Fire/Kin Guide - Turning you and your friends into a giant flaming wrecking ball

Caldazar4 · July 10, 2019

Why are there so many goddamn firekins?

In general, you take the most offensive primary and the most offensive secondary in the control sets and create a character which is capable of both incredible control and aoe DPS.

Fire/ (like all things fire) has a secondary effect of doing a little bit of damage. Granted, it is dogshit damage, but when you are doing dogshit damage from 4 different aoe dot skills at a time, and all of those are buffed to 400% damage, and hitting twice because of containment...it really starts to pile up. Plus you have imps slapping people with handfuls of damaged capped flaming dogshit.

/Kin is the most offensive secondary set. Most everything in the set is either a power that debuffs a targetted enemy, then buffs/heals people around the caster/target. Everyone loves to have a /kin on their team particularly because of Speed Boost, an amazing recharge, recovery and speed buff that is reasonably easy to keep permanent on your entire team, and Fulcrum shift which can provide up to 240% damage for 45 seconds on a base 60 second cool down.

Solo Vs Team

I've heard a lot of people talk about how a firekin is a great solo character. I can easily solo +4/x8 on my level 50, hundreds of millions of inf worth of enhancements fire/kin. You might even start to become a solo monster once you're level 38, but getting to that point solo is...not really an efficient use of time. The main issue I've found while trying to level is that your best damage skill (Hot feet) until level 32 requires you to stand right next to your enemies. Then they either run away, or smash you in your paper thin face. It also takes a ton of endurance. Your imps have good damage but are also fairly fragile and tend to run off by themselves, making it harder to keep them healed. Once you have fulcrum shift, at level 38, you'll probably start getting enough damage to kill enemies before your (relatively) weaker control options wear off and start to understand the solo potential. However, you'll also be able to buff your melee damage friends on your team up to an absurd amount so I didn't really want to stop. (Note: I've heard great things about using Arcane Bolt in the sorcery pool as a damage option while levelling. Maybe someone who's done that chime in on whether it makes solo levelling...not bad)

So I suggest teaming as much as possible. Kinetics really is a much more useful set in a team than solo. Hell, you even have two skills which you can't even cast on yourself. I could be wrong, and if you've had a great time soloing up to 50 on your firekin please chime in. Tips for teaming:

1. Make sure you're keeping speed boost up on your friends (some helpful binds in the power specific section)

2. Early on you can position yourself a little further back, but once you're sturdier you'll want to maximize the impact of Fulcrum Shift and Hot Feet by staying in melee range.

3. Try to keep siphon speed up and stacked as much as possible. That way you can keep up your (perma speed boosted) friends, and then you have the recharge to heal/buff/control as needed.

A Quick Note on "Containment"

"Containment" is mentioned a few times throughout this guide, so just in case you're not familiar: The controller's inherent power is called containment. Basically, if a target is Slept, Held, Immobilized, or Disoriented, every tick of damage you do hits twice. This means that your damage is doubled after all buffs/debuffs. Arcane Bolt (from the sorcery pool, more on this later) is a good (maybe only?) damage option early and containment makes it doublegood. Eventually you'll get damage capped 400% (100+300%) up to 800% effective damage

Powers and Slotting While Leveling

(See builds for slotting 50+).

Fire

Ring of Fire, ST Immobilize: This is generally considered to be the most skippable skill in the fire primary. I've not seen a single level 50 build that include it, but having it to trigger containment while levelling might be nice (especially if you're using Arcane Bolt for damage). If it comes down to Ring of Fire Vs Char I would go with Char. Holds are better than immobilizes because the bad guy cant shoot you with his gun.

Char, ST Hold: A nice single target hold. Not too much to say about this. Triggers containment and damage.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge, and End Redux (Maybe damage)

Fire Cages, AOE Immobilitize. This is a pretty good skill that makes it into the rotation at 50+. While leveling it is a lot of endurance and well, it immobilizes your enemies. This could be great if they are where you want them to be. However, if your tanker/brute/particularly brave scrapper is trying to herd people around it could be counterproductive.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge, and End Redux (Maybe damage if you're soloing)

Smoke, AOE To-hit debuff: This one I think is fairly skippable as well. It's nice that it doesn't draw aggro, so you can go ahead and cast it ahead of time on the next pack to make sure they are hitting you/your friends less. If you're soloing I would think you'd want to use this and make sure to keep it up on enemies, because it's the closest thing you get to defense before pool powers or sets. However, by the time you are 50 the idea is that you can kill/control everything or have actual defense so this isn't quite necessary.

Hot Feet, PBAOE Damage/Slow/Fea: This is where a lot of your DPS will come from at high levels, but at low levels you are probably too fragile and it takes an insane amount of endurance . Note that it only works if you're not flying. Because of this skill (and fulcrum shift) you will want to stay in melee range once you're sturdy enough.

While leveling, slot for: Damage, End Redux, Accuracy

Flashfire. AOE Disorient: Your first AOE hard control, I'm so happy for you. Depending on how strong you are relative to your enemies, and whether you are soloing, you'll either open up on a pack with this skill as the tank charges in, or keep it in your back pocket to help out if there is some sort of aggro problem (two packs, enthusiatic blaster, etc) . I usually tend to be pretty free with it, as if you wait until you are sure you need to use it, it is probably too late.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge, and End Redux

Cinders, PBAOE hold: Even though it is PBAOE instead of targeted AOE, I find myself approaching how to use this skill similarly to flashfire. It has a much longer cooldown though.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge.

Bonfire: Ground target AOE: This skill is pretty bad, until...you get the knockback to knockdown IO*. Then this might be the best control skill in the fire control set. Seriously, it is broken how good it is with the IO. I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw it myself.

The 2 sets with a knockback to knockdown IO are Sudden Acceleration and Overwhemling Presence. The first is available for relatively cheap on the AH and I would really strongly recommend you get this as soon as possible. The second you can get something in the set from summer blockbuster and use converters. Seriously this should be the first major thing you spend money on.

Then, make a macro or bind such as

/bind b powexec_location target Bonfire

Or

/macro bon powexec_location target Bonfire

That way you don't have to pick the the location. Just hit the bind or macro and cast it on your target.

