Neiska

That is a fair assessment. But I don't think the "have's" and "have-not's" are necessarily who people think they might be. I mean, there are people who sit in the D for hours far richer than I, who play the AH market game while they roleplay. Some of the richest folks I know are like, level 5? If you want to prune that wealth gap, its not the farmers who are the "have's" in that scenario, its the people who play the in game monopoly market.

I agree, it's fine to respectfully disagree. But first, I saw such things in LFG just last night. A discussion happened where some rather colorfully expressed their disfavor of law enforcement. Another player, claiming to be law enforcement, retorted. And it went from there. Next, that tool that circumvented that "small inconvenience" is what enabled some people to play the game in the first place. Without it, my two friends were unable to really play, without someone on auto follow to move around from zone to zone, mission to mission. Once that was gone, well, so was their ability to play open world content, and neither cared to play AE. My point was what is a small matter to "you" doesn't make it a small matter/petty excuse to "everyone." And that's just one example. And yes, there is a difference. A rather large one. The difference is, you don't hear the farmers calling to nerf all non-farm or power leveling content, which quite regularly from those who don't like farming. It isn't both sides dictating to each other, its one side (nonfarmers) lecturing/dictating to the other (farmers). The farmers aren't pushing for a change that would affect everyone, that's just one side. Right now? It's "if you don't like the AE, fine, then don't use it." But over the past few years we have seen everything from nerfing AE (again), to removing exp from it entirely, to removing money, or drops, to removing it completely. You will never hear anyone saying "remove everything that isn't AE content." So, I have to disagree there. The "farmer's" aren't pushing their play on anyone, while some who don't farm are for some reason so massively butthurt by how others choose to spend their time, they want to see it removed or gutted completely. I wouldn't call that "equal opposition" by any stretch.

Awesome feedback everyone, thank you. Is much appreciated! The build that Mekomancer is definitely better than my initial one. May take that one and make some tinker-changes, such as the Ragnarok KD into howling twilight, or Frozen Blast Immob as Carnifax suggested.

Right then, First off, not your "bud." A. I also said "in-game." If you don't know what I mean by this, then you are likely part of the problem. Such as kicking people from teams for their power choice, or for still learning their AT/the mission/the game, and rather than try to teach or help you rather just boot them and get the next person angling to get their weekly done. B. It's not "only" chat. It's in local. It's in LFG. It's in team. It's where-ever it cares to pop up. C. Ah yes, I shall be sure to tell my military friend who used to play with only one hand, or my other friend who was so nearsighted she is legally blind, that the difficulties they face are mere small inconveniences. To you, they might be "excuses." To other's those are certainly "reasons." The fact that people push for AE/Incarnate changes "of old," and not other things such as, oh, I dunno, Removal of the Gull, paying upkeep on bases, locking some clothing behind achievements or badges, or removal of power updates/changes/new sets, tells me that it isn't about balance at all, but more about people just wanting to be Elitist Karen Gatekeepers and feel they have the right to dictate to others on how to play. Especially if they claim "for the good of the community" while ignoring the loss in players such proposed changes might have on that community. If you want to "take your ball and go home," you will more and more find yourself playing alone. And I can't say such persons don't deserve to. I respect your opinion, as well as everyone else's. But yours is not the "live and let live" option.

Turn about fair play I say, considering you "stomped" on my posts that more or less said "what about solo players too" first, and no, I was "correct" - His point is that he wants to go back to how it "originally" was designed, even stating it was more than a year and a half before they added solo-capability, despite that being over TEN years ago. So, I would say there has been SOLO capability, for far longer than there has not. "Oh, I disagree, but I respect your opinion" There you go, that wasn't so hard, was it? 😋

