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Storm/Rad Defender?


Clave Dark 5

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Out of a bout of randomness, I made a Storm/Radiation Defender, stepped out of the tutorial and then logged off.  Looking around now, even on the old Live forums, it appears no one in the history of forever has ever posted a potential build for such a 'fender, and it's rarely even mentioned.  Did a Storm/Rad kill someone's family?  Is it really that bad a combo?  I'm generally of the mind that just about any combo is playable, but there's obviously some reason for this.  Can someone explain why this is a shunned combo? 

 

I mean, it's not so late that I can't reroll this toon, right?

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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Both Storm/ and /Rad used to not be that great. Well, I might catch some flak for that, so let's rephrase it: some of the latest issue changes as well as HC improvements make both Storm/ and /Rad significantly better than they used to be, which might explain the silence on old Live forums.

 

On the Storm side you can stuff KB to KD procs as well as turn Tornado and LS into extreme damage powers with procs.

On the Rad side you've got fast snipes, crashless nukes and loads of options for procs in your attacks.

 

I don't see any particular reason for the combo to be shunned. Properly built, it should be a powerhouse.

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It's funny, because I was just looking up the "flavor of the month" posts and Radiation Blast was the number one choice for Defenders.  C-could it be the intelligentsia build gurus have lead me astray?  🙂

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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Just now, Clave Dark 5 said:

It's funny, because I was just looking up the "flavor of the month" posts and Radiation Blast was the number one choice for Defenders.  C-could it be the intelligentsia build gurus have lead me astray?  🙂

Anything can work and rad is nice for its AOEs. I'd still use water blast over rad blast for the heal though, but like everything else in this game now, it can be built into a god with IOs and incarnates. 

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I had a Storm/Rad back on live that I played from 2005 until shutdown. Absolutely loved the combo, but I haven't recreated it on HC. I might have a build saved somewhere, but it's probably way out of date.

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Uunderdog - Rad/Rad Scrapper | Uundertaker - Rad/Dark Corruptor | Uun - MA/Inv Scrapper | Uunison - Grav/Storm Controller | Uuncola - Ice/Temp Blaster | Uundergrowth - Plant/Martial Dominator | Uunstable - SR/Staff Tank

Uunreal - Fire/Time Corruptor | Uunrest - Dark/TA Blaster | Uunseen - Ill/Poison Controller | Uuncool - Cold/Beam Defender | Uunderground - Earth/Earth Dominator | Uunknown - Mind/Psi Dominator | Uunplugged - Stone/Elec Brute

Uunfair - Archery/TA Corruptor | Uunsung - DP/Ninja Blaster | Uunflammable - Fire/Nature Controller | Uunflappable - WM/WP Brute | Uundead - Dark/Dark Tank | Uunfit - Water/Martial Blaster  | Uunwrapped - Dark/Dark Dominator

Uunchill - Ice/Kinetics Corruptor | Uunpleasant - En/En Stalker | Uunbrella - Rad/Rad Sentinel | Uunsafari - Beasts/Traps MM | Uungnome - Nature/Seismic Defender | Uunsavory - Poson/Sonic Defender

Uunicycle - BS/Shield Scrapper | Uuntouchable - Ill/Time Controller | Uunferno - Fire/Fire Tank | Uunthinkable - Psi/SR Scrapper | Uuncivil - Thugs/Elec MM | Uunnatural - Ice/Savage Dominator | Uunshockable - Elec/Bio Sentinel

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One con for the combo is having Hurricane on and trying to use the PBAoE attack.

Top 10 Most Fun 50s.

1. Without Mercy: Claws/ea Scrapper. 2. Outsmart: Fort 3. Sneakers: Stj/ea Stalker. 4. Waterpark: Water/temp Blaster. 5. Project Next: Ice/stone Brute. 6. Mighty Matt: Rad/bio Brute. 7. Without Pause: Claws/wp Brute. 8. Emma Strange: Ill/dark. 9. Nothing But Flowers: Plant/storm Controller. 10. Obsidian Smoke: Fire/dark Corr. 

 

"Downtime is for mortals."

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1 hour ago, Without_Pause said:

One con for the combo is having Hurricane on and trying to use the PBAoE attack.