Fire Imps: You summon 3 imps that run around slapping people in the face. Fairly self explanatory, slot for damage, maybe accuracy while levelling. Maybe recharge if they are dying a lot. Once you have fulcrum shift they'll start really slapping.

Kinetics

Transfusion: This is your heal and you'll be using it fairly often for...well ever. Learn to love it. You cast it on an enemy and it heals everything in an area around the enemy. . Even though you can't heal characters directly, a nice trick if you want to heal a melee ally in the middle of some chaos you can click target them from the team window and use the power. By default it will try to use it on their target which is likely going to be someone close to them. (This little trick is useful for basically everything in the kinetics set).

While leveling, Accuracy is the most imporant to slot this with, then recharge and heal/end redux to suit your fancy.

Siphon Power: A solid buff/debuff. Will debuff your target's damage by 20% and buff you and your team in an aoe around you's damage by 20%. It and transfusion have the same radius, so if you're close enough to get healed by transfusion on a target, you'll probably buff the person punching him in the face. While levelling, try to see if you can stand in the middle and buff both your blaster friends and your scrapper friends.

Slot for accuracy, recharge, and end reduction. Once you get fulcrum shift this power becomes much less appealing but it is still nice to have. This isn't in my 50+ build, but you could make an argument that it should be in there for AVs and such.

Repel:

Very skippable. Definitely the second most "situational' power in the kinetics set.

Pros: People don't run up and hit you

Cons:

Knockback

Annoying Sound

Endurance

Can it take a knockback to knockdown IO? Yes. I tried it. It was moderately effective, but didn't seem consistent. The sound was so horribly annoying, especially because as a firekin you want to be in the middle of the pile.

Siphon Speed: Debuff your target's speed and buff your movement speeds and recharge by 20%. I put this in the overall tips section but try to keep siphon speed up and stacked as much as possible. That way you can keep up your (perma speed boosted) friends, and then you have the recharge to heal/buff/control. Some people say you don't need this if you have hasten, but por que no los dos?.

While leveling, slot for accuracy, recharge

Increase Density:

Buffs smashing and energy resistence, and various mez protection to your target for 1 minute on a 2 second cooldown. Also provides the resistance in an AOE to nearby allies. It's a nice aoe buff and you should try to use it to save your friends from mezzes if possible. 1 slot wonder this for resist or maybe end redux.

It will also remove any active immobilization, disorient, or hold effects so if you want to be an all star do that. I'm not good at this because I never really know whether other people are mezzed though...except it is very obvious when they use an awaken. If someone does that you can hit them with an increase density to remove that annoying disorient. Might as well speed boost them after too :).

Speed Boost:

A 2 minute recharge, end recovery, and movement speed targeted AOE buff on a 2 second cool for everyone! Everyone but you that is. Your goal is 100% uptime on your entire team. I find that the easiest way to do this is with the binds below. From testing you can't do both the select and use the power in one cast, but the binds below will make it so a double tap on numpad# will first tap target the # teammate and then second tap will cast speed boost on them. Numpad9 will just find the closest friend you can target, and minus will cast speed boost. (Divide will cast increase Density if you want to get that in as well).

I usually just end up tapping numpad 9 then minus a lot to select the nearest friend and cast speed boost. It affects everyone in the aoe of your target so throwing one out there every now and again is usually good enough to not have to worry too much. Moving between packs, entering doors, while someone is getting finished off and siphon sped is down, really all the time any time. The only time it is not appropriate to cast speed boost is when people are dancing because it interrupts the party.

I know keeping up Speed Boost is an unsexy and thankless job. But it really is one of the best things you can do to help out your team. And if there's a kin on your team and he speed boosts you and you don't get him back...he'll know.

(edit to emphasize): Again, speed boost affects an aoe around the target so it isn't neccesary to go down the list and buff each person every time. Just keep in mind to slap it on the person nearest to you fairly often and keep an eye on your team buff bars and you'll be fine.

/bind NUMPAD1 "unselect$$team_select 1$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD2 "unselect$$team_select 2$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD3 "unselect$$team_select 3$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD4 "unselect$$team_select 4$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD5 "unselect$$team_select 5$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD6 "unselect$$team_select 6$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD7 "unselect$$team_select 7$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD8 "unselect$$team_select 8$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD9 "unselect$$target_friend_near$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind SUBTRACT "powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind DIVIDE "powexec_name Increase Density"

Inertial Reduction:

It's a group travel power. Completely skippable.

Transference:

Good skill, I use it to compensate for an end and toggle-heavy build. Everyone like a way to get endurance. Accuracy and end mod if you find yourself needing it.

Fulcrum shift:

Debuffs up to 10 enemies around the targeted enemy for 20% damage. Buffs allies in range of those enemies by 20% damage each. Buffs you and allies near you by 40%. Lasts 45 seconds on a 60 second base recharge.

Yes, that means that you can buff yourself, your fire imps, and all of your buddies in the giant pile of heroes and soon to be vanquished foes by 240% damage. To get the most out of fulcrum shift I like to be the second (or first on my 50++ build) person in, then take a second or two to check to see if anybody is moving towards the pile and use another power of some sort, maybe a quick siphon speed or add some control down on the pack with an IO bonfire or flashfire.. Once your imps and/or stray teammates are almost there, start the fulcrum so they can get the buff as the come running in to the enemies and start smashing away.

Slot with recharge and accuracy, then maybe end reduction if you like.

(Note: Previously this guide said something incorrect, what actually happens in terms of to hit rolling is: The damage buff from yourself auto hits, but each debuff/buff on the enemies does a normal to hit roll)

Pool Powers

Speed

Most ATs want to get perma hasten and so do you. This will make sure you have enough recharge to stack all of your buffs and throw out fulcrum shift every 18 seconds.

Fighting:

You have a lot reasons to be in the middle of the pile so tough/weave will be necessary to mitigate damage. Weave also has an LOTG slot for eventual global recharge.

Leadership:

I like Manuevers/Tactics. Again, you need to take defense where you can get it and the LOTG slot. Tactics offers nice positional defense from the gaussian's set as well as a friendly aura, Vengeance is kind of fun and can take an LOTG.

