PSA: New set IOs Power Transfer: Chance to Heal Self

[Caulderone]

Page 5 is getting ready to launch very soon now.  Coming among the various things are some new IO sets.  I want to focus on the new Power Transfer endmod set Proc.

 

Power Transfer: Chance to Heal Self (3ppm, 5% heal)

 

This can be slotted in anything that takes EndMod sets.  For a Tanker, the heal is 5% of base HP (1874) = 93.7 HP healed.

At 3PPM, this works out to 4.685 HP/Sec when slotted in an always active power (stamina, physical perfection, etc.).

 

Comparing that to Regenerative Tissues:  +25% Regeneration:

At base HP (1874), this works out to 1.95 HP/Sec.  At max HP (3534), this works out to 3.68 HP/Sec.

These numbers are the same for Impervious Skin:  Status Resistance & Regen.

 

So, for anyone who has added an extra slot to any build and used RT:+Regen or Imp.Skin:SR&R, you would be better off once this goes live switching that slot to another power that takes the PT:Heal.  Assuming you already have Panacea elsewhere, this is going to be the best HP recovery slotting for Physical Perfection.

 

This will be very, very nice for Tanker primaries that lack any direct healing.  My SR/ build will be having two of them, one in Stamina (slot moved from Health) and one in Phys.Pefection (replacing RT:Regen).  This will result in my effective HP regen going from right about ~38 HP/Sec to about ~42.67 HP/Sec.

 

TLDR:

**************

For HP recovery, PT:Heal comes in 2nd behind only Panacea.

**************

 

edit PS:  This can also be used to turn Power Sink, Energy Absorption, and several Mu Mastery powers into minor heals.

edit2:  Math

 

Late Edit:  I thought Panacea's heal was a flat 7.5%, but it apparently isn't.  So, PT:Heal is actually better than it for HP recovery.  Panacea is still likely more valuable because of the additional End return.

 

Double Late Edit:  See the 2nd page of posts and you will find the following:

There is apparently a lockout timer, designed to prevent multiple heals in AoEs.  This causes any PT:Heal past the first one in passives to have drastically reduces results (PPM halves for each added 1 beyond 1).

TLDR this time:  Any PT:Heal slotted beyond the first one is unlikely to be worth it.  Ugh.

A 2nd one can be worth it until you hit roughly +20% MaxHP.  After that, the 2nd slot is better off as RT:Regen.

 

Edit - Way Later!:  As Bopper noted towards the end of the thread, the issue with PT:Heal stacking has been fixed.  Yay!

Edited June 7, 2021 by Caulderone

[Bopper]

Excellent knowledge to put out there. Now that the proc is not unique, it can be great utility to builds that want to use multiples of these.

[Sura]

I added this tonight, and it seems to work fine in Physical Perfection.  Oddly though, I never saw Panacea proc, and I watched the combat log for several minutes.  I saw Power Transfer proc, and Performance Shifter, but not Panacea.  I have it slotted in Rise to the Challenge, which was toggled on, and I even stood in combat for five minutes or so.  Are the two procs exclusive?  Is Panacea not proccing because it's not in an auto power?  It should show in the combat log, right?

 

I'm not sure I could get both in auto powers, but I could try, if it would make a difference.

 

Also, at one point I unslotted Numina's Regen/Rec and my monitored Regen rate didn't change.  It does show up in the list of things contributing to the regen rate though.

 

EDIT: Swapped Panacea into Physical Perfection and now both are proccing.  I really thought it would work in RttC, but I didn't lose anything in the swap I guess.  Still feel like maybe my Regen isn't totalling what it should, but not sure I want to chase it right now.  Should things like Panacea or Doctored Wounds work in RttC?

Edited April 1, 2020 by Sura

[Bopper]

7 minutes ago, Sura said:

I added this tonight, and it seems to work fine in Physical Perfection.  Oddly though, I never saw Panacea proc, and I watched the combat log for several minutes.  I saw Power Transfer proc, and Performance Shifter, but not Panacea.  I have it slotted in Rise to the Challenge, which was toggled on, and I even stood in combat for five minutes or so.  Are the two procs exclusive?  Is Panacea not proccing because it's not in an auto power?  It should show in the combat log, right?

