Trick Arrow for Masterminds has only limited way to light up oil slick

[plainguy]

Trick Arrow Oil Slick really has a NICE DPS component.  

Problem is Masterminds do not have a real way to ignite the Oil Slick beyond the taser/charm starting power.  Assuming it works. 

 

I have been testing it out and if the charm/taser fails to ignite it, the oil slick target disappears. End result you only have one shot at it.  Whereas if  I fire another trick arrow at it does not disappear.

As a matter of fact I can fire all of the other Trick arrows at it.

But once the charm/taser is used the Oil Slick target is gone and the use of this power is NOT a guarantee of it igniting.

 

The other issue is this taser/charm is short range, thus if forces you to get into close almost melee range of the mobs.

 

I will eventually look to see if an chance for energy proc will activate the fire component. 

 

But couldn't Acid, Poison, Disruption, EMP arrow have some component to allow it to ignite via a chemical or electrical reaction ?

 

I honestly just think its a bit unfair that masterminds have something and are extremely limited in its use.

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by plainguy

[SeraphimKensai]

Honestly Trick Arrow in general could use some love as it's one if not the least played powerset in the game. The overall concept is cool, but the debuff values of the arrows do little to compete against other powersets that an individual could take.

 

I don't have the most Trick Arrow experience though only, as I've only played the set up to 50 on 2 toons (ta/psi defender on live, and a demon/ta mm here). *That demon pets will ignite oil slick as well.

[plainguy]

4 hours ago, SeraphimKensai said:

Honestly Trick Arrow in general could use some love as it's one if not the least played powerset in the game. The overall concept is cool, but the debuff values of the arrows do little to compete against other powersets that an individual could take.

 

I don't have the most Trick Arrow experience though only, as I've only played the set up to 50 on 2 toons (ta/psi defender on live, and a demon/ta mm here). *That demon pets will ignite oil slick as well.

Yea I went Beast and honestly its a Semi Petless build ( Its what I do ) But nothing I have in the build will ignite Oil Slick beyond the charm power and for some reason as I mentioned it is bugged in the sense it makes the Oil Slick target disappear, whereas the firing every single trick arrow at it does not. 

 

I have it on a defender and of course it works all the time because I have blazing arrow. 

[SeraphimKensai]

10 hours ago, plainguy said:

nothing I have in the build will ignite Oil Slick beyond the charm power and for some reason as I mentioned it is bugged in the sense it makes the Oil Slick target disappear

My live TA/Psi Defender was like that, I had to taser darts to ignite it. Maybe change your origin power to taser darts at the P2W vendor?

Edited November 9, 2019 by SeraphimKensai

[ghotistix]

Are there not 3 different epic power pools (Charge, Heat and Mu Mastery) that contain multiple powers that will ignite the Oil Slick Arrow?

[biostem]

47 minutes ago, ghotistix said:

Are there not 3 different epic power pools (Charge, Heat and Mu Mastery) that contain multiple powers that will ignite the Oil Slick Arrow?

Does that requirement apply to, for instance, radiation?  Do /dark MMs need to dip into a pool power in order to make full use of their secondary?  When was the last time you heard /kin MM say "If I take mace mastery, then I can make full use of transference"...

[Leogunner]

1 hour ago, ghotistix said:

Are there not 3 different epic power pools (Charge, Heat and Mu Mastery) that contain multiple powers that will ignite the Oil Slick Arrow?

There's also the pool attack available at lvl 4 that does energy damage.

 

29 minutes ago, biostem said:

Does that requirement apply to, for instance, radiation?  Do /dark MMs need to dip into a pool power in order to make full use of their secondary?  When was the last time you heard /kin MM say "If I take mace mastery, then I can make full use of transference"...

None of that reflects what the OP is even talking about which is:

 

14 hours ago, plainguy said:

Problem is Masterminds do not have a real way to ignite the Oil Slick beyond the taser/charm starting power.