Sorcery:

I honestly haven't used this one myself, but you can slap people decently hard with Arcane Bolt while containment is triggered. You will probably want pick this up for leveling if you're solo (actually, grab it even if you'll always be teaming too. Damage is good). The Rune of Protection is nice for a little extra resistance on a click. I don't put it into my 50++ builds though.

Leaping:

Combat Jumping is nice, it has a little def and you can put an LOTG in it.

Flying:

Hot feet (your primary damage source) will not turn on if you are flying and you don't really want to hover out of melee range in the later stages of the game. Hover is actually quite good while you're not using hot feet and and in a more middling position before level 40ish, but once you get fulcrum shfit and are getting serious about doing any damage yourself, you'll probably want to respec in to hot feet and combat jumping.

Travel Powers: You can buy jetpacks from the p2w vendor so you really don't need travel powers (I don't have one in any of my 50+ builds) but if you want to take one you can.

Suggested Epic/Patron Pools

Mace Mastery offers S/L/E defense and a single target damage power with -res. This is probably your best option if you want to get tankier without getting all your defense from set bonuses and pool powers. Being able to keep up a single target -res is really nice because -res is good synergy with +damage and it's a debuff tool you don't have yet. And you can summon a tarantula.

Earth is nice if you need more defense but haven't done the patron arcs.

Fire Mastery offers more damage and a fun self rez. If you want to maximize your AOE damage this is your best bet.

Psionic Mastery help plug your psi hold, provides great mez protection on click and an LOTG slot.

Incarnates

The Firekin wants to be in the pile, throwing out as many fulcrum shifts and getting hot feet damage off on contained targets while tossing out your various skills as needed. You're going to build for defense and recharge, so you're going to want for your incarnates to support those goals or give you something you want that you don't have already.

Alpha

Core Agility gives defense, recharge, and endurance modification, you'd want to take these even if it was just the first 2. I wouldn't invest in spiritual since you don't strictly need it for perma hasten and you really need defense.

Judgement

Ion makes a funny sound so I like it, haven't tried anything else

Interface

I've been happy with radial reactive, but I've heard good things about the degenerative proc too.

Destiny

Barrier Core is a good way to keep your defenses up (t4 is 5% perma) if you really want to be sure you can be perma capped

Barrier Radial has a rez so if you want to be a team player for whatever reason

Clarion Core might be your only option for Mez protection if you aren't //psi.

Lore

People say cimerorans, banished pantheon, or longbow. Longbow has some -regen which you don't really have in your kit which always helps. Really my only suggestion is whatever you do, go Core. Radial looks fun because you can get an invincible buffer but the DPS from Core is much better and you have fulcrum shift so, yeah you probably want to have an insane damage buffed Core whatever instead of Fortitude up half the time.

Hybrid

I like the damage proc on control core, but the buffs on support were nice too.

Edited February 10, 2021 by Caldazar4
Added containment definition and misc

Caldazar4 · July 10, 2019

Builds:

Goals when building your firekin:

Build defenses so you can safely run up and trigger hot feet etc. ~35% defenses are good targets for a 50+++ build(capped with a small purple/buffs).

Perma Hasten

Slot the powers you actually use.

You should make sure your powers (especially especially Transfusion) hit at 95% accuracy at the content you want to do. Check the combat logs when you use your powers on the big bosses to be sure.

None of these builds have travel powers, I use jetpacks and the various teleports from the p2w vendor to get around. Really on homecoming any character can get away with just those but I also have siphon speed to keep up as well, I've never really missed having a true travel power

Big caveat: These builds are not for levelling, just 50++. You will probably want to take the powers in a better order if you want to exemplar or while levelling.

Update2: I have attached files for the builds.

Update3: I fixed the order of the powers (you should take Fulcrum at 38) on the Fire/Kin/Fire build but the rest might be out of order.

Fire/Kin/Fire:

This is definitely my favorite build. I'm always hitting 95% on Transfusion and Transference despite not slotting any accuracy directly, something like the //Psi might be "optimal" because of the mez protection but this is what I think is "best".

It can farm a single comic con meteor map in about 10 minutes. Nothing to sniff at, but not competitive with specialized brute builds.

35% positional defenses, so you should be capped from your team, or inspirations.

Smashing and lethal resist capped. Fire almost resist capped and cold is close too.

Perma Hasten with good siphon speed uptime.

Variant Option:

1. Take out Vengeance and put in Super Speed with a stealth IO (Thanks to gamerguysteve for the reminder on this)

2. Take out Vengeance and put in Siphon Power, Siphon Power usually won't make it into my normal rotations but against AVs you have time for it.

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Fire/Kin/Psionic:

The build is designed to have the best mez protection while doing all-around pve content,

35% positional defenses, so you should be capped from your team, or inspirations

Smashing and lethal resist capped. Psionics might not make you immediately die/sad.

90 seconds Mez protection on 105 second cooldown, so almost perma

perma hasten.

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Fire/Kin/Mace

The build is designed to have the best defenses without having to rely on inspirations or buffs and has a ST -res.

Defense capped typed defenses.

perma hasten

Poisonous ray for ST -res

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A No purple build

You're close to perma hasten, 30% positional defenses and capped smashing/lethal resist. You could fairly easily switch out the Fire Epic for Mace or Earth for more guaranteed defense. Start working on Core Agility in your Alpha slot to squeeze out more defense and recharge.

If you have money left the first two upgrades should be:

1. the impervium: psionic for a gladiator's 3% defense in fire shield for even more defense

2. Numina's Regeneration/recovery for a panacea proc in health.

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FireKin Mace.mxd FireKin Psionic.mxd Fire Kin Fire No Purples.mxd

FireKin Fire v2.mxd

Edited February 10, 2021 by Caldazar4
Attached Files for builds as well

swordchucks · July 10, 2019

I just hit level 50 on my Fire/Kin/Fire Controller last night, so I haven't gotten deep into the end game. My general experiences are pretty well in line with what you're saying here. I know my build isn't the best, but that's mainly because I "wasted" some power picks getting flight + afterburner to get around town faster. I'll probably yank that out at some point and put Cinders in again (I'm terrible about using PBAoEs like that and realized it wasn't likely to hurt much to leave it out until I got better at playing the character).

