Solo-capable hoverbrute build suggestions?

[Extor Prime]

I want to have another go at creating a melee character. I tried with Rad/Bio, and found it too plodding and uninspired for my tastes.

 

What I want:

 

- "Unarmed combat" primary powerset. So no weapons of any kind and no claws. And it has to work with a flying character. I'm thinking either StJ or SS (though the rage crash of SS doesn't excite me at all).

- Solo-friendly. Doesn't necessarily have to be a super-duper AoE farmer, but must be able to take down a pylon or an AV on its own, and do decently well in AoE scenarios.

- Must be fly- and hover-friendly, so definitely no powers that only work on the ground.

What sets would fit this picture?

[Sovera]

Rad only has one power that demands being close to the ground. It can be annoying because of that, but I've leveled both a brute and a scrapper with it and it worked fine, it just requires to point my nose to the ground when using Atom Smasher.

 

I recommend a Rad/Bio. I'm leveling a Scrapper but it can easily be converted to a Brute. It doesn't need anything expensive to get started, the brute has better AoE (Electrifying Fences + Ball Lightning), the scrapper has better ST (my best time so far 1:45 pylon), both I've thrown at Comic Con during idle times and they survived fine.

 

Street Justice is slightly better ST further, but has no appreciable AoE, where Rad has a Footstomp like power + damage aura, and /Bio is pretty survivable and has a *second* damage aura.

[Extor Prime]

I have a fully IO'd Rad/Bio scrapper. No incarnates yet. He's a ground pounder though. Maybe I'll tweak the build and redo him as a flier.

 

Doesn't Irradiated Ground require you to be on/near ground though?

Edited September 29, 2019 by Extor Prime

[Frostweaver]

STJ/Ice, stj/wp if you prefer not concentrate too much on your defenses, stj/regen, stj/bio (If you love constant clicking)

And the statement "Street Justice is slightly better ST further, but has no appreciable AoE." is patently False. Spinning strike is 16 seconds recharge and does the same damage as atom smasher (vs 22 seconds). It also has sweeping cross, which is simply superior to radiation sweep. Not to mention that both can benefit dramatically from combo points.

Don't get me wrong, I love Rad melee, but irradiated ground, while an absolutely lovely proc mule, doesn't contribute appreciably to your damage by itself. STJ's AOE is considerably better than several other sets, including Rad and SS.

[Extor Prime]

I like the idea of stj/wp, do you have an example build? Any powers that are must have or should be skipped?

 

Also, how well does stj do in the air? Anything that would require me to land?

[Frostweaver]

If you'd like I could whip something up. It definitely is NOT a tanker, though. I have an STJ/wp, but he's a jumper. will take some minor changes, but I figure I can kitbash my 'vampire hover' and 'captain Incredible' builds in a few minutes. Do you prefer flight/hover/afterburner (more powers) or 'vampire/deity hover'?

It doesn't require that you turn off hover, but like all melee sets, you have to hover at ground level a lot... which means things like caltrops CAN ground you, but that's the case for all melee flyers.

Bear in mind wp doesn't cap easily... Instead it uses the 'combined defense' approach of a mixture of medium defense, medium resistance, lots of hp and lots of regen... You cannot pull off 'no hitsu' like some brutes, but I have fallen asleep in the middle of a 4/9 farm before and woke up with everything dead.
 

I take it you are looking for like... a Greatest American Hero type? And do you want it level up friendly or ouroboros friendly?

Edited September 29, 2019 by Frostweaver

[Extor Prime]

I would definitely take hover/fly/AB. And I tend to stay at level 50 and dislike exemping. As far as leveling goes, I will probably just PL him using my farmbrute alt. And yes, "greatest American hero" typage is about the size of it.

 

Thank you for being helpful. I can build my own ranged characters (having played ranged since back on live) but melee, especially the newer stuff like StJ, throws me for a loop entirely.

 

Do you think that Invulnerability would be a better secondary pick as far as getting to the caps goes?

