Electrical Affinity for Defending?

[Ankhammon]

I'm leveling up a Elec Affn/Beam character to see how it plays for a Defender. 

 

One of the things I've noticed is that the chain ability seems to be a bit limited in the range it can jump more than the static charges you can build up. 

It's easy to get a load of static on the char but if your first target is basically medium range (wish I knew the numbers) from something else that could be affected by it then it won't happen. To me that's the most infuriating part of the set so far.

 

The other thing I've noticed is when playing solo I'm spending a lot of time targeting through G Sentinel. So I can take advantage of the chains on myself. Not a bad thing per se, but when combining this pet with your Faraday Cage you end up in no mans land sometimes. Mostly just a thing to get used to but it does present moments of limitation within the set. 

 

There's a lot to like in the set as a whole but you do have to act differently and some things like herding become much more difficult. 

 

What have you guys seen? I did read someone (sorry I forgot who) saying that it plays havok with the visuals in raids and stuff.

And we all know it does fine for the MM crowd. 

[Linea]

It's a fairly genius design.  On the low end of builds, levels, playstyle, it's above average.  On the high end of builds, incarnates, and playstyles it's limited by the last "Pet or Teammate" alive.  This keeps it from being overpowered on the high end of the spectrum while nicely boosting the low end.  I do both Eafn/Water and Earth/Eafn .... so long as at least one pet/teammate is alive, I'm usually the last to die +4x8.   Solo it's much more difficult +4x8.

 

So, where do you play?  Do you play the extreme high end of Tier 4 IO Tier 4 Incarnate Builds Min/Maxing to the Extreme and Soloing Extreme +4x8 Content and Taskforces?   Or do you play the very casual SO Only end of the spectrum?  Or do you play somewhere inbetween with Tier 1 or Tier 2 IO builds, teaming, soloing moderate difficulty settings, and mostly just trying to enjoy yourself?   If you are on the Extreme High, you man not like it.  If you're on the extreme low, you should really like it unless it's just a playstyle thing.   halfway between it breaks even and you should still like it, unless it's just a playstyle thing.   It is a very good support set.  Perfect for targetting through the tank.   Great for Team Play. 

 

You may want to do something like (name him Sparky):  /macro X petselectname Sparky  ... or ... /bind numpad9 petselectname sparky ... this way you can quickly target him to bounce buffs back to yourself.   Also /bind numpad1 teamselect 1 .... etc ...

 

Spoiler

NUMPAD1 "Unselect$$team_select 1$$follow"
NUMPAD2 "Unselect$$team_select 2$$follow"
NUMPAD3 "Unselect$$team_select 3$$follow"
NUMPAD4 "Unselect$$team_select 4$$follow"
NUMPAD5 "Unselect$$team_select 5$$follow"
NUMPAD6 "Unselect$$team_select 6$$follow"
NUMPAD7 "Unselect$$team_select 7$$follow"
NUMPAD8 "Unselect$$team_select 8$$follow"
NUMPAD9 "Unselect$$pet_select_name Sparky"

 

 EAfn Water Defender - Alpha 1 - [i26].mxd

 

Earth EAfn Controller - Alpha 2 - [i26].mxd

 

Edited June 25, 2020 by Linea

[Seigmoraig]

I played a Corrupter and a Mastermind with Electric Affinity and while I had a good time playing both, I liked it better on a Mastermind especially for solo because I find it kind of miserable having to target through the sentinel all the time and thus never getting full value for your spells on yourself.
Mastermind was really great, I played it as a Thugs which can really benefit from the whole set as they really do eventually run out of endurance in larger spawns and EA just keeps them ticking non stop.

[seresibyl3]

I like it on my Cor... but only cuz it gives me (and the team, I guess...) unlimited Endurance for the primary. lol I do think it was "bad design" to try to use a pet to bounce it, rather than doing a self-casted (single target aoe heal on self type thing) that bounces... using the sentinel pet thing is just clunky. 

Edited June 25, 2020 by seresibyl3

[Hjarki]

Like most defensively-oriented sets, Electric Affinity tends to work better on Masterminds than other AT. The fundamental issue is that in most content, your teammates will not really need your defensive support to succeed and even if they do, it may not be the right kind of defense that they need. Electric Affinity is also a set that doesn't get much payoff from the Defender version. Many of the best effects are the same scale across all AT and many of the rest tend to fall into the 'too little to matter' or 'too big to matter' range. A Mastermind with EA is already healing superstar; ramping them up to Defender levels is just superfluous.