In any case, a couple of comments/thoughts:

1. Fire Imps are like really hyper small children with no self preservation instincts. I frequently find myself looking around and asking "where did the imps go?" while hoping that they aren't aggroing every pack on the level (which only happens sometimes). They can be difficult to get to start fighting (since they like to hang back), but once they do, they will range quite a distance. I've considered theming a character after a "kindergarten teacher from hell", but it seems like a lot of work for the three little brats.

2. Bonfire is best slotted with Sudden Acceleration's KB to KD proc. It makes the power absolutely hilarious and pairs well with Fire Cages to keep all of your foes in one spot. As long as you're not dealing with AVs, you should be able to lock down spawns this way without much trouble. Start with Bonfire, then throw in Fire Cages and dump the kitchen sink on top of them while they're constantly falling down. Even better, it sticks around a long time and I've had many ambushes run straight into it while the team was dealing with the next pack. It doesn't take a lot to get the recharge down below the duration, either.

3. If you're slotting Sudden Acceleration into Bonfire, that means you can still use the Summer Blockbuster (Overwhelming Force)'s KB to KD enhancement on a different power. This is important because that IO includes a chance to generate KD in a power that doesn't normally. Being a Universal Damage set, it slots into most attack powers, including your Imps which give even more chances to knock things down.

4. Since you're already taking the Speed pool, it can be fun to take Super Speed and slot a Celerity: +Stealth IO into it. This makes you very hard to spot and makes it easier to position yourself just so before tossing out the pain.

5. On the bad side, I found some EBs to be very, very difficult on a fresh 50 with only a few sets slotted (and the rest regular IOs). I died quite a few times to the pair in the alien base in one of the middle missions where you unlock your Alpha slot, and I'm still not entirely sure why. The AV at the very end died easily (well, with some kiting), but those two were murder, even while popping inspirations.

6. I find solo on the character pretty painful up until level 26 when Bonfire becomes available. Level 32 with Imps is even better. Those are probably the two break points that seemed most significant in leveling. I didn't end up with Hot Feet until I respecced in the mid 40s and didn't really miss it (I die enough in missions as it is).

Robotech_Master · July 10, 2019

Isn't speed boost now a whole-group-at-once buff, like bubbles? So there shouldn't be any need for numpad binds to apply it individually.

Caldazar4 · July 10, 2019

Isn't speed boost now a whole-group-at-once buff, like bubbles? So there shouldn't be any need for numpad binds to apply it individually.

Yeah, I sometimes use it if I notice that person doesn't have it in their bar. But usually just rely on the aoe to hit people.

knighthawk515 · July 14, 2019

awesome guide! thanks for the details. I read it while leveling up my fire/kin and it has helped me better understand the power set. (melee guy normally here. all my 50s so far and even back on live were tanks/brutes mostly).

Thanks!

jlabranche · July 15, 2019

I like this guide, I'm posting an alternative build for fire/kin/fire for those who want to do fire comicon farms solo on their fire/kin/fire trollers.

Spines/Fire brutes are faster, but I can typically get 7-9 minute run with this build

http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1554&c=700&a=1400&f=HEX&dc=78DA6594594F534114C767E82DD052845A0A6513284BA1556801138D0B51040D6D234AF4CD985A2E7093DA365D127DF441E3F664A27E014DC0EDC9F5CDF533F8E2FA01045CDEAFA7F33F78AFE94DE037F33FE7CC9C3367A6C90B473C4F8E5E9A12B2793A932A16CF4EE7B2A5422E93D10BF5C9722955327259419F67B69C4917CAE77B678D825E47428FE5B815335AB16D4D0236FBE1F2D2D268DCC8EA25235D14EEF91CF92EE4757DD1A386093D9537B2CB8D6A326B2CAF9468D6B4655AD40BC51523EF9DC91B69EC904C154B7AE16280B218A5BFCB52F0673AC5634D8898266A1F82BD6B60DF23E62AD8FF009CB16285E820746BE20A69904D4DCED728BF9A13CC93A0760AAC5D008374240E15644A4744C087D94F36276CC2E982FF559AD74173D61D8056BF9FB90F74EF65EE0163530EC5565ACF8558CDF50BDA36BF04D731EFDA00FB7E82D7C8DCC0310DC7B19E27C94C80CD73CC38D74AFB34F239348E40EB1F06074260788819061D14D3C475354D22A7ED1360CB6E9EC7781E90EABC5BDB408D62BD1CEB8D73AD5C5F80EB09707D1DBF995CB797627D7CC63ED67CA4F959F3AF213F933ED1A6FE5F27533B6FD7FE0ED761C75BE61BE66BBE461FC05DEFC11B14D7C957AEF33B5219F8C6FC0A86BE80239FC1F02770AE522D5FB9EE4E683749EBE15C7AA691EAD041E614F31018FAC3DC04131417C47A32789BDB74074C926D505616366B063B701D4722FFF31EA530CCB50CBF447D3B9F329F319F73FDAF982FC0FB141BE1BC23511CFB18B7776C9CC9ED8FF175888DA3E663B2F27C556EEA190BCD215AA865513E9B28B7B14BB33D51D5B9EE8A825DCD7095355AA5C42C7F5626AA7C26AB94449532AFFDFB61105229AE667AF650CC1F6EB24ABB75C352A43C8D6A7A2BED0F6962BDCA7BD3EE7D17FDEBBA05B6B710B8E28F3E6BBC1AB4C6C26F8DE3369F945B55A0C669DBF89C6D7CC636FE0BB20D088F

https://imgur.com/gallery/2GuwjH0

Hedgefund · July 16, 2019

Where did this myth that FS is auto-hit come from? This is the second time I've seen that mentioned in the last few days.

Buff emanating from caster - autohit

Buff/debuff from each siphon from enemies - does a to-hit roll, not autohit.

Caldazar4 · July 16, 2019

Where did this myth that FS is auto-hit come from? This is the second time I've seen that mentioned in the last few days.