[Frostweaver]

Okay, here's the deal-

 

The character is incredibly tough. It has partial immunity to getting slowed by stuff like green ink men, and in-combat it Hovers incredibly fast. It has fly 'at the end' mostly for the cool fly poses, but it's flight speed is more than capped even without Afterburner. (I hate anything that requres me to alter my stance if I decide to cap a sniper)

While it has capped s/l resistances, it's defense are not capped. But it has truly disgusting hp (tanker-level) and outrageous Regen (60hp/sec) without you having to click a single defensive clickie, as well as quite reasonable (50%ish) resistance to almost everything. Unlike many wp builds however, you are not stuck using greens/purple for the rare emergencies you may encounter.

It will respond EXTREMLY well on MSR's, since it has no holes that archmages or mentalists can use to kill you. It also has extremely capable energy defenses and insane end, so the really 'killer' endgame groups... arachnos, Malta, Carnies, and Dark Astoria stuff, you can practically have an emergency bathroom break while fighting them without getting hurt too badly, even at high difficulties. It has the accuracy to support high difficulties, and I kinda specifically meant it to deal with the unique survival challenges of MSR pulling, with it's multiple EB alphas and massive weird damage types. The psychic damage procs ensure that you aggro more with Taunt than the default 5 for pulling to the hole, and your defenses tend be high enough to deflect a lot of the mez overload.

It uses some nonstandard Incarnates, because it can actually benefit from them, but if you prefer to change to the good ol' standard muscle/agility and ageless it will not hurt you any... But Barrier is there for the very rare emergency like getting hit with a sonic grenade and sword attacks at the same time, or something, as well as to resurrect your team when the dominator decides that you are the same thing as a tanker and can peel 3 spawns worth of aggro off him after a raw nuke (You cannot, that's not your job).

I left your Interface empty, because the one that would work best, reactive core, comes with a visible fire damage proc...and you were trying to remain 'fisticuffs'. Although to be fair, sweeping cross still has a fire Proc, but I figured that was because you swing your fist so fast that the friction alone catches 'em on fire :)/ That's why I also used energy epic, because the others all did some clearly supernatural effect. But if you want laser beam eyes, replace physical perfection... The minor buffs from miracle won't make that much difference with your HUGE end and regen total, and 2 slotting a very rare set at +5 (damage and damage/end/rech) will make it do loads of damage. And melting someone's face with laser eyes while giggling maniacally is always fun.

You could also replace the epic with leadership, if that fits your style better. Dumping physical perfection for Maneuvers would boost your defense a couple of points, cap some, and let you put in another LOTG -recharge. tactics will help if you get smoked or against stealthed enemies like banes, as well as improving your utility against incarnate content at +4/8.

Just be careful about calling yourself 'Tighten' or 'Homelander' hehehehe.

Quick note- This is not a 'Farmer' as such, but once you hit 50 you probably won't have to double box... clearing s/l or even fire farms at +2/+3  /8 will be reasonably fast without any help, for building up Vet levels and incarnate rewards. I did one myself in about 16 hours solo using level 1 EB farms to get to 50 (about 8 hours) and then regular increasingly-difficult s/l farms as I enhanced him out to uber.


 

 

 