 

EA also pairs very poorly with Blast sets because it's such a 'busy' set. Not only are you constantly throwing a variety of effects from the set, but you need to do so to keep your stacks up. This effectively reduces your ability to deal damage. The bubble as a click rather than a toggle further limits what you can do - while other people are leaping straight into battle or dropping massive debuffs, you're just putting up a bubble that you're probably the only one who cares about.

[Cutter]

My experience (42 Elec/ElAff) is that ElAff is amazing for early game play because it plugs so many holes in those slot-starved levels. Resists, recovery, to-hit, +rech bursts... And it works incredibly in multiples. I recall a Posi a while ago where we had 3 ElAff heroes - ~50% resists for everyone on top of what they already might have had, endurance for days, and laughing at bubbles & ghosts because we had so much to-hit.

 

I will echo the frustrations of having to target through Sparky when solo. If it at least would pop a target reticle on whatever it's aiming at that would help; as it stands, if I want to keep buffs on myself I have no idea what enemy I'm engaging. I do use target binds to mitigate but that just adds to the clicky nature of the set. In teams I don't mind so much, but solo it can become a pain in the backside.

[Coyote]

I agree with @Hjarki completely. EA is a very busy set which leaves little time for blasting/controlling, and it's very strong defensively which is more important when your "team" is a bunch of low-HP henchmen who lack either real Resists or real Defenses (or if they're Ninjas, both 😛 ). So its strength on Defense matters more on a MM, and it's rather busy for pairing with a blasting or a controlling set.

[Linea]

Yes. It is very busy.  I can support, blast, control, or tank (leveraging the pet(s)).  But only one of those at a time.  

[Sir Myshkin]

I feel like the odd duck out on this jury call, but maybe that comes down to methodology of play style or something, but I (me, myself, as an opinion) don't find Electric Affinity so busy that I can't engage in combat like any other build. But, I am also marginally insane and tend to play character builds most others find too frantic or difficult to keep up with.

 

Of all the options that exist, and as many others have suggested, given the above, I would say that Electric Affinity leans to favoring Masterminds the most as it allows some freedom from the offensive side of the equation and how chains can stretch beyond a typical AoE field. For me, playing this with Demons/ElecAff, even still taking multiple attacks and Provoke I find the occasional moment of standing there thinking "Well... okay. What next?"

 

In regards to the chain effects though, and really the point of why I'm even posting, you have to be mindful about where you start your chain from. As was explained during the beta testing, the chains will follow priority effect based on whether you start with a pet or a player. As I have seen with my own Demons/ElecAff MM, eventually the chain can and will make it back to me, but I'm usually last depending on how things cycle through. If I start with a player, and the chain can go far enough, the pets will be last (if in range at that point). As such if you're using the Sentinel as your point-man, you can inadvertently be doing yourself a disservice. The chain has priority, and cascading effectiveness as it chains, so giving the Sentinel priority (thus 'Pets' priority) the trickle effect can skip the strong peak on a wasted target(s). You'll also want to try and either be mid-range, or in Melee to be in the best place for chains. In the pack, or somewhere between two points (range players v. melee) in order to be that anchor between them so a chain can flow backwards. Electric Affinity is definitely not a "back of the bus" support set.

 

Reinforcing what Linea said about setting a Macro to target, this is probably the most important thing to have in your tray as an ElecAff user. Make a Macro that targets the Sentinel in an emergency, and also one that targets a player (or get in the habit of Shift+Num from the top row to select a teammate).

 

 

[Hjarki]

1 hour ago, Sir Myshkin said:

The chain has priority, and cascading effectiveness as it chains,

I believe this 'cascading effectiveness' is full power on the first target and (roughly) half power on every other target. So the amount of benefit you personally receive should always be the same (since you can never be the primary target).

[kiramon]

1 hour ago, Sir Myshkin said:

I feel like the odd duck out on this jury call, but maybe that comes down to methodology of play style or something, but I (me, myself, as an opinion) don't find Electric Affinity so busy that I can't engage in combat like any other build. But, I am also marginally insane and tend to play character builds most others find too frantic or difficult to keep up with.

 

 

It’s just busy because it’s built around spam- low cooldown, weaker abilities. Like wg from nature vs insulating, or the end chain vs transference. 
 

you can definitely still blast but depending on the team/fight, you can get to a point where you have to choose....