Buff emanating from caster - autohit

Buff/debuff from each siphon from enemies - does a to-hit roll, not autohit.

Yeah, you're right about this, I have updated the portion on fulcrum.

kage1822 · July 31, 2019

confused on your builds... I've been told numerous times by lots of the big build guys that Gaussian's has a bad set bonus, that if taking it, just get the unique, yet you go full on 6-slot and everyone says never 6-slot gaussian's

Tamorand · August 1, 2019

23 hours ago, kage1822 said:

confused on your builds... I've been told numerous times by lots of the big build guys that Gaussian's has a bad set bonus, that if taking it, just get the unique, yet you go full on 6-slot and everyone says never 6-slot gaussian's

Can you be more specific?
Kinda sounds like you got trolled, or might be trolling?
Can you go ask your big build guys what they are talking about?

Dr Causality · August 3, 2019

On 7/30/2019 at 11:45 PM, kage1822 said:

confused on your builds... I've been told numerous times by lots of the big build guys that Gaussian's has a bad set bonus, that if taking it, just get the unique, yet you go full on 6-slot and everyone says never 6-slot gaussian's

The value of set bonuses is very specific to a build. But no the bonuses delivered from a full 6 Set of Guassian's are be no means bad if you need positional defense. Think about it this way you're spending five free slots to get +2.5 Melee, +2.5 Ranged and +2.5 Aoe def. So 5 slots gave you a total of +7.5% Def towards positional softcaps, that's a return of +1.5 Def per slot! The only sets in the game that can match that are the new Superior Event and AT sets. Now if you only need say Melee or if you need typed defense instead where Guassians is half strength at just+1.25, then sure Gaussian's maybe not so great.

*Edit* Just wanted to add that the PPM (proc per minute) change is one reason 6 slotted Guassians is out of vogue. The +positional defense set bonuses are still great, but with the PPM change you can get much more use of out the Guassian's buildup proc in a power like Aim/Buildup. Reason being, is it now has a high chance of procing in those high recharge powers, and that means you get to control when you're extra buildup is proc-ed to time with your best attacks. But it will rarely be worth 6 slotting aim/buildup the way it is in Tactics.... (Tactics needs endurance reduction, which Guassian's supplies plenty of...but Aim/Buildup mostly needs +Rech which Guassian's only get's to around 73% or 89% if you +5 boost the IO's... so that's a lot of slots used to still not have full 96% ED capped +Rech....)

Edited August 3, 2019 by Dr Causality
Add proc info

Caldazar4 · August 13, 2019

On 8/3/2019 at 2:04 PM, Dr Causality said:

The value of set bonuses is very specific to a build. But no the bonuses delivered from a full 6 Set of Guassian's are be no means bad if you need positional defense. Think about it this way you're spending five free slots to get +2.5 Melee, +2.5 Ranged and +2.5 Aoe def. So 5 slots gave you a total of +7.5% Def towards positional softcaps, that's a return of +1.5 Def per slot! The only sets in the game that can match that are the new Superior Event and AT sets. Now if you only need say Melee or if you need typed defense instead where Guassians is half strength at just+1.25, then sure Gaussian's maybe not so great.

Thanks, this is exactly correct, it's all about the positional defense. The fire/kin/fire and fire/kin/psionic rely on positional defenses, the fire/kin/mace build uses typed defenses and doesn't have 6 Gaussian's. And yes, everyone is also correct in saying that the build up proc piece of it is much more effective in Aim or Buildup...but I don't much worry about it for this build because of FS.

BeornOTNS · August 15, 2019

On 7/15/2019 at 11:56 AM, jlabranche said:

I like this guide, I'm posting an alternative build for fire/kin/fire for those who want to do fire comicon farms solo on their fire/kin/fire trollers.

Spines/Fire brutes are faster, but I can typically get 7-9 minute run with this build

https://imgur.com/gallery/2GuwjH0

what power did you choose at level 24?

~Beorn

SkyMonkee · August 21, 2019

On 7/10/2019 at 9:04 PM, Caldazar4 said:

Why are there so many goddamn firekins?

In general, you take the most offensive primary and the most offensive secondary and create a character which is capable of both incredible control and aoe DPS.

Fire/ (like all things fire) has a secondary effect of doing a little bit of damage. Granted, it is dogshit damage, but when you are doing dogshit damage from 4 different aoe dot skills at a time, and all of those are buffed to 400% damage, and hitting twice because of containment...it really starts to pile up. Plus you have imps slapping people with handfuls of damaged capped flaming dogshit.

/Kin is the most offensive secondary set. Most everything in the set is either a power that debuffs a targetted enemy, then buffs/heals people around the caster/target. Everyone loves to have a /kin on their team particularly because of Speed Boost, an amazing recharge, recovery and speed buff that is reasonably easy to keep permanent on your entire team, and Fulcrum shift which can provide up to 240% damage for 45 seconds on a base 60 second cool down.

Solo Vs Team

I've heard a lot of people talk about how a firekin is a great solo character. I can easily solo +4/x8 on my level 50, hundreds of millions of inf worth of enhancements fire/kin. You might even start to become a solo monster once you're level 38, but getting to that point solo is...not really an efficient use of time. The main issue I've found while trying to level is that your best damage skill (Hot feet) until level 32 requires you to stand right next to your enemies. Then they either run away, or smash you in your paper thin face. It also takes a ton of endurance. Your imps have good damage but are also fairly fragile and tend to run off by themselves, making it harder to keep them healed. Once you have fulcrum shift, at level 38, you'll probably start getting enough damage to kill enemies before your (relatively) weaker control options wear off and start to understand the solo potential. However, you'll also be able to buff your melee damage friends on your team up to an absurd amount so I didn't really want to stop. (Note: I've heard great things about using Arcane Bolt in the sorcery pool as a damage option while levelling. Maybe someone who's done that chime in on whether it makes solo levelling...not bad)

So I suggest teaming as much as possible. Kinetics really is a much more useful set in a team than solo. Hell, you even have two skills which you can't even cast on yourself. I could be wrong, and if you've had a great time soloing up to 50 on your firekin please chime in. Tips for teaming:

1. Make sure you're keeping speed boost up on your friends (some helpful binds in the power specific section)

2. Early on you can position yourself a little further back, but once you're sturdier you'll want to maximize the impact of Fulcrum Shift and Hot Feet by staying in melee range.