Villain Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.3
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Mutation Brute
Primary Power Set: Street Justice
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Heavy Blow -- Hct-Dmg:50(A), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(15), FrcFdb-Rechg%:50(42)
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance -- ImpArm-ResPsi:40(A), GldArm-3defTpProc:50(3), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(3), Heal-I:50(5), Heal-I:50(5), GldArm-ResDam:50(9)
Level 2: Sweeping Cross -- Arm-Dam%:50(A), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx:50(34), Arm-Acc/Rchg:50(34), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(34), Arm-Dmg/Rchg:50(36)
Level 4: Mind Over Body -- Ags-Psi/Status:50(A), Ags-ResDam:50(11), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx:50(11), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:50(17), Ags-ResDam/Rchg:50(19)
Level 6: Hover -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A), WntGif-ResSlow:50(7), WntGif-RunSpd/Jump/Fly/Rng/EndRdx:50(7), WntGif-RunSpd/Jump/Fly/Rng:50(9), LucoftheG-Def:50(17)
Level 8: Rib Cracker -- SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc:50(A), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(45), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx:50(46), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg:50(46), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg:50(50)
Level 10: Fast Healing -- Prv-Absorb%:50(A), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx:50(19), Prv-Heal/Rchg:50(21), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg:50(21), Prv-Heal/EndRdx:50(23), Prv-Heal:50(23)
Level 12: Indomitable Will -- Rct-ResDam%:50(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(13), LucoftheG-Def:50(13), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx:50(15)
Level 14: Kick -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge -- DarWtcDsp-Slow%:50(A), Pnc-Heal/+End:50(37), Pnc-Heal:50(37)
Level 18: Spinning Strike -- FrcFdb-Rechg%:50(A), SprBrtFur-Rech/Fury:50(36), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(46), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(48), SprBrtFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(48), SprBrtFur-Dmg/Rchg:50(48)
Level 20: Tough -- Ags-ResDam:50(A), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx:50(43), Ags-ResDam/Rchg:50(43), ImpArm-ResPsi:40(45)
Level 22: Combat Readiness -- GssSynFr--Build%:50(A), GssSynFr--ToHit/EndRdx:50(31), GssSynFr--Rchg/EndRdx:50(31), GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx:50(33), GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg:50(33), GssSynFr--ToHit:50(33)
Level 24: Quick Recovery -- PrfShf-End%:50(A), PrfShf-EndMod:50(25), PrfShf-EndMod/Rchg:50(25)
Level 26: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP:50(27), Ksm-ToHit+:30(27), LucoftheG-Def:50(29), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx:50(29)
Level 28: Heightened Senses -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx:50(31), LucoftheG-Def:50(42)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(40)
Level 32: Crushing Uppercut -- Dmg-I:50(A), SprEnt-Rchg/AbsorbProc:50(43), FrcFdb-Rechg%:50(50), SprEnt-Acc/Hold/End/Rchg:50(50)
Level 35: Superior Conditioning -- EndMod-I:50(A)
Level 38: Shin Breaker -- SprUnrFur-Rchg/+Regen/+End:50(A), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(39), SprUnrFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(39), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(39), SprUnrFur-Dmg/Rchg:50(40), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg:50(40)
Level 41: Physical Perfection -- Mrc-Rcvry+:40(A), Mrc-Heal:40(42)
Level 44: Taunt -- PrfZng-Dam%:50(A)
Level 47: Strength of Will -- ImpArm-ResPsi:40(A)
Level 49: Fly -- Flight-I:50(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Fury
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Flight-I:50(A)
Level 2: Health -- Heal-I:50(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-EndMod:50(A), PrfShf-EndMod/Rchg:50(36), PrfShf-End%:50(37)
Level 1: Combo Level 1
Level 1: Combo Level 2
Level 1: Combo Level 3
Level 50: Spiritual Core Paragon
Level 50: Barrier Radial Epiphany
Level 50: Mighty Radial Final Judgement
Level 50: Support Radial Embodiment
------------

 

 

 

 

As always, I would like to note that I have made slightly less perfect design choices in order to try and maximize your 'theme'. But nothing particularly painful. This build CAN be improved, or altered, but it was the best I could do to stay within the style and still maintain efficiency.

 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Frostweaver

[Frostweaver]

Now, I need you to build me a good water/ice blaster (grin)


I just wish that there was a way you could put in a 'super breath' cone AND laser beam eyes.

As for me, personally, I just don't much care for invulnerability. I am well aware of it's strengths, but it always feels sorta one dimensional... and since I love doing MSR's, it just feels like too much work to close up it's psi holes to make a good MSR puller.

Edited September 30, 2019 by Frostweaver

[Extor Prime]

Thank you very much. You are a good deal better at building characters than I am.

