Ukase

Just my opinion, but I'd love to trade incarnate components between characters. As for trading between accounts - here's why that may not be such a good thing, although the downside is limited. Forming up for a RHW, 50+3 required. So, the newer 50 acquires by trade the loot required to satisfy the criteria. But, in practice, we learn they don't really know how to use them. They don't realize that Hybrid is a toggle that turns off after 2 minutes, and needs to be re-toggled when it recharges. They aren't aware of the range of their destiny power, and half the folks miss out on the buff. Small things like these issues are why I'd be against it. Not strongly opposed, but cautiously considering.

Holy smokes, reading through this thread...it makes me think of political crap like Jordan B. Peterson being interviewed by very liberal reporters! And in some ways, I feel like I'm just as guilty, for not really seeing each side from the start. I want to think I've come around, with some of the insights shared by some of you. I mean, I can understand the reasons for the change, even if I don't think the change will impact things the way the devs want. But some of you are just outright militant, for and against! It kind of makes me disgusted - and that's saying something, because I can be damned obtuse and more than just a bit of a jerk in my own right. In this thread, we've literally had people telling other people to quit this game and go play other games instead. That is not the community our HC devs are trying to foster. I can disagree with some of you and still appreciate that you have a right to your perspectives. But I cannot condone someone telling other people to quit this game because this game is an "MMORPG". It ain't. It never was. If it weren't for global chat channels, badges and arch-villains, I probably would have never teamed. Thanks to badging, I've met some interesting people. Met a few asshats, too, like any population, there's all kinds. Some of you ain't that bad. Some of you deserve a kick in the keester. But that's just my opinion. This notion that people are seeing this game as it was meant to be, designed to be is interesting. But, just because the game may have been designed to be, meant to be played in a certain fashion, that should in no way dictate how any of us choose to play right now. In fact, nobody should dictate how anyone plays. There is no wrong way to play this game, provided it doesn't violate the Code of Conduct. You want to farm, farm. You want to team, team. But farmers shouldn't be giving folks who like to team up any sass, nor should the folks who like to team give any lip to the farmers. And fun fact, a fair number of us do both! In fact, I'd say a lot of us!

Why does it have to be one or the other? I used to call this "City of Options". I would like to continue to do so.

Who in the blue F*** do you think you are, talking to someone that way? Shame on you! You've basically stated that anyone who solos should just quit the game. Screw you and the holier-than-thou boat you came in on! I just can't believe you would state that for all to see. That's seriously disgusting! Consider the taste slapped out the mouth of your avatar! See, I was going to leave, but just for that, I'm staying!

You didn't see it because I foolishly left it out. So, again, thanks, and good call on your part.

There's no debate, really. If you're even half-inclined to figure things out, you can make a billion inf in day. Maybe not every day, but in a day. Or, you can get all the IO sets you need for your build with no influence of your own, just making good use of the drops you get.

Please know I don't like the removal of emps to reward merits. But, they won't be worthless, as you'll be able to transfer them to your alts. Now, if you're like Veracorp, who seems to predominantly only play one character...not sure what to tell you. Perhaps the HC devs can chime in about that.

Hey, you know what - I appreciate your taking the time to contribute to the discussion. A lot of what you said, I already knew - certainly about the time to form up. As far as frequency, I suppose it just seems like you guys are going all day every day, but I'm sure as you say, it's not the case. And your numbers about playing while afk-farming are consistent with my anecdotal experience, if my memory is serving me properly. Given the proposed changes and what I feel like are the devs telling me they don't want me to afk farm, (and well, I have more than I'll likely ever spend unless a dev steals my emails or the game has a nasty hiccup and they disappear. and even if that happens, I can market my way back to solvency easily enough. ) Funny how the grass always looks greener on the other side of the fence.

Very true, very true.

Oh my. Funny how fun to some folks sounds like masochism to others, lol. I can actually see forgoing the heal on a rad defender, as it's a fairly small heal, like 15%, with noticeable end usage when fighting (before you've hit 50 and are all decked out). And there are some good set bonuses for regen, too, so it may not be as bad as I think, once you get to level 22 or so.