Correct, but working around it isn't that difficult as hurricane can be toggled off and back on pretty quickly. I generally don't keep hurricane up full time anyway.

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Uunderdog - Rad/Rad Scrapper | Uundertaker - Rad/Dark Corruptor | Uun - MA/Inv Scrapper | Uunison - Grav/Storm Controller | Uuncola - Ice/Temp Blaster | Uundergrowth - Plant/Martial Dominator | Uunstable - SR/Staff Tank

Uunreal - Fire/Time Corruptor | Uunrest - Dark/TA Blaster | Uunseen - Ill/Poison Controller | Uuncool - Cold/Beam Defender | Uunderground - Earth/Earth Dominator | Uunknown - Mind/Psi Dominator | Uunplugged - Stone/Elec Brute

Uunfair - Archery/TA Corruptor | Uunsung - DP/Ninja Blaster | Uunflammable - Fire/Nature Controller | Uunflappable - WM/WP Brute | Uundead - Dark/Dark Tank | Uunfit - Water/Martial Blaster  | Uunwrapped - Dark/Dark Dominator

Uunchill - Ice/Kinetics Corruptor | Uunpleasant - En/En Stalker | Uunbrella - Rad/Rad Sentinel | Uunsafari - Beasts/Traps MM | Uungnome - Nature/Seismic Defender | Uunsavory - Poson/Sonic Defender

Uunicycle - BS/Shield Scrapper | Uuntouchable - Ill/Time Controller | Uunferno - Fire/Fire Tank | Uunthinkable - Psi/SR Scrapper | Uuncivil - Thugs/Elec MM | Uunnatural - Ice/Savage Dominator | Uunshockable - Elec/Bio Sentinel

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On 2/21/2020 at 1:39 PM, Uun said:

Correct, but working around it isn't that difficult as hurricane can be toggled off and back on pretty quickly. I generally don't keep hurricane up full time anyway.

That's what I'm finding with it, it's good to give it a rest sometime to help my End, and to take a break from the sound effect.  Still learning my way round using it to corner foes too.

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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I think the other older knock would be the secondary effect of the blasts, i.e.- def which wasn't all that useful.  Players built to reliably hit stuff and procs didn't work the same either (though turning the tier 1 blast into a little proc cannon of death existed). 

 

PS: Somewhat heretical I know but most of my Storms rarely used/use Hurricane but rather stunned mobs by stacking stuns.  Hurricane is a potent tool but I've got too much altitis to get the time in to get the skill needed to use it as it should be used.  Stunning mobs works much better for me in general.

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2 hours ago, Doomguide2005 said:

I think the other older knock would be the secondary effect of the blasts, i.e.- def which wasn't all that useful.  Players built to reliably hit stuff and procs didn't work the same either (though turning the tier 1 blast into a little proc cannon of death existed). 

 

PS: Somewhat heretical I know but most of my Storms rarely used/use Hurricane but rather stunned mobs by stacking stuns.  Hurricane is a potent tool but I've got too much altitis to get the time in to get the skill needed to use it as it should be used.  Stunning mobs works much better for me in general.

This is my first stormie of any sort so I just have to take Hurricane; I've already found that it has it's uses, such as blocking a doorway to keep foes bunched up and not slipping past to annoy my friends, and that it draws friends close who want to stay safe from melee as they plink away at the bad guys.  Those two things right there make me feel like a Defender with a capital D.

 

I was half thinking about that tier one blast as a proc canon, but it recharges so fast right out of the box I was afraid that would hamper the proc rate.  Currently cobbling up a build from a proc monster storm/sonic (I think it was) posted over in that thread, so we'll see how it goes.

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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That's what I;m discovering.  I tend to stick with a toon for a long enough time to get fairly comfy with it, so maybe by the time I ding 50 I'll be able to do that.

 

(Stupid  forum formatting down here, dunno how to get rid of these.  IGNORE ME!)

7 minutes ago, Doomguide2005 said:
Quote

 

 

7 minutes ago, Doomguide2005 said:

 

 

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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A Sudden Acceleration kb->kd proc in Hurricane will remove the knockback, but not the repel, and when things are knocked down repel will toss them a little bit.  Still, it removes much of the unpredictable scatter from 'Cane.  If you invest in to-hit debuff, Hurricane becomes a fairly effective debuff for team use and and an absolutely dominant tool for soloing.  It might take a bit to defeat foes since you're a Defender, but my Storm Defender is effectively fearless against anything but AVs (and their EB forms, which seem to retain the debuff resistance of full AVs). 