I am starting to wonder if I am the only one who saves EMP merits for alts to make their initial Incarnate slotting easier. I don't think I have ever changed an EMP merit into a normal merit, ever. They are like gold to me. Merits I can get easy peasy by speed running whatever. But EMP merits? Precious few ways to get those, especially for those of us who mainly solo. My main use for EMP merits is to save up 50 of them, turn them into a Tran Merit and mail it to myself, so my new fresh 50 (often mastermind) can get that initial level shift which is quite important for a Mastermind, due to how the pet scaling works. A fresh 50 non-level shifted MM can be quite rough, depending on the powers and build. I mean, I wouldn't even know what to buy with merits to sell on the AH for money. But now I am wondering. I am sitting on 10,000 threads on my main character alone that I have absolutely zero use for. I don't even know how many candy canes, costume parts, merits, or whatever else currency there happens to be. On my Farming Masterminds I usually like to keep 600 or so EMP merits in the mail, plus whatever else I believe I need to hold onto. The bulk of my money comes from selling white 50 recipes to npc vendors, some of them are 100k a pop and I might end a farming run with 40-50 of them. Plus the raw inf I got from the kills, plus whatever recipes and salvage I found that I can make and/or sell. Honestly I have never even considered EMP worthy of selling, as I value them more than INF, at least as far as gearing up an alt goes. I have piles of money aplenty. But EMP merits? Those take time to gain.

Funny, I find the exact opposite. The majority of my friends have left as well, the main complaints being A.) The overall attitude in the community both ingame and on the forums in particular. B.) The ongoing insertion of politics and other real life issues into an escapism hobby. But the big one is C.) The removal of things and tools we once had, such as the teleport command. Now instead of being able to move zones, one must collect badges to unlock them. I wouldn't call removing something we once had and having to "earn" it again, progress. Particularly when it serves no other purpose than something new and artificial to have to do, in order to enjoy something we all once had. You say the game is too easy? A fair opinion, and I respect your right to have it. Personally I say the Trials and Endgame content are overpopulated by a growing number of persons that the rest of the community don't want to interact with, no matter what form of carrot on a stick is tied to it. If I want endgame content, I will hunt AVs/GMs alone, or go solo trials and arcs by myself or with friends whose company I enjoy. And artificially trying to encourage/force different groups of people to interact will rarely end well for anyone involved. As an example, the last Incarnate Trial I tried to join randomly was not explained in any detail. I had never done it before, and did not know where to go or what to do, or even what the story was. When the leader got angry with me for lagging behind, I tried to explain that I was deaf and was trying to understand what the mission was. His response? "Then why are you here?" and I got removed from the group. Rather than take the 2 minutes to explain things, he was in such a hurry that he would rather boot me and find someone else. That is what the "public endgame" is like for some of us, and why we choose to avoid it. It actually has little to do with the rewards from AE at all. Its simply that there is a group of, well, shall we call them Elitists that are genuinely unpleasant to be around. Now I will add that this is hardly a problem unique to Homecoming. It is the internet and gaming in general. However, at least City of Heroes has options for me to advance to the same level, power, and wealth that they are, without me having to be forced to play in such an environment. Not all games are so blessed. And frankly, I think that's what upsets many of them. That we poor "scrubs" have options, and don't "have" to do it like "ye olde golden years of 2010" and nor would many of us even want to, if that was the only option available. Food for thought.

Citation needed. I do wonder if you mean the original NC soft developers, or the Homecoming staff. "Broken" according to whom? And to be blunt, I could care less what the original developers said about a game they themselves no longer host. If Homecoming want's to do something different, then that's on them. And if you are trying to argue we should go back to issue 5 or whatever for the "way it used to be," I find that both laughable as well as unrealistic.

"Originally designed" does not reflect the "here and now." So, yes, that is an insinuation on your part. I hasten to say I am not suggesting it is malicious or anything of the sort, I am more questioning why you are holding the "original" instead of the "updated" standard for "today," and then claim incarnates is not for solo play, when clearly, they added a way for solo method to gain them later. Which is 10 years old now, quite the old change to ignore, yes? I guess to put it simply, I would ask why do you think its not meant for solo play NOW, even though they added ways to make it solo-friendly after its original conception? Seems a bit contradictory to me?

No, I don't have a beta/test account or character. I have to go by rumors, or what I read on the forums, or what I manage to see from a GM post which isn't always easy to find. I have no custom AE's, I have a few that I enjoy but I also like just trying random ones people have made. It can be exciting sometimes, picking a random AE and seeing what's there.

