Level Up - Tokens

[Rudra]

21 minutes ago, golstat2003 said:

 

I'd . . . seriously be down for this, or the OP's idea. I use to be against it, but with instant PVP level 50s I see no harm.

 

I'm now open to any and all variations of the idea.

 

/shrug.

And if the game economy goes to hell and everyone is screaming for all the zones to be level 50? If the tokens are impossibly expensive to get, like @TheZag's 2 billion and 1 inf', then yeah, that doomsday view should not happen. If the tokens are quick and easy to get? I can see a demand for all zones to be level 50 not that far in the future. We already have a request for all PvP zones to be level 50, and the instant-50 thing isn't even live yet.

[golstat2003]

2 hours ago, Rudra said:

And if the game economy goes to hell and everyone is screaming for all the zones to be level 50? If the tokens are impossibly expensive to get, like @TheZag's 2 billion and 1 inf', then yeah, that doomsday view should not happen. If the tokens are quick and easy to get? I can see a demand for all zones to be level 50 not that far in the future. We already have a request for all PvP zones to be level 50, and the instant-50 thing isn't even live yet.

 

/shrug the game is changing. I think in 3 years there won't be a version of COH out there that is at all close to the original. Each server seems to be making radical changes to the old COH formula. I trust HC more than others to make changes that WOULD NOT tank the economy. If it were any other server I would not say the same.

 

So I no longer fear the OP's suggestion or others like it.

[Greycat]

On 7/25/2022 at 10:49 AM, Krimson said:

Unlike previous iterations of this topic, this one was created in response to the Insta 50s that PvP will be getting. What harm is there in discussing options, especially if said options results in less use of AE for farming?

 

Would it, though? That kind of leans on the "AE farming is for PLing," versus farming for drops/inf/etc. that happen to open the door so others can get XP at the same time.

 

Besides, most of the time I end up on a farm, it's a friend/sgmate/etc. who happens to be running one anyway at the time and it's an excuse to BS. The XP is a side benefit.  (Same holds true for doing missions, for that matter.) Granted, I'm *hardly* new to the game, so...

 

 

[Troo]

15 hours ago, Rudra said:

And if the game economy goes to hell and everyone is screaming for all the zones to be level 50?

 

Do you think maybe if players had a way to level up short of 50 it might stimulate more play and more alts?

I just struggle with the number of PL'd characters and the overall amount of time wasted door sitting. 1-40 is a blip economy wise.

Definitely open to other ideas.

 

2 hours ago, Greycat said:

Besides, most of the time I end up on a farm, it's a friend/sgmate/etc. who happens to be running one anyway at the time and it's an excuse to BS. The XP is a side benefit.  (Same holds true for doing missions, for that matter.) Granted, I'm *hardly* new to the game, so...

 

Agreed.

I think if folks have earned it, they should be able to focus on level ranges that interest them. If you wanna make a new 50, here's a way to level up closer to that goal and still put some stuff back into the game.

 

I see little difference between a player taking an alt 1-50, and the same player taking 2 alts 40-50. It should be about the same amount of time and the same rewards, right? 

We have so many character slots, let's use em.

Alts are good for my crafting. Alts are good for my marketing. Alts are good for finding that forever character. Alts cure all.

[Rudra]

18 minutes ago, Troo said:

15 hours ago, Rudra said:

And if the game economy goes to hell and everyone is screaming for all the zones to be level 50?

 

Do you think maybe if players had a way to level up short of 50 it might stimulate more play and more alts?

I don't know and I wish I did. I can't answer that.

 

18 minutes ago, Troo said:

I just struggle with the number of PL'd characters and the overall amount of time wasted door sitting. 1-40 is a blip economy wise.

Level up tokens will just change how they get there. Your struggle with PL'ed characters won't change. And they don't have to door sit while being PL'ed. They can actually contribute to mission accomplishment, just most won't and some farmers tell them not to.

 

I don't have any good answers to give. I'm sorry. All I have are concerns that I don't know how to resolve.

[golstat2003]

19 minutes ago, Rudra said:

I don't know and I wish I did. I can't answer that.