 

my EA is AR... you can bet I have to choose well when to full auto lmao 

Edited June 25, 2020 by kiramon

[Sir Myshkin]

2 hours ago, kiramon said:

It’s just busy because it’s built around spam- low cooldown, weaker abilities. Like wg from nature vs insulating, or the end chain vs transference. 
 

you can definitely still blast but depending on the team/fight, you can get to a point where you have to choose....

 

my EA is AR... you can bet I have to choose well when to full auto lmao 

Even if I counted it on a MM where Discharge is an actual ability and not baked into a Sentinel, that leaves two powers at 10/s interval averages, one at 15/s, and a heal every 4/s. That still leaves me enough time to attack 5-6 times depending on which attacks I might choose. In the case of Discharge I don't even use it personally because it takes at least two applications to actually matter, and at that point the spawn is pretty much toasted on most teams so there's not much point in it, thus I'm not down to Energizing, Rejuvenating, and Insulating. If Absorb is still stacked, then I'm not even hitting Rejuvenating.

 

Again, to me, that's a LOT of idle time. And if I'm the Tank, then I honestly have even less to worry about because I'm diffusing damage across Bodyguard through my high (capped on most) Resistances, and my Demon's who break 60-75% at a minimum to nearly everything. Different experiences for each, but this is ... definitely not what I'd consider "busy."

 

Edit: Don't get me wrong, I get why folks would feel this way compared to something like Force Fields or Sonic, but any set that involves a consistent heal method for mitigation is going to be more active by comparison. Empathy and Pain aren't much different in contrast to Electric when it comes to the immediate list of "regularly cast" abilities. What I don't agree on is the set being so demanding that one has to complete give up their other set because they don't have time for it.

Edited June 26, 2020 by Sir Myshkin

[Ankhammon]

I've been just starting my EAffn/Beam defender and I can tell you the difference between 11 and 12 is particularly huge on this guy. The damage boost is significant and really helps the char.

And if you keep your ordering right, you can get a lot of blasts going to. I know my char is a young'un but with all the freebie powers I can still blast/melee to my hearts content... or until I gotta hit a heal or buff and then go back to it.

 

That being said, I want to say that I think Sir Mishkin is right about this being a mid or close distance kinda set. One of the things that sets it apart from ringers and bubblers is Faraday Cage is planted. It really kind of chains you to one small area. Yes it can be moved but that costs activation time which is precious.

 

Sadly, I have to agree it is a better set for other ATs.

I do think for a "Defender" primary it leaves a bit to be desired as there's not much that makes it stand out in a Defenders hands and some which are worse than in a MM or Controller.

• The -recovery doesn't seem to be all that good a trick as it's not really advanced unless you are using a draining primary so good news for Elec trollers and those who choose to take Elec secondary on a Def.
• The added offense is nice but mathematically inferior to what that damage output increase does to multiple pets like with a MM.
• The tier 9 is really kinda overboard for added Defense (on paper cuz I'm not there yet) for one person at 75%. You see numbers of 45% +Def on the MM version which is really high, IMO. With all the other added goodies listed it sounds like it's tailor made for a Necro Lich or some pet who can control. At least it's on a large recharge where the player may have to IO for recharging... oops forgot Energizing Circuit can make that perma too.
• MM discharge has a really small recharge rate and can deliver reasonable return as opposed to the Sentinel (I will say Sentinel seems better than a semi small radius targeted aoe -Dam).
• The -Dam numbers are in the Defenders favor though but that can be outclassed by several other defender sets (Naff, Dark, Time).
• Energize is exactly the same for MM and Def.
• The biggest draw of Faraday Cage is the mez protection and it's all but identical between the various ATs. Yes, the defender gets better resist numbers and is at a level it should be except for the maneuverability factor and everyone shares that trouble.
• The absorb numbers listed in mids for Insulating Circuit can't be right are they? We are talking ~400 HP for a MM and ~540 HP for a Def. That sounds very strange for a power that starts out perma. I looked and it appears they are listed as 25.00 no percent so I presume it's a typo (Naff absorb in Wild Bastion is 25%).

 

Strange, I started this post in hopes of singing this sets praises for Defenders and the more I look at it, the less it seems to be something to help Defenders stand out.

 

In conclusion, it's still fun on a Defender though.

 

Edited June 26, 2020 by Ankhammon

[Linea]

I use (almost) 'Resist Capped to All' Stoney primarily now, and the defender version stays in the stable.

