Trademarked characters.

[MunkiLord]

34 minutes ago, AkuTenshiiZero said:

There is something incredibly depressing about seeing a system with such limitless potential as the CoX costume creator being used to create MCU characters.  It just kills my soul to see this, coming from Virtue and seeing the endless creativity of the community back then, that once the trademark rule is gone so many people default to being so basic.  I mean, did anyone even play Illusions before Far From Home came out, now we have a ton of Mysterio knockoffs?

 

It's OK to homage.  It's OK to be inspired.  But if you're just going to make the same character from Marvel, then why not play a Marvel game?

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to find a suitable urn for my ashes once y'all get through with me.

Not me. That's how a lot of people get started. Copying others directly, then a few changes here, then more, then they come up with their own stuff. 

[subbacultchas]

Not much to say now that I didn't say in the original thread. It's not really a likely event that they will be coming after anyone. If the game does get shut down, it won't be because of this I'd imagine.

Make homages, direct copies, inspirations or whatever else you want to play that makes you happy. Go with your own conscience, always.

[Oubliette_Red]

1 hour ago, GM Fiddleback said:

I have/had homage characters. I find the fun is getting across who they are meant to be without making them look nearly identical nor having the same name. For instance, a few people will know why my Captain Marvel homage was called Cap'n Miracle. Others won't. To me that's an interesting way to find people who have experienced/enjoyed the same stuff I have.

 

If you're just gonna name 'em the same and make them look the same, that, to me (and this is just me me, not anything official) seems kinda low effort / lazy. but some people wanna be the 900th incarnation of Wolverine or Superman so... okay I guess. If that's fun for you, go for it.

 

But it _is_ worth noting that the original devs did work things so that most of your costuming options can't be identical to a known copyright character. Sure, some things are VERY VERY similar.... but not identical. You might say you are Captain America or Superman or whatever, but most folks will know by looking that you aren't.

 

Some of us were present at HeroCon and stood and cheered for the lawyer that took on Marvel. The Legacy community was also very effective at self-policing and reporting IP-infringing characters running around to do their part in staving off another lawsuit.

 

Companies are very protective about their IP and now it's not just Marvel but Disney. Not saying that they'd come after Homecoming, but Disney had threatened to sue several daycare centers. Heck, Apple attempted to sue a grocer in Poland because of their web address (a.pl).  Don't assume what corporations may or may not do, because some of them are real Richards.

[MunkiLord]

2 minutes ago, PaxArcana said:

Because Marvel Comics actually sued NCSoft and Cryptic for exactly that.
 

They did. But at the time of that lawsuit Marvel was a failing company worried about keeping its doors open. They were desperate and looking for any source of income to stay afloat so they went for a company with decent sized pockets, that's all that lawsuit was ever really about.

[PaxArcana]

8 minutes ago, MunkiLord said:

desperate and looking for any source of income to stay afloat

... so of course they spent millions of dollars on a longshot lawsuit.

 

They weren't looking for income.

 

They were looking to preserve and even strengthen their Trademarks and Copyrights (while shopping for a buyer with deep pockets - which they eventually found, in the form of Disney).

 

Which they successfully did.

[jubakumbi]

There was a lawsuit, blah blah blah....against companies that are in no way currently involved for things that rely on revenue and proof of intent.

 

Do people really go out of their way so much in life to look for things to be afraid of that they need their entertainment to be full of fear?

If anyone actually thinks that making a trademarked character in this game is going to some way 'bring down the man on us all', I have some oceanfront property in Colorado for ya'.

 

Such FUD is just silly at this point.

 

TBH, I am just glad this FUD is mostly contained on the forums with the exception of the Hall Monitors in game that have decide to make more work for the GMs.

 

[GM Fiddleback]

Just now, jubakumbi said:

>---snip---<

...to make more work for the GMs.

>---snip---<

 

But then what would we actually _do_?

 

Anyway, you folks can argue this back and forth all you want, that's fine. But keep in mind, this comes up every so often and it always gets reargued in pretty much the same way and no one ever comes to any new conclusions or has any new information that changes anything. It's all pretty much trying to predict the future. With or without any useful information.

 

So I guess just keep it civil and maybe point any future threads you see at this one so it's all nicely collected in one spot.

 

Otherwise, three weeks down the road you get to do it all over again.

[jubakumbi]

Just now, GM Fiddleback said:

But keep in mind, this comes up every so often and it always gets reargued in pretty much the same way and no one ever comes to any new conclusions or has any new information that changes anything.

But then what would we actually _do_?

 

😉

 

[MunkiLord]

53 minutes ago, PaxArcana said:

... so of course they spent millions of dollars on a longshot lawsuit.

 

They weren't looking for income.

 

They were looking to preserve and even strengthen their Trademarks and Copyrights (while shopping for a buyer with deep pockets - which they eventually found, in the form of Disney).

 

Which they successfully did.