 

It's a particularly amusing tool against Cimerorans, who cumulatively debuff defense into the negative, and would maim a lot of defense-based builds, but they still can't hit through Hurricane's debuff.

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8 hours ago, Sailboat said:

A Sudden Acceleration kb->kd proc in Hurricane will remove the knockback, but not the repel, and when things are knocked down repel will toss them a little bit.  Still, it removes much of the unpredictable scatter from 'Cane.  If you invest in to-hit debuff, Hurricane becomes a fairly effective debuff for team use and and an absolutely dominant tool for soloing.  It might take a bit to defeat foes since you're a Defender, but my Storm Defender is effectively fearless against anything but AVs (and their EB forms, which seem to retain the debuff resistance of full AVs). 

 

It's a particularly amusing tool against Cimerorans, who cumulatively debuff defense into the negative, and would maim a lot of defense-based builds, but they still can't hit through Hurricane's debuff.

Noted and going into the build, thanks.  🙂

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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Another question to anyone who's still reading: if I had to cut one (which my build-in-progress seems to be indicating I do), which one would be less of a loss, Freezing Rain or Snow Storm?

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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Snow Storm is a serviceable debuff, and it's auto-hit, useful against things that resist holds or stuns, brings down flyers.  But it's not vital.

 

Freezing Rain, on the other hand, is routinely mentioned in rankings of the best debuffs in the game.  It's an absolute keeper for any Storm.

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Couldn't tell you, this is my first Rad.  I don't know if it's the same animation and time as Force Field's Repulsion Bomb, but one of my MMs had that and it never felt like it was taking forever to animate (can't say the same for Electron Haze, if that's the one I'm thinking of; I feel like I corpse blast a lot with that one

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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Here's another question for you guys:  looking at both Storm's Hurricane and Radiation's Irradiate, the "range" of them both is given (at least on Titan's wiki) as "point blank.  Question is, if I've got some foe's at arm's length away from my with a Hurricane, will Irradiate still hit , or is that too far for it to reach?

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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3 hours ago, Clave Dark 5 said:

Here's another question for you guys:  looking at both Storm's Hurricane and Radiation's Irradiate, the "range" of them both is given (at least on Titan's wiki) as "point blank.  Question is, if I've got some foe's at arm's length away from my with a Hurricane, will Irradiate still hit , or is that too far for it to reach?

Irradiate will not hit if the mob is at the max repel of hurricane according to mids and I have no reason to doubt it. I would skip hurricane, its repel effect make it much less desirable even after a knockback to knockdown IO.  

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15 minutes ago, Darkir said:

Irradiate will not hit if the mob is at the max repel of hurricane according to mids and I have no reason to doubt it. I would skip hurricane, its repel effect make it much less desirable even after a knockback to knockdown IO.  

I've had it on the toon enough to fiddle with it some and I like the panic button nature of it, and I normally hate panic button powers.  OTOH, Irradiate seems like nothing but a panic button, because what, my squishie is going to be running into the middle of a crowd on purpose or sidling up next to that AV for fun?  My play style sez take hurricane!  Electron Haze is more my speed.

 

Thanks for the info though, that does help me solidify my choices.

Edited by Clave Dark 5

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Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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1 hour ago, Clave Dark 5 said:

OTOH, Irradiate seems like nothing but a panic button, because what, my squishie is going to be running into the middle of a crowd on purpose or sidling up next to that AV for fun?

It's not terribly difficult to make a defender incredibly tanky. For storm/rad, the reason you would want to go into melee range is for atomic blast and irradiate, both of which have fantastic dpa and can apply the -20% res Achilles proc in a pbaoe. You can also soul drain and at just 5 targets that is an 80% dmg buff. So, you could run up, soul drain>aim>lightning storm>tornado>atomic blast or some variation of that and pretty much destroy everything except for +3/4 bosses. Aim with gaussians and soul drain should cap your damage, so that is a ton of damage coming out of your lightning storm and tornado. 