Well, I am reading conflicting things - that AE is getting veteran exp nerfed, or that Merit conversion is getting nerfed. Personally I have never converted EMP's, I usually hold onto those to get a jump on my alts Initial T3 Alpha - super important for Masterminds, my favored AT. A fresh MM is very weak until they get that T3 Alpha, due to how level shifts and the pets being a lower level interact. But right now I am not sure which is going to happen - either the Post 50 vet EXP Nerf, or the Conversion nerf, both nerfs, or neither. I have been told any mix of them.

Not "strictly" solo, but "mainly" solo yes. And why do you assume there is a teaming requirement on Merits or Incarnate threads? Or that Incarnate abilities are for Incarnate content only? Or is it written somewhere that I am not aware of that all Incarnate powers are disallowed in non-incarnate content? Or is that merely an assumption on your part? Lets apply your point to other matters shall we. Some tankers don't NEED healers outside of Incarnate content, ergo they should be removed. Some builds don't NEED inspirations either, so they should be removed. You don't NEED movement powers, those are entirely a luxury, and thus should be removed. Right?

Thank you both for the input, feedback, and advice. I do see a few changes I will make, but when I was slotting I was mostly chasing Recharge and Defenses, with ways to ensure smooth Resistance/Mezz/END management. I will look at the suggested slotting such as the Spectral Terror but I am at work this exact moment and don't have access.

A few thoughts from me. First, I am glad the proposed change was reverted. For some of us, it's the main way we get veteran/incarnate materials. And there seems to be some people that seem to be under the impression that is somehow a bad thing. Secondly, I wonder if it has ever occurred to some folks here that the AE is the only thing keeping some people around. True, I have no evidence of it, I am speaking only for myself. But if the AE was over nerfed, I would likely be looking to moving on before continuing to play, especially if the only other content that can advance me is either A) I have zero desire to do. Or B) involves me having to team with people I would sooner not interact with at all. If a random person is the "gogogogo" sort, or the sort to bring up hot topics of discussion, or to try to lecture me on unwanted advice, then I want very little to do with that person. And I shouldn't be "forced" to play with them, in order to get Emp merits, Veteran Exp, Incarnate Materials, and so on. Which, if the AE exp/drops/money were removed, I would have to do. Now, I am fine with the Dev's "rebalancing" rewards. If they are over or under tuned, then tone them down. This includes even perhaps increasing weekly rewards or ITF rewards and so on. But not "removed entirely," because removing entirely completely removes a tool that many people use. And as time goes on I feel the urge to team with random people less and less, and no amount of "carrot on a stick" is going to change that, and no amount of "stick" is going to either. An additional thought - the community is small enough as it is, and I suspect its only growing smaller. Now, is trying to force changes in rewards and play going to change that, or only make it worse? And perhaps, just perhaps mind you, how some people act or treat others in game might have far more effect on why they have difficulty finding teams, rather than the assumption that everybody is farming and needs to be stopped immediately so they will come join your Raids and Incarnate teams. Because I assure you, if forced to that choice - either play with random people I might not want to doing a task I have zero interest in doing, or play a different game entirely, well, that choice is a rather simple one to me and I am sure it would be for many others, making an already small community, even smaller. Now "you" might not care about that, but I think we can all safely assume that homecoming does. Players need more options, not less. You want people out of the AE? The answer isn't to nerf AE into the ground. It's to make other activities more attractive. Which includes solo activities. Many people like to play the game alone. Shocking news, I know. And outside of Veteran EXP for their EMP merits and threads, what is a solo player to do if they don't want to put up with random teaming?