 

[Galaxy Brain]

@Leogunner, that does apply directly as it further highlights the flaw in TA

[Leogunner]

Just now, Galaxy Brain said:

@Leogunner, that does apply directly as it further highlights the flaw in TA

The thread is talking about ways for an AT to light Oilslick, not the flaws of Trick Arrow.

 

Lighting Oilslick is the LEAST of TA's problems (that being, sometimes it doesn't light at all).

[biostem]

1 hour ago, Leogunner said:

None of that reflects what the OP is even talking about which is:

Which goes to my point, that only TA lacks a way within the set to make full use of all its power effects.  I.E., other MM secondaries don't need to reply upon the origin starter powers or APPs/PPPs in order to use one of their other powers.

[Leogunner]

5 minutes ago, biostem said:

Which goes to my point, that only TA lacks a way within the set to make full use of all its power effects. 

Sonic Resonance has 2 powers that affect foes that cannot be used without allies and Poison has a power that specifically needs henchmen to use.  Neither of those sets have powers within the set to make full use of these foe-affecting powers.

 

Frankly, if that is your point you either are wording it badly or you're trying to embellish the fault so that this pin-prick of a point looks like a cannonball sized hole.  Like I said before, lighting Oilslick is the least of TA's problems.

[plainguy]

4 hours ago, ghotistix said:

Are there not 3 different epic power pools (Charge, Heat and Mu Mastery) that contain multiple powers that will ignite the Oil Slick Arrow?

Doesn't exactly fit the build I like a travel power.. 

 

BUT sucked it up and respeced and removed the travel power and Maneuvers and Tactics and picked up Kick, Tough, Weave and Fire Blast 

[biostem]

2 hours ago, Leogunner said:

Like I said before, lighting Oilslick is the least of TA's problems.

No argument there.

 

2 hours ago, Leogunner said:

Sonic Resonance has 2 powers that affect foes that cannot be used without allies and Poison has a power that specifically needs henchmen to use.  Neither of those sets have powers within the set to make full use of these foe-affecting powers.

Ally-only and enemy-only powers are commonplace and well-established in CoH's history.  Name me any other power that requires a power outside of the set and of a specific damage type, in order to trigger its full effect...

[Leogunner]

1 hour ago, biostem said:

No argument there.

 

Ally-only and enemy-only powers are commonplace and well-established in CoH's history.  Name me any other power that requires a power outside of the set and of a specific damage type, in order to trigger its full effect...

I just did.  Those are the only powers that impart no effect to the ally you cast it on and only effects enemies.  Even Enflame in the Sorcery pool can be targeted on a foe and affect foes.  They are still unique to powers like Power of the Phoenix because that affects both ally and foe.

 

And that still fits Poison's Noxious Gas because you do require a power outside of the set (you need a henchman).

 

To complain that Oilslick Arrow requires one of two specific damage types is like complaining that Nature Affinity has bloom or Street Justice has combos.  Oilslick requires fire or energy damage to trigger and you too can pick up a ranged energy attack for a pool attack starting at level 4.  It's available to everyone.  And if you don't want to spend a power pick, everyone can revoke their origin power for taser or charm.

 

All that really does paint that there is no real issue there.

Edited November 9, 2019 by Leogunner

[Bossk_Hogg]

Legorunner, why do you have such a huge bug up your ass about what amounts to a QOL change for a set you don't even play? It is, as you note, easy to light (when it works) with various powers, it's just a hassle. Throwing minor energy damage in disruption arrow would easily remove this nuisance. Are you really just that miserable?

 

 

Edited November 9, 2019 by Bossk_Hogg

[biostem]

29 minutes ago, Leogunner said:

I just did.  Those are the only powers that impart no effect to the ally you cast it on and only effects enemies.  Even Enflame in the Sorcery pool can be targeted on a foe and affect foes.  They are still unique to powers like Power of the Phoenix because that affects both ally and foe.

 

And that still fits Poison's Noxious Gas because you do require a power outside of the set (you need a henchman).