 

I made an example build to highlight this. It has ranged and melee defense softcapped, perma hasten with the FF procs, perma soul drain with the FF procs, s/l res is at 73.4% (1.6% from cap), lightning storm should be endurance neutral giving the cast time and the endurance proc, and you should be able to apply a ton of -res to groups with double stacking freezing rain and achilles procs (plus gladiators in soul drain, but only 5 seconds out of 30ish). 

 

 

 

Spoiler

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.7
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Science Defender
Primary Power Set: Storm Summoning
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Blast
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Dark Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: O2 Boost -- Prv-Absorb%(A)
Level 1: Neutrino Bolt -- Thn-Acc/Dmg(A), Thn-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thn-Dmg/Rchg(3), Thn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Thn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), Thn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7)
Level 2: Snow Storm -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Irradiate -- Obl-Dmg(A), Obl-Dmg/Rchg(13), Obl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13), Obl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), Obl-%Dam(40), AchHee-ResDeb%(40)
Level 6: Steamy Mist -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(7), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(21), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(43), Ksm-ToHit+(46)
Level 8: Freezing Rain -- SprVglAss-Acc/Dmg(A), SprVglAss-Dmg/Rchg(42), SprVglAss-Rchg/+Absorb(43)
Level 10: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(11), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(43)
Level 12: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 14: Tough -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(15), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(15), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(17), GldArm-3defTpProc(17)
Level 16: Proton Volley -- StnoftheM-Acc/Dmg(A), StnoftheM-Dmg/EndRdx(19), StnoftheM-Dmg/ActRdx/Rchg(21), StnoftheM-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), StnoftheM-Dam%(25)
Level 18: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(19), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(46)
Level 20: Aim -- GssSynFr--Build%(A)
Level 22: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(23)
Level 24: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 26: Tornado -- ExpRnf-Acc/Dmg(A), ExpRnf-Dmg/EndRdx(27), ExpRnf-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), ExpRnf-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(29), FrcFdb-Rechg%(29), SuddAcc--KB/+KD(31)
Level 28: Cosmic Burst -- SprDfnBst-Acc/Dmg(A), SprDfnBst-Dmg/Rchg(31), SprDfnBst-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprDfnBst-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(34), SprDfnBst-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), SprDfnBst-Rchg/Heal%(42)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 32: Lightning Storm -- SprVglAss-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), SprVglAss-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), SprVglAss-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Apc-Dmg/EndRdx(33), PrfShf-End%(34), FrcFdb-Rechg%(34)
Level 35: Neutron Bomb -- Rgn-Dmg(A), Rgn-Dmg/Rchg(36), Rgn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Rgn-Dmg/EndRdx(36), Rgn-Knock%(37), AchHee-ResDeb%(37)
Level 38: Atomic Blast -- Arm-Dmg/Rchg(A), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), Arm-Acc/Rchg(39), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Arm-Dam%(40), AchHee-ResDeb%(42)
Level 41: Dark Consumption -- PrfShf-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(A)
Level 44: Dark Embrace -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(45), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45), UnbGrd-Max HP%(45), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(46)
Level 47: Soul Drain -- SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(A), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(50), FuroftheG-ResDeb%(50)
Level 49: Super Speed -- BlsoftheZ-Travel/EndRdx(A), BlsoftheZ-ResKB(50)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Quick Form 
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Vigilance 
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run 
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(9), Mrc-Rcvry+(11)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-EndMod(A), PrfShf-End%(9)
Level 50: Agility Core Paragon 
Level 0: Freedom Phalanx Reserve 
Level 0: Portal Jockey 
Level 0: Task Force Commander 
Level 0: The Atlas Medallion 
------------

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build |
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		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

 

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Well damn, guess I know what my build is going to be when I hit 50.  Thanks for that and pointing that out.

 

ETA;  But hey, "can apply the -20% res Achilles proc in a pbaoe" you say.  I haven't checked the numbers for this very proc, but I thought conventional wisdom said procs weren't terribly useful in area effect things and therefore not worth slotting there?

Edited by Clave Dark 5

╔═══════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════╗

Clave's Sure-Fire Secrets to Enjoying City Of Heroes
Don't bother with those farming chores...
Skip your homework on the Market...
Play any power sets that you want...
Because this game is easy.  Go have fun!

You'll be perfectly fine, promise! 

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