Focused Feedback: Powerset - Plant Control

[Championess]

I'm glad Plant is finally getting tuned.  It was getting tired having controls set to a standard of two broken-ass powers.  They'll just have to adapt and use more of their kit, like other control sets had to long ago. 

 

Seeds was warranted and seems to be where it should.  I do hope in the future for control if any more aoe confuses get conjured up there is strong consideration for how powerful they could end up being.  Honestly aoe confuses should be kept to a low number, they do feel unique.

 

Creepers I didn't see coming too, hopefully the whole set was vetted now with these changes.

Edited Tuesday at 05:59 PM by Championess

[Ratch_]

22 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

so none of these descriptions mention that there are less creeper vines.

 

So is this just something extra where they spawn less vines. Cause if so then HELL NO. all that creeper chaos is the best part and will just murder all the fun of it. Please tell me they don't spawn less vines cause that would be total BS and needs undone ASAP.

Yeah, the creeper vines spawn rate is sadness to my brain. Having a bunch of entities on field is the best part about plant control

Edited Tuesday at 06:00 PM by Ratch_

[WindDemon21]

1 minute ago, Ratch_ said:

Yeah, the vines spawn rate is sadness to my brain. Having a bunch of entities on field is the best part about plant control

Exactly. They are already getting proc nerfed, they NEED to have the max vines out on the field. That's the main fun of plant control and is just going to ruin it terribly, and needs reverted so at least that stays the same ASAP. The set is already getting hit really hard as is, this is the one place that really needs to not be nerfed.

[Nayeh]

On 5/26/2025 at 7:07 AM, The Curator said:

 Carrion Creepers

• VFX now moves along with the pet patch.
• Carrion Creepers can now proc Domination, Containment and Overpower.
• This power should no longer execute an excessive proc cascade.

 

What exactly was wrong with Plant having a niche identity of having more damage potential compared to other Control sets? They still do not out-perform other Archetypes such as say a Blaster that can annihilate huge swathes of enemies quickly. Remember: defeat is the best form of CC. Enemies could already cut the number of Creepers before, but now with less Creeper targets they can quickly focus the few that stand combined with less confusion application.

 

How will this effect buff powers that are short in duration like Envenomed Blades and Embrace of Fire if Carrion Creepers now spawned in a delayed/reduced rate?

 

This Power Set has been over nerfed! Nobody hops on a Controller or Dominator and says, "Gee, I wish I could do more Control and less Damage."

 

The crop yield is going to be pitiful if these change hit live.

 

 

 

Edited Tuesday at 06:06 PM by Nayeh

[ScarySai]

They nerfed contagious confusion, FYI. It now respects enemy level.

 

You can argue that's just fixing a bug and is 'correct', but it's another unnecessary hit to confusion stacking.

 

Also, I am noticing a significant drop in creeper spawns. This nerf went way too far, sorry. I don't care how you justify it by buffing the other powers, the carnage was the appeal of plant, and nobody is going to play this over mind control now.

[Auroxis]

It feels like whatever damage Vines is supposed to do to counteract the creeper nerf just isn't it. If you compare new Vines to new Tesla Coil (renamed from Paralyzing Blast), both location AoE holds with very long recharge and damage conditional on hold, the difference is quite dramatic:

 

 

[Riverdusk]

Some good overall changes, but Seeds of Confusion target cap nerf seems like a bad idea.  Recharge nerf is understandable, duration nerf is understandable.  Not sure why you'd also nerf the target cap.   3 big nerfs on a power all at once seems a bit much.   Basically, I compare seeds to things like flashfire or stalagmites.  It now underperforms those.    

 

 

[Hedgefund2]

I took my latest Planter - a Plant/Marine controller out for a spin.

 

As is, with no respec, I earned a new debt badge rather quickly.  A current "standard" plant build is no bueno.  Standard meaning no Spirit Tree nor Spore Burst.

 

I did a non-holistic respec to include those powers and omitted 2 "lesser" powers I had included, just so I keep slotting the same for what was in the old and new builds.

 

Including Spore Burst and Spirit Tree did wonders for survivability.  I can't say that Spirit Tree was all that impactful, it did draw some stray aggro on occasion but that's not what kept me alive.  Spamming Spore Burst was impactful though.

 

This isn't me giving "thumbs up" however.  Seeds is still the "bread and butter" and no other control set has their bread and butter opener capped at 10 targets.  Changing recharge and duration, fine, I suppose, but the target cap goes too far.

