Most effective ways to manage Endurance in your widow?

[StarSeven]

What do you use to manage endurance on your Widow?  My Night widow is absolutely sucking wind after going hard for 30 seconds.  I don't have the build but trying to come up with one.  Does anyone have a good comprehensive plan for keeping that blue bar from getting to empty?  I'm trying to build a Melee focused, Mostly single target, Widow, and there are a lot of options to help with the blue bar just not sure which is the most efficient.  

[KaizenSoze]

@StarSeven I feel your pain. As an experiment, I leveled a Night Widow from scratch w/o support until higher levels. It was difficult.

 

The claw attacks are what are eating your endurance. It does get a lot better once your have all your sets, but leveling on IO and SO is painful.

 

Your best option is to slap two endurance reducers into each attack. Even at the expensive of damage. At least leveling. Your toggles are not the primary issue, but you might want run all of them only when required.

 

Here is my fully built out build. I call it the Mu Widow.

 

Spoiler

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.5.6
https://github.com/Reborn-Team/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Mu Widow: Level 50 Natural Arachnos Widow
Primary Power Set: Night Widow Training
Secondary Power Set: Widow Teamwork
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Mu Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Mental Blast -- SprSpdBit-Acc/Dmg(A), SprSpdBit-Dmg/Rchg(3), SprSpdBit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprSpdBit-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprSpdBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprSpdBit-Rchg/Global Toxic(7)
Level 1: Combat Training: Defensive -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(37)
Level 2: Strike -- SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(42), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(43), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(45)
Level 4: Tactical Training: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(13), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(13), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(37), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 6: Fly -- WntGif-ResSlow(A), WntGif-RunSpd/Jump/Fly/Rng/EndRdx(15)
Level 8: Follow Up -- Mk'Bit-Dam%(A), GssSynFr--Build%(15), GldStr-Dam/Rech(17), TchofDth-Dam%(17), Mk'Bit-Dmg/Rchg(19), GldStr-%Dam(19)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(A)
Level 12: Spin -- Arm-Dmg(A), Arm-Acc/Rchg(21), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), FuroftheG-ResDeb%(23), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(23), Arm-Dam%(25)
Level 14: Lunge -- SprDmnofA-Acc/Dmg(A), SprDmnofA-Dmg/Rchg(25), SprDmnofA-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), SprDmnofA-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(27), SprDmnofA-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(29), SprDmnofA-Rchg/DmgFear%(29)
Level 16: Hover -- Rct-ResDam%(A), Rct-Def(31)
Level 18: Slash -- Hct-Dam%(A), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(31), Hct-Dmg(31), Hct-Dmg/Rchg(33), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Hct-Acc/Rchg(33)
Level 20: Mask Presence -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 22: Foresight -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(34), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(34), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(34), LucoftheG-Def(39)
Level 24: Mind Link -- AdjTrg-Rchg(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(36), LucoftheG-Def(36), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(36), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(39), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 26: Mental Training -- Run-I(A)
Level 28: Tactical Training: Leadership -- HO:Cyto(A)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(39)
Level 32: Teleport Target -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 35: Electrifying Fences -- PrfShf-End%(A), Bmbdmt-Dam(40), TraoftheH-Dam%(40), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(40), PstBls-Dam%(42), JvlVll-Dam%(42)
Level 38: Combat Training: Offensive -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Ball Lightning -- PstBls-Dam%(A), JvlVll-Dam%(45), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(45), PrfShf-End%(46), Bmbdmt-Dam(46), PstBls-Acc/Dmg(46)
Level 44: Static Discharge -- PstBls-Dmg/Rng(A), PrfShf-End%(48), JvlVll-Dam%(48), PstBls-Dam%(48), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(50), Rgn-Dmg(50)
Level 47: Tactical Training: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Placate -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Conditioning | Hidden
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Clr-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Prv-Absorb%(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(7), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(9), Mrc-Rcvry+(9)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(11), EndMod-I(11)
Level 6: Afterburner
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 50: Barrier Core Epiphany
Level 50: Agility Core Paragon
Level 50: Assault Radial Embodiment
------------
------------

 

 

 

Here are my leveling experiences.