3. Try to keep siphon speed up and stacked as much as possible. That way you can keep up your (perma speed boosted) friends, and then you have the recharge to heal/buff/control

Powers and Slotting While Leveling

(See builds for slotting 50+).

Fire

Ring of Fire, ST Immobilize: This is generally considered to be the most skippable skill in the fire primary. I've not seen a single level 50 build that include it, but having it to trigger containment while levelling might be nice (especially if you're using Arcane Bolt for damage). If it comes down to Ring of Fire Vs Char I would go with Char. Holds are better than immobilizes because the bad guy cant shoot you with his gun.

Char, ST Hold: A nice single target hold. Not too much to say about this. Triggers containment and damage.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge, and End Redux (Maybe damage)

Fire Cages, AOE Immobilitize. This is a pretty good skill that makes it into the rotation at 50+. While leveling it is a lot of endurance and well, it immobilizes your enemies. This could be great if they are where you want them to be. However, if your tanker/brute/particularly brave scrapper is trying to herd people around it could be counterproductive.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge, and End Redux (Maybe damage if you're soloing)

Smoke, AOE To-hit debuff: This one I think is fairly skippable as well. It's nice that it doesn't draw aggro, so you can go ahead and cast it ahead of time on the next pack to make sure they are hitting you/your friends less. If you're soloing I would think you'd want to use this and make sure to keep it up on enemies, because it's the closest thing you get to defense before pool powers or sets. However, by the time you are 50 the idea is that you can kill/control everything or have actual defense so this isn't quite necessary.

Hot Feet, PBAOE Damage/Slow/Not Fear: This is where a lot of your DPS will come from at high levels, but at low levels you are probably too fragile and it takes an insane amount of endurance . Note that it only works if you're not flying. Because of this skill (and fulcrum shift) you will want to stay in melee range once you're sturdy enough.

While leveling, slot for: Damage, End Redux, Accuracy

Flashfire. AOE Disorient: Your first AOE hard control, I'm so happy for you. Depending on how strong you are relative to your enemies, and whether you are soloing, you'll either open up on a pack with this skill as the tank charges in, or keep it in your back pocket to help out if there is some sort of aggro problem (two packs, enthusiatic blaster, etc) . I usually tend to be pretty free with it, as if you wait until you are sure you need to use it, it is probably too late.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge, and End Redux

Cinders, PBAOE hold: Even though it is PBAOE instead of targeted AOE, I find myself approaching how to use this skill similarly to flashfire. It has a much longer cooldown though.

While leveling, slot for: Accuracy, Recharge.

Bonfire: Ground target AOE: This skill is pretty bad, until...you get the knockback to knockdown IO*. Then this might be the best skill in the fire control set. Seriously, it is broken how good it is with the IO. I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw it myself.

The 2 sets with a knockback to knockdown IO are Sudden Acceleration and Overwhemling Presence. The first is available for relatively cheap on the AH and I would really strongly recommend you get this as soon as possible. The second you can get something in the set from summer blockbuster and use converters. Seriously this should be the first major thing you spend money on.

Then, make a macro or bind such as

/bind b powexec_location target Bonfire

Or

/macro bon powexec_location target Bonfire

That way you don't have to pick the the location. Just hit the bind or macro and cast it on your target.

Fire Imps: You summon 3 imps that run around slapping people in the face. Fairly self explanatory, slot for damage while levelling. Maybe recharge if they are dying a lot. Once you have fulcrum shift they'll start really slapping.

Kinetics

Transfusion: This is your heal and you'll be using it fairly often for...well ever. Learn to love it. You cast it on an enemy and it heals everything in an area around the enemy. . Even though you can't heal characters directly, a nice trick if you want to heal a melee ally in the middle of some chaos you can click target them from the team window and use the power. By default it will try to use it on their target which is likely going to be someone close to them. (This little trick is useful for basically everything in the kinetics set.

While leveling, Accuracy is the most imporant to slot this with, then recharge and heal/end redux to suit your fancy.

Siphon Power: A solid buff/debuff. Will debuff your target's damage by 20% and buff you and your team in an aoe around you's damage by 20%. It and transfusion have the same radius, so if you're close enough to get healed by transfusion on a target, you'll probably buff the person punching him in the face. While levelling, try to see if you can stand in the middle and buff both your blaster friends and your scrapper friends.

Slot for accuracy, recharge, and end reduction. Once you get fulcrum shift this power becomes much less appealing but it is still nice to have. This isn't in my 50+ build, but you could make an argument that it should be in there for AVs and such.

Repel:

Very skippable. Definitely the second most "situational' power in the kinetics set.

Pros: People don't run up and hit you

Cons:

Knockback

Annoying Sound

Endurance

Can it take a knockback to knockdown IO? Yes. I tried it. It was moderately effective, but didn't seem consistent. The sound was so horribly annoying, especially because as a firekin you want to be in the middle of the pile.

Siphon Speed: Debuff your target's speed and buff your movement speeds and recharge by 20%. I put this in the overall tips section but try to keep siphon speed up and stacked as much as possible. That way you can keep up your (perma speed boosted) friends, and then you have the recharge to heal/buff/control. Some people say you don't need this if you have hasten, but por que no los dos?.

While leveling, slot for accuracy, recharge

Increase Density:

Buffs smashing and energy resistence, and various mez protection to your target for 1 minute on a 2 second cooldown. Also provides the resistance in an AOE to nearby allies. It's a nice aoe buff and you should try to use it to save your friends from mezzes if possible. 1 slot wonder this for resist or maybe end redux.

Speed Boost:

A 2 minute recharge, end recovery, and movement speed targeted AOE buff on a 2 second cool for everyone! Everyone but you that is. Your goal is 100% uptime on your entire team. I find that the easiest way to do this is with the binds below. From testing you can't do both the select and use the power in one cast, but the binds below will make it so a double tap on numpad# will first tap target the # teammate and then second tap will cast speed boost on them. Numpad9 will just find the closest friend you can target, and minus will cast speed boost. (Divide will cast increase Density if you want to get that in as well).