 

To complain that Oilslick Arrow requires one of two specific damage types is like complaining that Nature Affinity has bloom or Street Justice has combos.  Oilslick requires fire or energy damage to trigger and you too can pick up a ranged energy attack for a pool attack starting at level 4.  It's available to everyone.  And if you don't want to spend a power pick, everyone can revoke their origin power for taser or charm.

 

All that really does paint that there is no real issue there.

Go back and read what I wrote, because you are blatantly ignoring that "ally-only" and "enemy only" are conditions separate from oil slick arrow's.  Sorcery's enflame is actually more versatile because it has a function vs allies or enemies.  Now, if they added an additional effect to oil slick arrow, where it did something different if it were hit with cold, negative energy, smashing, lethal, or psi, then maybe you'd have a point.  You cannot take poison, as a MM, without having access to henchmen.  In fact, they modified the set for ATs that don't have them.  If they didn't, then again you'd have a point.  You don't need to go outside of your primary for that, either.

Edited November 9, 2019 by biostem

[Leogunner]

44 minutes ago, Bossk_Hogg said:

Legorunner, why do you have such a huge bug up your ass about what amounts to a QOL change for a set you don't even play? It is, as you note, easy to light (when it works) with various powers, it's just a hassle. Throwing minor energy damage in disruption arrow would easily remove this nuisance. Are you really just that miserable?

 

 

Are you still mad that I corrected your mistake that you decided to double down on?  But apparently I'm the miserable one?  No need to hold a grudge...unless you want to go.  I might be able to find some time for a forum argument tomorrow lol

 

45 minutes ago, biostem said:

Go back and read what I wrote, because you are blatantly ignoring that "ally-only" and "enemy only" are conditions separate from oil slick arrow's.  Sorcery's enflame is actually more versatile because it has a function vs allies or enemies.  Now, if they added an additional effect to oil slick arrow, where it did something different if it were hit with cold, negative energy, smashing, lethal, or psi, then maybe you'd have a point.  You cannot take poison, as a MM, without having access to henchmen.  In fact, they modified the set for ATs that don't have them.  If they didn't, then again you'd have a point.  You don't need to go outside of your primary for that, either.

I read what you wrote and I provided a counter argument that you seem to want to ignore or don't understand.  Your qualifiers to present your argument on a stronger foundation merely expresses that Oilslick Arrow has a unique mechanic.  It doesn't, however, support your argument that it is somehow inherently unfair, broken or unusable.

 

If I were to read your initial reply to me:

 

5 hours ago, biostem said:

Which goes to my point, that only TA lacks a way within the set to make full use of all its power effects.  I.E., other MM secondaries don't need to reply upon the origin starter powers or APPs/PPPs in order to use one of their other powers.

Considering your specific qualifiers, you're still ignoring Poison's Noxious Gas.  Adding the qualifier of "a power from your other primary/secondary other than TA" is merely moving the goalpost from this response.  It's no different from taking 1 power from a pool or taking 1 power from your primary.  It's the same thing.

 

As for other interactions with other damage types, I'd adore they do that for other trick arrow powers.  That's actually why I advocate for that particular status quo.  It's a neat mechanic that should be expanded upon, not shored up because some people don't like it and yet can't be arsed to play a different powerset.

 

...but then my goal in posting in the thread was to help OP, not complain about a set I don't like.

 

[Bossk_Hogg]

14 hours ago, Leogunner said:

Are you still mad that I corrected your mistake that you decided to double down on?  But apparently I'm the miserable one?  No need to hold a grudge...unless you want to go.  I might be able to find some time for a forum argument tomorrow lol[/quote]

You mean the one where you didnt realize that the burn patch is smaller than the slick? The one where it's roughly the same size as a burn patch? Maybe, it's 8 radius rather than 5. IDK. And yeah dude, you stayed up in a hotel furiously banging on your keyboard to make a TA character on test (because you don't have one) with their shitty connection. Glad to have given your sad life some focus for a bit. 

 

Still doesnt change the fact that you constantly threadcrap in QOL/buff requests for sets you do not play (this and elec blast, probably others). You whine the game is too easy if we buff underperfoming sets, because you don't have the stones to post the nerf threads you want lol. 