 

Level up tokens will just change how they get there. Your struggle with PL'ed characters won't change. And they don't have to door sit while being PL'ed. They can actually contribute to mission accomplishment, just most won't and some farmers tell them not to.

 

I don't have any good answers to give. I'm sorry. All I have are concerns that I don't know how to resolve.

 

For the farmer it's usually just better if they doorsit. Someone that low usually can't contribute to fighting level 54s.

[Ukase]

On 7/19/2022 at 6:38 AM, Luminara said:

 

Encourages RMT, not acceptable to this development team.

 

 

Fails to enforce the requirement.  Anyone can get any badge any time without any effort, without even being present while logged in, simply by allowing another character to carry them, the same way they can get XP, inf*, drops.

 

And this adds market stress the same way insta-50 does.  The market relies on input, a character instantly leveled to X, regardless of what number you attach to X, generates nothing to input.  Increased demand, decreased supply, inflation rises.

 

No.

I appreciate your experience in other games, but I'm...well, not so knowledgeable about other games, as this is the only one I've played, unless you count Chess and Madden football. 
Can you expand on how (or even what) RMT means, and how such a thing would encourage it? 

As for adding market stress, no. I strongly suggest you are not correct on that. Half the guys I know that PL to 50 literally delete every bit of salvage and recipe except the rare salvage and very rare recipes, and maybe the pvps. And the number of those per character is often less than 3-5 recipes that they deem worth selling or crafting. 

How I would deal with drops or how you would deal with them is not how everyone else would deal with them. I promise you, the drops from 1-50 are meaningless in the AH. You'd never miss them. Why? because there are farmers that fill that gap, and always will, until the dev team makes it unsavory to do so. 

[Ukase]

On 7/25/2022 at 10:22 AM, Krimson said:

You still need catalysts to make Superiors from Winter Sets and ATOs. A level 50 toon has 67 slots. How many complete story arcs is a player going to run from level 1-50? I'm suggesting story arcs with the reward granted at the last mission to incentivize sticking around. I'm not saying drop ATOs, Winter Enhancements, or Purple Sets. Just a few proc goodies that could be used or sold. Stuff like Panacea, Numina, Preventive Medicine, Performance Shifter, Power Transfer and the like. Maybe even Gladiator's Armor and Steadfast Protection for those DEF boosts. The amount awarded per toon isn't going to be a lot, and if the reward is on completion of the arc, farming it probably won't be worth the effort. 

Sorry, a level 50 character has far more than 67 slots. 96 for most, and khelds and veats have even more than that. 

[srmalloy]

7 minutes ago, Ukase said:

Can you expand on how (or even what) RMT means, and how such a thing would encourage it? 

RMT is 'Real Money Transactions', and used to refer to the people running websites that had legions of grunts playing games for the sole purpose of grinding the in-game currency, then offering it (and, often, powerleveling services) for real cash. If I remember correctly, back on Live, after the introduction of AE, the cost for inf dropped to somewhere around $2.00 for 100 million inf from $10 per million in the early game.

[Ukase]

Just now, srmalloy said:

RMT is 'Real Money Transactions', and used to refer to the people running websites that had legions of grunts playing games for the sole purpose of grinding the in-game currency, then offering it (and, often, powerleveling services) for real cash. If I remember correctly, back on Live, after the introduction of AE, the cost for inf dropped to somewhere around $2.00 for 100 million inf from $10 per million in the early game.

I have words to express myself at this, but they're not productive in the least. SMH...
But I can't think of any reason a token would encourage RMT. In fact, HC has made things so user friendly for a new player (once they get the lay of the land), nobody sane or sober would ever spend a penny on any amount of inf. 
 

[Clave Dark 5]

Just now, Ukase said:

Nobody sane or sober would ever spend a penny on any amount of inf.

Have you met people though?  🙂

[Ukase]

4 minutes ago, Clave Dark 5 said:

Have you met people though?  🙂

Candidly, in real life, I've only met maybe 2 dozen people over the past 2 years - and that was online, over Zoom or Skype. I have met some folks in game, over Discord, but I don't count that, as I've no idea what their names are or much of anything about them. They're not really people to me. They're just pixels that I recognize are real people, but not really real to me. 
 