Until Iron Man, they were desperate and had few options. The only reason they found a buyer willing to give any significant amount of money was because of their movies, their lawsuit with NC Soft did not help with that in any way. Without the movies, which was the case in 2005, the company was worthless. They took a long shot with a frivolous lawsuit and it didn't work, it happens. Money was the only thing Marvel needed back then, and licensing was the only way they were making any, so they tried with NC Soft. Those that can't innovate, litigate. And in 2005, that was Marvel.

 

It's not a coincidence that Warner owned DC didn't file their own lawsuit.

 

And all of that is a good thing! Because if Marvel wasn't desperate, the MCU never would have been made. They would have been happy to rent out their property forever.

[Abraxus]

To be fair, I think Marvel was looking down the road at their own MMO/RPG, and they were trying to clear the decks in anticipation.  Of course, I can't recall if that idea died before it launched, or if it came and went so fast that it might as well have died on the vine.  In either case, their concerns about CoH being the potential cause of concern, with regards to it's success, or failure, turned out to be unfounded in retrospect. 

[subbacultchas]

41 minutes ago, Abraxus said:

To be fair, I think Marvel was looking down the road at their own MMO/RPG, and they were trying to clear the decks in anticipation.  Of course, I can't recall if that idea died before it launched, or if it came and went so fast that it might as well have died on the vine.  In either case, their concerns about CoH being the potential cause of concern, with regards to it's success, or failure, turned out to be unfounded in retrospect. 

Came and went, as it  happens. Although it was more like Marvel's attempt at a Diablo-style game with an MMO leanings to me.

[justicebeliever]

2 minutes ago, subbacultchas said:

Came and went, as it  happens. Although it was more like Marvel's attempt at a Diablo-style game with an MMO leanings to me.

Well they were looking at doing one at the time and isn’t interesting that a year or so later after they settled with Cryptic/NCSoft (for undisclosed terms) they tapped Cryptic to launch it?  It died before launch and became Champions...

[subbacultchas]

3 minutes ago, justicebeliever said:

Well they were looking at doing one at the time and isn’t interesting that a year or so later after they settled with Cryptic/NCSoft (for undisclosed terms) they tapped Cryptic to launch it?  It died before launch and became Champions...

See, even another layer. I was talking about Marvel Heroes (also Cryptic), which was around about 3-4 years but never really took off the ground.

I tried it, to see if it could rekindle what CoH had. It did not.

Edited July 30, 2019 by subbacultchas

[subbacultchas]

You were right Justice, and we are talking about the same thing. It was Marvel Universe Online, but they scrapped it and Cryptic went with Champions Online instead. And Marvel took their IP and some of the work, and went with Marvel Heroes. I did not know there was any connection between the two.  Heroes had a rather shady cash grab then shut down FWIR.

[Charistoph]

3 hours ago, jubakumbi said:

Such FUD is just silly at this point.

Still confusing caution and intelligent forethought as FUD. 

 

No one has presenting anything in a way that represents fear, so that leaves out the first part.  It has been presented in a reasoned manner.

 

Uncertainty will definitely be in play, because until another company actually comes out and says something, we don't know what they will do.  The fact that nothing has happened (so far) is an indication that tacit (meaning silent, unvoiced, or unspoken) permission has been granted by virtue of apathy.  But until a statement has been made or these systems have been around for some time, that uncertainty will still be quite proper.

 

Doubt?  I don't see anyone presenting anything to doubt the system as yet.  If they had, they wouldn't be here in the first place.  If anything, the doubt is that any major business is even going to bother doing anything about it.

 

So, the only one pushing any FUD here is you by continuing to call it that.

[nightroarer]

2 hours ago, subbacultchas said:

See, even another layer. I was talking about Marvel Heroes (also Cryptic), which was around about 3-4 years but never really took off the ground.

I tried it, to see if it could rekindle what CoH had. It did not.

Marvel Heroes was Gazillion, not Cryptic. It was a fun little change of pace game, but I agree that it could not replace CoH.

[subbacultchas]

10 hours ago, nightroarer said:

Marvel Heroes was Gazillion, not Cryptic. It was a fun little change of pace game, but I agree that it could not replace CoH.

Correct. It was only when Cryptic split during Marvel Universe Online that Gazillion took over and formed Marvel Heroes. It's an interesting business venture that did not end well for at least one of those companies; and Champions is still going strong.

[PaxArcana]

1 hour ago, subbacultchas said:

[...] Champions is still going strong.

No it's not.  It went free-to-play because subscription numbers dropped precipitously due to the Day One Patch of Doom(tm) and never recovered.

 

I bought a Lifetime Subscription shortly before launch.  I haven't logged in for mroe than fifteen minutes since six months after launch.  That should tell you something right there.

It is, at best, limping along on F2P life support.

[subbacultchas]

37 minutes ago, PaxArcana said:

No it's not.  It went free-to-play because subscription numbers dropped precipitously due to the Day One Patch of Doom(tm) and never recovered.

 

I bought a Lifetime Subscription shortly before launch.  I haven't logged in for mroe than fifteen minutes since six months after launch.  That should tell you something right there.

It is, at best, limping along on F2P life support.

That's fair lol. I had friends try to get me into it before Homecoming came about. So I assumed it had finally picked up momentum.