 

You are misreading the defense.   It's "+75% defense enhancement" like an IO, or as if granting an Incarnate Defense Alpha slot, or similar to Power Boost ... I'm not sure of the actual durations either.  It's complicated and hard to decipher.  Easier to test it on a pet and use the combat attributes monitor than dig through the files and try to figure it out.

 

Chains (roughly):

Heavy support:  Heal, absorb, Heal, Blast Once, Repeat.

Heavy Control:  Control, control, control ... this chain never ends.

Heavy Blasting: Blast, Blast, Blast ... this one also never ends.

Tanking I:  Send in the Clowns, I mean Stoney:  Heal, Absorb, Heal, Summon, Heal, Absorb, Heal, Blast, repeat.

Tanking II:  Teleport, Resist, Sleep, other buffs, Nuke, AoE Blast, Heal, Absorb, Heal, Pray the pet lives for bouncing buffs, Heal, Absorb, Heal, Blast, Repeat.

[Sir Myshkin]

On 6/26/2020 at 1:02 AM, Ankhammon said:

The tier 9 is really kinda overboard for added Defense (on paper cuz I'm not there yet) for one person at 75%.

It's Defense Debuff, not Defense. Amp Up directly impacts "secondary effect" in abilities, and the in-game data doesn't properly tell you that, but the power's description is accurate in saying "defense debuff" specifically.

 

Essentially its an ability that's really nice to toss on a Controller or Dominator, or has interesting interactions with Blaster's who often carry a lot of abnormal attributes in their survival tool kits that they're unlikely to slot for over damage (like -Recov, or -ToHit). It's also an effective way to spice up the Sentinel, or add punch to MM and Controller pets that possess solid control effects like the Demon Prince or Umbra Beast.

 

It's also the most skippable power in the entire set. wah wah waaaaah.

 

I still find it interesting that a duo of Electric Affinity users would be a fiercely tough combination and give reason to using Amp Up on each other... ElecAff+Fire Blast+Dark, Perma Soul Drain, perma Amp Up, double assault and maneuvers and Empowering, Resistance cap to everything but Toxic, easily sustainable +200% damage... so close to perma Rain of Fire (x2) mobs won't know what to do with their lives...

[Ankhammon]

10 hours ago, Sir Myshkin said:

It's Defense Debuff, not Defense. Amp Up directly impacts "secondary effect" in abilities, and the in-game data doesn't properly tell you that, but the power's description is accurate in saying "defense debuff" specifically.

 

Essentially its an ability that's really nice to toss on a Controller or Dominator, or has interesting interactions with Blaster's who often carry a lot of abnormal attributes in their survival tool kits that they're unlikely to slot for over damage (like -Recov, or -ToHit). It's also an effective way to spice up the Sentinel, or add punch to MM and Controller pets that possess solid control effects like the Demon Prince or Umbra Beast.

 

It's also the most skippable power in the entire set. wah wah waaaaah.

 

I still find it interesting that a duo of Electric Affinity users would be a fiercely tough combination and give reason to using Amp Up on each other... ElecAff+Fire Blast+Dark, Perma Soul Drain, perma Amp Up, double assault and maneuvers and Empowering, Resistance cap to everything but Toxic, easily sustainable +200% damage... so close to perma Rain of Fire (x2) mobs won't know what to do with their lives...

Good. Glad to hear it that about the tier 9 actually. It does make the whole set feel more in line.

 

Still not sure about how it plays, long term, on a Defender but I'll find out... unless I make a...

 

Time to take my altitus pills.

[Hjarki]

10 hours ago, Sir Myshkin said:

Essentially its an ability that's really nice to toss on a Controller or Dominator, or has interesting interactions with Blaster's who often carry a lot of abnormal attributes in their survival tool kits that they're unlikely to slot for over damage (like -Recov, or -ToHit). It's also an effective way to spice up the Sentinel, or add punch to MM and Controller pets that possess solid control effects like the Demon Prince or Umbra Beast.

I'd tend to view it as an ability that's not completely useless to toss on a Controller/Dominator rather than 'really nice'. Most of the time players don't build characters with the notion that they need a pocket EA to make their control/debuff powers worth using.

 

From memory, someone tested Amp Up on pets and found it didn't work. I haven't confirmed (since I haven't played a build where I would have cared).

[Coyote]

1 hour ago, Hjarki said:

Most of the time players don't build characters with the notion that they need a pocket EA to make their control/debuff powers worth using.