Warning: possible unpopular opinion. My favorite content? The AE. Why? Several reasons. 1. I can go at my own pace. I have to AFK often due to real life things going on, so I can pause my farm, go do what I need to do, and come back and push on. I am also deaf IRL, which makes doing some activities difficult at times, particularly on ITFs where nothing is explained, I am never given time to read anything, and its always "gogogofasterfasterfasterhurryhurryhurry" from the random people you team with. 2. I am not "artificially encouraged" to group with people I just soon avoid interaction with, including but not limited to - people who bring up hot topics, such as religion or politics. The "gogogogofasterfasterfaster" players, the "git gud scrub" players, or the "zomg you took THAT power?" sorts of players. 3. I am rewarded for my invested time doing an activity that I enjoy, instead of getting a lesser reward for doing something I enjoy, OR a greater reward for something I DONT enjoy. But apparently that is going to change, at least according to some polls/claims here on the forums. 4. I can multibox on my own without unduly interfering in the play of others. 5. I control the context of the mission - the damage, their levels, what they are, the map, so on. All of which is very lovely when multiboxing. 6. I can use the AE as a tool to teach others about complex builds or classes, such as Masterminds. 7. I don't have to put up with the antics or trolling behavior from random people in order to advance my character. As an example, I was running DFB yesterday trying to get the badges. Well, 3 runs and we had one random person purposefully sabotaging it. They got booted, then they swapped characters, and did it again. And, apparently, Post 50 veteran exp/rewards are going to get nerfed in AE's. How simply wonderful. So much for "play your way." I might be willing to accept a exp penalty or something, but to be removed entirely more or less feels like a big middle finger. And personally I hope it backfires, but that's just me. Honestly it's reaching the point where more players might just move onto something else rather than be brow-beaten into activities in a game they don't particularly enjoy. AE has already been nerfed before. And they want to nerf it again? I half expect them to just remove it entirely at this point. But that won't "make" people do missions or other things. I expect people will just run PI missions. Personally I will likely do the same, the only difference is I won't be so keen on helping others or allowing random people to join my team. Especially if I have to now do that just to get my incarnate or veteran rewards. So in effect, that might make "less teaming" rather than more. Food for thought.

@Troo @Infinitum Thought of a question regarding your Energy Melee/Energy Armor Stalkers, Why is Energy Armor and not Bio Armor higher ST damage? With the offensive stance and all, and I don't see any Damage Buffs from Energy Aura? Just wondering!

Hello forums, I would like some feedback on a build I cobbled together. It manages to have pretty good defenses, debuffs, END management, and Perma PA. Without Agility Core, I need a Recharge Reduction in PA, but with Agility Core I can put in a Damage/ACC Hami. I also managed to fit in Arcane Bolt and Fireball, so have some pew-pew options as well. My biggest concern is the gaping hole in toxic resistance, but other than that I think it looks pretty good. Is there anything I am missing or better way to slot this with the powers I picked? I would have loved to try and fit Enflame in to perhaps help the PA with AoE damage (it's fantastic on MM's) but sadly there was simply no room for it, at least in this setup. Thanks bunches in advance! This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.1.2.5 https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn Click this DataLink to open the build! Level 50 Magic Controller Primary Power Set: Illusion Control Secondary Power Set: Darkness Affinity Power Pool: Sorcery Power Pool: Speed Power Pool: Leadership Ancillary Pool: Fire Mastery Hero Profile: Level 1: Spectral Wounds -- Apc-Dmg(A), Apc-Dmg/Rchg(3), Apc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Apc-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Apc-Dam%(5) Level 1: Twilight Grasp -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(17), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(23), Prv-Heal/Rchg(27), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(34), Prv-Absorb%(34) Level 2: Deceive -- CrcPrs-Conf(A), CrcPrs-Conf/Rchg(33), CrcPrs-Acc/Conf/Rchg(36), CrcPrs-Acc/Rchg(36), CrcPrs-Conf/EndRdx(37), CrcPrs-Conf%(37) Level 4: Tar Patch -- PcnoftheT-Acc/Slow(A) Level 6: Arcane Bolt -- Dcm-Acc/Dmg(A), Dcm-Dmg/EndRdx(7), Dcm-Dmg/Rchg(7), Dcm-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(9), Dcm-Build%(9), FrcFdb-Rechg%(11) Level 8: Darkest Night -- DarWtcDsp-ToHitDeb(A), DarWtcDsp-ToHitDeb/Rchg(13), DarWtcDsp-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(15), DarWtcDsp-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(17) Level 10: Mystic Flight -- BlsoftheZ-ResKB(A) Level 12: Blind -- SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), SprWiloft-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg(31), SprWiloft-EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(31), SprWiloft-Rchg/Dmg%(42) Level 14: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(15) Level 16: Shadow Fall -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(25) Level 18: Phantom Army -- SlbAll-Build%(A), ExpRnf-Acc/Rchg(19), ExpRnf-Acc/Dmg(19), ExpRnf-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), ExpRnf-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(21), RechRdx-I(23) Level 20: Fade -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(37), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(48), RechRdx-I(48) Level 22: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(48), EndRdx-I(49) Level 24: Howling Twilight -- AbsAmz-Stun(A), AbsAmz-Stun/Rchg(25), AbsAmz-Acc/Stun/Rchg(27), AbsAmz-EndRdx/Stun(34), AbsAmz-Acc/Rchg(36) Level 26: Spectral Terror -- GlmoftheA-Acc/Rchg(A), GlmoftheA-EndRdx/Fear(46), GlmoftheA-Acc/EndRdx(46), GlmoftheA-Fear/Rng(47), GlmoftheA-Acc/Fear/Rchg(47) Level 28: Soul Absorption -- SynSck-EndMod(A), SynSck-EndMod/Rech(29), SynSck-EndMod/+RunSpeed(29), SynSck-Dam/Rech/Acc(33), SynSck-Dam/Acc/End(33) Level 30: Group Invisibility -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A) Level 32: Phantasm -- CaltoArm-Acc/Rchg(A), CaltoArm-Acc/Dmg(42), CaltoArm-Dmg/EndRdx(43), CaltoArm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), ExpStr-Dam%(43), SuddAcc--KB/+KD(45) Level 35: Fire Ball -- Rgn-Dmg(A), Rgn-Dmg/Rchg(40), Rgn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40), Rgn-Acc/Rchg(40), Rgn-Knock%(42) Level 38: Dark Servant -- CldSns-ToHitDeb(A), CldSns-Acc/ToHitDeb(39), CldSns-Acc/Rchg(39), CldSns-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(39) Level 41: Rune of Protection -- GldArm-3defTpProc(A), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(45), UnbGrd-Max HP%(45), UnbGrd-ResDam(46) Level 44: Fire Shield -- EndRdx-I(A) Level 47: Tactics -- GssSynFr--ToHit/EndRdx(A) Level 49: Vengeance -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A) Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A) Level 1: Containment Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A) Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A) Level 1: Swift -- Empty(A) Level 1: Health -- NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(13) Level 1: Hurdle -- Empty(A) Level 1: Stamina -- PrfShf-EndMod(A), PrfShf-End%(11) Level 6: Arcane Power ------------ No Rune - With Rune -