I've looked at a number of builds where the poster will think their build is top notch, only to realize the endurance recovery is too low to be of any real utility unless they're using the recovery serum from p2w, and/or ageless, or relying on team buffs. I finally found a way to realize the shortcomings of these builds before actually building them - noting the "misc. effects", where Recovery is contrasted with End drain. I aim for 2.00/s more recovery than end drain. This build isn't quite there, as we can see. But, +2 let's me fight with sprint and Superspeed on. So, in missions, I can turn off SS or sprint and be okay. Call me crazy, but I hate turning off toggles. Even sprint or SS. I will, if I have to, but I'd rather just keep them on. My tanks, I'll turn it off to keep the threat level higher, but the rest...I aim to keep them on. Just one less thing I have to be concerned with if I make the build properly. So, I keep tinkering until I can keep the defense numbers high and improve the end recovery.

Huh? Mender Remiel - complete his arc and unlock your Alpha slot. Granted, it doesn't confirm your +1, it's an option used to buy-in to begin the incarnate journey. The story arcs in Dark Astoria, and/or the iTrials (or farming your way with vet levels) - do result in awards that are of real benefit. Alpha, Judgement, Interface, Lore, Destiny, Hybrid - are all "awards" and all have value. Some are more situational and useful than others. And opinions will vary about their utility. I don't see how what's available now isn't what you state you're waiting for.

Not sure if serious...

So...a thought occurred to me. They often do when my mind is left unsupervised. Anyway, I'm on one of my project characters where I try to subsist off what the rng blesses me with. I'm going without 2xp because, well, I'm gonna need the influence, since borrowing from my alts would make things too easy. And, well, that'd be spending influence when I'd rather accumulate it. So, I'm level 26, and I got the Celebrity badge. When I use p2w for 2xp, I would earn this at 50. So, now that I realize I've gotten this at 26, I am thinking, surely I've gotten this earlier than 26 before. But I don't really pay attention to stuff like this. But what if I did? Celebrity (or Bling, or Who's Who) is awarded when you earn 500k influence. Any level 50 would tell you that's chump change. From marketing some drops, I made that much at level 10. But, what if I set out to see how soon I could get it? The lower the level, the lower the inf earned per npc defeat. Getting defeated past level 10 slows the leveling process a tiny bit. But, without turning off XP, how early could you get it? Or, rather, how early can I get it? If I use my marketing savvy to acquire the usual trinity of PvP IOs for my build, the kismet accuracy, the steadfast 3%, the kb protection if on a character that needs it, I can probably accept challenges that are more difficult a little sooner, and possibly get it sooner. So, that's going to be a challenge for my next character or two. To see how soon I can get it. Other challenges: drop challenge - no AH, no teaming, only slot what you can get from drops, but you are allowed to convert drops..you just can't buy converters (but you can use them from merit vendors) Delete upon defeat. (It's tough because end mod enhancement and recipes rarely drop!) Iron Man (I think) - SO enhancements only, delete upon defeat. I suppose one could try playing the entire game without enhancements, but that just seems really, really crazy. Any other odd-ball challenges you guys like to try?

Don't confuse people with logic.

Great minds thinking alike!

So, thanks for the replies. I can only assume I'm missing more, so am attacking more. Regarding slotting stamina with 3 slots....um...almost never. Certainly not at level 12. And I'll tell you why - this level 12, low endurance situation is temporary. Once I get the miracle +Recovery slotted and Atlas Medallion (around level 20), there's really never an endurance issue again. I'm one who is inclined to use SOs because of the higher % boost than set IOs before level 30, but I'll use the pvp IOs, Kismet Accuracy, Steadfast 3% in most every build and have them in asap. The return on 3 slotting stamina is probably worth if you're using SOs, but using IOs, with all the endurance recovery, and endurance discounts, and the passive accolades...3 slotting would be more end than I'd likely ever need.

For me, without exception, the worst sound in this game is that stupid yell from the Legionarii (I think that's who's screaming) in the ITF. It is a big part of the reason I try to avoid doing that ITF unless I have a very clear reason to run it. I liken it to fingernails on a chalkboard.