[Shadowsleuth]

 

No AT should have to feel obligated to dipping into pool powers or epics to utilize a feature of their powerset (either Primary or Secondary).

 

Redlynne's suggestion of swapping out Entangling Arrow & replacing it with Electrified Net Arrow (so that Electrified Net Arrow could be used to ignite Oil Slick) seems to be the simplest solution; doesn't require dipping into other pools or lock you into picking a specific origin for the origin power (which would limit player concepts for their character).

 

Redlynne even provides stats on the two powers.

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/11069-some-tweaks-to-give-trick-arrow-a-point/?do=findComment&comment=111191

[Leogunner]

3 hours ago, Bossk_Hogg said:

You mean the one where you didnt realize that the burn patch is smaller than the slick? The one where it's roughly the same size as a burn patch? Maybe, it's 8 radius rather than 5. IDK. And yeah dude, you stayed up in a hotel furiously banging on your keyboard to make a TA character on test (because you don't have one) with their shitty connection. Glad to have given your sad life some focus for a bit. 

I mean this one where you idiodically go by the numbers displayed on MIDS that say's Oilslick is 5ft range but hilariously don't understand what that means (that it would literally be smaller than a melee damage aura which are 8ft range) then admit you don't even know what the range of oilslick is here:

 

On 10/28/2019 at 7:29 PM, Bossk_Hogg said:

TA is fairly bad though, I might even say in worse shape than electric blast. Four of your nine powers are significantly worse than the Tactical Arrow equivalent, and Flash Arrow is more or less the same (a whopping 1% more to-hit debuff for defenders). It's debuffs also aren't anything spectacular, lacking -regen, -special, -hp, or anything to make it stand out from the other debuff sets that offer more utility. Radiation does in two powers what TA can barely accomplish in four, and offers a lot more. 

 

All TA really has going for it is Oil Slick Arrow, and Bonfire on a blaster is better anyways, with 2/3 the recharge and a massive radius of 25 vs Oil Slick's 5' radius.

 

On 10/30/2019 at 12:46 PM, Bossk_Hogg said:

No, the question was what levels have you played Trick Arrow and Electric Blast to, and on what AT's. And how bug do YOU think Oil Slick is. 8' radius? 10? 15? It's not 25 as near as I can tell, and the burn is smaller. 

 

Also, relative performance is a valid metric for requesting buffs. The set is lackluster compared to other defender options and appallingly, a blaster secondary. Just like electric blast's damage is weaker but its survivability isn't substantially higher. And once everything is on relatively equal footing, we can add higher difficulty tiers to challenge everyone. Because if everything was dragged down to TA's performance level, people just wouldn't invite defenders...

 

As for this:

3 hours ago, Bossk_Hogg said:

Still doesnt change the fact that you constantly threadcrap in QOL/buff requests for sets you do not play (this and elec blast, probably others). You whine the game is too easy if we buff underperfoming sets, because you don't have the stones to post the nerf threads you want lol. 

I assume people log into the forums to discuss things not pat eachother on the backs and agree with everything everyone else says.  I'm sorry that you decided to come into this thread with animosity then complain when someone throws some animosity back.  I'm willing to drop misunderstandings or feelings of hostility between threads. Do you really want to continue what was going on in another thread here?

[Leogunner]

2 hours ago, Shadowsleuth said:

doesn't require dipping into other pools or lock you into picking a specific origin for the origin power (which would limit player concepts for their character).

 

FYI, you don't have to pick a specific origin.  You can go to the P2W vendor, revoke your origin power and then pick one of the 2 that deals energy damage.

[plainguy]

21 hours ago, Leogunner said:

I just did.  Those are the only powers that impart no effect to the ally you cast it on and only effects enemies.  Even Enflame in the Sorcery pool can be targeted on a foe and affect foes.  They are still unique to powers like Power of the Phoenix because that affects both ally and foe.