 

Well, there are also slotting limitations. Like, after you put 4-6 Cloud Senses into Fearsome Stare, you're not going to bother to overslot it for -ToHit debuff. But if an EA teammate buffs you with Amp Up so that Fearsome Stare's debuff (and Fear duration, though that's less important) is stronger, that's definitely good. So you take powers that are good, worth slotting and using, and making them better.

 

Frankly, the real problem with it, is that it would be a great power EARLY when your teammates won't have the slots to have all of their buffs/debuffs slotted, and improving -Def is useful, etc. By the time you do get it if it's a secondary, well, a lot of the buffs and debuffs are already slotted to be strong enough. Boosting them isn't really useless, but it's not nearly as useful as it would be to boost them at level 22 or so. 😞

[Ankhammon]

Playing my EAffn/BR defender at level 23 and he's fun but a bit strange to play. The pet is not an alpha absorber at this level. He will take lots of damage if you put him in that position and you are stuck targeting through him. Can solo small groups of level 27's.

 

That said, my Jaunt/Faraday/Defib. opener is only somewhat effective. Only thing I'm experiencing trouble with is I want to heal/buff myself right after and Sparky Jr. is too far out for it to affect me. so I move to him to get the buffs and then the sleep is over. As silly as it sounds, I wish they would make his blasts shorter range to force him to follow me tighter.

It gives me a jittery feeling. very fast, then stop and jump back. Dunno if I'll be able to figure out how to make it all seamless.

Might have to adjust and leave out Jaunt entirely and make him stationary ranged again... too bad really.

Defib is a nice get outta my face power if you get too many on you.  Wonder how it will work slotted with the placate proc?

 

Just thought maybe experimental Injection on Sparky Jr. would shore him up as an alpha soaker. Will have to try that and see.

 

The buffs are very nice in a team environment. Acc, End, Resist bubble and Rech make for a very competent Defender. You do have to keep in mind the actual duration of Empower Circuit is a lot longer than it's recharge or you waste your end on spamming it.

 

And yeah, I can still blast but not as much in teams as with like a bubbler or ringer.

 

[Sir Myshkin]

6 hours ago, Ankhammon said:

Can solo...

I'll be fair with this statement that while yes, technically you could solo, Electric Affinity is most definitely not a solo (friendly) set so if you're really inclined to have that functionality I'd suggest rerolling your character now into either a MM or Controller to get you more bodies to work with.

 

Past that, if it makes you feel any better about the idea, Galvanic Sentinel can survive a 1 on 1 encounter with a Monster class enemy (Peregrine Island) through just resistances, absorbs, and the occasional heal to top it off at 50.

 

12 hours ago, Hjarki said:

From memory, someone tested Amp Up on pets and found it didn't work.

Actually, yes, I forgot about that issue. I don't remember seeing that get addressed/fixed/held-off at any point after release. Might still be an issue but I lack an Amp Up to double check.

[Saebeas]

On 6/25/2020 at 10:32 AM, Hjarki said:

Like most defensively-oriented sets, Electric Affinity tends to work better on Masterminds than other AT. The fundamental issue is that in most content, your teammates will not really need your defensive support to succeed and even if they do, it may not be the right kind of defense that they need. Electric Affinity is also a set that doesn't get much payoff from the Defender version. Many of the best effects are the same scale across all AT and many of the rest tend to fall into the 'too little to matter' or 'too big to matter' range. A Mastermind with EA is already healing superstar; ramping them up to Defender levels is just superfluous.

 

EA also pairs very poorly with Blast sets because it's such a 'busy' set. Not only are you constantly throwing a variety of effects from the set, but you need to do so to keep your stacks up. This effectively reduces your ability to deal damage. The bubble as a click rather than a toggle further limits what you can do - while other people are leaping straight into battle or dropping massive debuffs, you're just putting up a bubble that you're probably the only one who cares about.

This is BS.

[Marine X]

I have an Electrical Affinity / Electric Blast Defender I created for @Bionic_Flea's " SO Only " challenge. So far I have got pretty good performance out of that combo.

I can place Galvanic Sentinel in the center of the next group to debuff them while I finish up the previously debuffed group. It will suck their Endurance dry if I let it, which was really helpful with Outcasts, Trolls and CoT in the Hollows, which I just finished and just met Tarsis ( Cavern of Trascendence Contact ). Add a few more slots and enhancements here and there and this can be a very fun Solo Combo. Haven't teamed using it yet, so no opinion there, but it offers a lot more survival ability to a Defender than some of the other Primaries I have tried, basically if they have no Endurance, they go down quickly and quietly.

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Marine X