I usually just end up tapping numpad 9 then minus a lot to select the nearest friend and cast speed boost. It affects everyone in the aoe of your target so throwing one out there every now and again is usually good enough to not have to worry too much. Moving between packs, entering doors, while someone is getting finished off and siphon sped is down, really all the time any time. The only time it is not appropriate to cast speed boost is when people are dancing because it interrupts the party.

I know keeping up Speed Boost is an unsexy and thankless job. But it really is one of the best things you can do to help out your team. And if there's a kin on your team and he speed boosts you and you don't get him back...he'll know.

(edit to emphasize): Again, speed boost affects an aoe around the target so it isn't neccesary to go down the list and buff each person every time. Just keep in mind to slap it on the person nearest to you fairly often and keep an eye on your team buff bars and you'll be fine.

/bind NUMPAD1 "unselect$$team_select 1$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD2 "unselect$$team_select 2$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD3 "unselect$$team_select 3$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD4 "unselect$$team_select 4$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD5 "unselect$$team_select 5$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD6 "unselect$$team_select 6$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD7 "unselect$$team_select 7$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD8 "unselect$$team_select 8$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind NUMPAD9 "unselect$$target_friend_near$$powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind SUBTRACT "powexec_name Speed Boost"

/bind DIVIDE "powexec_name Increase Density"

Inertial Reduction:

It's a group travel power. Completely skippable.

Transference:

Good skill, I use it to compensate for an end and toggle-heavy build. Everyone like a way to get endurance. Accuracy and end mod if you find yourself needing it.

Fulcrum shift:

Debuffs up to 10 enemies around the targetted enemy for 20% damage. Buffs allies in range of those enemies by 20% damage each. Buffs you and allies near you by 40%. Lasts 45 seconds on a 60 second base recharge.

Yes, that means that you can buff yourself, your fire imps, and all of your buddies in the giant pile of heroes and soon to be vanquished foes by 240% damage. To get the most out of fulcrum shift I like to be the second (or first on my 50++ build) person in, then take a second or two to check to see if anybody is moving towards the pile and use another power of some sort, maybe a quick siphon speed or add some control down on the pack with an IO bonfire or flashfire.. Once your imps and/or stray teammates are almost there, start the fulcrum so they can get the buff as the come running in to the enemies and start smashing away.

Slot with recharge and accuracy, then maybe end reduction if you like.

(Note: Previously this guide said that Fulcrum would auto hit. The damage buff from yourself auto hits, but each debuff/buff on the enemies does a normal to hit roll)

Pool Powers

Speed

Most ATs want to get perma hasten and so do you. This will make sure you have enough recharge to stack all of your buffs and throw out fulcrum shift every 18 seconds.

Fighting:

You have a lot reasons to be in the middle of the pile so tough/weave will be necessary to mitigate damage. Weave also has an LOTG slot for eventual global recharge.

Leadership:

I like Manuevers/Tactics. Again, you need to take defense where you can get it and the LOTG slot. Tactics offers nice positional defense from the gaussian's set as well as a friendly aura, Vengeance is kind of fun and can take an LOTG.

Sorcery:

I honestly haven't used this one myself, but you can slap people decently hard with Arcane Bolt while containment is triggered. You will definitely want to try this out if you're solo. The Rune of Protection is nice for a little extra resistance on a click.

Leaping:

Combat Jumping is nice, it has a little def and you can put an LOTG in it.

Flying:

Hot feet (your primary damage source) will not turn on if you are flying and you don't really want to hover out of melee range in the later stages of the game. Hover is actually quite good while you're not using hot feet and and in a more middling position before level 40ish, but once you get fulcrum shfit and are getting serious about doing any damage yourself, you'll probably want to respec in to hot feet and combat jumping.

Suggested Epic/Patron Pools

Mace Mastery offers S/L/E defense and a single target damage power with -res. This is probably your best option if you want to get tankier without getting all your defense from set bonuses and pool powers. Being able to keep up a single target -res is really nice because -res is good synergy with +damage and it's a debuff tool you don't have yet. And you can summon a tarantula.

Earth is nice if you need more defense but haven't done the patron arcs.

Fire Mastery offers more damage and a fun self rez. If you want to maximize your AOE damage this is your best bet.

Psionic Mastery help plug your psi hold, provides great mez protection on click and an LOTG slot.

Incarnates

The Firekin wants to be in the pile, throwing out as many fulcrum shifts and getting hot feet damage off on contained targets while tossing out your various skills as needed. You're going to build for defense and recharge, so you're going to want for your incarnates to support those goals or give you something you want that you don't have already.

Alpha

Core Agility gives defense, recharge, and endurance modification, you'd want to take these even if it was just the first 2. I wouldn't invest in spiritual since you don't strictly need it for perma hasten and you really need defense.

Judgement

Ion makes a funny sound so I like it, haven't tried anything else

Interface

I've been happy with radial reactive, but I've heard good things about the degenerative proc too.

Destiny

Barrier Core is a good way to keep your defenses up (t4 is 5% perma) if you really want to be sure you can be perma capped

Barrier Radial has a rez so if you want to be a team player for whatever reason

Clarion Core might be your only option for Mez protection if you aren't //psi.

Lore

People say cimerorans, banished pantheon, or longbow. Longbow has some -regen which you don't really have in your kit which always helps. Really my only suggestion is whatever you do, go Core. Radial looks fun because you can get an invincible buffer but the DPS from Core is much better and you have fulcrum shift so, yeah you probably want to have an insane damage buffed Core whatever instead of Fortitude up half the time.

Hybrid

I like the damage proc on control core, but the buffs on support were nice too.