 

And that still fits Poison's Noxious Gas because you do require a power outside of the set (you need a henchman).

 

To complain that Oilslick Arrow requires one of two specific damage types is like complaining that Nature Affinity has bloom or Street Justice has combos.  Oilslick requires fire or energy damage to trigger and you too can pick up a ranged energy attack for a pool attack starting at level 4.  It's available to everyone.  And if you don't want to spend a power pick, everyone can revoke their origin power for taser or charm.

 

All that really does paint that there is no real issue there.

I disagree.

 

IF  every power had every IO option then I wouldn't be complaining or asking for some sort of fix to this. 

 

The problem is that to create a certain build within the IO sets given you are limited to Certain powers and if you want to add in thematic builds you are even limited even more.

A good example of this is the Dark with Fluffy pet at the end.  That Set because of the IO options pretty much limits you to to creating a Range cap build and rely on darkest night to obtain your melee and aoe defense cap via the anchor to debuff.

 

There is just no way to get Range cap and Melee cap or Range cap and AOE cap with that set because the IO options are limited. 

 

Whereas other sets like Traps for example get you almost to defense cap in your mid 30s and that is with just SO's and a few low end IO sets. 

 

If I were an SO only player or didn't understand the game mechanics then I wouldn't care less. Because it would mean nothing to me. 

But it does because I do understand enough about the game mechanics and care to create certain builds and yea sometimes a bit thematic builds.  

Again we could debate about the value of thematic builds etc... But that is a different discussion. Because then we could go into why have a costume creator and why play a superhero/supervillain MMO. 

 

Another problem you missed completely as I posted is that there is a BUG.. When you try to ignite with the Taser or Charm ( because they do exactly the same thing ) The Oil Slick Target will DISAPPEAR after the first shot. So if you fail you don't have a second chance and that REALLY SUCKS  !!

End result that is really Limiting Oil Slick to just making mobs fall down. I have zero clue if the procs I added to it are even working honestly.  But they are not working when its just an Oil Slick. 

I have a damage parser that I will use to see if the procs are of any value or working at all, just being lazy atm to test it out.

 

But in a nutshell the very simple crux is I am forced into something I really don't want because I want something to occur with a certain power.  So I need to pick A to have B turn into C.. 

 

But again at the end of the day I am playing a Free game by people doing volunteer work to run it. 

 

GOING OFF ON A TANGENT: 

Mind you I also have a bit of doubt about that as well. Not the free part but no one is doing anything for free and out of the goodness of their heart.  I work in IT and I know first hand this whole thing is one a great resume addition. Further many companies including my own look at your outside the company work and volunteering to determine a promotion.  This game right now is opening up doors for people's careers.  I know many people in my Company that offer their skills for free to other start up companies doing business with ours.  I've been told as I mentioned that promotions at times literally came down to the volunteer work these people did because the decision process was that close.

 

BACK ON TRACK

Playing Trick arrow with nothing else I can tell you the biggest greatest thing it has is Glue arrow and Igniting Oil Slick. Those 2 things alone are killing groups of mobs.  If it didn't have Igniting Oil Slick this set would really suck.. 

 

This is the build,  having or not having pets does not matter for this discussion but you can get the context of what its all about at least.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 9, 2019 by plainguy

[Leogunner]

5 minutes ago, plainguy said:

I disagree.

 

IF  every power had every IO option then I wouldn't be complaining or asking for some sort of fix to this. 

 

The problem is that to create a certain build within the IO sets given you are limited to Certain powers and if you want to add in thematic builds you are even limited even more.

A good example of this is the Dark with Fluffy pet at the end.  That Set because of the IO options pretty much limits you to to creating a Range cap build and rely on darkest night to obtain your melee and aoe defense cap via the anchor to debuff.

 

There is just no way to get Range cap and Melee cap or Range cap and AOE cap with that set because the IO options are limited. 

 

Whereas other sets like Traps for example get you almost to defense cap in your mid 30s and that is with just SO's and a few low end IO sets. 

