Fun History Lesson - Requiem

[Andreah]

3 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

That reminds me of a related tangent about fictional super powered characters whose creators sprinkle in their backstory things like: "he won two Medals of Honor" or "he or she got PTSD from the war."

 

It's just lazy writing! Sure it gives the audience the impression that the character is awesome or tragic quickly, but it's a cheap cop-out that I think lessens the meaning of such acts of heroism and achievement that military service awards mean to promote.

I agree, and despite all that, if the player writes some decent background fiction explaining this, I could be okay with it.

[Glacier Peak]

Just now, Andreah said:

I agree, and despite all that, if the player writes some decent background fiction explaining this, I could be okay with it.

Yeah that's totally fair and it's something writers may normally be able to do in other mediums like literature and perhaps graphic novels and comics. Maybe even in the short description field players are given in game. But in film and television, time is much more of a scarce commodity. The time to tell the audience a story is weighed against the larger narrative, so these types of shortcuts are much more common.

 

That's basically what I'm seeing. A shortcut to save time probably by an overworked and underpaid graphic artist who found the closest thing they could and pushed out a 'close-enough-that-most-players-wont-notice-or-care' product.

[Glacier Peak]

1 hour ago, Redletter said:

While I totally appreciate the sentiment, I think there's the implementation of rewards of honor, and war trauma can be very potent if done well. I'd cite Disco Elisium and Spec Ops: The Line as games that explore recognition of service and the mental toll of armed conflict respecitvely. Without spoiling either game, I think the crux of quality lies in HOW we find out about these things. For instance, if youre TOLD by a character or the narrator or something, to the tune of "Oh man, that's John Warhero! He got 11 purple hearts, and 6 medals of honor as well as the two galatic stars of infinite celestial valor! He's probably, if not definitely, the most honorable and well decorated and successful and humble soldier OF. ALL. TIIIIIME! He saved the President! And the UN! And his platoon! and an orphanage! ALL. AT. ONCE." then it's a blatantly transparent attempt at building up a character as a hero without any effort, which defeats the point OF these recognitions of service.

 

Likewise, if you have a character or the narrator go "That's John PTSD, he was the battalion commander of the Doomed Souls brigade and he and his team got stuck in the Death Woods for 666 years and he watched all his friends get eaten, melted, skewered, and worse! All while he had to shoot puppies and children with chemical weapons against his moral conscience but man, war sure is hell, so he did it and now he's a loner who doesnt talk about annnnny of this. He also has a token drinking problem, probably because of the total horror of all this traumatizing backstory that's just been exposited" you also due a massive disservice to those who pay for their survival with their sanity, It's not fair at BEST, and at worse it flanderizes mental trauma.

 

Mass Effect is a good example of doing it wrong, AND right at the same time. The begining of the game (with the right background) has a group of characters sitting around talking about Commander Shepard's traumatic service history. It's incredibly disengenious. But, later in that same game, you encounter quite a few OTHER survivors of traumatic events - who were under the command of Shepard in both cases (again, depending on shepard's service history) and those situations are handled fairly well in my opinion, and the "Paragon" responses for Shepard in those situations are appropriately respectable.

I've seen both sides of this play out in many art and entertainment mediums. You're absolutely right about the way these narrative anecdotes are introduced to the audience being the key to their impact. I remember playing Master Chief in the Halo CE video game years ago and just thinking he was a badass who kicked alien butt. Then a novel came out about him and I read that. Totally opened up a new side of the character that I now keep in my head when I'm playing the most recent Halo game. 

 

My point is, when it's spewed from the mouth of a nameless background character in less than a sentence during a quick plot filler scene it sullies the value of both the achievement or sacrifice that those awards are meant to represent in real life. When the story weaves in the trauma, hard work, etc in to the character using more than just a quick puff of imagination, I think it's impact is felt much more by the audience - especially those who aren't familiar with the meaning of those military ribbons or medals. 

[Redletter]

3 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

I'm almost certain Requiem came first, then the chest decal was added a few issues later. 

Of course Requiem came first, he was born in what? 1920? 

[Glacier Peak]

Just now, Redletter said:

Of course Requiem came first, he was born in what? 1920? 

He may have actually been one of the first AVs added to this game. Any old beta players remember this or know if it's true? Who was the first AV???

[Redletter]

4 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

He may have actually been one of the first AVs added to this game. Any old beta players remember this or know if it's true? Who was the first AV???

The Nazi commander powered by an evil energy alien was one of the first big baddies? Im stunned, befuddled, shocked, astonished and quite frankly bamboozled! Truly, this game was ahead of its time...

