they move to a focal point that puts them at an angle of this flat wall.. Which then causes them to just slide to the left or right and away from your hold. Could several stormers do this by spacing apart and such.. I would guess so.. Still doesn't answer why an IO would be such a horrendous game breaking idea..

No To be more clear.. I stated already it just ONE IO.. When you brought up the penalty of using this sort of IO I explained that ONE IO would hinder the user from getting that set bonus.. So if someone were to six slot Hurricane they now could only benefit from 5 slots of the set as this IO would kill the 6th slot.. That could be part of the penalty as well. So as you mentioned you felt that the hit debuff should be reduced for some reason. Why I don't know.. Mind you this is no different then slotting a KB to KD IO in a power but also using a different set for the other 5 slots Example.. M30 Grenade - 5 slotted with Superior Defiant Barrage and 1 Overwhelming Force KB to KD IO.. You loose 5% defense increase to Energy and Negative and 2.5% to Range Defense. As much as I would have liked that 2.5% Range Defense I had to get it somewhere else.. Because I didn't want M30 Grenade to do that KB.. Sacrifices you make.

No as I clearly mentioned it just an understanding of the game mechanics around defenses.. Which is why I have it in my signature for other players to understand. So I am not just giving someone a fish I am also teaching them how to fish IF they are interested in doing so.. If someone came to me and said I don't get how you do this.. I would happy to explain and I have explained several times on other post about defenses.. I was happy when someone pointed me to the link and explained it to me. Again I am the same plainguy from the old original forums so you can use wayback machine to find post I made.. I am positive there are post me asking about defenses and Adenonhawkwood was one of the players who took the time to explain it along with that link in my signature.. Which is about 10 years old but still up.. But as for Hurricane, You know I would LOVE to have hurricane up at all times when fighting.. I would love to give the debuff it offers to the whole team. Without messing up the Tank or Brutes herding ability.. Heck having the OPTION in the form of an IO ( yea it seems I have exaggerate these word, because it seems other posters are not reading it when I keep saying it) might give other players whom might be short on defenses melee wise and AOE but are range defensed the ability to pull and herd mobs for those moments there is no tankish type player on the team.. Again its an IO.. Not a base power change..

100% correct. I have an AR Device toon based around AOE and no trip mine as it was created before the change.. All my KB powers have KD IOs in them.. That was MY CHOICE for my game play.. I didn't do it because I was afraid a team wouldn't like me..

Sadly your verbiage would indicate I am agreeing or indicating to change how the power actually is working atm out of the box. Which is totally incorrect. I clearly expressed an IO.. No one forces anyone to use an IO.. So it is sort of sad that you would contort my words to make your point. I don't want it to gather and lock. I repeatedly made my point in many different fashions to make it clear. As you stated, you highly doubt the the OG devs created hurricane to herd.. So my statement that it was meant to scatter is correct.. Which is what I have been saying.. Thank you for supporting my point.. Mind you I also made that same comment that players created herding.. It was in line with the comment of players use powers differently then devs usually expect them to use them. Nonetheless I don't get your gripe over an IO.. I really think your picking the fly poo out of the pepper here.. Its an IO.. Again no one forcing anyone to do anything here.. What is the big deal with an option? At the end of the day if the devs here look and go if this player only knew how extremely difficult it is to create an IO do this he would not be asking this on the suggestions forums. OR They might go heck of all the things we want to do creating IOs to do something different in a power isn't the hardest.. If you want to debate why the request for an IO is bad and how it would ruin something and how it would ruin the game for you to be playing with a player that has repel suppressed then by all means do so.. But you are debating with me as if I wanted to change the inherit power of Hurricane for everyone without asking them. Which is utterly and totally incorrect and false..

Im sorry but nothing in this game takes skill or thought, beyond a costume. I have petless masterminds that can solo 4/8 setting.. Yes it might not be as fast as that other Archtype.. But there are players with IO sets that can't even solo 4/8 setting because they don't get game mechanics.. If the Devs say I like this IO idea BUT there must be some penalty then so be it.. I create characters with powersets that offer NO defense buffs to be defense capped.. Having to work with the possibility of Repel IO penalty is not a big deal honestly.. I just would like to have hurricane turned on and used like any other power at any time in the game without causing an issue.. I like the power. . I like the look and would like to use it more without any concerns.. Not looking for any sort of hand me out or freebie.. The Devs do what they do best.. If they feel it needs a penalty then do so. I'm okay with a -15% toHit debuff.

Yes you can shuffle mobs in a direction.. There is no debate.. But your wording is if your scattering mobs you are doing it wrong.. Who in the world says someone can't go into a crowd of mobs and turn on hurricane ? Again is there something in game that says we caution you NOT to go into mobs as they will scatter ? Game mechanic wise if you have decent range defenses and moderate melee defenses this power with its hit debuff at melee is doing what it is intended to do.. The simple debate is some people think the Repel in this power sucks. Regardless even if they know how to use this power like a surgeon with a surgical knife.. That is what is on debate here.. You are imposing or trying to impose your notion if someone isn't doing it your way its wrong.. Especially when there is NO WORDING in game to support your claim.. Again lie to me tell me you spoke with Matt Miller and that he secretly told you Hurricane was intended to be a containment power and that the description is wrong or that they were gonna change it the day they shut down the game.. Otherwise you need to accept you making a personal call on something with no real facts or data to support your claim.. So back to my original notion on this.. The Repel in Hurricane sucks. But understanding that some players like the repel or are okay with the repel. My suggestion is an IO to remove the Repel for those that like the knockback but NOT constant repel.. And again those that wish can change the Knockback to a Knockdown as well with another IO.. And yes we understand all of the above about using repel to contain mob.

