Dark Melee – Proposed Changes

[modest]

The developers have indicated that they wish to make changes to Dark Melee on all archetypes in order to make the set more balanced. The changes that I propose are independent of those that are a part of the i27 Beta. Please direct comments on the i27 Beta changes to this thread.

 

The perceived problem with Dark Melee is that it lacks AOE damage compared to other sets. It is also lacking in single target damage, but it arguably makes up for this lower damage by providing utility in the form of tohit debuffs and a slight heal in Siphon Life. The Scrapper, Brute, and Tanker versions of Dark Melee benefit from Soul Drain, a 30 second damage and tohit buff that scales based on the number of enemies hit when it is cast. The changes that I propose would not significantly increase the single target damage. The intention of these changes to create a balanced power set.

 

• Shadow Punch – Increase the damage by 10%.
  • Shadow Punch is currently a poor performing power on all archetypes. A slight increase in damage would make it a good filler.
  • This would especially benefit Tankers who are forced to take this power.
• Smite – No proposed changes.
• Shadow Maul – Increase the radius to 10ft. Keep the animation time, damage, radius, and target caps as they are.
  • This would increase the damage so that it performs above the damage formula. Here's why I do not think that this is a problem:
    • Every high-performing power set receives at least one power that does not follow the damage formula.
    • War Mace: Clobber.
    • Claws: Spin.
    • Street Justice: Crushing Uppercut.
    • Super Strength: Knockout Blow.
    • Stone Melee: Seismic Smash.
    • i27 Energy Melee: fast Energy Transfer, Stalker Power Crash.
    • Titan Weapons: I won't comment on specific powers because Titan Weapons is currently being worked on. Please check the Beta Thread for details.
  • There is precedent for 8-10ft cones in other melee sets.
    • Frost in Ice Melee.
    • Power Crash in i27 Energy Melee.
    • Guarded Spin in Staff Fighting.
    • Defensive Sweep in Titan Weapons.
    • Sweeping Strike in Titan Weapons.
    • Crowd Control in War Mace.
  • This would be the only substantial source of AOE in the set until the T9.
• Siphon Life – Decrease the animation time or increase the damage so that the DPA matches the DPA of Smite.
  • This would provide Dark Melee with two moderate damage single target attacks.
• Dark Consumption – Move to T4. No functional changes.
• Soul Drain – No proposed changes.
• Midnight Grasp – No proposed changes.
• Touch of Fear – Move this power to T9. Turn it into a PBAoE mini-nuke power.
  • This idea was originally proposed by @Captain Powerhouse. It was disparaged in the feedback thread, but I think that the idea is good and should be pursued.
  • The PBAoE would have the same damage, recharge time, radius, and target cap as Lightning Rod from Electrical Melee.
  • The PBAoE would not teleport the character. Instead, it would retain the existing tohit debuff and 3.0 terrorize for 10.43s.
  • The PBAoE would deal damage in 8 ticks over 4 seconds. This fits thematically with Dark Melee's existing powers.
  • The PBAoE would not be able to crit.

 

Here is how the proposed Dark Melee would look on the archetypes:

 

Scrapper

Power	Level	Effect
Shadow Punch	1	Melee, Minor DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Smite	1	Melee, Moderate DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Shadow Maul	2	Melee (Cone), High DoT(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Dark Consumption	6	PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Negative), Self +End
Siphon Life	8	Melee, Moderate DMG(Negative), Foe -To Hit, Self Heal
Confront	12	Ranged, Foe Taunt, -Range
Soul Drain	18	PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Negative), Self +DMG, +To Hit
Midnight Grasp	26	Melee, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Immobilize, -To Hit
Touch of Fear	32	PBAoE, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Fear, -To Hit

 

Brute

Power	Level	Effect
Shadow Punch	1	Melee, Minor DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Smite	1	Melee, Moderate DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Shadow Maul	2	Melee (Cone), High DoT(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Dark Consumption	6	PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Negative), Self +End
Siphon Life	8	Melee, Moderate DMG(Negative), Foe -To Hit, Self Heal
Taunt	12	Ranged (Targeted AoE), Foe Taunt, -Range
Soul Drain	18	PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Negative), Self +DMG, +To Hit
Midnight Grasp	26	Melee, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Immobilize, -To Hit
Touch of Fear	32	PBAoE, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Fear, -To Hit

 

Tanker

Power	Level	Effect
Shadow Punch	1	Melee, Minor DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Smite	2	Melee, Moderate DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Shadow Maul	4	Melee (Cone), High DoT(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Taunt	10	Ranged (Targeted AoE), Foe Taunt, -Range
Siphon Life	16	Melee, Moderate DMG(Negative), Foe -To Hit, Self Heal
Dark Consumption	20	PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Negative), Self +End
Soul Drain	28	PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Negative), Self +DMG, +To Hit
Midnight Grasp	35	Melee, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Immobilize, -To Hit
Touch of Fear	38	PBAoE, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Fear, -To Hit

 

Stalker

Power	Level	Effect
Shadow Punch	1	Melee, Minor DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Smite	1	Melee, Moderate DMG(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Shadow Maul	2	Melee (Cone), High DoT(Smash/Negative), Foe -To Hit
Assassin's Eclipse	6	Melee, Special Damage(Smash/Negative)
Build Up	8	Self +DMG, +To Hit
Placate	12	Ranged, Foe Placate, Self Stealth/Hide
Siphon Life	18	Melee, Moderate DMG(Negative), Foe -To Hit, Self Heal
Midnight Grasp	26	Melee, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Immobilize, -To Hit
Touch of Fear	32	PBAoE, Superior DMG(Negative), Foe Fear, -To Hit

 

Thank you to @Bopper and @Kanil for discussing this with me on Discord, and credit to @Captain Powerhouse for the idea of adding a mini-nuke with a DoT component to the set.