 

I'm not sure I could get both in auto powers, but I could try, if it would make a difference.

 

Also, at one point I unslotted Numina's Regen/Rec and my monitored Regen rate didn't change.  It does show up in the list of things contributing to the regen rate though.

That sounds like a bug. Take screenshots and submit details of weird things you're seeing. I'm not familiar with Rise to the Challenge, but if it's a toggle that is self affecting only, then that is the equivalent of an auto. Panacea should proc on average every 20 seconds in those types of powers and should show up as healing received (and maybe healing delivered).

[Caulderone]

RttC only really works with mobs in range, so it may be worth checking it with mobs around.  It may only be able to proc when a mob is in the area.

[Sura]

4 minutes ago, Bopper said:

That sounds like a bug. Take screenshots and submit details of weird things you're seeing. I'm not familiar with Rise to the Challenge, but if it's a toggle that is self affecting only, then that is the equivalent of an auto. Panacea should proc on average every 20 seconds in those types of powers and should show up as healing received (and maybe healing delivered).

I edited.  If it's supposed to proc, it certainly wasn't, and moving it to an Auto got it to proc just fine.

 

Interestingly, I also had regenerative tissue in RttC, and it wasn't applying either.  When I moved it to a slot in Health its bonus all of a sudden appeared in my monitor.  So that buff wasn't applying from within RttC either.

[Sura]

Just now, Caulderone said:

RttC only really works with mobs in range, so it may be worth checking it with mobs around.  It may only be able to proc when a mob is in the area.

I did, unless it didn't count because the mob was gray.  I'll log back in quick and try a group in PI.

[Sura]

Moved Panacea back to RttC.  No procs in a minute with no mobs.

 

Let six Possessed Scientists (3 blue and 3 white) do their best for some minutes and no Panacea procs.  Saw Power Transfer proc, but no Panacea.  

[Bopper]

2 minutes ago, Sura said:

Moved Panacea back to RttC.  No procs in a minute with no mobs.

 

Let six Possessed Scientists (3 blue and 3 white) do their best for some minutes and no Panacea procs.  Saw Power Transfer proc, but no Panacea.  

I looked up RttC. It's an 8 ft aura, and each target hit within that aura has a 26.3% chance to proc every 10 seconds. That is worse than an auto (50% chance every 10 seconds), but if you have atleast 2 enemies within your aura, you should see more procs on average. Unless there was a secret nerf to Panacea no longer procing more than once in AoEs (like what they did to Call of the Sandman and the new Power Transfer proc), you should be seeing it plenty. Even if they did nerf it, you would see it plenty. So it's odd behavior you're witnessing.

[Mikewho]

On 3/31/2020 at 11:53 PM, Bopper said:

I looked up RttC. It's an 8 ft aura, and each target hit within that aura has a 26.3% chance to proc every 10 seconds. That is worse than an auto (50% chance every 10 seconds), but if you have atleast 2 enemies within your aura, you should see more procs on average. Unless there was a secret nerf to Panacea no longer procing more than once in AoEs (like what they did to Call of the Sandman and the new Power Transfer proc), you should be seeing it plenty. Even if they did nerf it, you would see it plenty. So it's odd behavior you're witnessing.

Is it possible Panacea in this case is applying to the enemies erroneously, since rttc has things that affect enemies? Would be a hilarious and unfortunate bug.

[Bopper]

4 hours ago, Mikewho said:

Is it possible Panacea in this case is applying to the enemies erroneously, since rttc has things that affect enemies? Would be a hilarious and unfortunate bug.

It certainly is possible, and in that case I would get a performance analyzer from P2W and monitor an enemy within my RttC aura to see if they are getting health/endurance returns or regen buffs (if regenerative tissue is in there)

[Call Me Awesome]

5 hours ago, Mikewho said:

Is it possible Panacea in this case is applying to the enemies erroneously, since rttc has things that affect enemies? Would be a hilarious and unfortunate bug.