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by KaizenSoze

[Bopper]

I built my Widows to take Sorcery and use Rune of Protection instead of taking fighting pool where I would be running tough and weave which sucks plenty of endurance. On my Night Wido I didn't take Hasten since I didn't need it and it saves me from its crash. Throw in Performance Shift, Panacea, and the passive accolades, I have had no endurance issues

[Voltak]

12 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

@StarSeven I feel your pain. As an experiment, I leveled a Night Widow from scratch w/o support until higher levels. It was difficult.

 

The claw attacks are what are eating your endurance. It does get a lot better once your have all your sets, but leveling on IO and SO is painful.

 

Your best option is to slap two endurance reducers into each attack. Even at the expensive of damage. At least leveling. Your toggles are not the primary issue, but you might want run all of them only when required.

 

Here is my fully built out build. I call it the Mu Widow.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.5.6
https://github.com/Reborn-Team/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Mu Widow: Level 50 Natural Arachnos Widow
Primary Power Set: Night Widow Training
Secondary Power Set: Widow Teamwork
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Mu Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Mental Blast -- SprSpdBit-Acc/Dmg(A), SprSpdBit-Dmg/Rchg(3), SprSpdBit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprSpdBit-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprSpdBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprSpdBit-Rchg/Global Toxic(7)
Level 1: Combat Training: Defensive -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(37)
Level 2: Strike -- SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(42), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(43), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(45)
Level 4: Tactical Training: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(13), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(13), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(37), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 6: Fly -- WntGif-ResSlow(A), WntGif-RunSpd/Jump/Fly/Rng/EndRdx(15)
Level 8: Follow Up -- Mk'Bit-Dam%(A), GssSynFr--Build%(15), GldStr-Dam/Rech(17), TchofDth-Dam%(17), Mk'Bit-Dmg/Rchg(19), GldStr-%Dam(19)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(A)
Level 12: Spin -- Arm-Dmg(A), Arm-Acc/Rchg(21), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), FuroftheG-ResDeb%(23), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(23), Arm-Dam%(25)
Level 14: Lunge -- SprDmnofA-Acc/Dmg(A), SprDmnofA-Dmg/Rchg(25), SprDmnofA-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), SprDmnofA-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(27), SprDmnofA-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(29), SprDmnofA-Rchg/DmgFear%(29)
Level 16: Hover -- Rct-ResDam%(A), Rct-Def(31)
Level 18: Slash -- Hct-Dam%(A), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(31), Hct-Dmg(31), Hct-Dmg/Rchg(33), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Hct-Acc/Rchg(33)
Level 20: Mask Presence -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 22: Foresight -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(34), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(34), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(34), LucoftheG-Def(39)
Level 24: Mind Link -- AdjTrg-Rchg(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(36), LucoftheG-Def(36), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(36), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(39), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 26: Mental Training -- Run-I(A)
Level 28: Tactical Training: Leadership -- HO:Cyto(A)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(39)
Level 32: Teleport Target -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 35: Electrifying Fences -- PrfShf-End%(A), Bmbdmt-Dam(40), TraoftheH-Dam%(40), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(40), PstBls-Dam%(42), JvlVll-Dam%(42)
Level 38: Combat Training: Offensive -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Ball Lightning -- PstBls-Dam%(A), JvlVll-Dam%(45), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(45), PrfShf-End%(46), Bmbdmt-Dam(46), PstBls-Acc/Dmg(46)
Level 44: Static Discharge -- PstBls-Dmg/Rng(A), PrfShf-End%(48), JvlVll-Dam%(48), PstBls-Dam%(48), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(50), Rgn-Dmg(50)
Level 47: Tactical Training: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Placate -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Conditioning | Hidden
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Clr-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Prv-Absorb%(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(7), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(9), Mrc-Rcvry+(9)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(11), EndMod-I(11)
Level 6: Afterburner
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 50: Barrier Core Epiphany
Level 50: Agility Core Paragon
Level 50: Assault Radial Embodiment
------------
------------

 

 

 

Here are my leveling experiences.

 

I want to second that Night Widows... or, to be more precise, widow's melee attacks, are too expensive.  I have pleaded for Devs to reduce this in the past.  

I am giving up on them.  