[Solarverse]

I would change Midnight Grasp to share the same animation and cast time as the Instant Cast Energy Transfer.

Edited November 12, 2020 by Solarverse

[Ratch_]

I like the direction and organization of your post. Only thing I would like to see happen is for some kind of benefit for critting on Touch of Fear. It doesn't have to be in the form of extra damage, but some benefit would be cool like how it was handled with energy melee in returning life on a crit or getting an additional stack of energy focus.

What the benefit would be I am not sure, but as a theme of dark I wouldn't mind having a 28% damage boost on crit'ed targets and then receiving a heal (mimicing life being siphoned out of them)

Edited November 12, 2020 by Ratch_

[modest]

15 minutes ago, Ratch_ said:

I like the direction and organization of your post. Only thing I would like to see happen is for some kind of benefit for critting on Touch of Fear. It doesn't have to be in the form of extra damage, but some benefit would be cool like how it was handled with energy melee in returning life on a crit or getting an additional stack of energy focus.

What the benefit would be I am not sure, but as a theme of dark I wouldn't mind having a 28% damage boost on crit'ed targets and then receiving a heal (mimicing life being siphoned out of them)

Thank you for your feedback. It would be nice if some crit mechanic were implemented. I did not suggest it because I tried to follow the precedent set by other melee nukes.

[therealtitanman]

2 hours ago, Solarverse said:

I would change Midnight Grasp to share the same animation and cast time as the Instant Cast Energy Transfer.

I would complete remove midnight grasp, looks like lame skill but stay at t9.

better give us 1 extreme or superior st.

[ZorkNemesis]

11 minutes ago, therealtitanman said:

I would complete remove midnight grasp, looks like lame skill but stay at t9.

better give us 1 extreme or superior st.

Unless i'm misunderstanding, Midnight Grasp is already a 'Superior' ST attack, doing a lot of damage up front and suplementing it with a decent DoT afterward.  It does an enormous amount if damage already for an attack with such a quick animation.  It's already the strongest ST in the set at that.

[therealtitanman]

Just now, ZorkNemesis said:

Unless i'm misunderstanding, Midnight Grasp is already a 'Superior' ST attack, doing a lot of damage up front and suplementing it with a decent DoT afterward.  It does an enormous amount if damage already for an attack with such a quick animation.  It's already the strongest ST in the set at that.

i meant visual. midnight grasp doesnt looks like extreme or superior st.

[Naraka]

Point of personal privilege: AoE isn't needed for every set. If it is, give power pools AoEs and use those. Rather than change every set to need [this much] AoE and [this much] ST, emphasize flavor, style, customization and theme.

 

Of course that's never going to be a logical perspective since whether a set is balanced or not depends on putting it in a vacuum or tailoring it for specific endgame and not around what you can actually do with the set.

[Saikochoro]

Dark melee is one of my favorite sets. I honestly think these changes are overboard. It is already has strong single target damage especially given that soul drain has such high uptime. I don’t think siphon life needs to have higher dpa. It is already a decent attack and doubles as rotational healing. 
 

Making touch of fear a nuke on top of buffing shadow maul is just asking for the set to be subsequently nerfed. I don’t want another Titan weapons. I’d argue to scrap the touch of fear changes altogether and just buff the range and arc of shadow maul. I don’t think every set needs to have great single target AND great AoE damage. Balance wise each set should have a scaling mix of both. 
 

I’m not saying I wouldn’t have fun with the OPs suggestions. I just feel they are too much and the result would be overpowered. Just my opinion. 

Edited November 13, 2020 by Saikochoro

[modest]

5 hours ago, Saikochoro said:

Dark melee is one of my favorite sets. I honestly think these changes are overboard. It is already has strong single target damage especially given that soul drain has such high uptime. I don’t think siphon life needs to have higher dpa. It is already a decent attack and doubles as rotational healing. 
 

Making touch of fear a nuke on top of buffing shadow maul is just asking for the set to be subsequently nerfed. I don’t want another Titan weapons. I’d argue to scrap the touch of fear changes altogether and just buff the range and arc of shadow maul. I don’t think every set needs to have great single target AND great AoE damage. Balance wise each set should have a scaling mix of both. 
 

I’m not saying I wouldn’t have fun with the OPs suggestions. I just feel they are too much and the result would be overpowered. Just my opinion. 

This is a valid opinion. I think that the set would be much improved by following what you describe:

1. Scrap the i27 Beta Touch of Fear change.
2. Increase the radius of Shadow Maul.

I am most familiar with the Stalker version of Dark Melee, and on a Stalker the DPA of Siphon Life isn't very good. On a Stalker, Siphon Life is the T7 attack, but it has a lower DPA than the T2 attack. Increasing the DPA to the level of Smite would balance out the set. This would bring its Single Target damage to the level of Electrical Melee, a set that isn't particularly valued for its Single Target output.

 

The PBAoE mini-nuke is a nice-to-have-but-not-necessary request. Captain Powerhouse put a version of the PBAoE nuke on a previous Beta patch for us to test, and it was very well received and quite fun to use.