To answer the first question...it depends on how you define "better for the game economy". First, we must choose if we want a lot of goods available for purchase. It usually stands to reason, the more good there are, the cheaper they will be, as a bountiful supply generally satiates demand, with goods left over, making those goods more affordable for the other players. Do cheaper goods suggest a "better" game economy? I'm pretty sure most folks who buy those goods would say yes. At least, it's good for them. For the sellers..maybe it's better if the goods are higher priced. As a rule of thumb, I will vendor the common (referred to by many folks as "white") salvage. The uncommon (yellow) I almost always sell on the AH due to the shenanigans that tend to occur in the niche. So, I can usually make more than I would from the vendor. It's not really enough to be worth the time to put it in the AH, but it will at least be cheaper than it would be otherwise. I know the devs have seeded uncommon salvage at 100k, but I don't think it should ever be more than 2k, which is why I sell it for less than 2k. If I get more, great. If I get less, that's okay too. I will vendor all common IO recipes. It makes almost no sense to ever craft them unless there's a badge to be had, as they sell for less than the crafting cost in most cases. I will also vendor all the SOs, unless it's a special challenge character. But typically, SOs after level 30-35 are just trash, and I have IOs in place before then, so they're trash to me. Vendor 'em, get 'em out of the way.

I earned my influence. I am supposed to be able to influence things, that's why it's called influence. Don't you realize that's why they scrapped the initial change out of AE and downgraded to the lesser no emp to reward merit exchange? I used my influence. It was a lot of influence! I had to panic farm for about 5 days to make enough! And, no, none of that is true, but what if it was?

I'm not sure I understand you. Incarnate powers may fix problems a character has had, but those are problems the player has allowed to continue to exist. This is not a problem that existed since level 1 because of a design flaw in the game, it's a design flaw of your build. Players should try to learn, to recognize how their character plays, and to choose powers and slots that will help the character for the next levels. As an example: DPS seems to be something most characters strive for, whether it be in pursuit of set bonuses, damage procs, global recharge, and slotting recharge within the power itself, taking hasten and other options. But they do this at the expense of slotting end mods and/or end reduction enhancements. It's a lot like chess, when you move a piece to try to gain control of the center of the board, you lose control over another portion of the board. Or, if you like - Rock, Paper, scissors. When you choose Rock, watch out for the paper. IOs can cover up a lot of holes in a build if you plan them properly. Most who PL to 50 or a certain point beyond 12 don't really notice this, but at level 8-10, a character can run sprint and even Super speed while fighting and really have no end issues, despite only having maybe a single end mod enhancement, or maybe even nothing in it. But around that time, brutes and tanks get a second armor, and begin to full the end recovery struggle. Some folks get hasten in that level range, and make the problem worse. More recharge means more attacks. Each attack uses endurance. If the end use of your attacks and toggles outpace your end recovery, again, that's not a game design flaw. It's a build design flaw. The invention system has a lot of IOs to assist with endurance issues. Similar things can be said about defense or resistance. Blasters get beat down fairly often because they think it's all about dps. And it is - but there's a balance between chaos and order, and each player should try to find their own balance between the two. (Chaos is dps, order is defense & resistance)

