Strategies for a two Scrapper STF?

[MunkiLord]

So a buddy and I want to each use a Scrapper and complete the STF using only those two characters. Now I realize this will take extremely high end builds and Incarnate slots, we're good with that. What I'm wondering is what types of Scrappers do you all think would be best to build for this? His old DM/Invul has tanked the STF before, but we had other buffers/debuffers to help out, so while it's a great combo, would it be good enough?

 

My initial thoughts are primaries likely need great single target more than AoE for some of those AVs. Fire/SD was a favorite of mine back in the day, I also have significant experience with Fire/WP, DM/SR, and Spines/Fire. I'm currently leveling an Elec/SD for farming purposes, but I don't think she'll be a good fit for this goal.

 

So I'm open to any and all suggestions.

[Murcielago]

Rad/WP for -def and survivability. I'm not sure which of the new power sets have -regen but you're gonna need that too.

[jack_nomind]

It depends a little on the rules you're setting, but if there aren't any other than "two scrappers"...

 

Some of the best choices for single-target attack chains are TW, StJ, MA, Savage (I think), and DB.  Three sets worth talking about for their overall utility are Ice Melee, Kinetic Melee, and Dark Melee.  Of all of the above those, TW, StJ, and Ice Melee have -Res powers and Savage and DB have -Def powers (which accept Achilles' Heel); any set can get -Res or -Def additionally from EPPs, with Blaze having -Res/-Def in Melt Armor and Leviathan and Body mastery having -Def powers.

 

As far as I know, no Scrapper primaries debuff regen, but Bio and Rad armor secondaries do.  Rad is especially interesting because of the -tohit, ally heals, and the +DMG mild-crash T9, but it's a little on the squishy side.  Shield Defense, also, has a nice ally buff with Grant Cover.  A well-slotted Shield Defense with Maneuvers, Grant Cover, and Grant Invisibility can provide ~20% defense to all to an ally, while a well-slotted Rad Armor can... well, okay, the heal is fairly incidental, but at least the power it's on does an enemy DoT and debuff as well.

 

I think I'd recommend StJ/SD and TW/Rad for a duo.  What you're really going to rely on are temp and incarnate powers, though.

 

[itaalh]

The -regen hybrid incarnate is a must have

[hejtmane]

Ok not counting Incarnate stuff back in the day pre-incarnate we ran an all scrapper stf the person that ended up tanking recluse while we worked on the towers was a broadsword/shield they where softcapped and then added parry to stack probably want aid self if you go that route. The other option imo while rad is good I still think katana/wp is the other way to go stack DA and note Iggy soloed the itf with a katana/wp per-incarnate.

 

Now the second scrapper you want dps and pre-incarnate if you look at the top dps build for st on the tower test the top slot was dm/sd I made the top 10 with fire/sd the nice part about dm/sd you have a heal built into your attack chain and with spring attack now you have an aoe to mix in with your st prowess . With DM you can leverage the repairman as fodder for soul drain buff along with shield charge /spring attack.

 

Just my two cents from the past

[MunkiLord]

Awesome, thanks for the replies so far. I'm going to look into some of the sets mentioned, and try to come up with a few specific ideas. This is more of a long term goal it will take a while to get an extreme high end build with the right incarnate powers. Plus I wanna work on an Elec/SD Scrapper first, and I know I won't be taking this on the two Scrappe STF.

 

As far as rules go, two Scrappers only is the only one. We'll prep beforehand and get a ton of inspirations and whatever temp powers we may possibly need, but won't use them until we really need to just so we can see how far we can push this. It's been a long time since I've done this TF and my memory is fuzzy, but are there any major concerns other than Ghost Widow(and possibly pulling all four at once) and Lord Recluse? Most AVs I'm not very concerned about. I've beat GW once on my own, but I really think that was more due to luck than anything as her hold didn't land a single time. So I'm going to assume she could be a major issue.