@Voltak - Impressive, thanks for the videos! Seen a lot of suggestions and ideas. I think I am going to try an Illusion/Dark/Fire controller. I don't know if she will be capable of everything posted in this forum, but after talking with friends and on discord I hope it's what I am going for. Something that is good for both solo and team play, who doesn't rely on inspirations/outside buffs to perform, and who can fight AV/GMs if I want to. I might get around to trying the other ideas here, but at the end it was that I have never played a controller past level 10 or so before, certainly never had one fully kitted or slotted out. And Illusion looks really fun. I just hope the /Dark is strong enough on controllers to do what I want to do, but going from here and talks elsewhere it seems it will be. I hope to take Fire Mastery so I can get Fireball for some AoE, and Fire Shield for some S/L resistance. I don't have a build yet, plan on tinkering in mids when I get home. (Posting from work this exact moment.)

Thanks bunches. I have only dabbled with Darkness, as I usually like Buffs instead of Debuffs in games, but all the big brains say if you want to push content in CoH, them Debuffs are King. I think I will go Illusion/Darkness/Fire, it just seems to have an overall balance of healing, buffs, debuffs, CC, even END tool which will be nice. And I hope it will be decent enough at groups of trash as well as soloing the big things.

Hi forums, Have been reading up on controllers, and tinkered with a few. So far controllers seem like an AT that take a lot of planning but could be rewarding. But I have a question - Why is Time Manipulation not considered a good AV/GM killer? I mean it has -DEF, -Res, some -Regen, and even a heal. Why is it not considered a contender? Are their effects too weak or too short in duration, or something else? Right now I am debating on either Illusion/Dark or Illusion/Storm. I agree with all the things said about /Rad, but I have a /Rad mastermind and didn't like it, the toggles were too small for my liking.

