Solarverse

You think most agree with you? Really? Also, anyone who plays like you ignoring me is a huge plus. Spread the word! My play style does not offend anyone...like at all. Yours on the other hand...

You go right on ahead and keep doing you, boyyyyy! You'll have the whole server ignoring you in no time!!!

You seem to take such pride in what you did to them. You even admitted that you knew that you were being disruptive to their goals in the co-op zone. I guess congrats? When I read their story, I tried putting myself in both yours and his shoes. To you, you did nothing wrong. You took advantage of their work and got you a few kills. You probably figured taking a few kills here and there wouldn't hurt anything, but as you can see, it set forth a domino effect that did indeed hurt people. You were the root cause of this and you played the rules of the game to your advantage. And instead of placing these people on ignore, like you should have, you chose to take revenge and report them, in hopes of getting them banned...and according to your story, it worked. It would seem as though you are quite proud of that accomplishment. In their eyes, you were trolling them. They tried asking you to stop, you refused, which made them think even more that your true intent was to troll them. So naturally, the spoke before they thought, and berated you. They were wrong for doing this, and even more so for ganging up on you. However, I don't think that bothered you as much as you let on, because you used that against them and reported them, which in turn got them banned. You could have just as easily understood why they were so upset, and simply placed them on ignore and went about your day. Curious...why didn't you? I hope that I am wrong in believing that you chose to report them instead so that you could further disrupt them out of spite? As of right now, this is what I believe...which gives me a very low opinion of you. However, I am willing to accept the possibility that you had no intentions of them losing their accounts, and didn't wish any ill will against them... My conclusion, you started that mess, you set forth the momentum by interfering with their group effort, and you could have handled that way differently. They should have known better, because there are always vindictive people in online games. They should have known better than to even take it past requesting that you stop. Once they crossed that line, they left themselves open for your terror. Both of you are at fault here, however, I feel that you started the crap with a snide grin on your face. This is where you are wrong, I don't dictate anything to anyone. I make a request of them. It is completely up to them if they wish to play nice or not. If they do not play nice, I have the option to remove them and so I do. Once again you are playing straw man with me and putting words in to my mouth, and attacking those words instead of actually engaging in a conversation with me about things that I actually did say. Once again, I am sure some are fooled by your straw man tactics. So good job. Odd, that sounds exactly like a dictatorship... This statement shows me that you clearly have no clue about how the mechanics of this game works, not to mention is completely irrelevant to the conversation.

Which was the point of this thread... Take a breath and settle down there, Bevis! That was a long winded multi topic sentence. The only person engaging GM's is the disgruntled and vengeful player who was kicked. Also, that was not a direct comparison. In no way did I insinuate that playing badly was on the same level as a murderer. Nice straw man though. I'm sure some readers will be fooled by it. You can be snide all you like, it changes nothing. If I build the team, I reserve the right to remove you from the team if you are being disruptive. Like it or not, make fun of it if you like, it changes nothing. I agree. This forum has had me flabbergasted and laughing the whole way. Very amusing the way people can justify their disruptive antics. One thing I have learned, people will justify anything...anything at all, even when they know that everyone else knows that they are wrong. Absolutely comical!

Good to know. Now we can both play the game and have fun without ever risking a situation where the immovable object meets the unstoppable object. Again, no hard feelings and none taken. 🙂

Tell that to the rules guy up there...

You do realize talking about GM actions against players are against the rules, right? Especially when it concerns a ban made by a GM.

All I can say is do what you do best and report me and move on. For somebody who is so drilling about rules, I would think playing on a team that requires you to be team friendly would be a very easy rule to follow.

If this is how somebody feels, then they are free to start their own teams. However, it would seem a good majority of players are more than happy to sit around and wait for somebody else to do all the work of forming a team...so they sit...and wait...and wait, until I or somebody else puts one together. So yes, if I form the team, I fully expect each and every player on my team to be team friendly. If they are not team friendly, they can go play somewhere else. It's really that simple. While you may be of the opinion that players like myself are "mean people," I am of the opinion that player who refuse to change their playstyle to fit the team are selfish people...either that or they are just straight trolling the team to see how annoyed they can make players on that team. Key word here is 'team.' There is no 'I' in team. Just made up crap, eh? Want to know what I find as crap? Players who join a team, frustrate the team with a solo mindset and disrupt the team's strategies, all because people feel like if they join somebody else's team, they should be allow to disrupt the otherwise smooth tactics, all because of an entitlement personality. And trust me, if you or anyone like you have ever been removed from my teams for being disruptive and choosing not to play well with the group, you will only ever have the displeasure of being kicked in the middle of a mission but just once. I add a 1 star to that player's account, and if by some chance I ever invite you again, I will see that 1 star, read the notes I have on you, and remove you before the team even sees the first mission. No hard feelings, but we just don't see eye to eye on proper team etiquette, and I'll save you and myself the trouble of having to suffer an unsatisfactory experience on my teams by giving you my in game account name, @Solarverse. It would probably be best if you place me on a list so that you never have to endure the not so pleasant experience of being removed from the team. No hard feelings, just a huge gap in playstyles.