I seem to remember that happening on several powers way back when, the proc would fire on the mobs instead of on the player.  It seemed to be a common issue with procs on Live.  I'll bet that's where the issue is.  Fixing it may be another matter however.

[twozerofoxtrot]

Thinking of doing some heavy retooling of my SS/WP/EM Brute _{(I know, different forum but was searching about this proc)} and was considering slotting it up to 4 times (Stamina, Recovery, Sup. Conditioning, Phys. Perf.). Why? Basically even unslotted, these power combined give me more end than I really need, but they fit the theme. So I'm trying to get the most bang for the buck, and building on WP's superior passive regen sounds like a winner.

 

Questions for the collective:

 

1) Is there any limit to how much these can collectively proc? I am assuming no.

2) Can two of them proc at once?

3) Is this a great idea, or the greatest idea?

[Caulderone]

1.  No.

2.  Yes, they are independent of each other.

3.  As long as the regen you give up, if any, does not exceed the value of the HP/Sec you gain from PT:Heal, sure.

At Brutes base 1499 max HP, the value of this IO is 3.7475 HP/Sec.

[Brutal Justice]

How did this make it out of beta at its current power level as a non unique?   Why are the +regen uniques unique if this is roughly twice as powerful?   Not only are the raw numbers higher, but being a heal rather than regen, it’s also unaffected by -regen debuffs that can be pretty prevalent throughout the game.  

 

Some sets can easily slot this 3 times in either a passive or fairly long duration click, bio, willpower, rad.   

[Bopper]

17 minutes ago, Mr.Sinister said:

How did this make it out of beta at its current power level as a non unique?   Why are the +regen uniques unique if this is roughly twice as powerful?   Not only are the raw numbers higher, but being a heal rather than regen, it’s also unaffected by -regen debuffs that can be pretty prevalent throughout the game.  

 

Some sets can easily slot this 3 times in either a passive or fairly long duration click, bio, willpower, rad.   

Regen debuffs don't affect your regen procs. Whether you have the proc or not won't change the fact you're taking the full regen debut.

 

As for the proc being non-unique, might be because it can only proc once per cast, so AoEs can't stack up the +HP.

 

As for the proc being placed in multiple auto powers, is it really that powerful? At base regen (100%), your character will heal 5% of MAX HP every 12 seconds. With only 200% total regeneration, this becomes every 6 seconds. The Power Transfer: Heal Proc in stamina will have a 50% chance to heal 5% of BASE HP every 10 seconds. 

 

So let's assume you have 3 procs in autopowers, that averages 5% BASE HP every 6.67 seconds. Compare that to a character with MAX HP equal to 140% of BASE HP (20% from accolades, another 20% set bonuses). With 200% total regen you will be healing 7% BASE HP every 6 seconds. Don't get me wrong, it's powerful, but it still costs you an enhancement slot (in this case 3 slots). The real abuse may come from electric sets that can put one into every attack. But don't be surprised if this proc gets relooked at similar to what they did with Call of the Sandman

[Brutal Justice]

2 hours ago, Bopper said:

Regen debuffs don't affect your regen procs. Whether you have the proc or not won't change the fact you're taking the full regen debut.

 

As for the proc being non-unique, might be because it can only proc once per cast, so AoEs can't stack up the +HP.

 

As for the proc being placed in multiple auto powers, is it really that powerful? At base regen (100%), your character will heal 5% of MAX HP every 12 seconds. With only 200% total regeneration, this becomes every 6 seconds. The Power Transfer: Heal Proc in stamina will have a 50% chance to heal 5% of BASE HP every 10 seconds. 

 

So let's assume you have 3 procs in autopowers, that averages 5% BASE HP every 6.67 seconds. Compare that to a character with MAX HP equal to 140% of BASE HP (20% from accolades, another 20% set bonuses). With 200% total regen you will be healing 7% BASE HP every 6 seconds. Don't get me wrong, it's powerful, but it still costs you an enhancement slot (in this case 3 slots). The real abuse may come from electric sets that can put one into every attack. But don't be surprised if this proc gets relooked at similar to what they did with Call of the Sandman

I was saying when you’re hit with a regen debuff, your regen will go down, reducing the benefit of the +regen procs.  This proc however, will be unaffected by that debuff.  Therefore, not only providing double the regenerated hp/s as the +regen uniques, but also circumventing a debuff that the +regen uniques are subject to.  

