Could self flagging for pvp in any zone be a thing?

[arcane]

7 minutes ago, ZacKing said:

yeah thanks for reinforcing the point that there's a couple of bad actors making the whole community look bad.  I guess those badge hunters are a real match for those l33t pvp skillz of yours that you can't leave them alone for 30 seconds

Serious question: can you name for me an MMO where you *would* expect to be left alone without fail the second you asked for it in a zone primarily intended for PvP?

 

It just seems to me like you’re raging at the state of MMO PvP as it has always been and always will be, but you’re trying to make some small handful of CoH players out to be problems. Do you acknowledge that some of this is a how-online-gaming-fundamentally-works issue and not a toxic-CoH-players-are-evil issue?

[ZacKing]

3 minutes ago, arcaneholocaust said:

Serious question: can you name for me an MMO where you *would* expect to be left alone without fail the second you asked for it in a zone primarily intended for PvP?

I've seen it happen in WoW before.  I haven't played too many MMOs as I'm not a pro gamer, but not everyone who is a pvp'er is a total dick.

 

7 minutes ago, arcaneholocaust said:

It just seems to me like you’re raging at the state of MMO PvP as it has always been and always will be, but you’re trying to make some small handful of CoH players out to be problems. Do you acknowledge that some of this is a how-online-gaming-fundamentally-works issue and not a toxic-CoH-players-are-evil issue?

Man I'm not raging at anything.  You're generalizing in thinking that all pvp players are jerks.  They're not.  yeah, they're competitive and like to talk smack .  I'm not saying that people shouldn't attack others or expect to be ganked if they go into a pvp zone.  but if someone asks to be left to just badge or farm  or grab a temp, where's the harm in it?  or are you one of those types that just loves to stomp people who don't fight back?  where's the challenge in that?

[ShardWarrior]

13 minutes ago, arcaneholocaust said:

Serious question: can you name for me an MMO where you *would* expect to be left alone without fail the second you asked for it in a zone primarily intended for PvP?

I think you are making a very, very broad generalization here. 

[MTeague]

3 minutes ago, ZacKing said:

I've seen it happen in WoW before.  I haven't played too many MMOs as I'm not a pro gamer, but not everyone who is a pvp'er is a total dick.

I've never seen anyone left alone in a WoW pvp zone like Warsong Gulch, Alterac Valley, etc.

I have seen people ignored in places like Wintergrasp and Tol Barad once the raids you could do from those zones were out-dated / no longer part of current raid tier.

 

I have, sometimes, seen people left alone if they charged into a city of the opposite city to do Fishing for some of the Fishing achievements.

I've also seen the the opposite-faction fishers relentlessly molested until they just logged out dead and tried again in the wee hours of the night.

And I've BEEN one of said opposite faction fishers, each time.

[ShardWarrior]

2 minutes ago, MTeague said:

I've never seen anyone left alone in a WoW pvp zone like Warsong Gulch, Alterac Valley, etc.

I have not played WoW in a long time, but those are queued PVP zones as I recall?

[MTeague]

On 7/14/2020 at 9:54 AM, GastlyGibus said:

Well, actually, this thread is about whether players should be able to flag themselves for PvP or not. Basically being able to opt-out of PvP entirely.

Actually I believed this thread was for the option to create an OPT IN status for PvP in Non-PvP zones, if, if you're a rogue, can you PvP willing heroes in Atlas Park or Steel Canyon.

But that everyone was still unconditonally flagged for PvP upon entering a PvP zone.

 

Which is an entierely separately question from should you have the ability to decline all PvP even in PvP zones.

 

I'm fine with the first, and I would oppose the second, and I don't think I've engaged in actual PvP vs humans once since Homecoming launched.

[MTeague]

2 minutes ago, ShardWarrior said:

I have not played WoW in a long time, but those are queued PVP zones as I recall?

The memory is kind of fuzzy to me as well, but.... yea probably.  Warsong Gulch, etc you faced off against a small number of other players, each faction limited to same number of players.

[ShardWarrior]

8 minutes ago, MTeague said:

The memory is kind of fuzzy to me as well, but.... yea probably.  Warsong Gulch, etc you faced off against a small number of other players, each faction limited to same number of players.

Ok I looked it up and I remember it now.  That was the low level capture-the-flag one.  I had a pimped out elf rogue who did well in there.  My warrior, not so much. ☺️

[Dazl]

1 hour ago, ZacKing said:

yeah thanks for reinforcing the point that there's a couple of bad actors making the whole community look bad.  I guess those badge hunters are a real match for those l33t pvp skillz of yours that you can't leave them alone for 30 seconds

As I have already pointed out, I don't PvP in this game so I'm not the l33t asshat you keep implying that I am. I'm just laughing at the silly assumption that if you ask to be left unmolested in a PvP zone, that people would or should honor that.

 

I've played a number of PvP mmo's and that never happens. As a matter of fact if you tried it, they would probably target you more. Weakness in PvP is like blood in the water to sharks. Does that turn off a lot of people to PvP? I'm sure it does, but that is just the nature of the beast. Wolves are going to prey on the sheep.

[Twisted Toon]

4 hours ago, M3z said:

Yeah I never got the "PVP is the unwanted stepchild system of CoH" when wasn't it planned to be in the game fairly early on or even since beta?

I think if it was planned for in Beta, it wouldn't have taken 4 issues (over a year) to get implemented in such a hap-hazard manner.

 

I do not think that the game was designed with PvP in mind.

[macskull]

2 minutes ago, Twisted Toon said:

I think if it was planned for in Beta, it wouldn't have taken 4 issues (over a year) to get implemented in such a hap-hazard manner.

 

I do not think that the game was designed with PvP in mind.