Good closing statement. I'll give you a like for that.

So wait, that is on your teams. Teams that you went through the trouble to create. Then you have every right to allow whatever you wish. However, on my teams, teams that I take the time out to create, it is up to me. If MY team has a Tank, and he is skilled at getting mobs stacked on him so that AoE's can be used to maximize their potential, and then we pick up a player who consistently knocks mobs in every which direction, causing the NPCs to be scattered in every which direction, completely going against the grain of the rest of the team, then I have every right to make a polite request for that player to aim their knock back in a way that is beneficial to the team. If said player refuses or gives me flack over it, I have every right to remove that player. I am under zero obligation to "deal with it" or adjust the whole team's playstyle. No 9bligation whatsoever. And I call straight up BS on anyone who says they can have me kicked or banned from the game over this. I seriously doubt that story ever happened. Most players in this game are scared to death of that star that Grant's them lead of a team. So if they would rather sit around and wait for me to start one, then they are subject to play nice with others, or they are gone. And no, I am absolutely not sorry...not even a little bit.

My experience is the same as yours. I don't sit around and lay down the law. I don't say anything unless I see the team struggling to get anything accomplished at a decent pace. If Knock Back is causing chaos and dragging things out, I will say something and make a request for a change. If that request is made with retaliation or is ignored, I kick that player. You make it sound much worse than it is. If you play Excelsior, then chances are you have been on one of my teams. And let me say this, every single time I have had to kick a player off a team, I have been thanked, or people have thanked God, lol. I don't go around ruthlessly telling people how to play. I don't lead with an iron fist.

I should have added, 'throughout the leveling process.' My experience of end game matches your own.

In all honesty, with me, there is no discussion at the beginning of the team. I won't be making a checklist of all the things I dislike, I would never get teams rolling if I did. The team etiquette goes way back, so much so that the knock back kings who have no care about how to use them in a team setting are far and few between. So I find it unnecessary to go through a list of rules for everyone to agree upon. However, if a player like this comes on the team, I will politely request the player use his knock back to the team's advantage, and I will detail how to do so. If that player insists to continue, or gives me flack about requesting...I simply hover my mouse over the kick function and off that player goes. No hard feelings. But yes, everything else you said is correct as far as I am personally concerned. Just didn't want it to sound like I make a check list and get signatures before I create my teams, lol.

If it is a team that I went through the trouble of creating, I define it. However, I use the same rules that most anyone else uses...it's called work with the team, not against it. Plain and simple. I'm not going to cast Black Hole on the mobs you are trying to knock back on your teams, so don't knock back mobs I am trying to keep tight on my teams. That works both ways. This is why biostem called this strawman tactics. I never said anything like that. You put words into my mouth, then you attacked the words that you put into my mouth instead of asking me questions about things that I actually did say. I'm sure you just read my post wrong, so I won't judge. I have been known to do the same thing a time or two. My issue is not with the power or the effect it has, my issue is with how the player uses this power to negatively affect the team. If it goes against the grain of what the rest of the team is doing and a player won't stop...they are removed. That doesn't mean if they join my team with a power that knocks back that I'll kick them. That would be mean.

Exactly! When a player chooses to join a team, they subscribe to team etiquette. Nobody forced them to join the team...and regardless of how people want to justify their perspective on things, (Even a serial killer can justify their murders) they are the ones who will be removed from the team if they choose to play Rambo style. No amount of arguing their points of view will ever change this. I will not suffer chaos on any teams I put together just because a loose cannon feels that their needs outweigh their team's needs. When you join a team, it is no longer about you, it is about the team as a whole. This next part is about this whole thread and things people have said throughout this thread. Running free from the team and not sticking with the team will also get you kicked. You will be asked to stick with the team, and if you continue to stray from the team to do your own thing, you will be kicked...without warning. I do not threaten to kick anyone, I simply kick them after it becomes clear that they are not a team player. If the team is steamrolling too fast for you to pull off your Drain Psyche, then perhaps that team is running things on too low of a level. Simply put, regardless of how you may feel about it, you are either a team player, or you are not a team player. People who are not team players by the standards of what the team is playing by, will simply be removed. I guess these people are accustomed to being kicked from teams, if this thread is any indication to past experience. Final thought of the day: Play how you like solo, play how you like when YOU create the team...however, if you join somebody else's team, be prepared to get removed if the way you play, causes grief to the players of the team you chose to join. Nobody forced you to join a team. That was your choice. If somebody wants to attempt to get me banned just for asking you to play nice with others, then I kick you when you don't...all I can say is, good luck with that. You may find yourself disappointed when next you get on my team as I am playing an alt, and find yourself kicked yet again. Stamp your feet, justify your play style, it won't make any difference to me, I'll still kick you. Sorry, but not Sorry.