 

Short editorial - Plant is strong, yes but we far from live in the game "city of Plant Control".  I've got plenty of other characters that I would use in its place if I were looking for either mass slaughter or control.  This happened to be a fun combination of both.  It seems odd to me to choose this set for aggressively hitting with the nerf hammer after 20 years, being largely unchanged over that time.

[Blackfeather]

Potential idea for changing Seeds of Confusion that doesn't involve reducing the target cap:

 

 Seeds of Confusion -> Seeds of Chaos

• Recharge increased to 90s.
• Scale reduced from scale 20 to scale 12.
• Foe Confuse -> Foe Confuse, Disorient, Sleep, Hold, Fear

I quite like Psionic Armor's Aura of Insanity applying random mez effects. Porting it over to Seeds would have the intended effect of confusing less enemies while still affecting the same amount of targets.

[agentx5]

Wait a minute... I thought we were picking just one of those nerfs, not all them together.  WTF?  😕

[ApolloInferno]

Carrion Creepers got a flat, heavy handed, nerf. If you havn't done the math the damage numbers are easily 75% less then they were before with the changes. But the difference is so stark that you can tell that immediatly if you have played Plant Control ever.

I honestly like all the other changes to Plant Control. And if the Procs needed to be fixed then please increase the base damage of Creepers so they can do something again. 

Right now the dominator and Controller can't kill white or yellow mobs with Creepers so in their current form they are just too weak.

Put it all together and the changes to Plant are Mostly Minus. With most points lost with CC changes and some more lost to Seeds changes.

 

Edited Tuesday at 09:20 PM by ApolloInferno

[Nathic69]

I feel the Seeds nerf and Carrion Creeper is too much... seeds is the core control of plant and to basically gut the whole power its very upsetting, leave it as it was, it doesn't need a target cap change or CD increase

 

It feels unfair when Pyro has a deep sleep and confuse cone that's 16 target and 45 second CD

 

Keep seeds as it was it does not need nerfing to the ground

 

I understand creepers but heres a simple fix just don't allow slow or KB into the power that would reduce the proc by half and would bring its damage down without gutting the power, please devs these changes with those 2 powers are not good but everything else you have done hats off to you all amazing changes otherwise but please don't force me to never enjoy and play plant again

Edited Tuesday at 10:14 PM by Nathic69

[StarkWhite]

5 minutes ago, Nathic69 said:

 

 

It feels unfair when Pyro has a deep sleep and confuse cone that's 16 target and 45 second CD

 

Keep in mind Hypnotizing Lights can at best confuse 6 targets.

[ScarySai]

2 hours ago, Blackfeather said:

Foe Confuse -> Foe Confuse, Disorient, Sleep, Hold, Fear

Hell no. Every 'randomized mez' power is garbage.

Edited Tuesday at 10:38 PM by ScarySai

[SakuraFrost]

Very disappointed at the heavy handed “adjustment” done to seeds and creepers. To be in the game for so long and then be stomped on feels quite cruel. 🫤

[Blackfeather]

36 minutes ago, ScarySai said:

Hell no. Every 'randomized mez' power is garbage.

 

I think between having a reduced target cap of 10 and all confused vs. 16 and either confuse/disorient/hold/sleep/fear, I'd personally prefer the latter due to it affecting more targets. Does the former appeal more to you, out of curiosity?

[noogens2]

The target limit definitlely hurts seeds but I'm not sure it will make a drastic difference with the ways mobs are less bunched-up and more spread apart nowadays.  A few updates ago, I respecced to get spore burst.   My new tactics were to throw out spore burst get most of the mob and then do seeds which was bound to miss the mobs outside the cone.  I think with the way that Homecoming is evolving, you need to layer multiple crowd control powers to be effective. 

 

With all that said, the changes so far make Plant feel more mediocre but I'll hold my judgment until after more extensive testing.   

[ExeErdna]

As somebody that mains Plant/Nature this isn't good at all. It's solid Vines gets a buff and Spirit Tree does a bit more. Carrion Creepers is the ONLY big damage we can do. Since the pet is way too weak at least to me so I skipped it to grab the Tree which is solid when it comes to Trial content yet since it "taunts" it may not be as good due to it might pull off from tankers. The only thing strong was seeds and creepers that WAS the whole set. It opens up mid and late game. Looking at how Pyrotech is working nerfing Plant isn't needed since Pyro is better. Honestly Buff Vines yet leave everything else alone since with this current wave Elec is even better than Plant. Plant is only "silly" because I'm playing like I'm a tank which only works at 44+ since I don't have Burnout or Melee Core yet 

[ApolloInferno]

1 hour ago, ScarySai said:

 

Castle said many things were intended that HC hit anyway. Like soulbound in tornado.