 

Jokes aside, it's weird how these rabbit holes work. I'd have thought the first guy woulda been the Clockwork King given his general "hokey comic book super villain" energy, and how oddly pervasive he is (almost like a mascot, in a way). We should do more of these history lessons, because like, Ive helped kill Hamidon at least 10 times and I mostly still dont know why he's a big deal. Like, I heard he's a scientist turned giant unkillable amoeba that turns people into giant nature monsters and that's the total sum of my knowledge.

[Major_Decoy]

3 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

He may have actually been one of the first AVs added to this game. Any old beta players remember this or know if it's true? Who was the first AV???

He doesn't show up in anything until after level 40. He wouldn't have been in the game at launch as such.

[Take One]

1 hour ago, Redletter said:

Like, I heard he's a scientist turned giant unkillable amoeba that turns people into giant nature monsters and that's the total sum of my knowledge.

 

That's pretty much it.

[Luminara]

16 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

Some folks unfamiliar with military service might not be aware of it though.

 

Does Skippy's List constitute familiarity?

 

Setting aside jocularity for a moment, I have read quite a bit about WWI and WWII, but my focus wasn't on combat or distinguished service, rather, I prefer to know the underlying reasons for why things happened.  The cultural, social, financial and material conditions which preceded the events and shaped the politics of the time.  The context of what happened, rather than the content.

 

So I'm not well-versed in things like ranks, awards, national heroes, et cetera.

[Glacier Peak]

3 hours ago, Luminara said:

 

Does Skippy's List constitute familiarity?

 

Setting aside jocularity for a moment, I have read quite a bit about WWI and WWII, but my focus wasn't on combat or distinguished service, rather, I prefer to know the underlying reasons for why things happened.  The cultural, social, financial and material conditions which preceded the events and shaped the politics of the time.  The context of what happened, rather than the content.

 

So I'm not well-versed in things like ranks, awards, national heroes, et cetera.

Yeah macro stuff. That's all good! When you're a grunt, the little things are interesting as well. Like why did that guy run out in the open while getting shot at a bunch? Oh to get a machine gun up to provide cover fire while his or her unit hastily evacs casualties. History is riddled with heroism, but it isn't usually noted unless by the victors or those who live to tell the tale. 

[srmalloy]

15 hours ago, Major_Decoy said:

The 5th Column should totally have people on the corner ringing bells by cauldrons during the winter event

They tried, but the Council kept showing up, beating the bellringers unconscious, and taking all the donations.

[Sakura Tenshi]

This is a great thread, as a aficionado of history, this is a great spotting of detail and where the Developers (or at least graphic artists) might have made a few oopsies for the sake of saving time. Though, given how many Camp Prefects and Centurions are in Romulus' army, it'd be no surprise Requiem can't keep track of his own awards either. Romulus either started handing out promotions of centurion randomly to entice people to serve him (though looking at the Imperious loyalists, maybe not) or he nor Imperious are actually capable of counting.

 

 

For reference. (Also funny how FFXIV, a Japanese game is more accurate with their rankings of the Garlean army when Garlemald is an entirely fantasy nation)

[Glacier Peak]

55 minutes ago, Sakura Tenshi said:

This is a great thread, as a aficionado of history, this is a great spotting of detail and where the Developers (or at least graphic artists) might have made a few oopsies for the sake of saving time. Though, given how many Camp Prefects and Centurions are in Romulus' army, it'd be no surprise Requiem can't keep track of his own awards either. Romulus either started handing out promotions of centurion randomly to entice people to serve him (though looking at the Imperious loyalists, maybe not) or he nor Imperious are actually capable of counting.

 

 

For reference. (Also funny how FFXIV, a Japanese game is more accurate with their rankings of the Garlean army when Garlemald is an entirely fantasy nation)

Final Fantasy does it's pantheon/mythology very well! Cool video! I remember looking up a similar video when I wanted to make an accurate legionary character in game.

[Marshal_General]

20 hours ago, Sakura Tenshi said:

This is a great thread, as a aficionado of history, this is a great spotting of detail and where the Developers (or at least graphic artists) might have made a few oopsies for the sake of saving time. Though, given how many Camp Prefects and Centurions are in Romulus' army, it'd be no surprise Requiem can't keep track of his own awards either. Romulus either started handing out promotions of centurion randomly to entice people to serve him (though looking at the Imperious loyalists, maybe not) or he nor Imperious are actually capable of counting.

 

 

For reference. (Also funny how FFXIV, a Japanese game is more accurate with their rankings of the Garlean army when Garlemald is an entirely fantasy nation)

Maybe he got most of the rank and file soldiers killed and most of what he has left is officers, which would explain the mess he is it and why he can't move forward since no one is there to do the actual work.