The team, not just for me. So in that case I just don't feel bad about it, at all. Whatever we want to call what I am saying to them to me is just as irrelevant. You either work well with others or you do not. If you do not, then you are gone. Pretty cut and dry. (And when I say you, I do not mean you specifically.)

Can you give me an example? Because it sounds like you are saying that by my simply asking somebody to not scatter mobs with their knock back, and requesting they use knock back to put mobs in to a corner instead, would be something you would report and get me banned for. I'm sure this is not what you meant, but it kind of sounds that way. Can you give me an example of the type of thing you got people banned for?

But it is educating. I am not berating them, I am simply asking them to play as a team and not as a RAMBO, and then giving them examples of how to do so. The whole idea that one must dance around semantics out of fear of offending somebody is just not going to happen. They can either play as a team, or they can be dismissed from the team. If I am the one who goes through the trouble to put that team together, then I will for sure have no issues removing a player for trolling the rest of the team by ignoring team etiquette. People can defend whatever they want to, but in a game where most players act like the Star is the herpes, when I build the team, that makes me leader of the team. If people don't want to play nice, then they can play elsewhere or build their own team. I will not ask 6 other players to play the way a single player plays, just because that player refuses to play nice. It is far easier to kick that player, and fill his/her spot than it is to watch 6 other players quit because they are annoyed with a single player and then have to fill six spots on the team. As this title says, Sorry, but not Sorry. /kick If a player wants to play selfishly, then they can play the way *they* want to by themselves or on somebody else's team, it will not be mine.

In Jub's defense, he/she did say that they voluntarily leave if they see the team is growing annoyed with his/her play style. He/she is not here to annoy anyone it would seem.

You are the Darth Vader of video games! In all seriousness, I have no complaints if that's what you do. Not a villain as far as I am concerned.

So you don't care if you are completely making things extremely difficult for the rest of the team, just because this is how you wish to play? So you believe that when you join somebody else's team, that they should rearrange how they play to fit your play style? You feel that teams should just deal with how you want to play and revolve around your play style and if they don't, they somehow lack empathy? What about your empathy for the team that you joined? I am really having a hard time seeing things in a justified way through your eyes...even after putting myself in your shoes, I can see nothing but wrong on so many levels with this.

This is because people are playing everything on +0 these days throughout the leveling process. People want to steamroll, even if it means crappy xp. Players have gotten spoiled as time has went by. I remember a time when nobody ran anything under +2. Now I have to write out a paragraph to my teams explaining why I roll +1 just to keep them from complaining about it before I even start a Task Force. The game is only easy because players want it to be easy. Just wanted to add that in there to go along with what you wrote.

The ONLY issue I have with Electric Manipulation is the Endurance discount and what power it was added to. This may not bother some, but for me, it is enough that I can't play the set. I do not like stopping every so often to clap my hands randomly, just to get the Endurance Discount from it. So, here are my thoughts on how to get the Endurance Discount moved to the appropriate power without breaking the set. Remove Endurance Discount from Force of Thunder. Change the name Force of Thunder back to Thunder Clap. Add Endurance Discount to Lightning Field Swap Lightning Field with Havoc Punch The reason we swap Lightning Field with Havoc Punch, is to keep the Endurance Discount from Lightning Field in check with the other Blaster Secondaries that include the Endurance Discount toggle.

How people play is none of my concern. How they mesh with the team is. If you are playing on the team and you hit the mob with an AoE knock back, which scatters mobs all over the place, what ends up following is Trollers (accidentally) lock down the mobs while they are scattered, then the mobs are stuck in that scattered position. Meanwhile, you have the other Blasters on the team using their AoE's and it only hits one or two NPC's because the one they had targeted, has been knocked away from the rest of the mob. Meanwhile, that Tank that went through the trouble to get the mobs stacked on the Tank, is now subject to lose out on his +Defense per NPC within Melee range, and his Defensive bonus is now useless, which means the Tank now takes more damage than what he would had the mobs been stacked on him/her. The only person in that team that made good use of his/her AoE...is the player with the Knock Back with his/her initial AoE strike. If I inform that player that what that player is doing is hurting the team, and that players considers me judgemental for doing so, then I will without hesitation remove said player. That player absolutely is a bad player. That is a player who only plays for themselves, even though they willingly joined and became part of a team. When you join a team, you subscribe to playing in a team friendly way. I'm sure this is not how you play, but at some point you have to admit, this is a very good example of a bad player.