[Sovera]

10 hours ago, Frostweaver said:

STJ/Ice, stj/wp if you prefer not concentrate too much on your defenses, stj/regen, stj/bio (If you love constant clicking)

And the statement "Street Justice is slightly better ST further, but has no appreciable AoE." is patently False. Spinning strike is 16 seconds recharge and does the same damage as atom smasher (vs 22 seconds). It also has sweeping cross, which is simply superior to radiation sweep. Not to mention that both can benefit dramatically from combo points.

Don't get me wrong, I love Rad melee, but irradiated ground, while an absolutely lovely proc mule, doesn't contribute appreciably to your damage by itself. STJ's AOE is considerably better than several other sets, including Rad and SS.

 

 

I have never played an StJ (though I do love the animations) so take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

I perceived it as being pretty AoE-less though. Isn't Spinning Strike a six yard radius AoE? I don't visualize it hitting many enemies which in practical terms makes the claim of having a better AoE a bit iffy if their numbers are similar but one hits twice as many mobs.

 

Personally I would put Irradiated Ground firmly in the ground of underestimated AoEs. It's basically two patches doing hurts and spewing procs pretty much 24/7 (once we settle down to fight, if we are always on the move this does not happen), and more importantly we don't waste animation time on it, so it's ticking while we do our bit with other attacks.

 

And then Contamination effects. Not much damage, but there and in AoE. Right now I do three ST attacks while waiting for Atom Smasher and using Siphon last so the other two can use the Contamination effect before Siphon eats it.

 

 

Friendly argument, I have no vested interested on either side and haven't even played an StJ to speak with assurance that X has the better AoE.

[Frostweaver]

As someone who farms with both, I'd like to think I have a pretty good grasp of how both sets work in a real, high-stress environment.
It reliably hits all targets that are in melee with you. At least as reliably as rad.

The reason Rad edges out STJ for farming is very, very simple... and it is not contamination or irradiated ground's damage.

it is the -defense from IG, plus the fact that you can slot both fury and achilles -res debuffs.
Spines can only slot fury -res in quills, which is why it is only ever-so-slightly behind rad in clear times. about 2-3% on average

STJ doesn't have a proc aura. which places it squarely in the same category of 'almost as good as the ultimate farmers' as claws and savage.

Contaminate is nice. and can be leveraged quite a bit... but that leveraging is functionally identical to (and slightly below) STJ's combos, and slightly behind Savage's rage and Claws...well... insane spin cycle. But that is for standard content... in farming content, the rapid fire combination of Mu blast/cages and a PBAOE combined with burn are what truly matter... you just cannot justify ANY single target attacks during your spin cycle, not even to leverage contaminate or follow-up, combos, or bleeding, especially since you are almost always at your target and within a few % of your damage cap (about 500% caps your damage once you add in enhancements/inc boosts) Recharge IS god for farming... and being able to dish out your higher-damage set pbaoe's more often is what really matters. Heck, even hitting Build up or firey embrace will cost you time you could be using for dumping aoe's and you are already close to damage cap. You usually just use them for boss-clean up or an accuracy boost just before popping into a new spawn.

But in the looser world of open content, you are not as target saturated, fury buffed, and insp-bloated to damage cap. The Radius difference makes little difference when you are unlikely to catch more than 8 targets except in your VERY FIRST aoe (which almost always shreds all the minions) and the difference between a 6 and 8 foot radius makes almost zero difference. THAT is when you can start leveraging secondary damage, and rad's explosion is actually less telling than the combo effects from both stj and savage, due to it's 5 target cap, lower damage addition, and extremely limited radius, and all three outpace spines. That is also when decent and fast ST damage can actually outdamage AOE consistently.