[jshmoe1236123]

I'm going to be joining Munkilord in this endeavor and I've been tinkering with a Rad/Bio build.  Between DNA Siphon and Parasitic Armor, I can get some pretty crazy regen numbers that can rival WP. I saw a few talk about Rad/ as it will help with the -def.  Rad/ will also provide more healing with contaminated baddies.  Would Irradiated Ground almost act as a small heal with the contaminated mechanic?  Is that a pretty vital power to have in something like this?  If we are popping enough insps candy, it can fill in gaps when it matters.  Or I can just scratch all of that and beef up more on my dm/inv.  It's already up there as I have solo'd the ITF with it, but I'm sure I'll need to modify it some to match what I'll expect to see on the STF.  I'll hang up and listen. 

[MunkiLord]

jshmoe is hoping to use his Rad/Bio Scrapper for this, but I'm still undecided. I'm open to absolutely anything, but some that stick out as possibilities are WP or Shield. Perhaps DM/WP? I know WP can survive quite a bit, but if I go with that, what primary would pair well with it? DM is always good, but what about Psi or Titan Weapons? I'm not overly concerned with a lot of AoE, as likely whatever secondary I use will need minions to stick around for various ways to buff me. Assume that going into this the top tier Incarnate slots across the board and price is not going to be a problem with getting IOs.

 

Does anyone think there is a better or more viable option than DM/WP?

[FUBARczar]

Personally, if I were doing it I would probably take...

 

Rad / WP or Rad / Bio

&

Ice / SD or Psi / SD but if you had to DM/SD would do

 

Ice is interesting, good AOE and Freezing Touch has great numbers as the best Dmg/Second of Activation with the added utility of Ice Patch

 

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.962

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Click this DataLink to open the build!

 

DPS: Level 50 Magic Scrapper

Primary Power Set: Ice Melee

Secondary Power Set: Shield Defense

Power Pool: Leaping

Power Pool: Speed

Power Pool: Fighting

Power Pool: Medicine

Ancillary Pool: Leviathan Mastery

 

Hero Profile:

Level 1: Ice Sword -- Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg(A), Mk'Bit-Dmg/EndRdx(17), Mk'Bit-Dmg/Rchg(19), Mk'Bit-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(19), Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), Mk'Bit-Dam%(21)

Level 1: Deflection -- RedFrt-Def/EndRdx(A), RedFrt-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(9), RedFrt-EndRdx(9), RedFrt-Def/Rchg(31), RedFrt-EndRdx/Rchg(34), RedFrt-Def(40)

Level 2: Battle Agility -- Rct-Def(A), Rct-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(3), Rct-ResDam%(3), Rct-Def/Rchg(11), Rct-Def/EndRdx(13), Rct-EndRdx/Rchg(40)

Level 4: True Grit -- NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(A), NmnCnv-Heal(5), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx(5), ResDam-I(11), TtnCtn-ResDam(25), TtnCtn-ResDam/EndRdx(25)

Level 6: Build Up -- GssSynFr--ToHit(A), GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg(7), GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(7), GssSynFr--Rchg/EndRdx(13), GssSynFr--ToHit/EndRdx(15), GssSynFr--Build%(17)

Level 8: Ice Patch -- RechRdx-I(A)

Level 10: Active Defense -- RechRdx-I(A)

Level 12: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A)

Level 14: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(15)

Level 16: Against All Odds -- EndRdx-I(A)

Level 18: Greater Ice Sword -- Hct-Dmg(A), Hct-Dmg/Rchg(23), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), Hct-Acc/Rchg(27), Hct-Dam%(40), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(46)

Level 20: Phalanx Fighting -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(42)

Level 22: Boxing -- Dmg-I(A)

Level 24: Injection -- Acc-I(A)

Level 26: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), StdPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(27), HO:Ribo(50)

Level 28: Freezing Touch -- SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprCrtStr-Dmg/Rchg(29), SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(29), SprCrtStr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43), SprCrtStr-Rchg/+50% Crit(46)