Fair point. AA had an interesting method in determining this. Since America's Angel's numbers were based on optimal play, it makes sense to look at optimal play from those who run tfs and such. I know for a fact that a fairly decent speed run time for apex and tin mage are 10 minutes each. So, just taking the 80 merits, and making the exchange to converters, you can extrapolate from there on what the take home is. (as I did in a previous post) Some choose to add the conversion time into the equation, and fair enough. The numbers (as expected) show the speeders will outearn an afk farmer. And they might out-earn 2 afk-farmers. I think it pulls even with 3. I'd have to scroll up and look at the numbers. The active farmer, I dunno. I see Angel America's numbers, and consider them to be an outlier, but it's fair to say 10 minutes for apex and 10 for tin mage are also outliers, so may as well try to compare apples to apples, figuratively speaking. The active farmer will out earn the speeder. I am of the opinion that all of this is irrelevant. HC devs are gonna do what they're gonna do. Not to say they won't see if we have a point, but I think they've been planning the change for some time based on information they have. For now, they're going with doing away with the emp to reward merit conversion, presumably because of these potential violators of exchanging cash for inf, as has been discussed previously. Or, it could be that, and not wanting someone like me to get free converters with emp merits. And while I'd rather be able to do that, they have their reasons, and it's free to play...so how pissed off should I really be? Not very. My biggest disappointment is in the player that frowns upon people who farm. I mean, really? Seriously? I fully understand how a new player, getting farmed up with little or no knowledge of the game can screw up a team mission or TF. I certainly understand that frustration and annoyance. But it's like punishing everyone for the actions of a few. (or even several or many) Most of us have got anywhere from 20 to 200 level 50's all decked out and t-4'd. We get tired of some of the lower level content (me, it's kind of the opposite. I'm super tired of Tina McIntyre and Maria Jenkins. I've been trying to get those accolades at level 30 or earlier so I can just go to red side and re-experience some of those arcs because I'm not nearly as bored with those yet. Now, when I say "punish", I'm referring to the players who look down on farming, not the HC devs. These snobs are just plain mean, some of them. And some want us to just leave the game so they don't have to hear us chiming in lfg. It's almost as if they're miserable, and won't feel better until they make everyone else miserable. Gee, thanks. Just what we all needed. Just two days ago, I had to verbally expose an idiot in lfg chat who literally told the lowbie looking for a spot in AE farm "Stay out of lfg. Go to AE and chat in local. This is for people looking to team up." It was just the height of condescension. If I'd been in front of that person, I would like to think I would have just slapped the taste out of their mouth for being such a tool. That's really just me posturing behind a keyboard, lol. I'm old enough to know better than to slap someone for saying something stupid. But I sure felt like it!

On that, I think we can all agree, it's interesting. So, to sum up, I think this is where we're at: The proposed changes will likely go through. The scalability of afk-farming gives it an edge over pretty much anything - but, since there's only an initial barrier to entry, which every player has gone through, there's really not a true advantage for anyone. But, if the idea of it simply irks, or disgusts, or annoys , or whichever description one chooses, it puts them in a place where they feel like in order to keep up, they have to do something they don't really want to. It seems to me that the HC devs are listening to that, and would rather the farmers instead do things they would prefer not to do. At least, that's how it seems to me, based on reading the anti-farmer part of the debate in this thread. I believe afk-farmers and farmers alike will adapt, most likely within AE. If I/we/they make a little less per minute, it won't be the end of the world. And the addition of reward merits to the various iTrials will certainly boost the speed runner beyond what most afk farmers who only run 1-2 farmers will take in. At least, that's what I think. Only time will really tell. I have learned a bit about some of you in this thread. I have learned that some of you are decent folk, even if I disagree with your position. I have also learned that some of you are ...well, stubborn and don't seem to want to look at other perspectives except through your own doom-colored lenses. I honestly don't even know why I'm still typing, lol. I have a level 22 ice/fire brute that I'm leveling up, without any 2xp buffs, and building off of drops, and using converters to fund the way through. (although I did have an alt help me with invader, cuz I'm not about to run 5 radios and a bank mission 8 different times. I want merits to keep funding my way through, while my billions sit idle and basically removed from the economy - until such time the HC devs slap in a tasty inf sink for me. Or allow us to give away temp powers like work benches and such.

They can scroll up and read your quick thoughts. I agree with everything you stated could happen. It might take a little longer, but it would likely happen to some degree. Just my opinion, and they'll vary. But you did a good job expressing it.

ToS violations are probably what's gotten the devs attention on this whole farming thing. So, certainly any discussion of how such things are done are best left in the shadows. Seed22 just quoted that you, AA, and there's a rad/fire build you shared. It's commonly known that rad/fire, due to irradiated ground has a tiny edge over spines/fire. My data was presented with spines/fire, and I believe CoyoteDancer and others were not even using brutes. While your numbers are useful, and valid, they cannot be presumed to be the only numbers to consider, but as I stated earlier, just one set to consider in the data.