 

I’m not saying this IO is going to allow me to tank Recluse if I couldn’t already.  Possibly Hamidon though.  I am saying, why is regen tissue a unique and not this IO when it’s 2x as powerful.  It’s completely out of line with other IOs.  It’s existence as a non unique sets a bad precedence for future IOs.  

[GunnerTez]

Well in the mean time one has to ask, what set takes advantage of PT's proc the most. Bio? Rad Armor? Electric?

[Bopper]

38 minutes ago, Mr.Sinister said:

was saying when you’re hit with a regen debuff, your regen will go down, reducing the benefit of the +regen procs

I always think of regen in terms of HP/sec. So HP/sec = MaxHP/240 * (Regeneration%). So a +25% regen will always be an additional MaxHP/960 per second, assuming your starting point is greater than 0%.

 

But to your point, I assume you're talking about -regen debuffs that are astronomical to the point you're still in the red after the buff is added. In that case, I agree. 

 

36 minutes ago, GunnerTez said:

Well in the mean time one has to ask, what set takes advantage of PT's proc the most. Bio? Rad Armor? Electric?

I think Electric would get some major benefit. Its damage toggle can take the proc, plus being a resistance based set, you will live life constantly taking some damage while not suffering as much from burst damage, giving you more healing over time benefits (defense sets will remain at full health most times, wasting the proc...but when hot it will get more time before its next hit so it somewhat evens out).

 

Really, it probably helps electric melee more than anything. 4 slot kinetic combat in charged brawl, havoc punch, and chain induction, throw in a heal proc and a +5 Frankenstein to round out the attack. You could throw in the 15% heal for CotS into Charged Brawl (or Havoc Punch), but at best it will proc only 12.77% (or 25%) of the time (assuming no recharge). 

Edited April 7, 2020 by Bopper

[Sura]

On 3/28/2020 at 1:35 PM, Caulderone said:

 

TLDR:

**************

For HP recovery, PT:Heal comes in 2nd behind only Panacea.

**************

 

 

Sorry for the callback WAY to the original post, but Panacea is healing less for me.  

 

Panacea is healing for 64.58.

Power Transfer is healing for 93.7.

 

Of course I get END back with Panacea as well.

Edited April 9, 2020 by Sura
typo

[Caulderone]

Panacea is supposed to be 3PPM 7.5% HP heal.

PT:Heal is supposed to be 3PPM 5% HP heal.

 

Edit:  those should be of base HP, btw, and apparently they are being modified by +/- Heal, which may not be intended.

 

I haven't bothered to verify in game numbers, but there were some posts in the Beta threads about it here:

 

Bopper actually got 8.8% heal value from Panacea and 5% from PT:Heal a few posts down from that one.

Edited April 9, 2020 by Caulderone

[Caulderone]

Ok, something very odd is going on.

 

Made a Tank (most base HP) on Beta with Panacea.  As you noted, healing for 64.58.

Made a Dominator (least base HP) on Beta with Panacea.  Healing for 78.93.

[Sura]

Looking at the math:

 

Base HP for a tanker is 1874.1.

1874.1 * .05 = 93.7

PT:Heal is a 3PPM 5% HP heal. 

 

That would mean that at least in my case Panacea is doing less than 5%.  

 

1874.1 * .035 = 65.5 

So my Panacea is doing somewhere around 3.45%

The heal is at the top of this screenshot.

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by Sura

[Caulderone]

I'm adding these results to Macskull's thread in Bug forum here:

 

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by Caulderone

[Sura]

27 minutes ago, Caulderone said:

Ok, something very odd is going on.

 

Made a Tank (most base HP) on Beta with Panacea.  As you noted, healing for 64.58.

Made a Dominator (least base HP) on Beta with Panacea.  Healing for 78.93.

Somethin' ain't right.  🙂

 

Now I'm glad I posted, I was hesitant.