Basically, any set that has that initial high-damage PBAOE to open a spawn has 'good' aoe in standard content. That;s why foot stomp is considered the gold standard...not because it is good (it's actually one of the lowest performers) but because rage, in open content, puts that very first opener PBAOE at the same sort of levels it would be in a farm, while it is surrounded by minions that it smashes flat instantly. After that opener, however, a decent melee cone is what 'adds' to your aoe...and realistically, cross is a MUCH better cone than rad sweep when you can leverage combos (although, to be fair, that's also when contaminate starts to shine, and why sweep is often skipped... because it has NO leveraging opportunities, and is nothing more than a slow, 5 target melee cone that can only contaminate stuff that is probably already contaminated from your initial built up pbaoe)

Dark is considered 'poor' aoe because it doesn't have that opener.  Dual Blades, Spines, and MA (and some others) are considered 'light' because their initial pbaoe is below 50... while the 'heavy' aoe sets are above 60.

What sets STJ apart though, is that not only does it benefit hugely from it's buildup clone but while combat readiness only adds 50% damage (which shows up on mids) It also gives an extra 30% damage from it's combo... and that 30% damage does NOT show up in mids. That combo bonus 30% is also NOT a damage buff, it is almost like a second attack, which means that occurs outside of the damage caps. Much like Rad's explosion, except it affects every target hit by 30% rather than just exploding off a single target for 10%.

Now, that being said, two weeks ago Rad DID dramatically outperform in open content... because two weeks ago, Proc effects were propagated across explosion damage. So if you slotted poison, chance for buildup, and chance for -recharge into your ST attacks, and were careful to use your buildup and spin to contaminate EVERY target around you, each and every single target attack had SIX chances to pop a proc.... I built my rad/fire farmer with that principle, and for a little while my clear speeds were utterly disgusting WITH single target attacks instead of mu.

But last week, the devs stated very clearly that was a bug, and removed that effect. I literally had to rebuild my farmer because it's performance took a nose dive. It still performs amazingly well in both farms and open content, (It IS still rad, after all) but to exel in each, I had to create a different build... and the 'broken uber' kinda faded. It performs nearly identically to STJ now in open content, which was, I am sure, the intention.

Edited September 30, 2019 by Frostweaver

[Rathulfr]

One tiny little caveat about hovering melee characters: if you use /follow (I have it bound to my F key) to approach your targets, your avatar will stop *just short* of melee attack range, so you may have to scoot forward a bit before your melee attacks will trigger.  Unfortunately, this is not predictably consistent: sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.  And the not knowing until the attack fails to trigger is absolutely maddening for me.

 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Rathulfr

[Sovera]

24 minutes ago, Frostweaver said:

loads of info

 

This was very informative to someone who does not play StJ. Thanks for the time taken to write it all down, Frost. Tbh Rad isn't very thematic at all for my character, it is Staff I'd like to get into, but I like the ST damage of Rad and ST is where Staff flounders a bit. A close second would be StJ though and that makes me interested in checking it up on the PTS.

 

I think the proc removal off Contaminate is not yet 100% removed though. I have noticed Blistering Cold's icey proc hitting different enemies than the one I had targeted.

Edited September 30, 2019 by Sovera

[Hopeling]

7 hours ago, Sovera said:

I perceived it as being pretty AoE-less though. Isn't Spinning Strike a six yard radius AoE?

Yes, but a 6-foot sphere is comparable to a pretty wide melee cone. It's a targeted AoE, not a PBAoE, so you can aim it where that sphere will contain the most enemies rather than just hoping they cluster around you tight enough.

 

I agree that StJ is a bit lacking in AoE, at least until you add in something like a damage aura, Burn, or Fireball. Not cripplingly bad like Dark Melee or Energy Melee, but not great.

[Oubliette_Red]

@Frostweaver You've provided a lot of good information here on StJ, I've been trying to flesh out a build with Bio, Jumping, and Leadership but I am horrible at build planning in Mids. 😕

Do you happen to have a build already available?

[Snarky]

I recently 50'd a Kinetic Melee Tank.  Tank Mage.  Can stay at about range 40 and be nearly as effective as right on the mob. Animations are....odd, so I made it a wizard.  Tank Mage.