So far I see these suggested, with what I think are pros/cons, many of these are new to me so it's all guesswork, feel free to correct me if I have things wrong - Illusion controllers - Pros - Strong endgame, good at Single Targets of all kinds. Cons - Slow/difficult to level, especially solo(?), Unsure how good they are at other content besides big target soloing /Rad and /Dark Corruptors - Pro's - Strong Debuffs, good all around damage(?) Cons - Uncertain how good they are at other content besides soloing AV's/GMs, not sure how durable/tough they are Energy Melee/Energy Aura Stalker - Pro - Super strong ST damage, sneaky Cons - Uncertain how good they are at other content, or how good/bad their AoE damage is. I think this would rely on out dpsing the AV/GM's regen, more than debuffing(?) Poison/Fire Defender - Pros - higher debuff caps(?) Cons - lower damage than Corruptor(?)

Thank you everyone. I am curious as to why Rad Emissions stands out, as I can see it has -def, damage, and regen, but I am guessing its the -regen that is the biggie? And I was actually thinking about energy melee, but would have thought scrapper would have been the go-to. I never played a stalker, so that might be fun! In that case I assume its just a case of out damaging an AV's/GM's regen and so on?

Hello Forums, I have found myself playing alone more and more recently, as not as many teams or friends can be found, so I want to have a character who will be a strict soloist. Not only on missions, but I would like to also hunt GMs/AVs, perhaps even solo some TFs and so on. I am actually not entirely sure what is or is not possible to solo, both mechanically as well as realistically. Sadly I find myself more and more playing alone these days, with friends on less and less. So I thought I might make a character specifically built for it. So which AT/Build could truly solo from the very beginning all the way to level 50 +4/8 content? Solo AVs? GMs? Maybe even TF's? (I am not even sure what difficulty people mean when I hear them say they solo those things.) So I intend to start a new AT, and "enjoy the journey" from 1-50 as a strict soloist, never teaming once, and never using mailed/shared merits/money/drops. (I guess it could be an "Iron Man" self challenge I guess?) I don't even intend on using the EXP buff. Am open to any AT really, I just found myself musing about it and thought I would ask those that have actually done those things. So what are peoples thoughts? A Tanker? A Scrapper? Mastermind maybe? I am not even sure who the top solo builds/ATs are at the moment. I am not even sure if one AT can even solo "all" of those things, or if they have to be tailor-made to do it, or if there is a "King Soloist" currently? Thanks bunches in advance!

I had a Demon/Rad, she performed well. Not fantastic, but not terrible either. My main complaint is the toggles that she and her pets more or less depended upon was teensy. Not like, Tarpit sized, more like Bonfire sized. So you had to clump very tightly together to make sure everything was debuffed. But it was a nice change of pace, to me it felt like a bit of a cross between /Dark and /Nature. I wouldn't call it bad by any means, but there are things that are better certainly. But if you want to mix it up a bit for something with a different feel, it's good enough IMO.

Well, another change to the change. I couldn't quite put my finger on it but the values were still off, then I figured it out. You had all your passives clicked on - The big ones that cause errors in displays are Muscled and Support. Muscled adds to the defense, giving a false positive. Support adds as normal, but you had it enabled. So your values were much higher than the display otherwise indicated. Support adds 15% defense and Muscled (falsely) adds about 3%. But the GOOD news, is that MIDs doesn't account for your T2 protector bot buffs either, which as I have it slotted, is 8.7%. So with that in mind, here are your values without Support or Muscled enabled and not taking Prot Bot buff into account - So add the 8.7%, and you will have roughly 38% Melee DEF and 34.88%, Ranged DEF, respectfully. Your initial values without Support/Muscled enabled, again not accounting for Protector Bot buff - So your "real" current DEF values are - Melee - 24.68%, Ranged - 39.68. In short, with my build you lose roughly 4% Ranged DEF, but Gain 14% Melee DEF, and 20-40% Resistance, depending on which in question, which I would still consider an overall net positive gain. Anyway, sorry for the confusion but I was matching your build against my own and I couldn't figure out how you had 20% more DEF across the board. I generally don't enable Incarnates in MIDs for this very reason as it causes things to go wonky. Sorry for the mix up! I just realized what was going on and didn't want you to go "what the heck?!?" ingame.