But that's not the only problem.  Outside of Ageless, Fortunatas
( I call them machine guns since their rate of fire is high )
they suffer too especially when all toggles are up and running, but not nearly as much as a night widow build.  She also runs Cardiac for the incarnate alpha.  
That solves my endurance issues.  

If you see the video I posted of my Fortunata ( who solo'd the ITF no insps) she runs Victory Rush, and that always helps. 

 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Voltak

[Six-Six]

I have 3 widows, one pure Night, one Hybrid and one pure Fort. None of them have end issues. The attack powers themselves don't really add up to much; It's your def/res and even travel power toggles that will drain you if you leave them unchecked. The spider inherent Conditioning does a good job (for my non-IO'd toon). The moment you take double Leadership on top of Tough and Weave, plus indomitable will and other toggles, you're setting yourself up for a wheezer. When possible, I stick in a pure end redux crafted IO... sometimes boosted to 50+5 on the tertiary pool toggles as the spider's secondary version chugs less end. Also try to squeeze in some set bonuses for end, like eradication 2-pc, Annihilation 2-pc, etc.

[KaizenSoze]

3 hours ago, Six-Six said:

I have 3 widows, one pure Night, one Hybrid and one pure Fort. None of them have end issues. The attack powers themselves don't really add up to much; It's your def/res and even travel power toggles that will drain you if you leave them unchecked. The spider inherent Conditioning does a good job (for my non-IO'd toon). The moment you take double Leadership on top of Tough and Weave, plus indomitable will and other toggles, you're setting yourself up for a wheezer. When possible, I stick in a pure end redux crafted IO... sometimes boosted to 50+5 on the tertiary pool toggles as the spider's secondary version chugs less end. Also try to squeeze in some set bonuses for end, like eradication 2-pc, Annihilation 2-pc, etc.

I would really like to see your Night Widow build. I have endurance issues and I don't take tough, weave, or maneuvers. 

 

The inherit does practically nothing. It's a token to appease the live player base that demanded that all VEATs have an inherit.

 

See the thread I linked above for the history. Also, VEAT toggles are cheap compared to other ATs, very cheap compared to Leadership toggles.

 

If you look at the claw attacks endurance usage, just the ones that are not higher damage. Swipe, Follow up, Spin, and Eviscerate. They all use significantly more end that other ATs versions.

 

The other attacks, Strike, Lunge, and Slash do more damage or don't exist in other ATs, so it's harder to compare apples to apples.

 

Side note, Fortunatas tend to have less endurance issues, because their ranged attacks have a good damage/end ratio.  My Fort uses two claw attack Follow Up and Lunge, two ranged proc'ed out Dominate and Gloom. She has a lot less end issues with about the same toggles.

[kelika2]

end reduction in attacks is big, even a common io set will be noticeable

pool power leadership is not recommended on top of your veat leadership powers.  its neat to stack but end to result its just not viable

adding an extra slot to Health so you can slot numina proc and miracle proc.  also an extra slot (or two) to stamina.  one perf shifter proc and maybe a regular endmod io

the widow hide is up to you, but you only get the partial-crit from the initial attack and the +def suppresses afterwards

[Six-Six]

@KaizenSoze. Sure. I don't have MIDs, though, so lemme get in the mood for typing it all out. I'll get back to you on that.

Incidentally, IIRC, you're part of Black Fang on Reunion, aren't you? 
 

[KaizenSoze]

12 minutes ago, Six-Six said:

@KaizenSoze. Sure. I don't have MIDs, though, so lemme get in the mood for typing it all out. I'll get back to you on that.

Incidentally, IIRC, you're part of Black Fang on Reunion, aren't you? 
 

No sorry. No idea who that is. 🙂

 

Look forward to learning something about Widow slotting.

[tidge]

@Bopper covered a lot of what I would write, especially about not needing/using Hasten.

 

There are several sets on my (favorite) Fortunata that provide Endurance discounts: Annihilation, Preventive Medicine, Reactive Defenses.

ATO Spider's Bite provides a bump to MaxEnd.

 

Along with accolades, and a SG bump to recovery, I don't even have pieces from Miracle or Numina slotted.

Edited October 22, 2021 by tidge