This is a really great guide! But, am I missing something? I loaded up each build into mids and I'm not seeing any travel power? Surely these builds aren't purely for fire farming?! If I haven't missed something where and when would you take a travel power... SJ probably looks best bet but what to take out to put it in. Thanks

Dr Causality · August 22, 2019

20 hours ago, SkyMonkee said:

This is a really great guide! But, am I missing something? I loaded up each build into mids and I'm not seeing any travel power? Surely these builds aren't purely for fire farming?! If I haven't missed something where and when would you take a travel power... SJ probably looks best bet but what to take out to put it in. Thanks

Honestly, unless you're trying to do Master of TF's, you don't need Travel powers now that all the Temp and Prestige travel powers are readily available. Ninja Run stacked with one of the Sprints is decently fast. For getting over rough or high terrain you have 30s boosts from Steam Jump, etc. The main problem with these travel powers is endurance use, but since you're a /Kin Transference solves you're mana issues. Plus you have powers like Siphon Speed and the option of Inertial Reduction Super Jump....

misat · August 22, 2019

Just wanted to chime in on using Arcane Bolt while leveling. It makes it better and I find it very powerful compared to the p2w combat skills you can get. I've six slotted it for leveling and it works great. Just started last night on a Fire/Kin and hit lvl 20 pretty fast.

Caldazar4 · August 23, 2019

On 8/21/2019 at 4:46 AM, SkyMonkee said:

This is a really great guide! But, am I missing something? I loaded up each build into mids and I'm not seeing any travel power? Surely these builds aren't purely for fire farming?! If I haven't missed something where and when would you take a travel power... SJ probably looks best bet but what to take out to put it in. Thanks

Thanks! And yes - no travel power, just use jetpacks and various tps from the p2w vendor. That and siphon speed should do all you need. If you wanted to take something out for SJ or SS I'd probably go with Rise of the Phoenix or Vengeance. I updated the guide to clarify this too.

Edited August 23, 2019 by Caldazar4

samgraves · October 7, 2019

Hey, I'm new to CoH and am not a huge fan of MMOs in general, but I'm having a surprising amount of fun with this one.

So I'm trying this out right now and while it's a big pain to solo level, it's a lot of fun in groups. Something I noticed that I'm not sure has been posted about it is that while yeah, it absolutely helps to have the knockdown IO on bonfire, you can achieve the same effect (I think) if you use fire cages on the group you're going after. It's more endurance cost and only lasts as long as you keep the cages up, but you can still pump out a sizable amount of damage for a few seconds when mixed with everything else.

zenijos10 · October 10, 2019

On 10/7/2019 at 5:21 AM, samgraves said:

Hey, I'm new to CoH and am not a huge fan of MMOs in general, but I'm having a surprising amount of fun with this one.

So I'm trying this out right now and while it's a big pain to solo level, it's a lot of fun in groups. Something I noticed that I'm not sure has been posted about it is that while yeah, it absolutely helps to have the knockdown IO on bonfire, you can achieve the same effect (I think) if you use fire cages on the group you're going after. It's more endurance cost and only lasts as long as you keep the cages up, but you can still pump out a sizable amount of damage for a few seconds when mixed with everything else.

Welcome to the game!

I love Fire/Kins! Fire cages isn't as potent as bonfire.

If it is resisted or dodged it can't be applied again until you cast it again. Bonfire will continue to fire off by itself until it ends.
Fire cages immobilizes, so enemies can still fight, just not move. Bonfire knocks em down, so they cannot attack (or flee).
Anecdotally, I think bonfire foes more damage, but I have no data on this. I'm sure others do though.
While fire cages keeps enemies from running, bonfire slows enemies run speed, but makes them run away in fear

More importantly though, these powers have excellent synergy. Locking down enemies with immobilize then pulling up a bonfire at their location is absolutely devastating.

Eventually, once you have siphon speed, transference, and fulcrum shift, soloing gets A LOT easier. Level 50 Fire/Kin are some of the best soloers in the whole game while still being very much wanted in teams.

Caldazar4 · October 13, 2019

Zeni, I think you're mixing up bonfire and hot feet for the last point.

Anyways, I think Sam is trying to point out the Homecoming mechanics change where, if a unit is affected by both bonfire (without KB2KB IO) and the immobilize from fire cages, they will be knocked down instead of knocked back by the bonfire. I had considered including this in the original post but I had a whole essay on just bonfire already. But it's a thing for sure. (Fun fact: Before this change fire cages and bonfire with IO actually had anti-synergy, as the immobilize from fire cages ended up giving them immunity to the knockdown.)

Quote

POWERS

Immobilize Powers in Controller and Dominator primary power sets should no longer make their targets immune to KnockUp. KnockBack will be converted to KnockDown. This helps sets like Ice and Earth, as their AOE Immobilize power will no longer make their AOE Knockback power useless.

Edited October 13, 2019 by Caldazar4

GamerGuySteve · November 11, 2019

I used to have a really nice Fire/Kin build that I loved back in the day. Have seen a few similar builds but one thing I haven't noticed people doing is slapping Celerity: +Stealth into Super Speed. Doing this automatically activates stealth any time you use SS. SS itself actually reduces threat some by itself, so combined with the stealth from the Celerity: +Stealth enhancement, you can run right into the middle of a group and they won't react to you at all until you are engulfing them in flames. Works wonders. 😄

Captain Bob · December 27, 2019

Bottom line about Epic powers. Which of the three did you finally find that you enjoyed playing most? I Like the idea of not worrying so much about defense with mace, But slapping a KB to KD IO in Psi Tornado sounds fun too. All min/maxing aside, which was funnest to play?

Caldazar4 · January 9, 2020

I think I like //Fire the most, the DPS from fireball and the get out of jail free card from the rez (it has a lot of knockback so you can almost always turn on a jetpack and get away) both add a lot of fun.

siolfir · January 9, 2020

On 11/11/2019 at 4:38 PM, GamerGuySteve said:

I used to have a really nice Fire/Kin build that I loved back in the day. Have seen a few similar builds but one thing I haven't noticed people doing is slapping Celerity: +Stealth into Super Speed. Doing this automatically activates stealth any time you use SS. SS itself actually reduces threat some by itself, so combined with the stealth from the Celerity: +Stealth enhancement, you can run right into the middle of a group and they won't react to you at all until you are engulfing them in flames. Works wonders. 😄

I usually just drop it into Sprint instead, then I can have one layer of stealth from either Sprint or Super Speed, or two with both.

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Fire/Kin Guide - Turning you and your friends into a giant flaming wrecking ball

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