Oh its a trick.. Then you are using this for something it isn't actually intended to do.. EG using a butter knife to screw in a screw because you can't find or are too lazy to find a flat head screwdriver.. Look I will NOT debate that hurricane can keep some mobs in place. You cannot keep all mobs contained.. You can keep some.. But eventually they resist the hurricane and move into a spot that spins them off the wall behind you.. Again this is NOT a containment power.. That you have the ability to gimmick it as such is great.. But the description clearly says this.. You can summon a Hurricane. The wind and rain from this massive storm reduce the range and chance to hit of nearby foes. The massive winds of this storm continuously force foes away from you. But hey lets look at some more info on Hurricane and its containment abilities Effects Toggle: Point Blank Area of Effect Foe -Range, -To-Hit, Repel, Knockback Why would they have knockback in containment power.. Strange.. Maybe the enhancements might give us better insight that we might be missing Enhancements Reduce Endurance Cost Enhance Knockback Distance Increase Attack Rate Enhance ToHit Debuff Set Categories Knockback ToHit Debuff Set categories Knockback ? Where is the hold sets ? Again dude.. I get what your saying.. I get you can somewhat hold some mobs in place to some degree.. But NOTHING in this power remotely or closely says this can be done.. Why ? Why haven't the devs today cleared up the description saying it can be used to hold mobs in place but using a gimmick.. Why hasn't someone in all these years on the wiki added this tidbit of information about the power in the wiki ? Because you doing something with it that it actually wasn't intended to do.. This is what happens in games.. Players figure stuff out that the devs do not expect.. This is what you are doing but, NOW you are making it as if it is actual game mechanic placed in the game. You are pretty much imposing your interpretation of the power where there is nothing anywhere to support your statement.. Yes again Hurricane can hold a few mobs in a corner with repel.. But hurricane was not made for that no matter how much you keep repeating the same line..

But the power has an inherit scatter effect with the repel. How can I be doing it wrong ? It is working as intended right ? Tell me where there is a manual on Hurricane. Is it on the Wiki ? Do we have some old quotes from the creators that says Hurricane is used to contain enemies in an area.. I mean look up Hurricane.. I am pretty sure the last description you will have about a hurricane is it contains things.. Except maybe in its whirlwind before spewing it out the top.. Again not being a dick.. But common sense.. This is Storm powers.. Lighting storm - creates and cloud and shoots down lightning cause knock down.. Make sense right.. Who wouldn't get knocked on their ass by lightning Freezing Rain - Slows people down.. Who would have thought that.. Thunder Clap - who would have thought getting hit by a Sonic Boom would possibly stun you.. I mean do I need to go on ? How about they intended Hurricane to push mobs back and scatter them around, just like all the other powers in storm summoning are doing what they intended.. Maybe they didn't realize because this game was the first of its kind that people would eventually look to herd mobs and clear maps as fast as they can. Listen realistically there are no corners you can completely herd mobs into with Hurricane.. I mean you just can't.. They move around.. get knocked down.. spin off the sides.. ETC.. There is just no real EXACT PERFECT way to keep mobs in one place with hurricane.. It just is not a containment power..

Why ? Where is your math to prove this ? A player is loosing a set bonus for this. I think that is penalty enough. But again show me the theory where you feel this is standard SOP. I mean you are purporting that there is no benefit to this IO and people should LRN2PLAY Hurricane. So why would someone requesting to be penalized because they have some difficulty with hurricane for some reason now suffer yet another penalty.. Again to have a penalty they must be getting some benefit. Are you now saying there is a benefit to this IO ? Sort of contradicts your stance. Again not being a dick.. Though I know I sound like one on here, but just no other way to put it clearly so sorry if my Verbiage offends..

I know I had a long post but if you read you can see I understand how to work with issues of Hurricane. But I have been on teams with first time players that were just excited to have a new power and use it not realizing the amount of scatter.. I've been on ITF where players have used hurricane to accidentally put mobs into walls. I have been on ITF where key mobs guarding those Sybil were knocked in to a wall and we waited around waiting for the mob to come back and then just decided for a reset.. I don't know when you started playing I've been playing since the game originally opened. This issue or debate is nothing new.. Just use waybackmachine and look at the original forum post about this.

The player is NOT scattering anything.. The Power is scattering.. They created this power to do that.. You are basically blaming the tiger for eating someone at the zoo that accidentally entered the cage.. The tiger was just being a tiger. You are giving someone a hammer and then complaining they are not using it properly to screw in a screw.. If anything I give credit to the game creators they created and simulated a hurricane pretty well with this power for all intent and purposes..

Am I correct that this failed coming in on the last patch ? I also understand that there was a Ninja run without the Ninja Stance, which I liked as well. I loved the mobility of Ninja Run but hated the stance, but regardless would suck it up and enjoy using it a bit more if it just didn't detoggle Combat Jump.