Level 30: Weave -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), RedFrt-EndRdx(31), RedFrt-EndRdx/Rchg(37), RedFrt-Def(42), RedFrt-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42), RedFrt-Def/EndRdx(48)

Level 32: Frozen Aura -- SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(33), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(33), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), FuroftheG-ResDeb%(34)

Level 35: Shield Charge -- SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprScrStr-Dmg/Rchg(36), SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), SprScrStr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(36), SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), SprScrStr-Rchg/+Crit(37)

Level 38: Aid Self -- IntRdx-I(A), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(39), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(39), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(39), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(45), Pnc-Heal(45)

Level 41: Water Spout -- SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), SprFrzBls-Dmg/EndRdx(43), SprFrzBls-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(46), SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprFrzBls-Rchg/ImmobProc(50), AchHee-ResDeb%(50)

Level 44: Hibernate -- RechRdx-I(A)

Level 47: Grant Cover -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A)

Level 49: One with the Shield -- GldArm-3defTpProc(A)

Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Critical Hit

Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Sprint -- EndRdx-I(A)

Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)

Level 4: Ninja Run

Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)

Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A)

Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)

Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-EndMod(A), PrfShf-End%(43), PrfShf-EndMod/Acc(45), PrfShf-EndMod/Rchg(48)

Level 50: Agility Core Paragon

Level 50: Melee Core Embodiment

Level 50: Diamagnetic Radial Flawless Interface

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[MunkiLord]

What do yall think about TW/WP? I've used WP plenty, so I know that's great and I've heard good things about TW. I'm also considering Ice/SD as that looks promising.

[Charistoph]

Secondaries?  Bio Armor and Shield Defense.

 

Shield Defense will buff your his Defense when you're around, and your Defense when he's around.

 

Bio Armor has a modifiable aura that will reduce opponent's damage, just like Shield Defense.

 

Dark Melee will reduce your opponent's chance to hit, as well as giving you an extra heal if you need it.

 

Ice Melee has slows, increasing the time between attacks.

 

Those would be the first ones that I would look at.

[MunkiLord]

JSHMOE is going with Rad/Bio. I'm considering Shield, but I just finished a build for an Elec/SD, so I'm hoping to go another route, but it seems it is the most popular vote for secondary. Guess I'm gonna look at Ice/SD some more and see what I can do with it.

[Crowcus Pocus]

I'm curious about how will you manage to survive LR before red/yellow pylon os down.

 

What kind of strategy will alllow you to do this?

[Jaguaratron]

Ok not counting Incarnate stuff back in the day pre-incarnate we ran an all scrapper stf the person that ended up tanking recluse while we worked on the towers was a broadsword/shield they where softcapped and then added parry to stack probably want aid self if you go that route. The other option imo while rad is good I still think katana/wp is the other way to go stack DA and note Iggy soloed the itf with a katana/wp per-incarnate.

 

Now the second scrapper you want dps and pre-incarnate if you look at the top dps build for st on the tower test the top slot was dm/sd I made the top 10 with fire/sd the nice part about dm/sd you have a heal built into your attack chain and with spring attack now you have an aoe to mix in with your st prowess . With DM you can leverage the repairman as fodder for soul drain buff along with shield charge /spring attack.

 

Just my two cents from the past

 

If the blue tower is up hes going to hit you.

 

If the red tower is up if a hit lands its going to wreck you.

 

If the orange tower is up then your chances of landing any + def abilities like parry are minimal.

 

If the green tower is up then you just wont kill him.

 

Until the blue and the red towers are down you will need to be kiting like a boss, aid self with 2x lvl 50 (+5) interrupt reduction IOs would be very helpful for taking the sting out of the hits that do land while you kite.

 

To duo this will be an extreme effort, I look forward to seeing the OPs attempts.

[greenstalker]

Before do this go to warburg and get nukes so you can get some debuffs on AV's at the end.

[nihilii]

Going to +1 Jaguar - the biggest threat in a duo scrapper STF is going to be beefed up Recluse. Everything else takes a back seat.