 

It's irrelevant though, because it's still a dumb idea to be slapping around a control set in the current meta. People like this set, leave it alone.

Actually yeah this is very true. Where are all the " I hate the meta" people in all of this? Even with all the buffs and no change to seeds or Creepers this will not be meta. So What is the point of this? You are going to push people to play their Fire / Fire Blaster not a Controller or Dom. GREAT way to make people go meta since there is now another controller that doesn't do any damage.

Edited Wednesday at 02:31 AM by ApolloInferno

[macskull]

I do wish they'd address control being less-than-useful in a lot of scenarios before they nerf one of the best control sets, but here we are. Deep sleep and the AoE mez changes are a decent start but until other changes happen in who knows how many years we're going to be stuck in the current state. Oh well.

[Heatstroke]

Ive never been one to " proc bomb " Carrion Creepers.. I dont know what was done to that power.. but it does WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY less damage now.. I have it slotted with a set of Ragnarok and its not nearly as effective.. You hit this with the hammer a little to hard IMO. 

[TygerDarkstorm]

I'm not sure if everyone dooming and glooming these changes have actually tested them on beta yet or not. I didn't think all the changes felt horrible as of level 20 (I will try to do more testing at higher levels later).

 

However, there are noticeable differences and I am unsure if they're all good. We all knew Seeds was going to take a hit at some point as it was wildly overtuned for where it's at in the tiers, but I do agree that it got over-nerfed. Duration and target caps reduced feels terrible in leveling play as an average (e.g., not twinked, not exemping, just basics skills player). While you can layer this with Spore Burst for layered mez/control, that technique doesn't feel so great either as Spore Burst is also left feeling like a shortish duration.

 

I like the idea behind the changes to Spirit Tree, however, it's taunting power sucks. Doing a Council mish at +0/x2 and while the regen did noticeably help keep me alive, the tree taunted maybe 1 of the 12 or so opponents I tested it on. This made me have to rely far more on Vines to keep me safe.

 

The Vines changes are fantastic, however. This power was reliably holding groups and dealing damage and even reholding enemies who broke free of the hold.

 

I did feel like it took a long time to kill the mobs though, which felt weird when plant is usually known for damage--taking almost as long as my arsenal controller to arrest mobs doesn't feel good, especially when my plant controller can't control the groups as effectively as my arsenal controller can.

 

I do hope the devs rethink the scale to which they've nerfed plant control--I accept that Seeds needed a change, but something is feeling a little overdone. I will probably still play plant, but I do plan to do more testing as some of these changes are not feeling as good.

[Saarei]

Why does this set need to change? I didn't pick it for my main because it was the top of the meta, I chose it because it was fun. Between seeds of confusion and flooding the field with carrion crawlers, it was a great set to play. These changes just turn the set into something unrecognizable.

[Mezmera]

1 hour ago, ApolloInferno said:

Actually yeah this is very true. Where are all the " I hate the meta" people in all of this? Even with all the buffs and no change to seeds or Creepers this will not be meta. So What is the point of this? You are going to push people to play their Fire / Fire Blaster not a Controller or Dom. GREAT way to make people go meta since there is now another controller that doesn't do any damage.

 

They did nerf confuses to the floor on 4stars based solely on watching how good of a confuse Seeds of Confusion allowed Plant doms to behave in those.  That in turn had a large affect on all the other control sets that didn't have such an abusive confuse power.  Maybe fixing Seeds of Confusion earlier wouldn't have led to a nerf to other control sets in 4stars to where they are less than ideal.  

 

How OP Seeds of Confusion is was a crutch to control players creating bad habits and setting terrible precedents.  Sure there also being such a nerf to Creepers as well comes off a little heavy handed maybe but ohly well learn to leverage the other powers in the set that just got better.  Having a 1-2 buzzsaw seems a little cheap as it was.  

 

As far as 'meta' goes it could flip like a switch.  If the devs had the control balancing to their liking all they'd have to do is introduce content where enemies take paltry damage unless they are mezzed thus making having some control characters in the team 'meta'.

[tjknight]

It seems like the set overall is stronger. Seeds got nerfed. But Spirit Tree is buffed into a useful pseudo tank and Spores now provides meaningful control. Plant still looks like an extremely versatile set.