I don't think the implementation was that haphazard. They probably had bigger fish to fry re: bugs and balance issues before getting to PvP since that required some new assets and systems to be added, but considering how long some things took to see the light of day in this game a year isn't that bad. I mean, it took them five months to add the respec system and teleport/rez prompts and almost nine months add difficulty sliders and cross-server chat. It took longer to add supergroup bases to the game than it took to add PvP.

[arcane]

26 minutes ago, macskull said:

It took longer to add supergroup bases to the game than it took to add PvP.

And IO’s.. and villains... the game wasn’t designed for much of the current meta at all, was it...

[macskull]

Yeah, that's why "this game wasn't designed for PvP!" is a shitty argument. This game wasn't "designed" for a lot of things.

[Twisted Toon]

31 minutes ago, macskull said:

Yeah, that's why "this game wasn't designed for PvP!" is a shitty argument. This game wasn't "designed" for a lot of things.

Just because they were able to shoehorn many things into the game doesn't mean that they had planned to implement those things from the beginning.

How long did it take for them to add color customization to the game?

The game definitely wasn't designed for that.

It wasn't even a twinkle in the Lead Designer's eye at launch.

 

I'm also fairly certain that they had zero plans for Invention Enhancements at launch as well.

 

PvP is a completely different dynamic than, IOs, Power color customization, and Bases.

 

Good against remotes is one thing. Good against the living, that's something else.

[macskull]

Sure, but of all those things PvP was the only one stated from the beginning as a feature the game was going to have. In fact I'm looking at some early alpha gameplay on Youtube right now and the demonstrator specifically mentions the arena and player versus player as one of the game types CoH is going to feature.

[ShardWarrior]

4 hours ago, Crimsonpyre said:

I'm just laughing at the silly assumption that if you ask to be left unmolested in a PvP zone, that people would or should honor that.

Why should that be a silly assumption?  Seems to me there are people here who would oblige another player if they asked nicely. 

 

4 hours ago, Crimsonpyre said:

I've played a number of PvP mmo's and that never happens. As a matter of fact if you tried it, they would probably target you more. Weakness in PvP is like blood in the water to sharks. Does that turn off a lot of people to PvP? I'm sure it does, but that is just the nature of the beast. Wolves are going to prey on the sheep.

I can only speak for myself, but in the various MMOs I have played that have had PvP of one kind or another, there were quite a lot of very helpful people there.  Sure, there are those who are there to just get their jollies out of bullying others, but they exist in the PVE world too.

[Dazl]

2 hours ago, ShardWarrior said:

Why should that be a silly assumption?  Seems to me there are people here who would oblige another player if they asked nicely. 

 

I can only speak for myself, but in the various MMOs I have played that have had PvP of one kind or another, there were quite a lot of very helpful people there.  Sure, there are those who are there to just get their jollies out of bullying others, but they exist in the PVE world too.

Sure there are be people who will help new PvP players, but attacking people who enter the PvP zone is not bullying. If you enter a PvP zone, be prepared to be attacked.

 

Sorry this whole asking nicely not to be attacked sounds so sweet and happy, but it's not reality.

[Xanatos]

 

11 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

PVP is the unwanted stepchild system of CoH.

 

It wasn't prior to Issue 13.

Edited July 16, 2020 by Xanatos

[ShardWarrior]

5 hours ago, Crimsonpyre said:

Sure there are be people who will help new PvP players, but attacking people who enter the PvP zone is not bullying. If you enter a PvP zone, be prepared to be attacked.

 

Sorry this whole asking nicely not to be attacked sounds so sweet and happy, but it's not reality.

I do not think anyone is suggesting people should not expect to be attacked or get attacked when they enter a PVP zone.  If they do then ask to be left alone so they can work on a badge or whatever, I personally see no harm in leaving them be.  I have done this many times. 

[arcane]

4 hours ago, ShardWarrior said:

I do not think anyone is suggesting people should not expect to be attacked or get attacked when they enter a PVP zone.  If they do then ask to be left alone so they can work on a badge or whatever, I personally see no harm in leaving them be.  I have done this many times. 

Dude, people are literally asking why continuing to attack them is not banworthy harassment. Of course that’s what they’re suggesting.

 

the confused emoji is cute, but if you would just read the thread...

Edited July 16, 2020 by arcaneholocaust

[Hyperstrike]

9 hours ago, Xanatos said:

It wasn't prior to Issue 13.

Oh....REALLY?

So all the acrimony I remember before i13 is just...a hallucination?

Edited July 16, 2020 by Hyperstrike

[ShardWarrior]

2 hours ago, arcaneholocaust said:

Dude, people are literally asking why continuing to attack them is not banworthy harassment. Of course that’s what they’re suggesting.

It is wishful thinking for them to believe they will be able to report people for attacking them in a PVP zone.  The discussion was about courtesy toward another player.

[arcane]

35 minutes ago, ShardWarrior said:

It is wishful thinking for them to believe they will be able to report people for attacking them in a PVP zone.  The discussion was about courtesy toward another player.

It’s turned towards courtesy now. It was definitely partially about harassment and bans earlier, hence why I pushed back against the statement that no one expects to be left alone (some people earlier in the thread clearly do believe they have that right).

We’re probably on the same page now.

[Lines]

3 hours ago, arcaneholocaust said:

Dude, people are literally asking why continuing to attack them is not banworthy harassment. Of course that’s what they’re suggesting.

Actually, I think that was someone making a straw man argument at some point and it got out of hand.

[ZacKing]

53 minutes ago, arcaneholocaust said:

It’s turned towards courtesy now. It was definitely partially about harassment and bans earlier, hence why I pushed back against the statement that no one expects to be left alone (some people earlier in the thread clearly do believe they have that right).

We’re probably on the same page now.

Yeah for sure there are people who have unrealistic expectations.