 

If I were an SO only player or didn't understand the game mechanics then I wouldn't care less. Because it would mean nothing to me. 

But it does because I do understand enough about the game mechanics and care to create certain builds and yea sometimes a bit thematic builds.  

Again we could debate about the value of thematic builds etc... But that is a different discussion. Because then we could go into why have a costume creator and why play a superhero/supervillain MMO. 

I'm not sure why you went on this tangent.  To bring up min/maxing IO builds as to why a build is limited from choosing a specific tactic is as shallow and superfluous as trying to claim a thematic build forces you to not have powers to trigger Oilslick thus apparently we need to take IO builds and concept builds into account.  It's not going to happen.  I mean, sure, you can continue to complain that the game doesn't always perfectly fall into place for every build but you aren't the only one and it really isn't an arguing point.  Perfect IO builds sometimes have to sacrifice power choices and slots to attain their desired performance and concept builds often suffer from low performance or lack of tools to fulfill their character's concept.  My only hope is that perhaps the OP was aided in some way so that their character had an easier time with their character rather than waiting for the off chance the devs decide to alter Entangling Arrow or some other power.

 

14 minutes ago, plainguy said:

Another problem you missed completely as I posted is that there is a BUG.. When you try to ignite with the Taser or Charm ( because they do exactly the same thing ) The Oil Slick Target will DISAPPEAR after the first shot. So if you fail you don't have a second chance and that REALLY SUCKS  !!

End result that is really Limiting Oil Slick to just making mobs fall down. I have zero clue if the procs I added to it are even working honestly.  But they are not working when its just an Oil Slick. 

I have a damage parser that I will use to see if the procs are of any value or working at all, just being lazy atm to test it out.

I didn't miss that.  I actually did comment on the bug.  However, you're overstating it.  When I was observing the size of the Oilslick on test so that I could take pics for that other thread, I did test to see if the size of the burning patch was smaller and from what I could tell, It was the same size as the oil slick.  But anyway, when I was doing that, I was gauging the size of the slick by using Ice Slick so it was an Ice/TA controller so I had to use the origin power to light it.  Since the build had no enhancements or powers outside of Ice Control and Trick Arrow that would help with accuracy, I occasionally missed with taser.  There was one time I missed 2 times.  Needless to say, it doesn't always disappear if you fail.  In fact, that bug never occurred despite trying different methods.  Also also, it's very possible to light the slick so late that it ignites after the oil disappears, just leaving the burn patch, which is what I started doing to compare the size of the slick vs the size of the burn patch.

 

I have no doubt that Oilslick does bug sometimes, it did it somewhat moderately when I played it on live, but I think that has more to do with powers that don't do energy damage hitting it causing this hiccup.

 

 

[plainguy]

4 minutes ago, Leogunner said:

I'm not sure why you went on this tangent.  To bring up min/maxing IO builds as to why a build is limited from choosing a specific tactic is as shallow and superfluous as trying to claim a thematic build forces you to not have powers to trigger Oilslick thus apparently we need to take IO builds and concept builds into account.  It's not going to happen.  I mean, sure, you can continue to complain that the game doesn't always perfectly fall into place for every build but you aren't the only one and it really isn't an arguing point.  Perfect IO builds sometimes have to sacrifice power choices and slots to attain their desired performance and concept builds often suffer from low performance or lack of tools to fulfill their character's concept.  My only hope is that perhaps the OP was aided in some way so that their character had an easier time with their character rather than waiting for the off chance the devs decide to alter Entangling Arrow or some other power.

 

I didn't miss that.  I actually did comment on the bug.  However, you're overstating it.  When I was observing the size of the Oilslick on test so that I could take pics for that other thread, I did test to see if the size of the burning patch was smaller and from what I could tell, It was the same size as the oil slick.  But anyway, when I was doing that, I was gauging the size of the slick by using Ice Slick so it was an Ice/TA controller so I had to use the origin power to light it.  Since the build had no enhancements or powers outside of Ice Control and Trick Arrow that would help with accuracy, I occasionally missed with taser.  There was one time I missed 2 times.  Needless to say, it doesn't always disappear if you fail.  In fact, that bug never occurred despite trying different methods.  Also also, it's very possible to light the slick so late that it ignites after the oil disappears, just leaving the burn patch, which is what I started doing to compare the size of the slick vs the size of the burn patch.