But yeah, point taken. Some folks just amaze me with their commitment to escape reality by drugs of some kind or another, only to further escape reality in game. But that's a whole 'nother thread. 

[Ukase]

14 minutes ago, Krimson said:

So my suggestion would have an even smaller impact overall. Good to know. 

I'd have to do some serious studying to determine certain percentages on average, but I don't think any impact would be noticed by itself - but there are a lot of other changes proposed, and there's really no telling how these things would all impact the game over time. In the short run, I don't think we'd notice much of anything. But in the long run, a different change might make things a bigger factor. It's enough to make me go for more coffee. 

[arcane]

1 hour ago, Ukase said:

Sorry, a level 50 character has far more than 67 slots. 96 for most, and khelds and veats have even more than that. 

67 is the number of *additional* slots you get to allocate for leveling, to clarify for whoever brought that up. As in, a 6-slotted power has 5 additional slots. I have to use a spreadsheet instead of mids and that number is burned in my brain.

Edited August 1, 2022 by arcane

[Troo]

I'd rather see token earned by doing something rather than bought.

 

A combo of simple accomplishments that a typical 50 would achieve.

[Ukase]

8 minutes ago, Troo said:

I'd rather see token earned by doing something rather than bought.

 

A combo of simple accomplishments that a typical 50 would achieve.

So, on the surface, I like the idea of folks being able to insta-level to whatever they want. 
The pros: 
Less AE (Presumably) 

Happier players - look, there's more than a few folks that are weary of lower level play. This would give them what they want. 


The Cons: 
I promise you, there would be some folks that would use the current Alt recycling method for emps to get to 50 faster to more emps faster. So, there would have to either be parameters to limit or prevent this, presumably the focal point behind the change being discussed in the Reward Merit focused feedback thread. Would it be a wash? I've no idea. 

Unhappy players - there would be some players that suffer through the lower level stuff to get to 50; presumably as the original devs designed. If they could insta-level past that, whether with a token or some other means, there would likely be fewer players for other folks to team with. 

 

 

 

 

There's probably a lot of other factors to look into - such as impact on the market, server stress (perhaps such a change would bring more players?) 
Troo mentions that players should earn these tokens, and that makes good sense to me. If you're going to skip past a large portion of the game, then there should be a method to account for that saved time. As to how that should be earned, we have so many different types of players, that to ask for something challenging would result in perhaps, some players not being able to meet this objective. Some players will say, "Good! It should be hard". 

For me, I would want something that demonstrates a clear understanding of in-game geography (how to get from zone A to Zone B, then to Zone C and back to Zone A in a timely fashion. (2 minutes, I think), then follow that up with a specific mission where you have a pre-set difficulty that depends on your hitpoints and your level. And you have to complete that mission without defeat (or maybe just one) in a specific time frame, like 15 minutes - which, depending on the map, should be 3x the necessary time for most ATs. 

After all, if we let just anyone have a level token, then the same folks who lambast AE for producing ignorant players, nothing will have changed. 

[Troo]

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

Less AE (Presumably) 

 

add to this, less time wasting, more time playing whatever content folks should want.

 

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

There's probably a lot of other factors to look into - such as impact on the market, server stress (perhaps such a change would bring more players?) 

 

This is part of what led me to think maybe level ups should only go so far, like to the middle of the 1-50 rewards / xp. Thinking folks could level up the rest of the way as they saw fit and still potentially return some rewards to the market.

 

 

Thanks for the feedback.

Edited August 1, 2022 by Troo

[Ukase]

10 hours ago, Troo said:

This is part of what led me to think maybe level ups should only go so far, like to the middle of the 1-50 rewards / xp. Thinking folks could level up the rest of the way as they saw fit and still potentially return some rewards to the market.

I wouldn't worry one iota about the impact on the market until characters hit level 40. That's when they start teaming up to clobber AVs and such, and when the influence starts rolling in at more noticeable levels. 
The biggest impact is on the lower level loot, like Steadfast Protection that caps at 30, and Achille's Heel. When folks zip past those levels, the prices of those will increase a little bit, if not by a fair bit. But it would be nothing for a farmer to do some AE for tickets and feed that demand in 30 minutes. Happens every day.