 

First, one of you will likely have to be a dedicated kiter/taunter. Might or might not involve jetpacking through the skies and picking Confront... You could get away without Confront, but you really don't want to lose Recluse for a moment and for him to zoom to your friend, "oneshot" him (with dot), and have the repairmen undo your work.

 

Meanwhile, the tower killer has to be on point with dealing decent DPS, and shutting down the repairmen before they get a heal off (much harder solo than it is on a team). It's a race to take the first tower down before Recluse kills the kiter, and you'll likely want to take down the Arachnos Flyer beforehand so it doesn't show up in the middle of it.

 

With that in mind, quick animations and fast recharge AOEs could have greater importance over optimal DPS. Rad/Bio might do the trick for a tower killer, if nothing else because it has two damage auras (of sorts) + Atom Smasher. Animations are pretty long, but you can probably work with that with quick reaction times. You may or may not have to let your Lore pets do the damage and strictly focus on killing repairmen (anyone knows which pet to go for the highest ST DPS? Longbow Cataphract might be a decent overall choice in any case, their absurd -regen an useful addition to taking down lvl 54 AVs).

 

Going to third /SD for the kiter, nice mix of def, res, hp, and not only you'd provide your friend with defense, but also defense debuff resistance which is arguably even more important. I'd assume you'd want slotted out OwtS as well as Barrier, and Aid Self to patch yourself up. Primary is up to you, as Jaguar said you're not going to land anything on Recluse before the point where it matters less, so Katana, Broadsword, Titan and DM aren't as important for their +def / heal as you might think.

 

It's going to be a significant achievement if you guys pull this off, please keep us updated. :)

 

[MunkiLord]

These are all fantastic suggestions, I appreciate it everyone. So................I already have a pretty high end Elec/SD that is just missing the Portal Jockey Accolade. What does everyone think about maybe using that? I understand that the ST is very lacking, I don't have confront, and it's likely a long shot. But does anyone think there is a way to make that work?

[nihilii]

IMHO, a different primary wouldn't be the make-or-break factor in this scenario. The two of you are going to push over 300 DPS regardless, before Lore pets. It's going to come down to whether your strategy lets you survive more than whether you can dish out the damage - because no matter the primary, we're looking at someone handling Recluse for minutes until at least one tower goes down.

[FUBARczar]

These are all fantastic suggestions, I appreciate it everyone. So................I already have a pretty high end Elec/SD that is just missing the Portal Jockey Accolade. What does everyone think about maybe using that? I understand that the ST is very lacking, I don't have confront, and it's likely a long shot. But does anyone think there is a way to make that work?

 

IMO I wouldn't want to take Electric Melee for an AV hunt, I'd take most sets over that, KM, Psi, Ice, DM, IDK anything

[Murcielago]

I would also bring Warberg Nukes and as many pets that you can muster.

[FUBARczar]

Oh and BTW you can use the old Blaster tanking Recluse trick:

 

Just hover out of his range and keep sniping him, idk you might even be able to put enough +range into Confront and do this too.

[jshmoe1236123]

Thanks for the input on this.  Definitely gave us some new things to think about.  Looking at the Interface Incarnate, would it be more beneficial to get the -ToHit and-Regen or the -DMG and -DEF?

[MunkiLord]

Regen. The Incarnate powers alone won't be enough to overcome a buffed Recluse. So once those are gone -regen is definitely what we want.

[jack_nomind]

For -regen, you're really going to be leaning on Lore pets and trying to burst him down in that window.  The Interface -regen probably isn't going to make a dent; you're going to get a net of -10% regen and no DoT with Diamagnetic.  I'd strongly recommend Degenerative and Reactive.  He resists Toxic more than Fire (Fire, Cold, and Psi are his lowest resists), but the -maxhp is still useful; you get slightly more effective -regen (since he'll lose just over 10% of his maxhp), lower his actual hit points, and still get some use out of the DoT.

[Murcielago]

Another strategy is to die a lot.