 

I have no doubt that Oilslick does bug sometimes, it did it somewhat moderately when I played it on live, but I think that has more to do with powers that don't do energy damage hitting it causing this hiccup.

 

 

 

Regarding the IO comment. 

Its just a basic fact with certain sets either primary or secondary you are somewhat limited in your options if your trying to obtain some goal game mechanics wise. 

So when you pick for example Beast Mastery / Trick Arrow there are only so much you can do. Meaning you can't defense cap. You can't  go for super recharge rate. Basically the funnel of choices is smaller compared to for example Robot Traps. I can get perma hasten and defense cap with Robot Traps. 

 

So that does have some play in creating a build. You just can't ignore it. You can't say I am pick Primary A and Secondary B and Power Pools 1,2,3,4 and getting perma hasten and defense cap.

It just isn't gonna happen.  But I want it to happen, still doesn't mean its gonna happen.  

 

I don't want fire, I don't want energy..  I want darkness.  Why am I being Pigeon holed to picking up Fire or energy and drop another power I might want to ignite Oil Slick ?

 

At the end of the day I had to do what I had to do, to make it work.  I picked up energy because it had a shield. But in doing so I had to rework not one or two powers. 

I had to rework 5 powers and make sure the numbers worked out. 

 

Again I hear what your saying..

 

In a nutshell without all the sugarcoating and pleasantries, you are  telling me Pick a power that will make it ignite stop complaining. Or accept the bug and it might not ignite from the taser and you might loose the window to ignite it as well. 

 

I'm telling you I don't want to change my build without  complaining about it and ask for something to be added into the trick arrow set that would allow for ignite to go off. 

 

As I mentioned I did what I needed to make it work on a consistent basis. But doesn't mean they shouldn't fix it to make it work.

 

If your playing a SO build or just slotting IOs without a care then none of this matters. But when you have an end goal build wise it matters.  All these things matter. The Primary the Secondary, the IOs that can go into a power.  

 

So just saying Slot this for that isn't that easy sometimes.  

 

Further if you went on test and just created a toon to test it out and it happen. Its a bug..  Its broken.. Period... 

If you want to down play it and just say oh its no big deal stop your complaining it might happen every once and a while, just deal with it.   That's fine.  I can't stop you. 

But  I am still going to say its broken and needs to be fixed.  But again I'm back to my its free so stop complaining. 

 

End result its here.. Fix it if you want. Change it if you want.  

I did my work around and when you fix it or change it I will look to see if I want to respec back into the fix.  

 

 

 

[GM Sijin]

Bugs shouldn't ever be 'acceptable' - especially those that impact the performance of a character. Neither should players have to 'deal with it' except in the time it takes the developers to locate the cause and implement a fix. I would argue that the fact that it's bugged does not matter for the point of this discussion except that the question might be raised "Assuming it wasn't bugged and oil slick reliably ignited, is it acceptable to have only the origin power or APPs enable igniting oil slick?"

 

Then again, neither should argumentum ad hominem or personal attacks be utilized, yet here we are. Mind your arguments don't continue to delve into the personal or insulting, please.

 

On the topic: Yes MM's choices for igniting oil slick is limited, but not necessarily more than other ATs. Demon summoning, thugs (the arsonist) and robots all have access to fire/energy damage types. That's no different than energy blast, fire blast, etc. having access to them as well, while other sets do not. I'm not sure that this topic should be limited to Masterminds as a result. Either way, I encourage continued discussion about the power and its somewhat stringent damage type requirements. I, personally, have mixed feelings. I like the idea of power synergies, but when it comes to Trick Arrow I think it just needs a whole lotta love. Or at least a little bit of tweaking.